Current Events > Article: Parrying is the Worst Thing in Video Games

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://aftermath.site/parrying-bad

so, i read it. I'm going to assume this person is serious, in the way that DevsBro is serious about all the stupid shit he posts. Real opinion couched in heated rhetoric to play up into annoying people

it sounds like a dude who aged out of certain games/genres and assumes those games/genres should have the same learning curve as superficially similar games from 20 years ago (like how RE4 doesnt have parrying, but RE4 remake does)

it almost seems like entitlement? i dont know if that's too strong a word though. like, if the mechanic is bad iyo why not ignore it or not play those games? is it a fear of missing out on all the fun new releases, bc parrying happens to be in vogue?

anyway whatchu guys think

Dungeater posted...

anyway whatchu guys think

I AM A LEGEND

Tried to click the link, parried it by mistake.

When discussing my stance with my Aftermath colleagues, the conversation quickly devolved into points about iframes and hit boxes; i.e., shit for sickos.

...so you're an idiot.

*sees someone replied already*

"i bet its DevsBro enjoying the attention"

wow that was easy

Clickbait hell.
I typically disregard such articles since it's obvious they're just writing nonsense for a quick buck.

Dungeater posted...

*sees someone replied already*

"i bet its DevsBro enjoying the attention"

wow that was easy

I feel like you don't take our relationship seriously enough.

While I'm not great at parrying in games whatsoever (Quit three games this year due to my horrible timing) I'm not going to whine about the games... I'll just go play something else...

I also like how he brought up he's done fencing and can parry irl... Like that helps in anyway

"I kind of respect the fact that some people were bad at Sekiro and decided to turn it into an ideology"

hah

Parrying is cool when it's executed well (see Ultrakill), but most of the time it isn't (see Dark Souls).

nothing ultrakill does is good. please do not troll

It's one of the best mechanics, especially if it looks cool and has satisfying sfx

It depends tbh.

It's great in Sekiro because everything can be parried unless specifically telegraphed that it cannot be.

It's not as good in Dark Souls / Elden Ring because many attacks arbitrarily can or cannot be parried, and you just have to know how the UI reacts to try and judge whether you missed timing or you're barking up the wrong tree.

Without reading the article, I will say at least that parrying feels a little bit like the modern day version of QTEs where a lot of games will throw it in as a mechanic and pretend that it adds depth to their systems.

Doe posted...

It depends tbh.

It's great in Sekiro because everything can be parried unless specifically telegraphed that it cannot be.

It's not as good in Dark Souls / Elden Ring because many attacks arbitrarily can or cannot be parried, and you just have to know how the UI reacts to try and judge whether you missed timing or you're barking up the wrong tree.

i think its a difference between core mechanic vs combat option

i do wonder why i can parry radahn and morgott, but not godfrey or godrick or mohg. its weird and unclear

but its just a potential piece of a kit in souls, not remotely necessary to get by. so i evaluate it differently (whether thats fair or not, idk)

It's weird when they call it a parry but the animation is clearly just a block animation.

It depends. Parrying as a helpful mechanic is fine, but if you can't win without parrying, it's a little much.

Ivynn posted...

It depends. Parrying as a helpful mechanic is fine, but if you can't win without parrying, it's a little much.

wdym?

random_man9119 posted...

I'm not going to whine about the games... I'll just go play something else...

It's creeping into more and more games though lol

it depends on the parry, actually.

Sekiro/Lies of P/Fighting Game style "you do the guard at the right timing" feels great, amazing, wonderful

Souls style "there is a parry button and the active frames don't match the actual animation because lmao" feels very bad, actually, even if the dopamine hit from landing one is amazing

Voidgolem posted...

it depends on the parry, actually.

Sekiro/Lies of P/Fighting Game style "you do the guard at the right timing" feels great, amazing, wonderful

Souls style "there is a parry button and the active frames don't match the actual animation because lmao" feels very bad, actually, even if the dopamine hit from landing one is amazing

idk, people say this but im somehow able to intuit parry timings in souls innately. no prior knowledge - it all feels very casual and natural to me

Dungeater posted...

wdym?

There's a difference between "parrying makes the fight easier" and "parrying is required to even stand a chance." The latter I do not care for.

Bio1590 posted...

It's creeping into more and more games though lol

I'm not hurting for games though... If something has parrying (or something else I'm not great at) I have plenty of other stuff to play...

Ivynn posted...

It depends. Parrying as a helpful mechanic is fine, but if you can't win without parrying, it's a little much.

It really depends on how it's implemented and for what game.

Metal Gear Rising it was pretty integral to combat against damn near everything, but mechanically, it's easy enough to do that even a 'mistimed' parry turns into a block that still (sometimes) saves your ass. And going out of your way to do it against big moves bosses may throw at you will reward you greatly (and getting a better timing down before attacks hit will make you auto-counterattack).

Ivynn posted...

There's a difference between "parrying makes the fight easier" and "parrying is required to even stand a chance." The latter I do not care for.

but wouldnt the latter imply its like, that kind of game?

Depends on the game

I kind of agree.

Its either to easy in most games and becomes redundant and or breaks the game.

Or its to hard and with little payoff and ultimately not worth it.

Then theres the few other times the system is balanced. But still not worth it over other mechanics in the game.

Lies of P in my opinion was one that managed to find a good balance overall in my opinion.

