Current Events > James Bond: No Time to Die... was okay. Better than Spectre. *Series Spoilers*

(+) Yeah! (+)

I mean, most things are better than Spectre so...

My first reaction was "omg they did it, they got a black woman to be 007, I'm laughing so hard right now imagining pale old white men raging"

It starts off pretty entertaining but kinda gets less so as the movie goes on.

But I'm disappointed that they didn't do much with the rami malek villain. I'm glad they killed off their lame blofeld attempt, but there could have been something special there with a new gang that's fighting against spectre. I thought they'd bring up Quantum or whoever the shadowy organization was in Casino Royale/Quantum of Solace.

A lot of it was contrived and by the numbers at times but that happened throughout the 50 years of Bond so I let it slide.

I liked Lea Seydoux once again and it's cute that they gave james bond a daughter, maybe there's some sequel hook there. I guess this time they ended Bond for real, there's no way he's coming back from missile strikes right?

ps, jfc ana de armas is perfect

Killing off bond is "not much" i guess lol come on op he is the only villain to be successful.

Also they can always do a reboot or flashback movies.

I liked it overall. It could've used some improvements (the annihilation of SPECTRE felt like an afterthought in the grand scheme of things), but I can't really think of anything in particular that dragged the movie down. The bit in Cuba (?) with Ana de Armas was obviously the highlight, and gave the movie just the right amount of levity. And I had a hunch going into the movie that they might kill off Bond, so I was glad they had the stones to go through with it (obviously they're not going to kill of the entire franchise, but it was a fitting end to the Craig run).

I think it can now be said with confidence that all the odd-number Craig movies are good, and the even-numbered ones are bad. I really liked Daniel Craig as Bond, and I'm happy that his run ended with more good movies than bad.

It's kinda crazy that they tried to do a "Bond is old and has-been and shoulda retired" like 3 movies ago. Took until this movie to make it stick. It was super annoying when Skyfall did it, 2012 was a weird year where both movies (batman and bond) went with the "the hero is old and has been" when the previous 2 movies were literally just establishing them.

saspa posted...

It starts off pretty entertaining

Bond just seething in the car at Lea Seydoux when the baddies are shooting his bulletproof mirror was so fucking good.

masterpug53 posted...

I liked it overall. It could've used some improvements (the annihilation of SPECTRE felt like an afterthought in the grand scheme of things), but I can't really think of anything in particular that dragged the movie down. The bit in Cuba (?) with Ana de Armas was obviously the highlight, and gave the movie just the right amount of levity. And I had a hunch going into the movie that they might kill off Bond, so I was glad they had the stones to go through with it (obviously they're not going to kill of the entire franchise, but it was a fitting end to the Craig run).

I think it can now be said with confidence that all the odd-number Craig movies are good, and the even-numbered ones are bad. I really liked Daniel Craig as Bond, and I'm happy that his run ended with more good movies than bad.

Yeah I can't believe ana's role was so short, besides those scenes being the highlight she's literally awesome. I thought she would come back into play later in whatever capacity be it villain, ally, whatevs.

I definitely agree it felt like an afterthought. I actually went back to rewatch the last few scenes of Spectre because I completely forgot Bond lets Blofeld live and "get captured" in that one, completely forgot that sequel hook. Mission Impossible 5+6 did that waaay better with the villain getting captured and that coming into play in the next movie

It definitely could use improvements. For me it was the little things that dragged it down like how was Blofeld celebrating his party when he's under 24 hour surveillance which I don't think the movie answered, but I just let go. And why madeleine decided to put herself and her daughter in harm's way by being Blofeld's therapist(?) was also weird but again, like most things I just let it go.

Also thought Rami's character did something to the little girl which is why he let her go run off on her own, but I guess not. The vial thing was enough. That was convenient, him being the last man standing all on his own for a final tussle with James Bond.

That foggy forest scene is fucking brilliant.

Seems like there was, in fact, plenty of time to die

ApherosyLove posted...

Bond just seething in the car at Lea Seydoux when the baddies are shooting his bulletproof mirror was so fucking good.

Love it.

How did he or MI6 or literally anyone else not think that Vesper's grave was obviously a prime bait spot for anyone who knows Bond and would stake it out because obviously one day Bond will visit it?

I really liked it, I'd maybe put it same level as Skyfall, below Casino Royale and above the other two.

The settings were great, Matera at the start, the forest chase in Norway, and I do enjoy a classic bog standard evil villain lair at the end - even if the villain could've been better utilised. I know it's a long film, but I wouldn't have minded if they added another half hour to expand that further.

