Current Events > I know times are pretty bad now, but man, it's getting really concerning

(+) Yeah! (+)

This kind of just really hit me while I was talking to a younger relative of mine. He's in his second year of college, and he's been contacting me lately for advice with school. We end up having this long conversations. He seems to be a smart, likable kid. He also likes talking politics and social issues. He have some.... interesting opinions to say the least.

The thing that really raised my eyebrow was when we got on the subject of Kanye West and Jewish people. He's a fan of Kanye, and he had some out there takes regarding Jewish people throughout history and the conversation shifted from "Kayne isn't entirely wrong," to "Hitler was kind of misunderstood."

That conversation was quite something, and very hard to sit through. It's one thing seeing people say crazy shit like that on the Internet. It certainly hits different hearing that irl, especially coming from family. Someone I never in a million years would have expected to hear stuff like that from.

I posted.

I'm not surprised in the slightest. It's very difficult to have any kind of hope or optimism towards the future. Everything is getting worse.

ah jesus. like a gut punch. I'm sorry bud, it definitely hits different. i dont even know if there's anything we can do to stop it. oi.

I didnt know Kanye was playing whats your opinion? Your young relative ever heard of mass murder?

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I tried to do it with as much understanding as possible. Because lately, his mom has really been pushing me to talk to him and give him advice. It sounds like he's not a very popular person around his peers and have no one to confide in.
I'm starting to see why >_>

Shabriri posted...

ah jesus. like a gut punch. I'm sorry bud, it definitely hits different. i dont even know if there's anything we can do to stop it. oi.

That's just the tip of the iceberg. He have this tendency to call people that he likes/respect "Based". Among these so far has been Stalin, Putin, Elon Musk, Atilla the Hun, and ths YouTuber I've never heard of called Sam Hyde. Upon googling who that is, the guy is apparently associated with Neo-Nazis and The Daily Stormer.
Fuck me...

Kitt posted...

I tried to do it with as much understanding as possible. Because lately, his mom has really been pushing me to talk to him and give him advice. It sounds like he's not a very popular person around his peers and have no one to confide in.
I'm starting to see why >_>

That's just the tip of the iceberg. He have this tendency to call people that he likes/respect "Based". Among these so far has been Stalin, Putin, Elon Musk, Atilla the Hun, and ths YouTuber I've never hear of called Sam Hyde. Upon googling who that is, the guy is apparently associated with Neo-Nazis and The Daily Stormer.
Fuck me...

The last guy wouldn't be Andrew Tate? Say it's not Tate...

Suolevram posted...

The last guy wouldn't be Andrew Tate? Say it's not Tate...

I haven't asked him about Andrew Tate. I don't think I want to know his answer.

Aren't schools banning shit like Anne Frank's Diary nowadays.

With the start of Trump it was a real wake up call to how many true blue insane people there are in the world. They were on the fringes of society before but now they have no problem standing on a pulpit and proclaiming their stupidity for all the world to hear

It sounds like he's not a very popular person around his peers and have no one to confide in.
I'm starting to see why >_>

that's by design; this stuff is supposed to make you ostracized. so that you go right back to the people who got you started saying it. because you have no other support.

Scare him straight with the Kitt RAGE

that sounds like a him thing

Axiom posted...

With the start of Trump it was a real wake up call to how many true blue insane people there are in the world. They were on the fringes of society before but now they have no problem standing on a pulpit and proclaiming their stupidity for all the world to hear

Oh yeah, I forgot. He likes Trump too. He went on some long-winded tangent about how he actually made the country better and that most of his critics are mainly haters that never gave him a fair shot to begin with. And then, that shifted to how it's okay for some people within' a country to discriminate based on skin color because history makes things seem more "black and white" than it actually was, and this is how the conversation circled back about how he feels about how Jewish people were treated throughout history.

Like I said, he really likes the subjects of politics, social issues, and history, and this is clearly stuff that he goes over in his free time...

Yeah, I think people are starting to realize just how many "normal" people are really conspiratorial. And social media and the culture war shit has really made people more emboldened in some of those things.

And it's like, how do you even try to get people to rid themselves of those conspiracies? Obviously you have to do it from a position of compassion and understanding, but it's REALLY hard to change people's opinions.

