Current Events > So the teacher's union wants us to go demand that every person gets a raise.

(+) Yeah! (+)

BUT...where's the money going to come from. See, I just got this teacher's union letter for like a call to arms for raises across the board. Now, I'm for that, in principle, but surely this dumb mother fucker knows the money has to come form somewhere. And if they didn't notice, our broke ass govt can't hardly pay for a decent education as it is. I'm just thinking to myself...where...?
Teacher's unions in Texas are not just useless, but a little batty, honestly.

https://twitter.com/KyleKulinski/status/1638293140267229187?s=20

A huge chunk of public school district funds come from local taxes. So the union wants everyone in town to go demand a tax increase, which is one of the reasons why public schools are always underfunded.

s0nicfan posted...

A huge chunk of public school district funds come from local taxes. So the union wants everyone in town to go demand a tax increase, which is one of the reasons why public schools are always underfunded.

no, workers demanding fair pay is not a major contributing factor to public schools being underfunded

I work for the government and I know we have a shit ton of money. They can afford to give people proper raises but if they can low ball then they will.

foreverzero212 posted...

https://twitter.com/KyleKulinski/status/1638293140267229187?s=20

Fifty years of deficit spending at the federal level, has somehow convinced us that government money is infinite at all levels.

PowerfulSageIRL posted...

no, workers demanding fair pay is not a major contributing factor to public schools being underfunded

School districts have to propose a yearly budget to the town and those cost increases get reflected in tax increases. In many towns, people have the ability to vote on local budgets and will often simply vote no on anything that involves more taxes. It's not specifically about teachers wanting more money, it's about the processes in place by which the funding for that becomes available and the ease with which people will just say no.

if people dont want to pay enough taxes for teachers to be paid properly, that just means they dont want enough taxes to pay for schools. and anyone who doesn't want to pay for schools doesnt have an opinion worth considering/respecting

We could tax the rich/corporations more as they have plenty of money to spare, but that would be SOCIALISM!!!!111

Whats the punishment if you refuse?

They find the money real quick when the teachers strike. It ends free daycare so there's no one to watch the kids while you work, bringing the entire city to a halt.

Kloe_Rinz posted...

if people dont want to pay enough taxes for teachers to be paid properly, that just means they dont want enough taxes to pay for schools. and anyone who doesn't want to pay for schools doesnt have an opinion worth considering/respecting

When your taxes go up every year anyway, yet there's still somehow never enough money for cops and firemen and teachers, what the hell is going on?

Weird topic, you should definitely be in favor of and do your part to support this. Everyone deserves periodic raises, I don't care who you are or where the money comes from. Many of your fellow employees could probably really use the money. Federal employees including myself just got an 8% raise across the board, you think I or any of those who received it had moral apprehensions about it? We lose in so many other ways you have to take the small victories.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

I was jumped in in 2004.

s0nicfan posted...

A huge chunk of public school district funds come from local taxes. So the union wants everyone in town to go demand a tax increase, which is one of the reasons why public schools are always underfunded.

Bingo, voting against themselves.

AI_TechGam3FAQS posted...

Whats the punishment if you refuse?

No punishment. That's the thing with the unions down here, all roar, no bite. Whatever happens happens.

The money has always been there. School admins just take more than need to while underpaying teachers.

It's just weird you wouldn't support fighting for better pay for teachers.

AceAttorneyist posted...

Everyone deserves periodic raises

Of course they do. I'm just saying, that's A LOT of raises. This is the biggest school district in Texas.

Tmaster148 posted...

School admins just take more than need to while underpaying teachers.

That's a district move, not school admins.

We're also presuming that raises is the answer to better education though, but it is not, not by a blame sight.

Cocytus posted...

We're also presuming that raises is the answer to better education though, but it is not, not by a blame sight.

Low salaries for teachers are absolutely a large contributing factor to the difficulty in hiring and retaining quality teachers

and we want good public education as a society because it raises quality of life for everyone across the board

TheGoldenEel posted...

Low salaries for teachers are absolutely a large contributing factor to the difficulty in hiring and retaining quality teachers

and we want good public education as a society because it raises quality of life for everyone across the board

Maybe, but mostly please just get the administrators and testing out of the way. That's all.

I always got high evals and my principal wants me back. I couldn't afford not to quit teaching.

I now make way more as a school janitor in the same district I was teaching.

foreverzero212 posted...

I always got high evals and my principal wants me back. I couldn't afford not to quit teaching.

I now make way more as a school janitor in the same district I was teaching.

Whoa! That's crazy.

Cocytus posted...