Maybe controversially, I didn't like the bit in Cuba, just all of Spectre happened to be there at the same time? Blofeld's eyeball? And Ana de armas was just a ditzy dumbass who might as well have had superpowers, she didn't fit the vibe of the film at all.

I'm also surprised the ending wasn't more widely spoiled in 2020 when it was released for a couple of weeks.

Woodger posted...

Maybe controversially, I didn't like the bit in Cuba, just all of Spectre happened to be there at the same time? Blofeld's eyeball? And Ana de armas was just a ditzy dumbass who might as well have had superpowers, she didn't fit the vibe of the film at all.

It was indeed a tonal lurch, but that's what I loved about it. It was a refreshing bit of levity that showed the self-serious Craig movies could still be fun and even a little goofy at times, without going too over-the-top. Her characterization was also spot-on, contrasting all the veteran hardasses around her by being clearly very talented, yet also new at the job and still nervous / unsure of herself. In hindsight, I personally would not have wanted to see the Ana de Armas character expanded upon, at least in the context of this movie; she was there just long enough to be a breath of fresh air, and that's all that was needed. Would certainly love to see her character return in future movies, though.

Like I said, my only problem with it was the demise of SPECTRE being over and done with in relatively-short fashion. But on the other hand, the meta-commentary as I see it is that the writers knew how badly Spectre (the movie) dropped the ball with SPECTRE, and they were eager to wash their hands of it.

Also I just assumed that the next Bond movies would be with the new 007 lady, or they would once again reboot the series after 15 years.

I hated it. You don't kill off Bond.

saspa posted...

Also I just assumed that the next Bond movies would be with the new 007 lady, or they would once again reboot the series after 15 years.

They absolutely are just going to reboot it all. The series has done it so many times, why would you expect it to be different? New Q, new M, new Moneypenny, new Bond.

RISEofCHRISTIAN posted...

I hated it. You don't kill off Bond.

You sound just like my dad. I thought it was a great ending and it obviously is not going to be the end of Bond at all.

saspa posted...

Also I just assumed that the next Bond movies would be with the new 007 lady, or they would once again reboot the series after 15 years.

I believe is a reboot.

Ironically, while I didn't like Skyfall and Spectre was terrible, they both had by far the best Bond songs, literally fire. This one I think was sung by billie eilish, and her weak gravely voice is like the worst thing about her songs, she definitely cannot hold a note.

Tyranthraxus posted...

Seems like there was, in fact, plenty of time to die

Lol "with a title like that, surely they wouldn't kill Bond off!"

The third act was weak, but I really enjoyed it overall. Maybe the best cinematography of any Bond film.

Most movies are better than Spectre. I don't know how they managed to take a car chase between a super spy and an enforcer from a top level criminal organization, with both of them driving extremely expensive cars, and turn it into the most boring vehicle chase ever put to film, but... they did.

metallica846 posted...

Thats the rumor. He had to stay in top top shape for 15 years and the west and tear on his body from the stunts was getting too much. In the end they kept throwing $30 million at him per movie til they were ready to move on.

I was always so confused by why they insisted on Craig. They must have thought that he was the reason Skyfall made a billion, but it was simply the fact that since 2010s, the international markets (India/China etc) have been huge, so of course big summer blockbusters would make money in the billions. He wasn't the reason for those movies' success. They could have gotten anyone to play Bond with the same result at the box office

I really liked Craig in the beginning and Casino Royale was perfect, but he and the movies kept getting worse every time.

au_gold posted...

The third act was weak, but I really enjoyed it overall. Maybe the best cinematography of any Bond film.

Like others have said the forest scene was good too. And yeah it's that 3rd act isn't it that's weak. I would have been into the villain lair if they did better with the villain.

RISEofCHRISTIAN posted...

I hated it. You don't kill off Bond.

I hate to agree with Christian Rules, but this. Hated the contrived ending, soured the rest of it.

saspa posted...

Like others have said the forest scene was good too. And yeah it's that 3rd act isn't it that's weak. I would have been into the villain lair if they did better with the villain.

The third act has that superb stairwell fight scene too, it was extremely reminiscent and a clear homage to the Casino Royale stair fight but opposite. In Casino he was falling down the steps fighting one guy hand to hand, meanwhile in his final swan song action hero act he's fighting UP the steps with gun fu and just pure bravado. A huge change of how messed up he was after just one guy as opposed to the dozens he kills in NTTD.

I loooved it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySuyJrLeVWk

Hell even his quip at the end, I loved it. NTTD might be right up there with Skyfall for me. Casino Royale is the best he's done, but I really liked NTTD.

Nanomachines, son!

And FOXDIE

I must be the only person who liked quantum, if nothing else it was a continuation of the Vesper tragedy and her character was basically the highlight of Casino Royale so... plus at the time, olga k was the hottest bond girl by a large margin.

