Board 8 > SMFFFC 25th Anniversary Tournament - Bracket and Discussion Topic

(+) Yeah! (+)

I know who I'm killing first!

One vote kill the entire way or at some point do you pause the topic and switch to 2 votes, 3 votes, etc at some point?

guffguy89 posted...

Would you be interested in setting something up? An automated Kill My would likely be easier than trying to run it manually.

I'd have to add the kill my feature to the more recent contest bot code since I rebuilt it, but yeah actually if there's interest I'd be down for it!

tho 248 would be a lot for 1 round per day especially kill contest that by design narrows down into a field of the least liked characters in the bunch. there's the options of doing x rounds per day, or 24/7, maybe with x hour breaks, x eliminations per round, etc - or indeed just one long round

There's a lot of different ways to run a Kill My. I guess my original thought was to take inspiration from the Kill My Pokemon contest that would happen at the end of every Save My Pokemon contest.

The rules there was that it was just a single round. All characters included. I think everyone was allowed to kill 1 character per hour, and since there were over 700 pokemon, that made sense.

The round just kept going until only one character remained. It's a shorter contest than doing multiple rounds, but I kinda think it embodies the Kill My spirit moreso that way.

The only tweak I made from the Kill My Pokemon contest was to change it from 1 kill per hour to 1 kill per day to elongate the contest a bit and since it is a smaller field than the kill my pokemon contest was.

If we wanted to stretch it out into a multi-round Kill My, we'd have to discuss how that would look exactly.

One long round is best imho

np, y'all decide on rules and i can set up a bot to do that

@Grimlyn

What do you think about the single round option? All 248 characters, one round. Do you think it would be easy to set up a bot to run that? I imagine it might be a little easier setup than a multi-round variation.

Edit: And I think limiting users to 1 kill per day could help make it go a little longer. If we make it one kill per hour, the contest would end in a day. 1 kill per day would extend the contest to about a week. Which is a nice length for an inbetween thanksgiving and Christmas contests.

I don't expect much difficulty, tho remaining idea of Suprak's about switching up kills to die after the field thins down which still wouldn't be much difficulty to implement

Or, yes, having a gradual increase in kill count needed could also extend things a bit. That is actually an interesting concept that could be a neat addition.

1 kill per 24 hours sounds awful. If you want it to last longer, I would suggest splitting it into rounds where like, day 1 we kill some characters, day 2 we kill more, etc. Especially if you plan on increasing the kill count needed.

Though I think the kill my standard is best, just a single round that ends the same day.

the argument against having it all done in a single day is that, even if the date is announced ahead of time, there is undoubtedly going to be some people unavailable that day to play. So then they just miss out on the whole thing.

I know something like one kill a day is a bit tedious, but it would allow for everyone to participate and even allow for things to marinate a bit as far as strategy and such.

Though, having it split up into daily rounds that end once a kill cap is reached is an option, and could work well with a increasing kill count option. I think the problem of people missing out on rounds would still come into play. To mitigate that, if that is the path we choose, I would suggest maybe a consistent daily start time, which wouldn't be too hard to set up if a bot was running it I imagine.

I'll participate in anything, I was just thinking the other day how it's a Save My desert. Used to be you couldn't walk around B8 without tripping on a bot contest, Waifu, MCU, or whatever _Keeby was in the mood to run, lol. We also never got the "Save My God" from Johnbobb come to think of it...

I've actually never participated in a Kill My before, wouldn't the winner just be the most mid out there, the most banal that doesn't stand out?

MartinFF7 posted...

I've actually never participated in a Kill My before, wouldn't the winner just be the most mid out there, the most banal that doesn't stand out?

I think that would be the best part! With 248 characters, that's a pretty wide range for 'mid' characters to slip into the late-game. Popular characters who have haters, like Lightning, will die immediately. Legit hated characters like Palom will also die immediately. Then even popular characters without haters, like Vivi, will get picked off simply because they're popular... and that's where the fun begins! What crazy, forgettable nonsense is going to reach the end? I'm excited to find out.

