Lurker > Forceful_Dragon

Obellisk posted...

I've been drinking but I'm here for a bit before dinner. you can ask me 4 questions.

What is your name?

What is your quest?

What is your favorite color?

How do you feel about the following users:
Wallz
IGCD
Brohan
Sultan

If you had to Kill one them, Protect one of them, Scan one of them and Ignore one of them which would you do to each?

Or you derailed our already malnourished activity.

Why tell us anything now if we just have to wait for info later?

right I assumed metalhead to be vanilla based on the character bio. I don't really understand why he would be particularly intuitive though.

And to be clear you had the option to activate the box? It wasn't forced? I'm failing to guess what potential boon we'll receive that would make it worth deactivating our abilities and making us unable to remove/move votes.

Right my point is that if my very first role PM had something along the lines of "You are intuitive and will be able to use [Second Flavor]'s action before you transform into him" I think I would be pretty confused or at least convinced that a flavor swap was coming?

Or was it originally "You're a thoughtful and emphatic guy, it doesn't do much" and then "JUST KIDDING, you can do X/Y/Z now!"?

Chaeix posted...

My intuitive trait said that I would get some clue to some grand mystery (paraphrased) at the start of the night, and gave me the ability to use my Elliott action contingent on surviving until morning.

It sounds like your intuitive trait is contingent on having a second form then?

Chaeix posted...

I was hoping to come in today with a grand post this morning but my anxiety about a psychiatrist appointment is off the fucking charts so Im not putting much effort into the grand reveal.

Im responsible for the chain hunt. The Box will appear after 24 hours as someone speculated.

I will explain how the box works with a full claim before the 24h mark and the Box appears. I am, however, Jeff Sorensen, SOLO QUEUE Intuitive Metalhead and Elliott Spencer (I suppose Pinhead), SOLO QUEUE Game Master Sadist Metalhead.

Please continue to scum hunt in the meantime.

How is it that you are responsible for a pinhead box if your only actions available would have been as Jeff? You didn't become pinhead until day 2 started.

BCT was also named Quiet, so wouldn't it be the same name AND the same effect?

Zzz

Maybe having a single killer first is a sort of flavor miller? I don't like it though

2 confirmed claims of survivor first, killer second.
Ben and BCT/Lea both claimed survivor first.

If true this also means that Ashe and BCT/Lea had the exact same functional abilities N1. Both claiming Quiet (ninja) with a vanilla trait.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/7/7441550a.png

htaeD posted...

... you were a killer day1?

My thoughts exactly. Does anyone else want to claim to have been a killer first? I'll confirm that I was not.

I think Gamefaqs doesn't like how wide it is. Let's try a vertical layout:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/d/d4cf3d48.png

I think that should work nicer, though it will still balloon sideways a bit as longer traits/descriptions get added. Might have to do vertical and split it between two pages of 8/9 players to be able to keep scaling it.

Can try blue/red next time. You think passive/active visualization is better than scanning/protection? Also am I missing anything?

That didn't come through very well by copy/pasting from Paint, lets try this isntead:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/c/c90a7b94.png

I'm putting together my spreadsheet of information and I did notice something.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


BlueCrystalTear posted...

Day 1 role was basically Vanilla Ninja. For whatever reason I had no actions, but I wouldn't be seen at night if for some reason I moved

Would Lea say "don't have game abilities" even when faced with what seems to be the Passive ability of being a Ninja? It's thin but something to think about. It's also possible that BCT/Lea's second flavor has the ability to generate an item or ability that could then be used by their ninja self?

Either way this is what I have so far. Using (V) and yellow highlights for flavor-only traits.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/f/f0008783.png

It's gonna be a lot more cluttered and confusing than normal so I'll try to use color coding to make it easier. Yellow will continue to be vanilla traits. Maybe use something else for passive/active traits? Or to isolate scanning/information traits vs protection vs other? Open to suggestions to make it more digestible and currently including a column for day actions as well as night since they seem to be relevant enough to warrant letting us know when day actions lock/resolve.

red13n posted...

Oh and the boxhunt sucks cause we feel stalled til we figure it out and no one has said anything that seems important at all on it unless I'm missing something.

