Lurker > Lopen

5tarscream posted...

If it was up to me I'd say no for the pokemon unless they are able to change back to their original form. Otherwise, it's just a change.

This

Evolution isn't shapeshifting
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Well, my point is you shot two people. I'm glad you're okay with that. I'm sitting nicely having shot zero.
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Two guys shoot up a shopping mall, I guess one technically shot more people and is primarily at fault.

Kinda like that?

Yeah I guess that's important.
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Mr Lasastryke posted...

but when it takes so much effort to get a decent argument out of tim (as lopen admitted), who is primarily at fault?

It doesn't matter who is primarily at fault.
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The luxury of this game is because the 1-3*s are so viable, that rolling for one and failing isn't the worst thing in the world. It's not like you constantly need to be getting every 4* or 5* you want to clear content.

Also what changes did Japan get, specifically talking about the relevant ones here? Does their Gacha get less awful at some point?
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CelesMyUserName posted...

or you can't accept when a piece of your argument was garbage so you have to retreat back to the focal center

I mean, if you crumple up a $100 bill it looks like garbage too.

I retreat to the focal center because you misrepresent pretty much everything I say that isn't at that. Heavily implying you don't understand what I'm saying, so I have to repeat myself 100 times.
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CelesMyUserName posted...

or maybe you keep restating a stupid point

Well I mean you don't even know what my point is so what do you really know.
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LapisLazuli posted...

I just think your point is wrong, and everybody but you is recognizing that.

I called you out for stubbornness last week for a reasonnnnnnnnn.

Yeah, because you're a venomous influence who would rather try and point out character flaws in people than argue. I know.
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LapisLazuli posted...

You've basically made the same post 100 times in this topic and I have to wonder if that gets boring.

It absolutely does.

But with some people like GMUN even 100 times isn't enough it seems because he still is blatantly misrepresenting my point.
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I didn't embellish on Lasa's story

His story as presented was literally

"Lasa says something unoffensive"
"Tim lashes out"
"Lasa gets defensive because of Tim lashing out"

Like I said, maybe 10 times now, if that was the extent of patience I had when talking to people, hell, you right now because you're constantly putting words in my mouth and misunderstanding my point and I'd almost rather you just call me gutter trash than try and twist what I'm saying, it would rapidly devolve into a flame war. Like, all the time.
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Keep in mind, since, you're having trouble grasping the actual point.

The core of the issue is

There are a few people here who like to antagonize the guy, or just disagree in a total douchey manner
Tim can't zone those people out, and they get him in a riled mood
Thusly, random people who aren't hostile to him to start sometime get him snapping at them

At that point, if you decide to fire back, the conversation is basically over. But the "few people" who basically put him on edge by default are as much to blame as he is.
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Yeah, and he thought he was as tolerant as I was, or as tolerant as he'd need to be if he really wanted to actually have discussion with Tim that didn't rapidly deteriorate to shouting.

He was mistaken.

Again, that's part on Tim being abrasive and confrontational by nature, part on the environment amplifying his state. Lasa would be a distant third in fault, there, and I explicitly said I don't lump him in with people like Inviso and Ltm.
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I didn't say it was Lasa's fault.

I said Lasa trying to claim he'd been as chill with him as I had was false.

Lasa's so called attempt to be "non hostile" would have me shouting at, well, you right now, for one.
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Mr Lasastryke posted...

again, please tell me how my "trump is a racist" post was intolerant with tim.

The opener was fine

Then he brought heat

Then you brought heat back-- at that point you can't really say you put any really honest effort in.

Like I said before, if that was the extent of my drive to attempt to converse with a lot of people in the politics topic I'd be slinging heat at probably a good 20-25% of the topic instead of actually trying to converse. Because like, believe it or not, Tim isn't the only guy on this board who tends to lash out. I've been called a bunch of dumb stuff directly, subtly jabbed at-- many times I just say "okay let's not focus on that" and clarify my point about 15 times, and then eventually I get a point vaguely across.

Now, even among people who lash out, Tim's worse than most of them because they don't go so hard on it, but yeah, not significantly worse than some of the more hostile people.
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Nice putting words I literally never said in my mouth, and in fact specifically made a point to note that I never said several times to prevent someone from putting those words in my mouth
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No

Yuffie being a heel isn't funny. It's just kinda whatever. Returning it all disorganized is kinda funny just cause it's neat detail.

Vivi being a heel is very funny. I mean just look at him.
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Just change the guaranteed pull on the 10s to a 4* minimum servant or a 5* craft essence

That's literally the only thing that needs to be changed I feel for this game's gacha to be "fine"

But there's nothing more soul crushing than a bunch of a 3* servants and craft essences, and a 4* craft essence as your guaranteed. Doubly so now that I have all the 3*s I like at NP5.
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Tom basically gave him crap in some TEW project we were doing (that Tim did his darndest to screw up) and I feel like they've been at odds ever since.

