Current Events > Live action Avatar: TLA topic.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Out in an about an hour.

I'm more excited than I should be.

I expect it to be awful so I can only be pleasantly surprised and not disappointed.

Hmm maybe ill check it out

I didn't expect it to come out so soon lol

It's up!

Finished the prologue part of, so the first twenty minutes or so.

Action is gorgeous.

Less enthused about the changes they've made so far, weakens Aang's story a little, but not egregiously so.

Oh boy, Gran Gran's actress was not the one to give the opening narration to.

pegusus123456 posted...

Finished the prologue part of, so the first twenty minutes or so.

Action is gorgeous.

Less enthused about the changes they've made so far, weakens Aang's story a little, but not egregiously so.

What changes did they make to the prologue?

How much does this series cover?

Mistere_Man posted...

What changes did they make to the prologue?

Aang learns he's the avatar the night of the comet, so his friends don't really shun him for it. He doesn't run away because he's being separated from Gyatso, he just goes for a flight to clear his head a bit and gets caught in a storm while his people are slaughtered.


spikethedevil posted...

How much does this series cover?

Season one.

Thank you.

Hows the first episode? Ill be watching it tonight.

SomeLikeItHoth posted...

Hows the first episode? Ill be watching it tonight.

It's alright. Pretty negatively heavy on the exposition, but it's not bad. The highlights so far are the action and Ian Ousley as Sokka.

The acting could definitely stand to improve across the board though.

I vibed much, much harder with the second episode. Still some minor issues, but it was much better than the first.

People gonna be bigmad that they did actually take out all of Sokka's sexism though.

My only real complaint so far is that Katara is like the Ember Island version of the character. She has absolutely no bite, she's basically just motivational speeches.

Chuds can calm down about Sokka lol. It lasted for all of, what, 3 or 4 episodes in Book 1?

pegusus123456 posted...

Aang learns he's the avatar the night of the comet, so his friends don't really shun him for it. He doesn't run away because he's being separated from Gyatso, he just goes for a flight to clear his head a bit and gets caught in a storm while his people are slaughtered.

Season one.

Thats a pretty bad change tbh. Aang running away and dealing with the consequences of that are a huge part of his character.

pegusus123456 posted...

My only real complaint so far is that Katara is like the Ember Island version of the character. She has absolutely no bite, she's basically just motivational speeches.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

Thats a pretty bad change tbh. Aang running away and dealing with the consequences of that are a huge part of his character.

I can't speak for everyone, but some of us who complained about Sokka's sexism getting removed weren't complaining about it in a bubble; the worry was that it was a grim forecast of the writers not grasping the little details, traits, and roots of character development that made the Gaang so memorable. That forecast is only getting grimmer by the day.

BearlyWilling posted...

Chuds can calm down about Sokka lol. It lasted for all of, what, 3 or 4 episodes in Book 1?

Has Chud just morphed into "people I disagree with" now?

Trelve posted...

Has Chud just morphed into "people I disagree with" now?

My best guess is the dude thinks people hated Sokka's sexism being removed because...we all thought Sokka was being his best self when he was putting those icky uppity girls in their place, apparently? Other than that, yeah, 'chud' was completely meaningless in that post apart from trolling.

pegusus123456 posted...

Aang learns he's the avatar the night of the comet, so his friends don't really shun him for it. He doesn't run away because he's being separated from Gyatso, he just goes for a flight to clear his head a bit and gets caught in a storm while his people are slaughtered.

Sounds like a poor change.

Trelve posted...

Has Chud just morphed into "people I disagree with" now?

Took you this long to realize that?

masterpug53 posted...

My best guess is the dude thinks people hated Sokka's sexism being removed because...we all thought Sokka was being his best self when he was putting those icky uppity girls in their place? Other than that, yeah, 'chud' was completely meaningless in that post apart from trolling.

More like I just dont see it as a legitimate complaint. It is a blip on the radar of character development in the original series, especially for him. Id be more worried about how they intend to show his fumbling, and subsequent growth, as a leader when they have confirmed they arent doing Day of the Black Sunat least now, anyway.