I think one kill per day, plus one long round, would be the most interesting. It would allow a decent amount of strategizing, even early on. Do I waste my daily kill on a character a lot of people hate, or do I prioritize someone only I hate and hope the other character gets taken out by someone else? If the round went too fast, it'd be over too quickly for any of that. And, if there were multiple rounds, it would also start blurring together a bit. I don't want to have to kill Jecht fifty times.

In one long round, it could also be fun at certain points to increase the number of 'kills' needed to eliminate someone. It would add a lot to the strategy. For instance, I would need to take Jecht out early, because if he sticks around into the late-game there might not be enough other Jecht haters to take him out with me. I understand that programming something like that might be tough for GMUN, though, so I'd also be fine with just one kill to die the whole way through.

Anyway, as you can tell by how much I talked about it, I'm excited at the idea of a kill-my (and I really want to kill Jecht)

Robazoid posted...

I think that would be the best part! With 248 characters, that's a pretty wide range for 'mid' characters to slip into the late-game. Popular characters who have haters, like Lightning, will die immediately. Legit hated characters like Palom will also die immediately. Then even popular characters without haters, like Vivi, will get picked off simply because they're popular... and that's where the fun begins! What crazy, forgettable nonsense is going to reach the end? I'm excited to find out.

I think one kill per day, plus one long round, would be the most interesting. It would allow a decent amount of strategizing, even early on. Do I waste my daily kill on a character a lot of people hate, or do I prioritize someone only I hate and hope the other character gets taken out by someone else? If the round went too fast, it'd be over too quickly for any of that. And, if there were multiple rounds, it would also start blurring together a bit. I don't want to have to kill Jecht fifty times.

Very well said (except for the part about Jecht, he's amazing). The fun of a Kill My is having no idea which mid character is going to somehow come out on top. The 1-round, winner-takes-all aspect of it also adds to the intrigue. And as Roba mentioned, by adding a 24-hour buffer between votes, it will actually give time for strategy, discussion, and just the chance to enjoy the contest for the week or so that it'll last.

Personally, I would vote against upping the kill count at certain thresholds. I don't know. I just like the purity of the classic Kill My where every vote someone casts kills a character. It would also make the 24 hour rule a little too long and tedious. I think if we were to go the route of upping the kill count at certain stages, we would likely have to have it as 1 vote per hour, and separate it into different rounds that end when a certain kill cap is reached. Or just bite the bullet and have one continuous round that ends in a day or two.

I think one single round is best, with only one kill necessary all the way through. Once every 24 hours is an interesting idea too, people will inevitably hold off near the end so they can snipe out someone they dislike.

I predict the winner will be... Sazh

Kill My Final Fantasy, where we determine who the most inoffensive Final Fantasy character is!

Does anyone hate Sabin

He might be viewed as overrated

in order for a character to be overrated they kind of at least need at least one stan

If the goal is to last a week, an easy schedule would be to kill 50 day 1, 50 day 2, 40 day 3, 40 day 4, 30 day 5, 20 day 6, leaving the final ~18 for day 7.

Alternatively if you want it to be like Pokemon, just do it all in one round and require 3 kill votes per character. Voila, ~750 votes.

pjbasis posted...

Does anyone hate Sabin

Inviso does, sadly. But then vis might be too busy annihilating the X cast to get around to him...

inviso doesn't like that kind of a bear

So just to check in on this. Several ideas have been thrown around, and while it's impossible for what's ultimately decided to be everyone's first choice, that's why we're having this discussion.

While I still favor the 1 round, 1 kill, 1 per 24 hour idea, there are a couple people who aren't fans of the 1 kill per 24 hour rule. So let's look at the alternatives.

The more I think about it, the more a gradual increase seems unappealing. There would just be too much incentive in killing strong characters early when they only require 1 kill, rather than waiting until it takes more kills. Nobody would bother killing fodder in the beginning because of this. It's just too imbalanced of a concept. If anyone disagrees, feel free to chime in.