That being said I'm 100% on Tom's side with that one Tim was a baby with that, but there is a reason there's animosity there that has nothing to do with Tom's personality. I'm fairly sure had Tim not been a dumbface with that project there'd be more neutrality there.

I mean Leonhart and others have said similarly. I'm not literally alone, here. It sounds more like you can't accept that you may not have been as tolerant with him when trying to open a dialogue as you thought you were.
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Vivi stealing all your equipment would be hilarious. It'd be so gloriously heel.
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Okay maybe she's only a decent OCD check

I honestly don't even remember being irritated by the materia being scrambled though. I thought it was kinda funny.
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It pretty much is. The only reason I haven't dropped this game is I hardly want any of the 5* Servants anyway and it's fun with the 3*s and below.
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Yuffie is a good OCD check

If you hate Yuffie you probably have it
If you like Yuffie you probably don't
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Jeanne Alter is 5*

And no you can't pull any Story Unlock Servants if they're not directly featured on the banner you need the generic story banner for those otherwise
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Cloud/Yuffie at Golden Saucer is one of the most awkward things I've ever read in a game.
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Mr Lasastryke posted...

i've TRIED being non-aggressive and non-hostile to tim and he still treated me like a dick, so why bother?

it's cool that you were be able to be perfectly amicable with tim (because he apparently liked you and hated me for some reason), but your experiences with him aren't universal.

Uh, what you described didn't really sound like that, that's why I ignored it

I read it as:

- You posted something that wasn't directly hostile about Trump being a racist
- He took it the wrong way and lashed out at you
- You lashed out at him in turn because he made an unfounded assumption about you

It's not really anything you did wrong but it's kinda like... I said I saw the entire series of Breaking Bad and thought it was awesome and you watched like two episodes from a random boring point of Season 5 and claim that the show sucks.

I mean I'm not saying you should feel obligated to be that patient, and I'm not actually particularly faulting you as I don't feel you tended to antagonize the guy, but you really don't have much ground to stand on to compare your experiences with mine. Like if I had that little patience with people in the politics topic I'd get into hostile flame wars all the time there.
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I never really thought of Yuffie as a comic relief character. Definitely light hearted and has a sense of humor but I don't really remember her doing much stuff that's supposed to be overtly funny per se.
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I post on Reddit sometimes. It's definitely possible to have discussions there but I do feel it tends to isolate things a bit. Like usually you've got a few subthreads where two people are just going back and forth in each. Which reduces clutter a bit, but also kinda discourages other people from giving input. Also because of the way the voting system is you basically have to be there live if you have anything important to say because if you post after it's fresh you probably won't get too many upvotes.

All of that is not necessarily even a bad thing but it it does create a really different experience I feel.

Of course there is the whole sort by last post thing but I feel like a lot of people don't actually do that.
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Hi Jeanne I don't need that sign to know this.

Random note I just saw that Scathach has Medea Lily on it as a 4* which is actually a 4* I wouldn't mind having unlike Tamamo Cat who I wouldn't care for.

I would be upset had I actually got any 4* or higher servants in my 70+ draws on that thing but whatever.
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Ssurfer
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What are the rates on on banner vs off banner 5* do we know that?
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Technically it's a feud built around neither one of them watching the show

I guess Orton has failed to watch more segments though so he should probably claim ownership of the gimmick over Shinsuke for now.

Gonna try to get some updates tonight. Still holding out I can catch up by Survivor Series.
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Yuffie sounds like a pretty expensive boot I don't think FFVII has the gil to afford it
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I'm not a huge Vincent fan but we don't need to boot him
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If it works fine never update your phone imo
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Wow it wasn't even close for Vivi there

Poor guy. But I celebrate all forms of IX blood at this point.
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Easier to sway in and out of activity as it suits my interests than to outright quit.
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Yuffie
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It was all me. I'm pretty good at making post counts explode for little reason.
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I do think LTM is significantly worse than Inviso to be fair. I have considered blocking him long term from time to time just to spare myself annoyance, and did it a while back short term to see if it made the politics topic more readable.

Whereas while I may disagree with Inviso often and do think he's a bit more hostile than necessary pretty often, I've never gotten to a point where I considered blocking him. Inviso mostly got lumped in because it was largely his fault on this particular instance and because he was the one who made the laughable comment about Tim ALWAYS ATTACKING while he was in the process of completely overreacting to him.
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Minwu
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MenuWars posted...

But I do agree that putting people into different positions is weird metaphor that doesn't work well because everyone's different.

Definitely. I'm not saying it'd be exact 1 to 1 conversion either.