Maybe, but mostly please just get the administrators and testing out of the way. That's all.

Without tests, by what metric will you measure student success?

Also, what admin need to get out of the way?

ZMythos posted...

Without tests, by what metric will you measure student success?

Also, what admin need to get out of the way?

why does student success need to be measured?

PowerfulSageIRL posted...

why does student success need to be measured?

How do you prove if a student has learned something?

ZMythos posted...

How do you prove if a student has learned something?

that depends on who the "you" is in this context, and on what the student was supposed to have learned. you have to interact with the student in the context of whatever it is that they're learning.

certainly tests are not useful for demonstrating that a student has actually "learned" something

Cocytus posted...

Whoa! That's crazy.

Knew a guy who knew a guy at the neighboring school that had an opening for head custodian. The pay scaled quicker and I make 60k now vs the 45k (before supplies) as a teacher.

PowerfulSageIRL posted...

that depends on who the "you" is in this context, and on what the student was supposed to have learned. you have to interact with the student in the context of whatever it is that they're learning.

certainly tests are not useful for demonstrating that a student has actually "learned" something

I speak from the perspective of an educator. "You" is collective, representative of all stakeholders in that child's education, along with stakeholders in the success of a school.

Assessment, in whatever form it takes, is critical to educational goals, and comes in two varieties. Formative assessment is essentially asking the questions "What does this student know in this moment? What is their current progress towards the educational goals that were set? What evidence do I have of these things?" Formative assessment can be as simple as a participation grade, homework, exit tickets, or asking questions for the class to answer by raising their hands.

Summative assessment asks "To what degree has the student met the educational goals that were set now that we have reached the end of this block of learning?" Summative assessments include tests, quizzes, projects, essays, and presentations.

Now, tests are a perfectly valid assessment tool when correctly applied. From my perspective, there is a pushback against tests, especially high-stakes testing, because they are overrepresented in the kinds of assessments used by teachers and institutions, coupled with the misuse of their purpose and results. A good teacher uses a variety of both formative and summative assessments to measure student learning and, more importantly, to inform future planning and instruction.

ZMythos posted...

I speak from the perspective of an educator. "You" is collective, representative of all stakeholders in that child's education, along with stakeholders in the success of a school.

Assessment, in whatever form it takes, is critical to educational goals, and comes in two varieties. Formative assessment is essentially asking the questions "What does this student know in this moment? What is their current progress towards the educational goals that were set? What evidence do I have of these things?" Formative assessment can be as simple as a participation grade, homework, exit tickets, or asking questions for the class to answer by raising their hands.

Summative assessment asks "To what degree has the student met the educational goals that were set now that we have reached the end of this block of learning?" Summative assessments include tests, quizzes, projects, essays, and presentations.

Now, tests are a perfectly valid assessment tool when correctly applied. From my perspective, there is a pushback against tests, especially high-stakes testing, because they are overrepresented in the kinds of assessments used by teachers and institutions, coupled with the misuse of their purpose and results. A good teacher uses a variety of both formative and summative assessments to measure student learning and, more importantly, to inform future planning and instruction.

No one said you can't give a test. A LOT of people are saying it shouldn't be a high stakes test and linked to school performance and graduation requirements. Give a test every day, Mr. Smith, just don't make all of us suffer from it.

Cocytus posted...

No one said you can't give a test. A LOT of people are saying it shouldn't be a high stakes test and linked to school performance and graduation requirements. Give a test every day, Mr. Smith, just don't make all of us suffer from it.

I have yet to see someone propose a feasible and compelling substitution for testing when it comes to measuring performance and graduation requirements.

Like, what exactly kind of evaluation criteria are you proposing to replace testing that would accurately measure the degree to which a student is actually learning? If anything, schools push way too many failing kids up grade after grade because they don't want to have to deal with them. We should probably be holding kids back at a much higher rate, rather than firing them off into the working world completely unprepared because it was easier than addressing those problems.

s0nicfan posted...

I have yet to see someone propose a feasible and compelling substitution for testing when it comes to measuring performance and graduation requirements.

Like, what exactly kind of evaluation criteria are you proposing to replace testing that would accurately measure the degree to which a student is actually learning? If anything, schools push way too many failing kids up grade after grade because they don't want to have to deal with them. We should probably be holding kids back at a much higher rate, rather than firing them off into the working world completely unprepared because it was easier than addressing those problems.

Now, how do we address these problems?

hint: it involves taxpayer money

They need to make schools online only and get AI programs to take the place of teachers so they dont have to pay them anymore.

They could then turn the old school buildings into used car lots.