I will say that criticism of the change with Aangs backstory is valid, and is a much more important indicator of possible disconnect between the writers and source material than the removal of a brief period of Sokka being sexist. Its a big part of what he deals with personally as well as socially with people constantly questioning where he went.

Sokkas sexism, on the other hand, effectively vanishes after their run in with the Kyoshi Warriors. Not saying Ive seen it here, nor was the comment directed at anyone here either, but it doesnt help that early complaints about this across the internet were largely rooted in complaints about the show being woke.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

Thats a pretty bad change tbh. Aang running away and dealing with the consequences of that are a huge part of his character.

It wasn't changed and it is something he's dealing with in the series. He didn't just leave to clear his head. He was upset he had to leave his friends.

Be it good?

59% on RT so far with critics / 79% audience score / 8.1 on IMDb (but less than 1k reviews/ratings)

I had high hopes for this, Ill admit, especially after my daughter loved the animated series when I watched it with her last year, but if this doesnt get the viewership numbers Netflix wants, Im not sure a second season will happen.

might be a bit early for doomsaying, but I also think Netflix has unrealistic expectations for their shows after how they did Warrior Nun dirty

2 episodes in and it's pretty faithful to the cartoon series so far. Which may be one of its issues because there's nothing new, it might come of as boring or "been there, done that" to some critics.

Also since it is faithful, that means it won't really pick up steam until closer to the end of the first season.

BearlyWilling posted...

Sokkas sexism, on the other hand, effectively vanishes after their run in with the Kyoshi Warriors.

Like I've explained many times in previous topics, that...is...the...point. It's a subversion of the usual sexist male character trope who's slow to learn and adapt; in any other show it would've taken a character like that an entire season to finally throw out a begrudged "y'know what, you gals are alright." The fact that Sokka quickly 'gets over it' by admitting the error of his ways and learning from it shows the viewer early-on that, in spite of being overtly labeled as the sarcastic comedic punching bag of the group, deep-down Sokka is uniquely bright, humble, and thoughtful.

Sokka is one of my favorite characters in popular fiction, to the point where I will immediately respond positively to characters in other stories who exhibit similar traits (Steve Harrington from Stranger Things immediately springs to mind). So my personal enjoyment of the Netflix adaptation hinges upon whether or not they get these characters right, Sokka in particular.

Now there's one of two ways the writers could approach this change. They could contrive some alternate backwards-thinking trope for Sokka to subvert early-on and display his intelligence and good nature in equal measure. Or, they could approach it with your mentality, handwave it as 'eh, it's not that important, no one will miss it,' and the show will end up falling flat as a result; not because of that one alteration in particular, but because they inevitably approach more and more little character-building nuances as being irrelevant.

lolife67 posted...

It wasn't changed and it is something he's dealing with in the series. He didn't just leave to clear his head. He was upset he had to leave his friends.

thats still vastly different in a bad way in my opinion. He was upset but wasnt ever intending to run in this version.

In the original he was straight up running away from it all. He was knowingly abandoning his role as a protector of the world because he couldnt handle the responsibility. Much prefer the original version in this respect.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

thats still vastly different in a bad way in my opinion. He was upset but wasnt ever intending to run in this version.

In the original he was straight up running away from it all. He was knowingly abandoning his role as a protector of the world because he couldnt handle the responsibility. Much prefer the original version in this respect.

It pretty much plays out the same way here. Like I said, there's not a lot of change. Major plot points and characterization is still all there.

lolife67 posted...

It pretty much plays out the same way here. Like I said, there's not a lot of change. Major plot points and characterization is still all there.

I'm still going to refrain judgment on the Netflix version until I've seen it myself, but I will say that if you don't notice / care about little characterization details in adaptations like this, then you end up being one of those people who never realized what a spectacular trainwreck Game of Thrones was heading towards until the penultimate episode crashed and burned in front of you.

masterpug53 posted...

Like I've explained many times in previous topics, that...is...the...point. It's a subversion of the usual sexist male character trope who's slow to learn and adapt; in any other show it would've taken a character like that an entire season to finally throw out a begrudged "y'know what, you gals are alright." The fact that Sokka quickly 'gets over it' by admitting the error of his ways and learning from it shows the viewer early-on that, in spite of being overtly labeled as the sarcastic comedic punching bag of the group, deep-down Sokka is uniquely bright, humble, and thoughtful.