I'm just saying I've seen enough hostility off the strangest things from some people on this board, and have seen Tim be perfectly reasonable to me pretty much all the time, even when I call him on BS once in a while (about wrestling, not the police), to know that they're not as wildly different people as you'd think.

But you'd think they were if you listened to them. Which is kinda what set me on this rant more than anything. Inviso making a comment about Timjab always overreacting and attacking while in the middle of tirade over two relatively harmless and justified posts, particularly by Tim standards, and it's like what.
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lordloki12 posted...

Why hold everyone else to that standard and not him?

Because other people claim to be better than him.

Other people haven't closed their accounts

They can leave too, if they really want

Like why are you guys even making this about Tim. Dude's gone. Who cares. If you want a token win, I can lie and say I feel Tim is worse than these other people (of which, you are closer to in the Inviso/Ltm category than not based on my observations if we're keeping score-- you just post less) but it's frankly not relevant. Point stands no matter if Tim is more to blame or less or equal.
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I'm trying to get people to change the way they act, or at least, curb it a bit.

Awareness is the first step. Given their reactions to Tim I don't think there's even an awareness. That's the main thing I want.
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Yeah. There are definitely situations where you wanna leave it to the pros.

I'm just saying that, as someone who has a pretty simplistic return, and has interacted with people with similarly simplistic returns, and have seen them take their stuff to the pros, even the simple stuff is daunting for a lot of people. I can't even imagine what crap you gotta dig through to find the stuff in there that's being exploited, and I doubt most politicians can grasp it on a first hand level either.
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lordloki12 posted...

Something he could easily have done without all the insults and turning it into an argument. He doesn't do that though.

Again

I know. That is not the point I'm making.

It's not Timjab is not at any sort of fault it's "suck it up and be the better person if you really want to talk-- it works!"
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dowolf posted...

But the simple fact is, a lay amateur is probably paying more in taxes than the person who relies on professional help, no matter how he might like to debase their intelligence.

Not necessarily. There becomes a point where you have few enough potential deductions and such that it actually gets fairly simple.

Like I've compared tax returns with friends of mine in similar income brackets and living situations and we're pretty similar. Close enough that the fee for professional help probably overcomes the difference in the return, if there is any. I guess it's possible that the professionals are frauds and missing the same stuff I'm missing, though.

It's not about debasing intelligence though it's just about the tax code being really intimidating to even try and comb through. There is definitely a way to make a lot of it simpler, and I think even for politicians it probably needs that for them to even know what's stupid in the thing.
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XIII_rocks posted...

And why does he have more enemies on the board? Because he's confrontational. This is just going around in circles.

Incorrect

He has more enemies because he's equally confrontational, but there are more people to clash with, and after clashing with these people, the negative interaction causes other people to clash with him. And it snowballs.

Like... on an extreme example, say you've got three extreme bigots. One hates Jewish people, and the other two hate gay people. Now say all three are on a message board, and say at some point it's revealed that the majority of the board is Jewish. Meanwhile, the known gay people are far and few between.

It'll be a lot easier to see that the hater of Jewish people is a massive bigot than the anti-gay people, as they don't interact with a lot of known gay people on the board, even though at their core they have the same fundamental issue.
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Kenri posted...

There's gray area for all crimes: it's whether they were actually committed or not. This is true whether the crime is murder, rape, or whatever.

Why should we give benefit of the doubt to police but not teachers?

Police basically have two layers of doubt to crack through. Once it's known that a cop killed a guy is when the articles get printed-- that's unfortunately just how the news works. It's more interesting to report on the actual death.

However, on the next layer, it's proving whether killing was necessary or whether it was murder. The articles usually come out before there's conclusive evidence on that-- Tim tends to start from the end of "necessary job hazard" and the board at large tends to start on the end of "murder" so there is a point of contention there, and yeah, if it's always assumed that it's murder, it's easy to see why he gets defensive.

Now on the end of the fucked student, it's only once it's known the student has been fucked, the article is published. There's not really any wiggle room there. There was a teacher. There was a student. There was a fucking. That's it.
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XIII_rocks posted...

Timjab, by entering a topic and attacking people, has in fact started trouble. It is not the fault of Inviso (many things are but not this) that Timjab is needlessly hostile. This is why people are saying you're giving Tim an out - right there.

I realize that

What you don't realize is I'm not trying to say that Timjab should be forgiven. I'm saying that in a different situation, a different career choice or set of ideologies, those two would literally be Timjab, and are generally as bad as him when a fight actually starts, or starting fights that don't need to be started.

Like the only reason Timjab is more confrontational is because he disagrees on a more regular basis and has more enemies on the board. That's it.
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I'm pretty sure there's no grey area for a teacher fucking their student. There is grey area for someone being killed by the police being murder vs not. That's the distinction you're not making.
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