I think mnk's idea of 3 kills per character from beginning to end is a plausible solution to consider for those who want more frequent voting intervals. For one thing, it would be nice if your favorite couldn't be killed instantly, but rather it would take 3 kills from 3 different users to fully eliminate a character. Having roughly 750 kills needed would extend the contest to at least a couple days. The voting would likely be 1 kill per hour, though I would argue 1 kill every 2 hours could help extend it even further. A bot or someone else would need to run such a venture though. Updates may have to be shown on an external link of some kind for at least the first half of the contest.

So what are people more in favor of at the moment?

Scenario A: 1 continuous round, 1 kill to eliminate, 1 kill per 24 hours
Scenario B: 1 continuous round, 3 kills to eliminate, 1 kill per 1 or 2 hours
Scenario C: Some other option

Some of this also depends on GMUNs ability to set up a bot for this. I would volunteer to run Scenario A manually if a bot cannot be created. Otherwise, a bot or other volunteers would have to step in to run alternate scenarios.

I vote A, I think it best fits the spirit of a Kill My.

on more thought and seeing the tiny ones go by, the idea about changing the # kills to die is probably a double-edged sword and would even further encourage people to kill tough competition early while it's easier to do so

although i am kinda interested in maybe the reverse - starting at 2 kills to die and rolling it down to 1 at the half-way point. then it's not just the quick-draws deciding the bottom of the field

although if that was the case would that mean everyone at the halfway point with 1 kill on them would they get insta-killed at the half-way point or would they get a second wind for surviving.... second wind actually sounds cool, although in fairness that would should also free up the kills of people who attempted them

outside of that theorizing, I would so far be on Scenario B just 'cause it's really lame of the first kills to always take the wind out of the big names from a single murderer

I'd vote for a mix of A and B. Either two or three to kill (preventing one person from sniping anything, assuming you also ban trading), but then also give everyone either two or three kills per day to keep it the same length. Maybe every 12 hours, but I wouldn't like it any quicker than that.

daily budget of kills is an interesting idea

A and B are both bad. The contest shouldn't be active 24 hours per day. Then it could end at 4am or something. Either do a standard kill my all in one day or limit kills per day by limiting the amount of time a round is active per day. Any longer of a duration than 1 hour between kills (in the same active period) just makes it too much of a slog.

I guess maybe a compromise would be 1 kill per like, calendar day (so it doesn't have to be at the same time or later each time) but still a minimum of 12 hours in between. And then once the field reaches the final X, all killing is halted for a separate round at normal save my hours of the day.

I'd definitely prefer a kill per calendar day rather than exactly 24 hours but I don't know if that would be easy to program and time zones would probably make a mess of it for most people anyway

Kill by calendar day (or by round) would work, and I think could solve some of the concerns people have. Similar to the bracket contest that was just completed, each round would last 24 hours from the topic posting. Everyone would get a chance to make 1 kill in that period of time. They could do it near the beginning or end of the round, it doesn't matter. Then the next round is posted, and everyone would get a kill again to use in that round. Rounds continue until there's no one left, except the winner.

What do people think about that? Honestly, with that kind of structure, a bot wouldn't necessarily even be needed since tallying would be very simple without having to worry about timestamps.

I get the concern of it being a slog to just kill one a day, but the contest would literally only last about a week under that format. Not long at all. And it would allow for maximum kill equity, giving everyone a chance to compete.

I'm fine with 24 hour rounds and one kill per round.

I like the idea of 24 hour rounds. I still think the daily kill allotment should be the same as the number of kills required (so if two kills equals dead, we each get two kills per day). I don't want to kill only 50% of Jecht in a day, you have to let me kill 50% of Cid H too to make up for it!

Yes, the thought is that it's going to take just 1 kill to eliminate characters from beginning to end, so that won't be an issue.

To extend an olive branch to those who would like a little more action, I'm thinking of, for at least the first couple rounds, increasing the amount of kills users can make per round to 2 kills. So just to clarify, it would still just take one kill to eliminate a character, but people would get to make 2 kills per round for at least the first couple rounds. It would help whittle down the list a bit quicker.

So, I think we're pretty much set to go? I'm anticipating the first round will start on Saturday evening or Sunday afternoon. 24 hour rounds. Each user can make 2 kills per round (will go down to 1 at some point), it takes just 1 kill to eliminate each character. Last character standing wins.