I agree with all the criticisms and I get disliking Dominic Greene as a villain, but something about him and his bug eyes really meshed will for me. He did the bug eyed creepy villain before rami malek at the very least

And that plot about stealing or contaminating the water supply? That definitely got to me on a personal level. Hell, that's actual true to real life, just read up on the Nestle CEO and his stance on water.

saspa posted...

I must be the only person who liked quantum, if nothing else it was a continuation of the Vesper tragedy and her character was basically the highlight of Casino Royale so... plus at the time, olga k was the hottest bond girl by a large margin.

Speaking of her, please tell me Bond was not still crying about Vesper in this new movie.

QoS was pretty forgettable overall, but I actually liked the change of pace that was having a Bond villain be obviously (and justifiably) pants-pissingly afraid of Bond, and fight him like a cornered rat gone mad with fear. They established early-on in Casino Royale that this Bond was brutal, occasionally unhinged, and had plenty of muscle to back it up; so it made perfect sense that at least one of the villains he went up against couldn't maintain the standard air of aloof calmness in Bond's presence.

It's not something I'd like to see more than once, but I liked that approach as a one-off.

I guarantee i'm in the minority when I say I loved Spectre. Even though Casino is the best of the Craigs (IMO), Spectre is the one that most feels like a classic Bond movie (again,IMO).

I liked Nttd but i'd rank it 4th among the Craigs. Though that might change on repeat viewings. I also didn't like the end of Spectre being such a throwaway thing and especially Blofeld's death feeling so anticlimactic and meaningless.

Ryven posted...

I guarantee i'm in the minority when I say I loved Spectre. Even though Casino is the best of the Craigs (IMO), Spectre is the one that most feels like a classic Bond movie (again,IMO).

I liked Nttd but i'd rank it 4th among the Craigs. Though that might change on repeat viewings. I also didn't like the end of Spectre being such a throwaway thing and especially Blofeld's death feeling so anticlimactic and meaningless.

I didn't really hate it tbqh. I don't understand the widespread hatred of it, I thought QoS was the worst due to some real bad cinematography and a weak villain.

I think what really sunk Spectre and Blofeld's character for me was the unnecessary history they gave him with Bond. Skyfall had already taken Bond's past as far as it needed to go - his relationship with M, his return to his ancestral home, and Silva being a predecessor / sort of dark reflection of him. Remove that connection, make Blofeld an underworld god-emperor who's so far above Bond's head that Blofeld's never even heard of him, and everything else that drags the movie down (especially the contrived 'it was really me this whole time' climax) goes out the window with it.

saspa posted...

I guess this time they ended Bond for real, there's no way he's coming back from missile strikes right?

Not at all. I fully expect that the next James Bond movie, just like Craig's first movie, will be a reboot. Craig's run will be it's own little "universe" in the series.

007 isn't the franchise, James Bond is.

masterpug53 posted...

QoS was pretty forgettable overall, but I actually liked the change of pace that was having a Bond villain be obviously (and justifiably) pants-pissingly afraid of Bond, and fight him like a cornered rat gone mad with fear. They established early-on in Casino Royale that this Bond was brutal, occasionally unhinged, and had plenty of muscle to back it up; so it made perfect sense that at least one of the villains he went up against couldn't maintain the standard air of aloof calmness in Bond's presence.

It's not something I'd like to see more than once, but I liked that approach as a one-off.

I mean all the Bond villains have never been on equal footing physically or combat-wise with Bond, they rely on their henchmen to be their muscle. Now a movie where the villain is actually strong enough to take on Bond hand-to-hand such as an ex-comrade, that's a different story. But Craig's Bond was already facing criticism from whiners saying he was "too much like Jason Bourne" especially in QoS so I don't know if that would mesh well.

I did feel that Dominic Greene was inspired by the Joker who appeared just a few months before this movie. They both were weaker than the hero and coincidentally enough tried to attack the hero in a maniacal way with a lead pipe or something.

Kaldrenthebold posted...

The third act has that superb stairwell fight scene too, it was extremely reminiscent and a clear homage to the Casino Royale stair fight but opposite. In Casino he was falling down the steps fighting one guy hand to hand, meanwhile in his final swan song action hero act he's fighting UP the steps with gun fu and just pure bravado. A huge change of how messed up he was after just one guy as opposed to the dozens he kills in NTTD.

I loooved it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySuyJrLeVWk

Hell even his quip at the end, I loved it. NTTD might be right up there with Skyfall for me. Casino Royale is the best he's done, but I really liked NTTD.