Sokka is one of my favorite characters in popular fiction, to the point where I will immediately respond positively to characters in other stories who exhibit similar traits (Steve Harrington from Stranger Things immediately springs to mind). So my personal enjoyment of the Netflix adaptation hinges upon whether or not they get these characters right, Sokka in particular.

Now there's one of two ways the writers could approach this change. They could contrive some alternate backwards-thinking trope for Sokka to subvert early-on and display his intelligence and good nature in equal measure. Or, they could approach it with your mentality, handwave it as 'eh, it's not that important, no one will miss it,' and the show will end up falling flat as a result; not because of that one alteration in particular, but because they inevitably approach more and more little character-building nuances as being irrelevant.

Fair enough. Hadnt really made the Steve connection despite loving Stranger Things and his character. I can definitely see it from your point of view then.

Just finished the first episode...

I absolutely hate the way it's through sheer coincidence that the Air Nomads get wiped out. If Aang wanted to "clear his head" he could have retired to his room, or stayed up on the mountains. And furthermore, he allows himself to be hit by a gargantuan wave, despite being on a flying bison. That's two coincidences in a row that needed to occur for this story to even exist.

Also, the characters lack chemistry. The line delivery feels off in a lot of places, and the expository dialogue comes off extremely heavy.

And the outfits...I disagree with their decision to make perfect replicas of the animated outfits. The environments look great, but the characters stick out like a sore thumb. The fire nation's armor is the only thing congruent with the tone of the world. The water tribe is living in wooden huts and struggling to catch fish. How are they producing such lavish garments? An Aang's outfit looks like an upscale Halloween costume.

It's not horrible, and maybe it'll get better. But it's exactly as good as I thought it would be based on the trailers. The trailers really did show you exactly what you were getting.

On an unrelated note, how did the fire nation know that the Avatar was still alive? Did they have any reason to believe that Aang wasn't among the children left at the Air Temple?

VideoboysaysCube posted...

On an unrelated note, how did the fire nation know that the Avatar was still alive? Did they have any reason to believe that Aang wasn't among the children left at the Air Temple?

That's a plot hole never addressed in the series or the cartoon. Another is, had they actually killed the Avatar, he'd just reincarnate as a Water Bender and they'd have the same issue.

On a whim, I decided to spend my evening binging the first four episodes. Figured it's going to be hot topic over the next fews days and I won't be able to resist chiming in, so the least I could do is know what I'm talking about firsthand. So far it's very...uh, I honestly don't know how I feel about it, other than to lamely describe it as 'mid.'

Like TC said, the biggest issue is in the acting; but more so than that (since I try not to pick on child actors too much), every character just feels like a watered-down version of their originals. Katara doesn't have her temper, Sokka doesn't have any backwards upbringing to iron out, Zuko rarely shows any of his trademark bratty arrogance and hardly ever backtalks to Iroh. Sokka's actor is doing his best to pull his weight though, and honestly his chief shortcomings are in the dialogue department, so his faults are on the writers, not him. Surprisingly enough, the child actor who shows the most promise thus far imo is Azula. The actor playing Iroh is doing a pretty good job, and is thankfully doing his own thing and not attempting a Mako impersonation. I'm also kinda digging the new take on Commander Zhao, as more of a conniving upstart as opposed to the arrogant blowhard in the original series.

I can't deny that it's got its moments. Danny Pudi as the Mechanist was a treat. But it seems like every time I start getting into the show they have to dampen my enthusiasm with something weird and unwelcome. I won't spoil anything specific, but several plotlines from the original are heavy truncated and jammed together. Some fit well enough, others are very disjointed; and the disjointed ones were clearly meant to cater to fans of the original series, who will likely just feel put out that these characters were jammed in so awkwardly. The weirdest thing of all is that it feels at times like they're speedrunning through certain plotlines and character development, but they aren't actually saving all that much time (the Netflix s1 will only end up being 2 hours less than the original s1).