Many people have conspiracies, ranging from the left to the right. Many of the ones on the right are more harmful and scary these days though.

Kitt posted...

Hitler was kind of misunderstood."

Did he go into any more detail on this?

emblem-man posted...

Did he go into any more detail on this?

Oh, yeah... It started out the usual stuff like how, yeah, what Hitler and the Nazis did were bad, but he was just a guy who happened to be a good speaker and trying raise the morale of his country since they got screwed over after World War 1.

But then, he goes on about how history tries to make things "Black and White," and that the Jews weren't great people either. Goes on about how they were always persecuted and ran out of countries because a lot of them were "Troublemakers" that were causing some kind of issues. He goes on to say that they screwed over Hitler at some point, and Hitler simply saw how they were causing trouble in Germany, so he had to do something about it.

We were talking on the phone. I was literally sinking in my seat and holding my head while he was explaining this shit to me. Holy crap.

Yeah, I think people are starting to realize just how many "normal" people are really conspiratorial.

i think the realization should be more towards how effective propaganda is. it's hard for me to sit here and blame people for believing in something that was designed to deceive them.

this type of thing takes the most effective parts of pyramid schemes, cults, and support groups, and it leverages them against a vulnerable and impressionable population. i bet this kid calls himself a gamer too.

tell his mom.

Kitt posted...

Oh, yeah... It started out the usual stuff like how, yeah, what Hitler and the Nazis did were bad, but he was just a guy who happened to be a good speaker and trying raise the morale of his country since they got screwed over after World War 1.

But then, he goes on about how history tries to make things "Black and White," and that the Jews weren't great people either. Goes on about how they were always persecuted and ran out of countries because a lot of them were "Troublemakers" that were causing some kind of issues. He goes on to say that they screwed over Hitler at some point, and Hitler simply saw how they were causing trouble in Germany, so he had to do something about it.

We were talking on the phone. I was literally sinking in my seat and holding my head while he was explaining this shit to me. Holy crap.

Oh god.

This is legit by design and will get worse, remember, we have extreme right ringers running for not only big political offices but also small ones like school boards, the entire goal is to raise a generation of right wing loyalists who refuse to listen to anything but right wing talking points no matter how at odds with reality they are because they've been conditioned since a young age for that, Thanks to how Youtube is set up as well as other social media sites like twitch and ticktock an impressionable teen can easily wind up being linked to right ringer spewing BS and fall down the rabbit hole like TC's nephew has and most of them will stay there, become radicalized and grow up into loyal right wingers eager to further the ideals they've been fed their entire lives anyway they can.

tremain07 posted...

This is legit by design and will get worse, remember, we have extreme right ringers running for not only big political offices but also small ones like school boards, the entire goal is to raise a generation of right wing loyalists who refuse to listen to anything but right wing talking points no matter how at odds with reality they are because they've been conditioned since a young age for that, Thanks to how Youtube is set up as well as other social media sites like twitch and ticktock an impressionable teen can easily wind up being linked to right ringer spewing BS and fall down the rabbit hole like TC's nephew has and most of them will stay there, become radicalized and grow up into loyal right wingers eager to further the ideals they've been fed their entire lives anyway they can.

He's not my nephew. Our moms are cousins, so he's technically my second cousin.

either way he's fucked, you can't save him once he's gone this deep, once they reach that stage attempting to say they are wrong and why they're wrong will make them dig their heels in deeper and feel attacked and isolated because right wing rhetoric often words it's ideology as they're the real smart ones for understanding things as greyish instead of black and white and use it their arguments, like looking at things from a genocider's prospective and thinking he had no choice but to do those horrible things or that at the time those horrid things were considered okay by society, etc. Another tactic the right tends to use is likening these people with the person themselves, you see it alot especially with Trump in how they tend to go "If they can do it to me they can do it to you!" and "They're coming after me just like they'd come after you" they say this so often so they can put the listener in the shoes of the horrid person they're lionizing so that eventually the person likens criticism and negativity towards that person as criticism and negativity towards themselves and they take it extremely personality like they're the ones being attacked, investigated, judged,ect and when people feel like that they truly feel their only friends are these people and never come out it

It's a pretty easy tactic to gain followers that a lot of people who start cults use, social media has made it even easier and corporations love this as well because more often than not these people are also hit up for donations and buying shit merch to wear as their pride, their rebellion against a world that rejects them.

