Current Events > United States net worth -$31,000,000,000,000

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/us-starts-fiscal-year-with-record-2431-trillion-in-debt/ar-AA12BuPZ

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

i know, right?

just cancel our debt mr joe president biden

my $150 trillion in Zimbabwe money may finally mean something.

The Global National Debt issues with all major countries is a long running problem that needs to be solved sooner than later.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

The Global National Debt issues with all major countries is a long running problem that needs to be solved sooner than later.

United States has an absurd hoard of gold. Paper currency was always a mistake.
Germany, Mexico, and Zimbabwe should have tought us that.

Boomers werent content with just getting theirs, but they had to have ours, and our childrens, and our childrens childrens.

Pitlord_Special posted...

Boomers werent content with just getting theirs, but they had to have ours, and our childrens, and our childrens childrens.

You're pushing a whole lot of people that didn't benefit off shit into that generalization

Is usa one of the poorest countries now

Questionmarktarius posted...

United States has an absurd hoard of gold. Paper currency was always a mistake.
Germany, Mexico, and Zimbabwe should have tought us that.

Doesn't matter if it's the "Gold Standard" to base your currency on or "Fiat Currency".

There's a far larger issue then just the currency's basis.

Morbius - 31,000,000,000,000 cultural impact

Kami_no_Kami posted...

Morbius - 31,000,000,000,000 cultural impact

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/0/5/8/AAJBROAADvwq.jpg

What's the net global trade wealth per year? $100tril?

Maybe quit spending money on wars

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

There's a far larger issue then just the currency's basis.

Explain.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Explain.

Some dudes get to create money from nothing or some shit then they get to lend it to countries with interest.
I actually have no idea how fiat currency works, or crpyto, money might as well be magic to me, so I'd like a good explanation too.

In theory couldn't rare space metals or space gems have more value then our debt?

If the US went into austerity mode it probably make a huge dent in that in like 1 presidential term.

Jesserae posted...

Some dudes get to create money from nothing or some shit then they get to lend it to countries with interest.
I actually have no idea how fiat currency works, or crpyto, money might as well be magic to me, so I'd like a good explanation too.

Nixon ruined everything.
Lock your currency to a hard resource, or it's all over.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Explain.

What you base your money on, be it:

• Gold Standard
• Fiat Currency
• Latinum (Star Trek)
• Imperial/Republic Credits (Star Wars & Star Trek)

Is largely a artificial valuation of a common unit of exchange (i.e. currency) and always has been.

The real value/wealth of any nation is:

• The Goods, Services, & Knowledge they produce/provide from the a combination of raw materials, energy, & Labor available in various forms.
• The Territory that they claim/control & the ability to enforce it
• The raw access to Materials, Energy, & Labor Pool (Especially Highly Educated & Specialized labor fields) to grow your new Goods, Services, & Knowledge base.
• The ability to constantly innovate, improve, and out produce your competition (Other Nation States)
• The Military might to enforce your claim once peaceful negotiations / business dealings fail.
• The ability to maintain or expand your population over the long term while growing the repeated system of making, providing, and consuming.
• The power you wield as a Nation State and the ability to influence policy / direction of other Nation States without the need for "Brute Force" if possible. You FAILED MISERABLY if you have to revert to "Brute Force" or you're in a very crappy sitation that has resulted into "Brute Force". Either way, it should be the LAST OPTION on your play book. But it should ALWAYS be an option available should all other methods of negotion and business dealings fail. Otherwise, you'll always be at the mercy of somebody more powerful than you.

The entire currency system is a artifical construct based on "Debt based Currency"
Our entire Fiat Currency System is literally run on "Debt" instead of the "Wealth" we produce and what is available when we make new "Wealth" available to everybody.

Go research it, there's a HUGE rabbit hole you can fall into about the issue.

YeOld3DS posted...

In theory couldn't rare space metals or space gems have more value then our debt?

Didn't some asteroid float by not long ago with multiple times earths circulating currency in iron.

that isn't what debt means

I 'member when they used to always fear monger about the debt.

Naysaspace posted...

that isn't what debt means

This. Borrowing money doesn't equate to a negative net worth. It just means you owe money.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Go research it, there's a HUGE rabbit hole you can fall into about the issue.

I like you now

Questionmarktarius posted...

I like you now

=D

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_as_Debt

"Money as Debt" is a 2006 animated documentary film by Canadian artist and filmmaker Paul Grignon about the monetary systems practised through modern banking. The film presents Grignon's view of the process of money creation by banks and its historical background, and warns of his belief in its subsequent unsustainability

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nBPN-MKefA

Here's your starting point if you don't feel like going down the Google rabbit hole just yet.