There's also a lot of weird editing choices. Particularly glaring was them cutting straight from the Air Nomads getting massacred to Katara practicing her waterbending a hundred years later in the span of a couple seconds.

I'm at least interested enough to finish out the first season. There's enough hints of promise here that they could get things together and make s2 more compelling.

One last thing to vent about, I guess: (Episode 4 spoilers) I really didn't like how they handled King Bumi. Part of it was, again, down to weird editing: I'm almost positive I heard Aang say 'I always wanted to visit here' when approaching Omashu, so I assumed they were cutting out his past friendship with Bumi. But then episode 4 starts, and we get like a ten-second flashback without a lead-in showing Aang and kid Bumi hanging out, and then Aang recognizes old Bumi within 30 seconds of meeting him again. And this Bumi's a depressed sad sack whose attempted jokes don't land, and his motivation is to put Aang through the ringer just to teach him how to make hard choices. It was at least plausible that original-series Bumi was some kid who became king because he was just as clever as he was crazy; Netflix Bumi is just crazy. They omitted pretty much all the challenges, and they didn't even bother to do the 'choose your opponent' gag, which served to trick the viewer as well into the realization that - surprise! - this crazy old coot is actually a crazy-powerful earthbender putting on an act. Netflix-Bumi just walks into an arena, takes his shirt off, and starts chucking boulders; no fanfare, nothing interesting or exciting about it. Out of all the scenes / plotlines thus far in the show, this is the one that really feels like they were just going through the motions. Still, credit where it's due, it was a nice touch at the end when Aang reveals that Bumi was the one who made his bison whistle for him.

lolife67 posted...

That's a plot hole never addressed in the series or the cartoon. Another is, had they actually killed the Avatar, he'd just reincarnate as a Water Bender and they'd have the same issue.

This isn't true. When no Air nomad Avatar appears, it would be pretty safe to assume they were killed in the genocide. The Fire Nation explicitly seeks out and captures waterbenders from the Southern Water Tribe (they can't get to the North), almost certainly in an effort to prevent a Water Tribe Avatar.

Ozai sends Zuko to find the avatar the same way you'd send somebody to buy headlight fluid. It's his way of getting rid of his unwanted heir and the only one who doesn't know it is Zuko.

pegusus123456 posted...

This isn't true. When no Air nomad Avatar appears, it would be pretty safe to assume they were killed in the genocide. The Fire Nation explicitly seeks out and captures waterbenders from the Southern Water Tribe (they can't get to the North), almost certainly in an effort to prevent a Water Tribe Avatar.

Ozai sends Zuko to find the avatar the same way you'd send somebody to buy headlight fluid. It's his way of getting rid of his unwanted heir and the only one who doesn't know it is Zuko.

But they didn't eliminate the Southern Water Tribe like they did the Air nomads. In fact, they didn't even attack for 100 years. They also didn't kill every Earth bender.

lolife67 posted...

But they didn't eliminate the Southern Water Tribe like they did the Air nomads. In fact, they didn't even attack for 100 years. They also didn't kill every Earth bender.

But they did wipe out all of the water benders (they thought) and the avatar would obviously be a bender. They couldn't be that selective with the Air Nomads because all Air Nomads are benders.

Sozin never believed they'd actually succeeded, so his reign would have been focused on finding the last airbender, not seeking the Water Tribe avatar.

The raids against the Southern Water Tribe did not start a hundred years after the genocide. We know from Hama that they started "over sixty years ago," which would put them at 40AG at the latest.

And I feel like you didn't think your thought about the earth benders through because a major plot point in the show is that the Fire Nation have been in a century-long stalemate against the Earth Kingdom.

lolife67 posted...

But they didn't eliminate the Southern Water Tribe like they did the Air nomads. In fact, they didn't even attack for 100 years. They also didn't kill every Earth bender.

I assume they didn't eliminate the Water Tribes because there was no Sozin's Comet to boost their power. They needed the comet to wipe out the Air Nomads and the Water Tribe has the advantage in the opposing element along with getting a power boost every single night.
And they did attack and imprison waterbenders all the time, as evident by Hama later on in the series. She was captured from the Southern Water Tribe.

pegusus123456 posted...