I didn't read the article - But I'm usually not good at the whole parrying thing. For the most part I skipped it in RE4 Remake.

foxhound101 posted...

I didn't read the article

It's for the best.

ReturnOfDevsman posted...

It's weird when they call it a parry but the animation is clearly just a block animation.

Parrying is sometimes called blocking in Japanese but still gets translated to English as parrying. SF3 basically cursed us with this.

Prismsblade posted...

I kind of agree.

Its either to easy in most games and becomes redundant and or breaks the game.

Or its to hard and with little payoff and ultimately not worth it.

Then theres the few other times the system is balanced. But still not worth it over other mechanics in the game.

Lies of P in my opinion was one that managed to find a good balance overall in my opinion.

too

I like parrying, but I have to agree with him that some of the Clair Obscur attacks . I love the game and parrying does feel good in that game, but man some of the animations are frustrating. A regular enemy would charge at you, you parry according to the animation but then he stops and hesis your ass. Then smacks you while you are in your recovery animation. Then this other enemy winds up for like 5 whole seconds charging an attack with some fakes during it with swords popping out.

You pretty much have to memorize every attack as opposed to just playing by feel.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

I'm occasionally okay at it.

Fucking terrible in Lies of P, though. I cannot figure out the timing.

Squall28 posted...

I like parrying, but I have to agree with him that some of the Clair Obscur attacks . I love the game and parrying does feel good in that game, but man some of the animations are frustrating. A regular enemy would charge at you, you parry according to the animation but then he stops and hesis your ass. Then smacks you while you are in your recovery animation. Then this other enemy winds up for like 5 whole seconds charging an attack with some fakes during it with swords popping out.

You pretty much have to memorize every attack as opposed to just playing by feel.

the issue with E33 in particular is that they trick you into thinking it's animations and it's actually *sound cues* for like 98% of the attacks in the game

DrizztLink posted...

I'm occasionally okay at it.

Fucking terrible in Lies of P, though. I cannot figure out the timing.

in lies of piss u gotta do it slightly earlier than would feel natural

Blocking in reaction to something is just a basic human thing. Its all over just about every sport.

And no, holding a shield stationary is not blocking anything.

Jerry_Hellyeah posted...

And no, holding a shield stationary is not blocking anything.

?

yes it is

Dungeater posted...

https://aftermath.site/parrying-bad

so, i read it. I'm going to assume this person is serious, in the way that DevsBro is serious about all the stupid shit he posts. Real opinion couched in heated rhetoric to play up into annoying people

...anyway whatchu guys think

That guy needs to git gud

crayola555 posted...

That guy needs to git gud

i think "git gud" needs to be shown the door already

His whole argument seems to boil down to "I'm bad at this thing and don't like it", which is fine, but I feel like you could pretty much apply that to just about any mechanic. Most games with parry mechanics don't even really require you to use them if you don't want to (I've played through Elden Ring multiple times and I don't think I ever even tried to parry), and the ones that do? Maybe they're just not for him.

Dungeater posted...

"I kind of respect the fact that some people were bad at Sekiro and decided to turn it into an ideology"

hah

I, who am good enough to NG first try Sword Saint, find that funny.

wanderingshade posted...

I, who am good enough to NG first try Sword Saint, find that funny.

i'm generally a pretty benefit-of-the-doubt guy, but im struggling with this one. i beat him 3rd try with no prosthetics or special moves on my first run (forgot i had them). but based on your posts in my other game threads, this is pretty astonishing

I like parrying in games. Especially Expedition 33. There's just something satisfying pulling off a parry. Especially when you finish an enemy/boss off with it. Currently playing Steelrising and wish every weapon (or more weapons...or at least the current weapon I'm using since I've been trying a new one every so often) had a parry.

Parrying isn't bad, it just needs to be clear what you can and can't parry. Sekiro does it well, but in Dark Souls I never bothered because I couldn't be sure if I was just mistiming or if an attack just can't be parried.

Dungeater posted...

i'm generally a pretty benefit-of-the-doubt guy, but im struggling with this one. i beat him 3rd try with no prosthetics or special moves on my first run (forgot i had them). but based on your posts in my other game threads, this is pretty astonishing

I've beaten the game like 11 times, but yeah after the third fresh NG run I've never found his patterns to be that challenging. I just beat him first try a few days ago with the Bell Demon, although I had only like 3 flasks left. I might have revived once.

The worst phase is phase 2, I think. But it has some gimmies like when he jumps and swipes back with the spear, pulls out his gun and then goes for a Perilous thrust almost every time in the same sequence.

wanderingshade posted...

I've beaten the game like 11 times, but yeah after the third fresh NG run I've never found his patterns to be that challenging. I just beat him first try a few days ago with the Bell Demon, although I had only like 3 flasks left. I might have revived once.

The worst phase is phase 2, I think. But it has some gimmies like when he jumps and swipes back with the spear, pulls out his gun and then goes for a Perilous thrust almost every time in the same sequence.

wait, perhaps i misunderstood - were you not saying that you beat Isshin on your very first attempt on him? or are you just saying youre capable of that these days. the latter is way easier to believe

Dungeater posted...

wait, perhaps i misunderstood - were you not saying that you beat Isshin on your very first attempt on him? or are you just saying youre capable of that these days. the latter is way easier to believe

No yeah, my actual first attempt was like 25 tries.