Forceful_Dragon posted...

But now I would like to hear from red about whether or not he is STILL functionally a miller in his second form.

Just gonna bring this up again

It could also mean that if we decided to cast votes despite being unable to move them that the day would end when we lynch someone early, before enough time has passed for the box to reveal itself.

EDumey posted...

and then you post before looking to see if I posted justification to stand behind my vote, which I did. Maybe you weren't intentionally trying to spin a false framing, but you only looking for Vote posts and launching a statement like that at me was false.

You are looking at my post incorrectly.

The point of my post was not "Dumey only wanted Brohan to show up and then he NEVER UNVOTED HIM"

It was "Dumey made a choice to leave his vote on someone that did not have a chance to be lynched. Also, here is his original vote from 9 hours before end of day".

You are choosing to infer that my including your vote means it was the reason I have a problem with you keeping your vote on Brohan, and that's the part that is false. My problem with you leaving your vote on Brohan was entirely intrinsic to the fact that you left your vote on Brohan with 3 other options available.

EDumey posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/80607678/976963792
The above post, plus him jumping onto Ashethan with Ulti and Lea at the end of day. I don't think scum Ben passes up an easy Ulti lynch D1, and him instead voting Ulti to tie him with the lynch leader at 4 votes, was pretty instrumental at making it a real possibility of Ashethan being lynched.

is Ashe's alignment relevant? Because I'm not sure how a town Ashe would clear Ben, especially as Ulti was more or less a claimed vanilla so scum could be keen on taking a shot somewhere that might hit power instead. Hell scum might have even considered that there was a tiny possibility that ulti WAS unlynchable and they might have ended day 1 without a mislynch at all if they pushed him.

EDumey posted...

and I wanted to challenge you on that and show anyone reading that you were dishonest about that.

I don't care about you "updating your rational". I'm physically looking through prior topics to find relevant posts and I started by looking for all the ## vote posts until I found yours so I could refresh myself on your stated reason for voting brohan. I found it so I included it. So no, I didn't ctrl + F 17 other pages right away to make sure you didn't slightly justify it down the road with some more information because I had enough information to see that your initial vote was to get brohan to return and at the point when you left everyone else had jumped ship from brohan but you.

I did eventually find all of your posts from that day and quote all the brohan-relevant ones (there weren't many and the justification was light) but that doesn't mean I was being dishonest as you're so keen to say with my first post. My main point is that the only choice you made at the end of day1 was to leave your vote right where it was and THAT was the weird part to me. Where exactly your justification fell on a range between 'none' and 'little' doesn't change your final action which was to leave without moving your vote.

Obellisk posted...

I'm clearly missing something. FD you received a special message outside of role pms

In fairness it was literally the first thing I said today. >_>

But again, unless someone wants to fess up it feels like a non-starter.

htaeD posted...

I feel like the host message should be clearer if thats the case.
Did you ask for clarification?

No, and the more I think on it the less it is likely to be related to my own flavor since my second role should have kicked in quiet yet. But it's not something I want to focus on. If someone wants to admit doing something to me last night then great, we can talk about it. But more likely that not it feels like something would have been done to me by scum so I doubt they will step forward.

htaeD posted...

Sounds more like the result of a night action then.

Just to be clear, you didnt receive this message at the same time as your new traits?

Correct, it was much later. I do not believe I took any action that would have prompted the message I received, but there is a [tiny] chance that it could be related to my second flavor. But if so it would be something that wasn't spelled out in my second flavor PM so I'm more inclined to believe something happened to me apart from that. I'm hoping that means I'm not gonna wake up dead tomorrow, but I can't really change it now if that's the case.

EDumey posted...

The answer is that I didn't have any reason to suspect Lea or Wallz, where I did have something to suspect against Brohan. It's not just OMGUS. No need to try and discredit me like that. I was definitely not going to leave a dead vote on Lea or Wallz who I had no claim info on and didn't actively think might be scum. Ulti I was unsure of because of the chaos, and Brohan is who I actually wanted lynched.

:shrug:

I see a thread, I pull on thread.