But they did wipe out all of the water benders (they thought) and the avatar would obviously be a bender. They couldn't be that selective with the Air Nomads because all Air Nomads are benders.

And they waited 100 years to do so. Which doesn't make sense if they thought the Air Avatar was dead. Sozin should have immediately attacked the Water tribes but they basically waited to allow the Water Avatar to come of age? It's a hole.

pegusus123456 posted...

Sozin never believed they'd actually succeeded, so his reign would have been focused on finding the last airbender, not seeking the Water Tribe avatar.

Why wouldn't he think they succeeded? And then why would Ozai assume they did succeed when no other Avatar showed up? If the had killed the Air Avatar then the Water Avatar would be old as hell. Why kill the younger water benders? Again, it doesn't hold up.

pegusus123456 posted...

The raids against the Southern Water Tribe did not start a hundred years after the genocide. We know from Hama that they started "over sixty years ago," which would put them at 40AG at the latest.

Even then that's a long time to wait to even attempt to kill an enemy you believe will completely upend your plans.

pegusus123456 posted...

And I feel like you didn't think your thought about the earth benders through because a major plot point in the show is that the Fire Nation have been in a century-long stalemate against the Earth Kingdom.

No, I'm taking that into account because that stalemate still enabled the Earth Avatar enough time to gain power. My main point is the attack on the Air Temple wouldn't have actually solved the Avatar issue.

lolife67 posted...

And they waited 100 years to do so. Which doesn't make sense if they thought the Air Avatar was dead. Sozin should have immediately attacked the Water tribes but they basically waited to allow the Water Avatar to come of age? It's a hole.

Firstly, you don't know what a plot hole is. A character making a mistake is not a plot hole. Secondly, Sozin's best friend was the previous avatar. He probably clued in to the fact they didn't get him when there was no apocalyptic demigod suddenly rampaging across his forces when the Avatar State kicked in.

lolife67 posted...

And then why would Ozai assume they did succeed when no other Avatar showed up? If the had killed the Air Avatar then the Water Avatar would be old as hell. Why kill the younger water benders? Again, it doesn't hold up.

Ozai, like the rest of the world, assumed they succeeded because there was no avatar for literally a hundred years. Ozai did not order the raids on the Southern Water Tribe, that was his father.

lolife67 posted...

Even then that's a long time to wait to even attempt to kill an enemy you believe will completely upend your plans.

Sozin died in 20AG, the raids started at most twenty years later. Accounting for the coronation, other military actions, continuing his father's search for the last airbender for a while, and the fact that their fastest form of communication is a bird, I think it's reasonable that it took that long to implement a new military strategy.

lolife67 posted...

No, I'm taking that into account because that stalemate still enabled the Earth Avatar enough time to gain power. My main point is the attack on the Air Temple wouldn't have actually solved the Avatar issue.

Aang is an extreme outlier. Most avatars learn what they are when they're sixteen and then it takes years of training to master all four elements. It took Korra thirteen years to master earth, air, and fire.

So even if Aang had been killed, the Water Tribe avatar had been born, and they'd managed to master them in secret, that still gives the Fire Nation about thirty years to freely swing their dick around. And they'd be down airbending, so they wouldn't even be at full power.

And aaaaaall of this is supplementary to the idea that Sozin's decision to wipe out the Air Nomads to get to the avatar was at least partially motivated by Roku threatening to stop him if he continued his conquest which made him big mad.

pegusus123456 posted...

Firstly, you don't know what a plot hole is. A character making a mistake is not a plot hole. Secondly, Sozin's best friend was the previous avatar. He probably clued in to the fact they didn't get him when there was no apocalyptic demigod suddenly rampaging across his forces when the Avatar State kicked in.

I'm well aware of what a "plot hole" is and this qualifies. This was not a mistake, it's the entire premise of the show and treated as though it makes sense when it actually doesn't. And you're making a lot of assumptions to fill it.

pegusus123456 posted...