That was a good quip, I enjoyed that scene. And that's an interesting parallel I didn't think about thanks, it's definitely fitting! I'm trying to find my copy of both casino and qos but I can't find them might have to get them again.

The eyeball henchman of this movie was weak though in terms of gimmick and overall presence. Also was I crazy to think he looked like Rami malek a little bit? He has the exact same pointed face and nose

saspa posted...

That was a good quip, I enjoyed that scene. And that's an interesting parallel I didn't think about thanks, it's definitely fitting! I'm trying to find my copy of both casino and qos but I can't find them might have to get them again.

The eyeball henchman of this movie was weak though in terms of gimmick and overall presence. Also was I crazy to think he looked like Rami malek a little bit? He has the exact same pointed face and nose

Yeah he was certainly a weak main henchman. His only specialty was the eye ball but hey we got that quip out of it. That and the grenades in the beginning are some fun comedic Bond moments. I feel like NTTD definitely felt the most Bond-y in terms of action, humor and gadgetry.

Ryven posted...

I guarantee i'm in the minority when I say I loved Spectre. Even though Casino is the best of the Craigs (IMO), Spectre is the one that most feels like a classic Bond movie (again,IMO).

I liked Nttd but i'd rank it 4th among the Craigs. Though that might change on repeat viewings. I also didn't like the end of Spectre being such a throwaway thing and especially Blofeld's death feeling so anticlimactic and meaningless.

I won't get into a longer post over why I dislike Spectre with its whole trying to do everything I've ever wanted in a Bond sequel at the same time thing (and each more terrible than the last) especially the whole "it was me, I was the mastermind mwahaha" so I'll just say it was a real shame to waste Monica Belluci and Lea Seydoux, both of whom I've always felt were simply perfect Bond girls that deserved to be in a better Bond. I do get where you're coming from though since Spectre is a movie I wanted to like. And while James Bond is basically the spy, the most famous and quintessential spy, his was the weakest spy movie of that year, a year absolutely loaded with spy movies, from MI5 to hilarious comedic ones like Spy.

I guess for us who disliked Spectre, we were okay with them just killing off the organization and Blofeld just like that, since we felt their introduction in this universe was a pretty big misfire.

i honestly think, in the long run, craig bond will be seen as a 'weird phase' of the franchise and won't be looked upon very highly, besides CR. but CR's legacy won't be strong enough.

Overall, I'd say the Craig movies were... alright. Having time to reflect, now that it's all ended I'm remembering them a bit more fondly than if it had ended on Spectre's note. In those 15 years, when it started was a completely different time than when it ended

Lorenzo_2003 posted...

Speaking of her, please tell me Bond was not still crying about Vesper in this new movie.

He goes to her grave in this one and says that he misses her. But wasn't the whole point of Quantum of Solace that he got over it?

I liked No Time to Die mostly, but the third act really ruins the rest of the film. Everything on that island is where it goes downhill and it becomes so contrived that Bond HAS to die and that there's NO way out for him. Safin is a crap villain as well, he moves from wanting revenge on Blofeld to world domination for some reason? If it wasn't for the ending with Bond dying, I'd put the film second after Casino Royale.

CR > Skyfall > NTTD > Quantum > Spectre

It seems like a common consensus with liking the beginning of the movie and disliking the third act. Could the first part of the movie be when they were working on it, and then the last part was during the coronavirus pandemic, hence the drop?

No Time To Die was completed before Covid hit, I believe. It was originally going to release in April 2020 but got pushed back to November 2020, then April 2021 and then finally came out in September 2021.

nttd is great and has the best action out of the craig bonds to me. its second behind casino

Trelve posted...

No Time To Die was completed before Covid hit, I believe. It was originally going to release in April 2020 but got pushed back to November 2020, then April 2021 and then finally came out in September 2021.

Oh... I weirdly remember some kinda re-writes and delays but it might have been just delays not re-writes

saspa posted...

It seems like a common consensus with liking the beginning of the movie and disliking the third act. Could the first part of the movie be when they were working on it, and then the last part was during the coronavirus pandemic, hence the drop?

saspa posted...

Oh... I weirdly remember some kinda re-writes and delays but it might have been just delays not re-writes

That's still a good observation - I wonder why the third act was weaker

Honestly looking back I think it's because they introduced him as being some guy who wants revenge on Blofeld so it's always interesting to see villain vs villain since they go all out on killing and deviiousness compared to heroes, but then they just off blofeld and he's this dude who owns a drug island and nothing interesting about him whatsoever.

The tone is also all over the place with the whole bond feeling betrayed by lea seydoux, her becoming blofeld's therapist, blofeld doing one last troll attempt with vesper's grave, and how lea is tied to both him and rami malek