I stand by the way I handled the end of day 1 and I would honestly do it the same way all over again in that situation. I stand behind my choice to push Ulti/Wallz much more easily than I would stand behind the choice you made. You can't realistically expect me to believe that YOU believed your Brohan vote was going to magically become relevant after you dipped.

But you sound awfully defensive for someone who came at me swinging for pressing the vote on the same person you admit you might have ended up voting had you been around.

PunishedBen posted...

When did you receive the message? Because your second persona does not come into effect until the start of day 2

Shortly before day 2 began.

EDumey posted...

I don't really care for your opinion that he wasn't relevant.

That's not my opinion. It is a fact that voting brohan was not relevant in the final hour of day 1. The other votes had already moved along.

EDumey posted...

It could have just as easily been Brohan that got specialed because of my sitting vote.

Possibly. I just know that I personally wouldn't tend to leave a stray vote on someone when I leave for the end of day and hope that despite being the only person on them someone else will take up my torch and try to finish them off.

EDumey posted...

I'd like to reiterate that you didn't' want Ashethan up there. You wanted Wallz as the second option.

That is correct, but I don't have any specific reason for this other than feeling worse about wallz (for the reasons I mentioned). I also wasn't crazy about the WAY the Ashe votes got layered on, within minutes of each other and without any real justifying information being given at the time. Ashe could easily be scum, I have no way to know that for certain. All I can do is make my best attempt with the information I have available.

EDumey posted...

How do you feel about Crescent, IGCD, and Brohan being late votes on Ulti with you, FD?

If it turns out Ashe was scum then I'll feel somewhat worse about them, sure. Particularly Crescent (chang's slot) for having broken the 4/4 tie by pulling off of Lea. But ultimately the case against Ulti felt like it justified the lynch so it's entirely plausible for town to cast a vote on ulti with the way day was coming to a close.

Obellisk posted...

Dont blame me for my inactivity, blame your host, or god.

I actually recognize this as a joke.

Wallz, take note.

wallmasterz posted...

its a joke

In fairness to death, I didn't "get it" either. (as should be obvious by my last post)

htaeD posted...

Btw I dont really like Wallz saying that Ulti's lynch could have been avoided if we knew about the secondary flavor thing.

Exactly. A secondary flavor doesn't affect anything ulti said or did in relation to the fake scan and his first flavor.

The only thing it did was gave me false hope that he was really scum and his body was morphing into that of a killer to show that we actually got it right. But then I realized he was still "solo queue" even in that other form. Then I got my own secondary role and it's clear that town/scum is not going to be a survivor/killer flavor split.

But I digress, I clocked that as an odd comment for wallz to have made as well. I'm not sure what problem he believes it solves within the context of the day 1 discussion.

htaeD posted...

FD ninja

Feel free to let me ninja you a couple more times, and then come at me hard tomorrow for some reason ;)

Obellisk posted...

Did you guys have sny luck finding the box?

Isquen posted...

The Box will make its presence known at a later time.

This doesn't seem to have happened yet.

EDumey posted...

Remember that Lea and Ulti swinging onto Ashethan only happened AFTER I left the topic.

I understand that Ashe didn't get the rush of votes yet, but Ulti, Lea and Wallz all had multiple votes when you left. If you were so convinced ulti was town, why not Lea? Sure she had a vote on you so it might have had some bad optics, but surely she was a better choice for you than Ulti since you were apparently convinced he was town. You asked her some questions but then admitted that the questions might be odd coming from you, the person she had a vote on.

And then if not her, why not wallz? I'm looking to see if you said anything about wallz. So far I found a conversation from early topic 3 (page 1/2, 8-9 hours until lynch) with wallz about why he was still voting you, but you never really gave an opinion on wallz.

Was your only concern just talking to people who had votes on you?

EDumey posted...

Hi Brohan. I didn't like your initial vote on me, mostly because you just said, "I don't like this post of his either" without any kind of justification. Do you remember what about that quoted post you didn't like about me?

Also do you think you will have time to read at least a couple topics before deadline? I'd like some of your thoughts, even if it's just, "lean town these people for topic 1, think this person is scum because of topic 2"

Ashethan posted...

Aren't you pushing us in the direction of Brohan, or was that more in hopes that he comes back in?

EDumey posted...

