Current Events > Do you think there might be worlds and beings out there similar to our fiction?

(+) Yeah! (+)

The universe is nigh infinite. It could be possible anything that we think of could be possible in the universe. Final Fantasy worlds, Star Wars, StarCraft, etc. Is it possible that this fiction could be reality given that the universe is almost infinite with nearly infinite planets. Maybe reality IS fiction?

Unlikely. There's no reason to think other beings, if they do exist, would be anything like humans, and human fiction is all ultimately coming from a human perspective.

I don't remember where I heard this. But I just remember someone saying that they believed that the very fiction we imagine up and create comes from their belief that what we imagine up and create does infact already factually exist in our universe. We are just so far away from these places and beings that the chances of us meeting is still effectively 0 right at this moment. So in their belief the natural order of I guess what we call "life" and simply "being" allows us to "create' our fictions but the ideas come from the fact that these things do infact exist. Almost like it would be life's way of slowly preparing us as a people of this world to one day in the dumb far off future meet these beings and not be as taken back when those meetings take place.

If the universe is infinite, then anything that can happen will happen infinitely many times.

This does not mean that anything is possible. Things that violate the laws of the universe (SoL, conservation of energy, etc) cannot occur.

If Final Fantasy is real, is Kingdom Hearts? That would mean Donald and Goofy actually exist

EmbraceOfDeath posted...

Unlikely. There's no reason to think other beings, if they do exist, would be anything like humans, and human fiction is all ultimately coming from a human perspective.

True. But what if earth is like some alien story

Zikten posted...

If Final Fantasy is real, is Kingdom Hearts? That would mean Donald and Goofy actually exist

Goofy and Donald are just intelligent dogs and ducks, respectively. There could be a planet where their animals evolved to be intelligent and anthropomorphic like us.

The universe is not infinite though. The general concepts behind things like a galaxy wide Imperial Empire, or different aliens all interacting in Star Trek fashion, can all be possible.

Those exact fictional works would not be. You're not gonna find a real Luke Skywalker or Spock out there.

EmbraceOfDeath posted...

Unlikely. There's no reason to think other beings, if they do exist, would be anything like humans, and human fiction is all ultimately coming from a human perspective.

If there a planet out there that is similar to Earth, has a star similar to ours, and has planets similar to our solar system...who is to say life couldn't emerge looking and acting like us?

HornyLevel posted...

The universe is not infinite though. The general concepts behind things like a galaxy wide Imperial Empire, or different aliens all interacting in Star Trek fashion, can all be possible.

Those exact fictional works would not be. You're not gonna find a real Luke Skywalker or Spock out there.

You never know. The universe might not be infinite, but it might as well be infinite if you think about it. There are estimates ranging from 70 quintillion to 700 quintillion planets out there, with other estimates up to the sextillion number. It's basically infinite.

Anything is possible with those numbers.

there might be a galaxy out there with a tyrant like frieza terrorizing it. So glad that they haven't discovered us yet

Probably not sadly. We probably would have seen at least some sign of it by now. Assuming NASA isn't withholding it from us for whatever reason.

Hell all that crazy science friction stuff may not even be possible for all we know. Not for us or any civilization.

Pikachuchupika posted...

You never know. The universe might not be infinite, but it might as well be infinite if you think about it. There are estimates ranging from 70 quintillion to 700 quintillion planets out there, with other estimates up to the sextillion number. It's basically infinite.

Anything is possible with those numbers.

I think you're vastly underestimating the concept of infinity.

The estimated number of stars are way more than what you listed actually for the observable universe. 10^25 (10 septillion) stars with 10^25 to 10^30 planets and possibly even more. The Milky Way alone has anywhere from half a trillion to an upwards estimates of 10 trillion planets.

However, these numbers are nothing compared to the unending concept of infinity. They're actually very small numbers. You would need true infinity for all non-zero probabilities to occur, and with true infinity, they will happen an infinite number of times.

As I said, I would not be surprised one bit there's a galaxy out there completely ruled by a galactic empire. But finding Darth Vader out there is gonna be zero even in a truly infinite universe.

Prismsblade posted...

Probably not sadly. We probably would have seen at least some sign of it by now. Assuming NASA isn't withholding it from us for whatever reason.

Why would there be signs of it? The universe is huge.

HornyLevel posted...

However, these numbers are nothing compared to the unending concept of infinity. They're actually very small numbers. You would need true infinity for all non-zero probabilities to occur, and with true infinity, they will happen an infinite number of times.

That's why I said it's "basically" infinite. With a massive number of planets up to septillion (I did a google search and only found up to sextillion, but that's not here or now) as you say, does it matter if the universe is infinite or not? I can't even wrap my head around a trillion planets. We've only found around 5000 exoplanets ever since we started looking.