A lot of people think Hitler was right but the act of genocide wrong. Hitler basically thought he could Thanos snap a race of people which is wrong.

Acts of genocide can be found all throughout history. The doctrine of discovery and the Roman Catholic crusades killed way more people than the holocaust but of course we never learn about those atrocities

fear not the evil man but the nave man who has been led to believe his cause is just no matter what they must do to achieve and forward that cause.

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I know man some parts of history are pretty dark

a lot of people just have dumb opinions when theyre young

Spiderman23J posted...

A lot of people think Hitler was right but the act of genocide wrong. Hitler basically thought he could Thanos snap a race of people which is wrong.

Acts of genocide can be found all throughout history. The doctrine of discovery and the Roman Catholic crusades killed way more people than the holocaust but of course we never learn about those atrocities

Can we not?

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Leopold-II-king-of-Belgium

This guy killed over 10 million Africans.

VampireCoyote posted...

a lot of people just have dumb opinions when theyre young

Yeah I had dumb opinions when I was young, but "maybe Hitler was right" was definitely never one of them.

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why is it that when I bring up other acts of genocide im diminishing the Holocaust? Dont all these atrocities deserve attention and recognition?

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As a person born from Haitian immigrants I dont think you know a damn thing

So now you're derailing the topic by bringing up other atrocities with the intent to downplay The Holocaust via concern trolling? Cool. Can't wait for the inevitable suspension topic

Kitt posted...

So now you're derailing the topic by bringing up other atrocities with the intent to downplay The Holocaust via concern trolling? Cool. Can't wait for the inevitable suspension topic

People who throw their thumbs up at the holocaust and genocide in general are people you really need to be careful around because it shows a complete lack of empathy for their fellow man and a sign of a sociopath

isnt it easier to just acknowledge the fact that other historical events of genocide have existed without projecting me to be gaslighting? I didnt say anything to diminish the holocaust and Im not derailing the topic

Kitt posted...

It sounds like he's not a very popular person around his peers and have no one to confide in.
I'm starting to see why >_>

If people seem fine at first but have no friends or social network of any kind--and didn't just move to a different state or country--there is always a reason why. In this fellow's case, he loves talking about politics, but is so far down the rabbit hole that even people with similar political leanings find him too strange and extreme. If you manage to see a fresh post on a controversial topic on a sub like r/conservative before the moderators "clean" up posts, you'll actually see that there are plenty of Republicans who vote Republican, spout the common memes and talking points, but aren't nearly as extreme as people might think. Another thing you'll run into is people with the same general world views will buy into different conspiracy theories and have trouble getting along because, to them, everyone else's conspiracy theory is obviously ridiculous while theirs is just fine.

Once they get the hook in you though, you're done. I don't think it's possible for someone to dig themselves out until the light bulb comes on naturally. Source: I was secretly in a New Age internet cult for years and believed shit so crazy that the stuff coming out of Q looks graduate level quantum mechanics.

Spiderman23J posted...

isnt it easier to just acknowledge the fact that other historical events of genocide have existed without projecting me to be gaslighting? I didnt say anything to diminish the holocaust and Im not derailing the topic

Yes, other bad things have happened.

You can fuck off now.

Normally I would never advise putting a young person on to left-leaning debate bro types, like Vaush or Destiny (I dont consider the latter to be real left tbh) etc. but for someone who is already as far down the fascist rabbit hole as your cousin is, they might be a palatable alternative to watching whatever awful garbage hes consuming through YouTube and Twitter.

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https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/3/2/9/AAG5lXAAD09B.jpg

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/3/3/0/AAG5lXAAD09C.jpg

DarthAragorn posted...

Yes, other bad things have happened.

You can fuck off now.

You better fucking believe when the holocaust is mentioned I will bring up genocide that has also occurred against people especially those who look like me as well because unlike the holocaust (which I never said was right). The fact I didnt learn about that in school is what I find interesting