Yes I don't know what type of things you feel about voting in general. But sometimes votes are just for pressure and not a strict, "I want this person dead."

Though if Brohan disappeared again without giving any substantial thoughts now that he's here, I would push for him to be actually lynched. No pressure Brohan. :)

EDumey posted...

Okay I'm home from work and heating up food real quick. Also I forgot until just now but because deadline is an hour later than normal, I will be missing deadline. So let's hopefully get a direction by 8 EST. I need to reread the Brohan stuff. I was glancing at my phone as it happened and seemed to think he was giving okay takes. Nothing I really agreed with, but seemed like he was playing the game.

EDumey posted...

I think I'm still okay with Brohan. Largely because his scum list is so incredibly disagreeable to me. I feel like people backed off him really fast because of the Lea thing, but even if he does have some memory of Lea, that doesn't really make his super old memory a valid thing to pull a suss out of a hat from.

Yeah you said those things spread pretty far apart over the course of several hours. Other then the couple of votes that temporarily joined on you Brohan (presumably for inactivity?) there was no steam behind a Brohan lynch. You can call your vote justified by those posts if you want, but I still see someone who had the opportunity to put their vote somewhere that would actually be relevant to the end of the day and instead chose to leave it on the person only they were pressuring at that point.

And hell, for all I know Brohan is scum and your read(or bus?) was right on the money. I can't say for sure what his alignment is, I can only say that he wasn't a realistic option and you decided to stay on him instead of making a choice on someone else.

htaeD posted...

If its a voting thing, I would rather just wait and find out through a natural lynch

We might not have the luxury of a natural lynch if our votes our currently stuck. But the opening day post does say

Isquen posted...

The Box will make its presence known at a later time.

I'm hoping that's before the end of 24 hours for anyone who may have a day action to use, but otherwise we're just gonna have to keep discussion going while we wait for that scenario to progress.

EDumey posted...

Because it seems like the latter is what actually happened. If it was reasonable to assume to, then FD continuing to push him looks worse. If the former is more reasonable, then it's more okay.

If you think it was just "ulti doesn't have reading comprehension, lets get him!" then you weren't reading.

Everything with the Lea scan and the various possible traits he was claiming to maybe have felt like a pattern of deception on his part.

Combine that with the fact that the thing he said most was how "obviously town" he was, a thing he also said often last game, as scum.

.

So yeah, I had every reason to consider Ulti the best possible lynch for a day 1. But then you? You and I appeared to be sharing a brain cell down the stretch with regard to the ulti interrogation, but then not only did you NOT move you vote onto someone more relevant, you left it on the person you had voted nearly 9 hours earlier. The person no one else was currently joining you to pressure. With this vote:

EDumey posted...

If I had to pick one of Ulti, Sultan, or Crescent to vote for right now. It'd probably be Crescent. I have individual reasons for thinking Sultan and Ulti are playing like their town selves. I am frustrated with Crescent but don't have a super strong leaning on her one way or the other.

##Vote: Brohan

EDumey posted...

Oops didn't mean to hit post yet that vote looks weird. Was going to say let's get Brohan back in here and question him instead of doing a "choose between the lesser of three evils" vote.

And so yeah, its entirely behavior like yours that has me preferring to make everyone make an actual choice and stand behind their day 1 vote. I know my reasons for voting Ulti, i stand behind my decision to do so given the options available at the time.

What is YOUR reason for not making a choice? For joining me virtually lockstep in raking Ulti across the coals only to leave a vote on someone utterly irrelevant?

Corrik7 posted...

Also screw you FD for saying I don't read day 1 until I'm alive day 2. I skim it sometimes. Lol

I'll believe it when I see it, neighbor ;)

.

Anyways It's pretty hilarious that after I showed up day 1 and put in all the effort I was on everyone town list, and now I'm on everyone's scum list seemingly because I got a lynch wrong and very publicly at that. I must have missed the memo that said impeccable psychic powers were required if you want to be acknowledged as town.

Anyways, that's all the effort I have the time for tonight, I should be around during my work shift tomorrow.

PunishedBen posted...

I thought Ulti was super giga town the whole last 16 hours and tried to convince as many people as i could

This only makes me suspicious of you.

wallmasterz posted...