You don't need infinity to have some of the fiction that I'm describing either. It shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that there could be a Disney world out there or another Earth with humans on it.

HornyLevel posted...

But finding Darth Vader out there is gonna be zero even in a truly infinite universe.

Why not? Maybe he doesn't have the force powers (we could argue this too...I read that apparently physics are different on other galaxies), but you said there could be a galaxy with an empire, so why can't there be a ruthless space lord with the same kind of suit as Darth Vader? lol

Pikachuchupika posted...

That's why I said it's "basically" infinite. With a massive number of planets up to septillion (I did a google search and only found up to sextillion, but that's not here or now) as you say, does it matter if the universe is infinite or not? I can't even wrap my head around a trillion planets. We've only found around 5000 exoplanets ever since we started looking.

You don't need infinity to have some of the fiction that I'm describing either. It shouldn't be out of the realm of possibility that there could be a Disney world out there or another Earth with humans on it.

But it is out of the realm of possibility even in a truly infinite universe.

The probability of a Disney world or an exact replica of Earth with the same humans are both zero. Actually, the latter would require 10^10^151 iterations of the universe to to have an identical universe where all our lives play out exactly the same again.

Could there be a planet very similar to Earth with life? Probably quadrillions.

Pikachuchupika posted...

Why not? Maybe he doesn't have the force powers (we could argue this too...I read that apparently physics are different on other galaxies), but you said there could be a galaxy with an empire, so why can't there be a ruthless space lord with the same kind of suit as Darth Vader? lol

Yeah, there could be some dude like that. I was just saying you're not gonna find an exact guy named Darth Vader that used to be Anakin Skywalker and has a son named Luke Skywalker lol.

HornyLevel posted...

Yeah, there could be some dude like that. I was just saying you're not gonna find an exact guy named Darth Vader that used to be Anakin Skywalker and has a son named Luke Skywalker lol.

In a truly infinite universe, you would.

Possible, sure. Likely, no.

HornyLevel posted...

Yeah, there could be some dude like that. I was just saying you're not gonna find an exact guy named Darth Vader that used to be Anakin Skywalker and has a son named Luke Skywalker lol.

Ok gotcha.

But I never said exact replicas. I'm saying similar conditions. Similar beings that have a similar look and similar minds and thoughts. That's really all that matters.

I sort of creeped myself out just thinking about it too. Imagine "humans" somewhere out there...maybe possibly thinking about the same things we're thinking? With the similar look as you and me. It's freaking creepy...but also intriguing because it's all very possible. I mean it is possible: we already had Neanderthals and Erectus and other homo species, they all look similar to us. Or the countless weird and interesting species on Earth. If life evolved in similar conditions on an Earth-like planet somewhere out there, I cannot rule out the possibility that there are other "humans" out there.

And with the near infinite planets out there, I can't rule out Mickey Mouse, or Zerglings, Or Cloud Strife either (at least beings similar to them).

HornyLevel posted...

But it is out of the realm of possibility even in a truly infinite universe.

The probability of a Disney world or an exact replica of Earth with the same humans are both zero. Actually, the latter would require 10^10^151 iterations of the universe to to have an identical universe where all our lives play out exactly the same again.

That number isn't really any closer to true infinity than zero.

You could count the 10^10^151 iterations and how many would there be left to count? Infinitely many.

everything we make is based on human concepts and understanding. there are even a vast amount more species on our own planet that aren't human or even remotely similar to us in concept. to think that anything beyond our world would have anything similar to human concepts is incredibly unlikely.

we can't even see everything, we can't hear everything, we probably can't even feel everything. to think that anything out there is limited to our exact ranges pretty much sounds impossible to me. yeah anything is possible but, yeah i don't think so.

Not at all. I don't believe faster than light travel is possible. You could have a network of generational ships going to and from different systems but that's it.

Pikachuchupika posted...

Ok gotcha.

But I never said exact replicas. I'm saying similar conditions. Similar beings that have a similar look and similar minds and thoughts. That's really all that matters.

I sort of creeped myself out just thinking about it too. Imagine "humans" somewhere out there...maybe possibly thinking about the same things we're thinking? With the similar look as you and me. It's freaking creepy...but also intriguing because it's all very possible. I mean it is possible: we already had Neanderthals and Erectus and other homo species, they all look similar to us. Or the countless weird and interesting species on Earth. If life evolved in similar conditions on an Earth-like planet somewhere out there, I cannot rule out the possibility that there are other "humans" out there.

And with the near infinite planets out there, I can't rule out Mickey Mouse, or Zerglings, Or Cloud Strife either (at least beings similar to them).