Sozin died in 20AG, the raids started at most twenty years later. Accounting for the coronation, other military actions, continuing his father's search for the last airbender for a while, and the fact that their fastest form of communication is a bird, I think it's reasonable that it took that long to implement a new military strategy.

Their mode of communication never impeded them in the series. You're overthinking it. The fact is it wasn't fully thought out when they wrote the show and that's fine. It's still a plot hole.

pegusus123456 posted...

Aang is an extreme outlier. Most avatars learn what they are when they're sixteen and then it takes years of training to master all four elements. It took Korra thirteen years to master earth, air, and fire.

So even if Aang had been killed, the Water Tribe avatar had been born, and they'd managed to master them in secret, that still gives the Fire Nation about thirty years to freely swing their dick around. And they'd be down airbending, so they wouldn't even be at full power.

And once those 30 years are up, they're screwed so what would be the point? It's treated in the show like wiping out the Air nomads is the end all he all of the plan and would allow them total victory when, in reality, it wouldn't really change much.

lolife67 posted...

I'm well aware of what a "plot hole" is and this qualifies.

I don't think there's any point in continuing this discussion because, my man, even if you were correct about everything, it still wouldn't be a plot hole. The show itself paints Sozin's search for the last airbender as unhealthily obsessive. You disagreeing with the military tactics of the Fire Nation is not a plot hole.

lolife67 posted...

It's treated in the show like wiping out the Air nomads is the end all he all of the plan and would allow them total victory when, in reality, it wouldn't really change much.

How is it treated as the "end all be all" of the plan when the very start of the series clearly shows it lead into a century of war?

TheSavageDragon posted...

How is it treated as the "end all be all" of the plan when the very start of the series clearly shows it lead into a century of war?

I mean as far as ending the threat of the Avatar from the Fire Nation's POV. When it really wouldn't have done anything even had they succeeded in killing the Air Avatar.

I was never excited about this, but I'm a few minutes in and I'm liking it so far. t
The opening bit was cool. Lmao though at how Kyoshis narration was like a more verbose version of the cartoon classic.

I'm on episode 5. The owl looks super detailed wow.

Umm there is some pacing issues imo. Got really noticeable for me in episode 3.

The use of blur in the background causes my TV to have an astigmatism effect with some of the artificial light sources like those green lamps in the prison.. I have HDR on. Might be a limitation of my VA TV's local dimming? Are oled tvs having this effect too?

I like most of the action scenes so far. My only gripe is that the water bending without ice looks sooo weak. Like how tf are characters being hurt by that? It looks to be a weaker pressure than what comes out of powerful firetruck hoses. The iced up version is fine tho

I've watched a couple more episodes, starting episode six now.

I don't really get the hate tbh? Like I've been fucking bombarded by people posting on the subreddit talking about how it's garbage and it's honestly fine? Not as good as I was hoping, but not nearly as bad as I'd feared. I quite enjoyed the spirit world episode, even if they did mash a few things together. The acting still isn't amazing, but it's gotten better than it was in that first episode or two.

Ratchetrockon posted...

My only gripe is that the water bending without ice looks sooo weak.

This is true though. Katara just looks like she's splashing them. It's probably tough to do well in live action, but I think the only thing they'd really have to do is cut back on the splashing. Like when she water whips someone, don't have it just immediately disperse into a cloud of water, have it keep its shape.

Not all of the changes have been good, but I will say this show's Ozai is a massive improvement. I know some people will dislike that he's so prominent and not just a shadowed face and a mean voice, but he's just such an absolute piece of shit in the live action.

It's really not a terrible show, if you judge it on its own, and not compared to the original. It has pacing issues, and is terrible at dropping lore. The Air Temple battle was pretty lame. I wish shows would stop doing action sequences with all these half-second clips with 90,000 cuts in a three minute scene. But Sokka is pretty good, Azula shows promise. Iroh is good. The bending actually looks impressive.

...Okay, so it's really a poorly executed show that is fairly enjoyable because the source material is amazing.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b83d12a8.jpg

Omg cute (episode 8 spoiler)

I was expecting aang to be start blasting atomic breaths lol

I just finished it. I thought it was petty good overall. I want a book 2 because Toph is my favorite character.