Now keep in mind town FD did spend a good chunk of last game repeatedly calling for my Lynch because I had MR in my flavor without being part of the damn neighborhood,

I don't know that I would say repeatedly.

I brought it up and I cast a vote, but bear in mind that my ass was getting lynched that day no matter how hard I tried and it was happening because my life was saved by the JK. So in that position of knowing nothing and trying to be as active as possible to both (A) solve and (B) save my own ass those are the kind of arguments I was left with. It was AFTER I died that other people brought it up repeatedly.

wallmasterz posted...

but it would certainly be interesting to see when the push to narrow the lynch down to two town candidates, who else was gaining steam at that time.

Nobody? At that point it seemed like it WAS going to be between Ulti and yourself (wallz), the two vote leaders around that point. Since I was fine with either lynch I put my vote on the person who had less votes (you) to try and crystallize the end of day into one versus the other for the purpose of making people make a choice between the two of you.

It was only AFTER I voted you that several votes materialized onto Ashe in rapid succession. That concentrated barrage of votes only served to convince me that I was on the right track and Ashe was a distraction. Lea, IGCD and Ben all voted ashe within minutes of each other. At 5:07, 5:11 and 5:13 PM PST which thrust the vote into a 4/4 tie between Ashe and Ulti. They were also all cast without comment.nobody was talking about Ashe or saying "I'm not sure about this ulti or wallz lynch, let's go back to ashe" It just sort of happened.

Corrik7 posted...

Didn't read the end of day 1 yet cuz I assumed i would die last nigh5. Lol. Oops.

I thought you would as well, that's a shame ;)

Might as well make the best of it and lean on some of that legendary corrik day 2 insight.

changmas posted...

Like Dead By Daylight's Pig Killer, Hellraiser's Pinhead has an additional object that will spawn on the map at the beginning of the match. The Lament Configuration puzzle box will activate a Chain Hunt, which summons interdimensional chains to hunt Survivors. Players must pick the box up and solve the puzzle to deactivate Chain Hunt completely. Unfortunately, players carrying the Lament Configuration puzzle box will suffer from the Oblivious status effect. Unlike solving the Pig's mask, the Lament Configuration needs two Survivors to safely complete. The vulnerable state of the puzzle box carrier ensures another Survivor must accompany them to act as a lookout or take hits from Pinhead.

To clarify what I mentioned earlier, I do not believe the message I received indicates that I am in possession of the box. It mentions an oblivious status so maybe whoever has the box simply doesn't know? But within the context of DbD "oblivious" apparently means "Survivors who are Oblivious will be unable to hear the Killer's Terror Radius, making them vulnerable to sneaky attacks.". I guess just to be safe

##CheckSelfForBox

?

EDumey posted...

But my conclusion here is that FD was a large part of pushing Ulti because of Ulti's incomprehensible actions around understanding his own role, and not actually for being scummy. Coupled with FD making a strong case for trying to isolate the lynch to Ulti and Wallz, makes me suspicious of his motivations at end of day.

It's because Ulti and Lea were both participating in what amounted to lies, and lies that didn't have a logical purpose at that. Those things MADE ulti scummy to me so it was never from a place of "well I think Ulti seems town but now we HAVE to kill him because he's acting insane". I never had a strong feeling ulti was town, and everything else about the fake scan and stuff about now even knowing his own traits just added to that.

Also, for the record, that PM did not seem to crazy to be parsed. Hell "you can't do much, though the Entity has at least given you a fair shot at remaining the center of the universe by giving you a voice in elimination proceedings." is about as vanilla as it gets.

EDumey posted...

That entire argument relied on my understanding of the Opening Post and my own role trait that Flavor traits and Passive traits might not be exclusively spelled out, and that Red may have claimed a Passive trait confidently at start of day, not realizing that an actual Town Miller may not have had a clearly spelled out "Miller" trait.

I never once thought red was claiming to have a trait that was literally titled miller. I assumed it would be something like 'untrustworthy' or 'suspicious past' or something like that which would give him the same effect.

But now I would like to hear from red about whether or not he is STILL functionally a miller in his second form. I'd wager not since there seem to be pretty substantial difference between one solo queue form and the next.