There's ALOT more to understanding the "Debt Based" currency & the CURRENT economic system that the world has setup and why that's the fundamental issue. It's a VERY complex & DEEP topic.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

There's ALOT more to understanding the "Debt Based" currency & economic system that the world has setup and why that's the fundamental issue.

I like you more.

The US constitution saw this coming, and we fucked up in the meantime.
https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/article-1/

No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility.

Questionmarktarius posted...

No State

Key term there.

if you owe the bank 100k, the bank owns you
if you owe the bank 100m, you own the bank
if you owe the bank 30t, ???

Serious_Cat posted...

Key term there.

Assuming that "all of them" is more than "all of them" is where America failed.
If the fifty states can't afford it, assuming that that all of the states somehow can, is folly.

Questionmarktarius posted...

I like you more.

The US constitution saw this coming, and we fucked up in the meantime.
https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/article-1/

Blame our Predecessors who agreed to change things.

The biggest issue isn't Gold/Silver standard.

That will go away with time once Gold/Silver becomes abundant & plentiful from Interstellar mining and easy & Plentiful access to Gold/Silver.

Why do you think Star Trek with it's Replicator Economy has the Ferengi use Latinum as it's currency basis?

Not because Latinum itself has any value, but because Latinum can't be replicated.

Gold/Silver is not really worth much since it can be replicated within the fictional Star Trek setting.

Latinum is used to as the fundamental basis for Ferengi Currency because it can't be artificially manufactured, ergo devaluing currency.

But the value of currency, all of it, is "Fiat" in nature.
Latinum is just used to prevent artificial forgery / Counterfeit Money making operations.

In Star Trek, the Ferengi value Latinum because Latinum based currency can't be replicated, ergo you knew how much money you had.

But the real value of things in IRL is the all the stuff I listed above.

The Goods/Service, the people, the territory, the resources you have access to.

Currency should be a way to measure it's worth and allow easy barter / transaction for it.

Debt based Currency is a abomination and it needs to be dealt with "Sooner than Later".

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Why do you think Star Trek with it's Replicator Economy has the Ferengi use Latinum as it's currency basis?

Starfleet is post-scarcity, and the Ferengi are not.

Just make more money duh

Questionmarktarius posted...

If the fifty states can't afford it, assuming that that all of the states somehow can, is folly.

Afford doesn't have anything to do with it. It's just a thing that states can't do (such as coin currency) but the federal government can.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Starfleet is post-scarcity, and the Ferengi are not.

Actually, the Ferengi has Replicators & similar Energy availability as the UFP.

It's not about "Post Scarcity". Ferengi is "Post Scarcity" by definition.

It's about how you acquire Goods/Services.

Did you ever wonder how the UFP deals with other Species who use currency?

The UFP has the "Federation Credit".

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Federation_credit

Just another fancy word for money. The Federation Credit was the UFP's version of Electronic/Digital Currency.

While the Ferengi value Physical Currency (ergo Latinum based).

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

While the Ferengi value Physical Currency (ergo Latinum based).

Ferengi value things that are things.

I have an overtly marxist friend around here, @antifar. Someone who should also be your friend here.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Ferengi value things that are things.

So do most human beings.

I have an overtly marxist friend around here, @antifar. Someone who should also be your friend here.

I'm not fond of Marxism in general, but I don't mind being friends with most anybody around here as long as you're open minded to people who think differently.

"approximately"

Lost_All_Senses posted...

You're pushing a whole lot of people that didn't benefit off shit into that generalization

A very significant portion of those who didn't benefit off it still act as if there's nothing wrong with those who did, and as if it's somehow the younger generations' fault rather than their generation's.

Lets just cancel it all

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

I'm not fond of Marxism in general, but I don't mind being friends with most anybody around here as long as you're open minded to people who think differently.

I'm way off the Ayn Rand end, but I still consider Antifar to be one my friends.

YeOld3DS posted...

In theory couldn't rare space metals or space gems have more value then our debt?

Unlikely more value than the massive amount of resources it would take to mine them

Warframe's main baddies were meant to be satire, but Corpus is getting uncomfortably plausible.

Questionmarktarius posted...

United States has an absurd hoard of gold. Paper currency was always a mistake.
Germany, Mexico, and Zimbabwe should have tought us that.

How is the value of gold any less arbitrary than the value of paper money? It's not like it's useful for anything. Except for conductors. It's valuable because everyone says it is.

Tag

I say that we sell California to China and wipe away the debt.

And yet the USD is consistently one of the top 3 currencies in the world, quite curious

Flauros posted...

Muppet noises

Dig it.