Ok, I thought you were talking about exacts. I'm sure there's other human like beings all over the universe. Even the Milky Way has an estimated 11 billion Earth like planets, so it wouldn't be surprising if they're out there in abundance.

ai123 posted...

That number isn't really any closer to true infinity than zero.

You could count the 10^10^151 iterations and how many would there be left to count? Infinitely many.

I wasn't trying to downplay infinity. I was giving an example of how long it would take for something to repeat on the scale of the universe. Obviously, over infinity, it will happen infinitely, so these are all extremely small numbers.

GuerrillaSoldier posted...

everything we make is based on human concepts and understanding. there are even a vast amount more species on our own planet that aren't human or even remotely similar to us in concept. to think that anything beyond our world would have anything similar to human concepts is incredibly unlikely.

we can't even see everything, we can't hear everything, we probably can't even feel everything. to think that anything out there is limited to our exact ranges pretty much sounds impossible to me. yeah anything is possible but, yeah i don't think so.

I don't see why both can't exist at the same time in this nigh infinite universe (we don't even know if it is infinite or not). There's probably all kinds of weird and wacky beings out there that's even stranger than fiction. I'm just saying with all the planets and galaxies out there, the chances of a Donald and Goofy and Sora running around out there could be likely, or at least some strange and different variation of them :P

What's great (and kind of creepy) about this universe is that it's so massive we don't even need to think about parallel universes to imagine scenarios of "us" running around out there living similar lives.

IMHO No.

I feel the requirements a universe needs in order to exist is a consistent set of physical laws and constants that are self-arising, self-contained, and self-sufficient. It can be described mathematically as a model, even if we have to invent new mathematics to do so.

Written fiction and art does not have to be consistent with itself. Computer models like video games are an order higher, but the hardware it runs on still relies on the physical laws of our own universe. It's neither self-arising or self-contained. It's not self-sufficient either because it required a programmer to make it and a power outlet to power it.

To the best of our knowledge, the universe created itself out of natural phenomenon. Even assuming we were to discover that the universe is artificial, it wouldn't be an answer, it would be merely kicking the question of "how" a block down the street.

Garsh, the universe is so massive. It would take millions of years to count to the number quadrillion. Now multiply that by several factors, and that's how many planets are out there.

O.O fuck

Prismsblade posted...

Probably not sadly. We probably would have seen at least some sign of it by now. Assuming NASA isn't withholding it from us for whatever reason.

Hell all that crazy science friction stuff may not even be possible for all we know. Not for us or any civilization.

There's always the possibility that it's beyond our event horizon and that's why we haven't seen it

Is there is possibility that another planet with earth-like conditions could possibly have evolved life somewhat similar to ours?

Probably.

The issue is, a lot of scientists hate to admit that they just don't know and that there is a possibility.

They double down on their perspectives while acknowledging that as a species we have explored literally less than 0.01% of an otherwise near infinite universe.
This means that they're assuming that the forces of nature that we experience is what is governing the entire universe and its quite a foolish thing to do, especially when we are now discovering that there may be other forces of nature.

Turbam posted...

There's always the possibility that it's beyond our event horizon and that's why we haven't seen it

Is that the correct term for something that's beyond the reach of our visible light?

I thought that was just a black hole thing.

BB_mofo posted...

Written fiction and art does not have to be consistent with itself. Computer models like video games are an order higher, but the hardware it runs on still relies on the physical laws of our own universe. It's neither self-arising or self-contained. It's not self-sufficient either because it required a programmer to make it and a power outlet to power it.

To the best of our knowledge, the universe created itself out of natural phenomenon. Even assuming we were to discover that the universe is artificial, it wouldn't be an answer, it would be merely kicking the question of "how" a block down the street.

While I mostly agree with this, there's a couple important things to remember.

1. While the hardware we run simulations on is bound by the physical laws of our universe, the universe that is being simulated by that hardware does NOT have that limitation. We are always simulating universes with different values for major variables and constants like gravity or the strong/weak forces.
2. This means that if we ourselves are actually living in a simulation, we absolutely cannot take any of the values we perceive as guaranteed in the "higher" universe where the hardware running our simulation actually exists.

So while we may be kicking the can down the road in terms of answering "how did it start?", we can't actually say that there isn't an end to that can kicking. The "higher" universe may potentially be entirely predictable and explainable internally, with a known start and/or end (or no end at all, as in a static universe) that doesn't rely on hand-waving or guesswork. If we're in a simulation, we have no way of knowing if we are an attempt at simulating their own universe or a work of art created by 1 being in his spare time that completely subverts the expectations other beings of his kind would have in their normal lives.

It's like the difference between scientific fluid dynamics simulations and Halo: Combat Evolved. They're both simulations, but one of them takes a whole lot more liberty with the rules of physics for the sake of fun. And there's no real way for us to know from the inside which one it is.