Ashethan posted...

FD was on Lea at the time.

Like hell I was.

I never voted for Lea

Because we were both saying the same things at the same time and now he's trying to distance himself from saying things that led to the death of a town.

:thinking:

Meanwhile I'll wear ulti's lynch like a badge of honor. It may have turned out to be wrong, but he behaved in a way that deserved to be lynched, certainly more so than anyone else at that point. He can complain about "this is why I'll just be idle" all he wants. It wasn't his activity that got him killed, it was the insane things he was representing with his activity. I didn't pressure a town lynch because I knew it was a town lynch, but because I had been given ample reason to believe it wasn't.

And you're welcome to believe what you want, but I don't believe I would behave so forwardly as scum. Certainly not to bury that guy who didn't understand his role PM and eventually settled on vanilla.

First, something happened to me last night. I mean in addition to switching from one solo queue role to another, that happened as well.

I received a message telling me... something. There's a couple different ways to interpret it. It's possible its erroneous flavor related to my second solo queue persona, or it's possible its an indication that I'm loving on borrowed time.

Anyways,

PunishedBen posted...

FD, did you have a little doubt at the end there? Why the for better or for worse "its out of my control" comment?

Of course I had doubt. I'm town and don't know how someone is going to flip before they flip. I was frustrated with the way things played out, but in light of the inconsistencies and frankly lies that were coming from ulti and Lea i didn't think there was a better play to make.

It's the same way I felt about Sultan last game after his lie about being unable to talk for 24 hours. If an illogical lie is being told I'm going to grab that thread and pull and all I can say is that if someone is town they should think twice about that kind of bs.

EDumey posted...

FD, in addition to the above, I'd just like to ask a pointed question: Why Wallz?

I mean, I said as much multiple times. He was on my short list of people I was willing to vote after my initial catching up post and it was largely because it felt like he was trying to not be noticed.

And no I had no way to guarantee that one or both of wallz and ulti would be scum, but being assertive seemed like my best option to make others commit to something so they wouldn't just skate by without taking a stance on something.

Hell I'm more inclined to be suspicious of those who were reluctant to vote ulti in that spot because it's only the scum team that knew beyond a doubt he was town.

2

Sir Chris and red13n

Should probably meet more at some point

Nah that's BS. Nearly all of his egregious conduct was revealed after he'd been elected, he's an entirely different person publicly at that point than the one who was voted in. He may as well have ripped his human mask off revealed the lizard person underneath.

There may be a scenario where Santos wasn't technically guilty of the specific nuance of certain crimes.

But there are 0 scenarios where he wasn't deliberately deceptive about a ridiculous number of things on the road to being elected that should cross some sort of ethical line.

We don't need to know exactly how guilty he was of illegally receiving unemployment benefits to be able to deem his conduct unbecoming of a member of congress.

60 seconds.

##Vote: Ulti

for better of for worse this is happening.

red13n posted...

wait how many traits are these.

That looks like two?

Quiet

And Eye Candy?

Reading Felix lore now though it's not an obvious connection.

UltimaterializerX posted...

Christ I will rub this in forever

You have nothing to rub in.

Either you are scum or you are in a noose of your own design. YOU were in charge of your own posts today and they were objectively bad.

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

I dont think he is but if ulti flips scum o might die of laughter

Even if he is town we'll get to read his PM and find out exactly what he was working with when he somehow simultaneously believed he was scanned vanilla AND that he might be unlynchable PGO.

Crescent-Moon posted...

So basically my vote switch is what put Ulti back into the lead after the surge on Ashe which is pretty much exactly what it intended to do.

Correct. it was a 4/4 tie between Ulti and Ashe when you switched your vote off Lea and onto Ulti.

UltimateBrohan posted...

i forget how this works does most votes get lynched at the end or is it no lynch if theres no majority

The lynch leader is lynched unless the leader is "no lynch".

UltimaterializerX posted...

The lesson, as always never bother being active on day one. One day Ill bother remembering this because holy shit are you people bad about only suspecting actives.

Yes, it had nothing to do with your insane actions.

Consider my vote to still be on Ulti, just want to give the final 10 minutes time to play out.