Current Events > Transgender swimmer Lia Thomas wins women's 500-yard NCAA title

(+) Yeah! (+)

IanKinglerFalfl posted...

You don't know what sealioning is. Sealioning is when someone already gives an answer and the sealion follows up with the same question phrased differently, and then pesters over and over again while the opponent answers and then ignores.

Asking one question and not a single person answering is not sealioning, it's providing an argument that doesn't seem to have a counter

User Info: IanKinglerFalfl
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User Since: Mar 2022
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Whose alt?

The answer is no. Woman generally can't compete with men physically in the realm of sports and it's why there's a difference between male sports and woman sports.

Now I'm confused though. But I'll take your word.

However, a transgender individual can't compete with men either after taking treatment to become their idealized gender.

Why not? You're saying it's because there's a difference between male and woman sports? But why though?

So the question is coming across as disingenuous because it operates on the assumption that they still have certain advantages prior to beginning their transition.

But the point I'm getting is that there are no certain advantages prior to transition. Which means that from a competitive standpoint, men and women are on an equal playing field.

Again, I'm not making any definitive statements. I don't have the answer. I don't know enough on this subject but there are people who have a vested interest in this and they write the rules when it comes to who can or can't compete. Arm chair philosophers and their arguments aren't going to sway those who do the actual testing, look at the data, and see the performance. It's just pointless bickering in the end. Those people are always looking to tweak the rules to make things as fair as possible and will alter said rules when enough data warrants it.

Well I wish people who are in support of the trans movement in sports would be more open and willing to educate people, because as it stands right now there seems to be a huge blockade in obtaining accessible and understandable knowledge.

Congrats to her! Well deserved

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/3/1/8/AAc53qAADDJW.jpg https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/3/1/9/AAc53qAADDJX.jpg

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This doesn't explain why cis women have never reached professional sports outside a woman's division. If there is no inherent difference in physiology, than they should be able to do this.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/02/22/us/lia-thomas-transgender-swimmer-ivy-league/index.html

undefined posted... Lia Thomas stood tall and smiled wide atop the championship podium, her nearly 6-foot-4 frame pushing her head past the top of the Ivy League's green photo backdrop.

Wow. Nearly half a foot taller than me.

Not surprised this is going to 500.......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2-r5M2Khzs&ab_channel=JAMARI

UConn Women's Basketball team has women who are 6'5" (x4), 6'3", 6'2", 6'1", and 6'0"

Must all be former men, right? Women don't grow that tall through puberty, RIGHT?

Derwood posted...

UConn Women's Basketball team has women who are 6'5" (x4), 6'3", 6'2", 6'1", and 6'0"

Must all be former men, right? Women don't grow that tall through puberty, RIGHT?

Its very very rare for women to grow that tall.

Notice how Lia is taller than all her competitors?

Notice how male college basketball has people way taller than 6'5

IanKinglerFalfl posted...

If there is no difference in physiology than all women should be allowed to play in the NBA.

She didn't say there's no difference in physiology.

Are you related to a brick wall?

CyricZ posted...

She didn't say there's no difference in physiology.

Are you related to a brick wall?

My mistake, I misread that.

Apologies, I will retract what I said.

Rayman2943 posted...

Its very very rare for women to grow that tall.

Notice how Lia is taller than all her competitors?

Notice how male college basketball has people way taller than 6'5

This isn't making a point at all

Derwood posted...

UConn Women's Basketball team has women who are 6'5" (x4), 6'3", 6'2", 6'1", and 6'0"

Must all be former men, right? Women don't grow that tall through puberty, RIGHT?

The NBA should draft some of these women.

https://twitter.com/ErinInTheMorn/status/1476578962499420160
This from a lengthy thread and she's a bit inaccurate here, but, umm, yeah. It's very clear HRT had a huge impact on her performance, almost like all those studies on trans women and testimonials from trans women are accurate. She was actually a top swimmer in the men's division before she started HRT (which tanked her times and rendered her physically incapable of being competitive).

Let's break it down: she lost 0:15:34 on her best 500m time (the event she won, as opposed to the two she lost).
Her best time pre-HRT was 4:18:72, or 0:12:40 off of Kieran Smith's record time.
Her best post-HRT time was 4:34:06, exactly 0:10:00 off of Kelly Ledecky's record time.

So, she picked up a little bit relative to the record, but not much. It hardly seems she's some absurdly dominant swimmer i.e. that is not logical basis for an argument. Which leaves other, much more unsavory basises...

Derwood posted...

This isn't making a point at all

it absolutely is. what percent of Lia's competitors are as tall as she is?

Rayman2943 posted...

it absolutely is. what percent of Lia's competitors are as tall as she is?

You're not arguing to ban tall women though.

Rayman2943 posted...

it absolutely is. what percent of Lia's competitors are as tall as she is?

Is height what makes a good swimmer?

ElatedVenusaur posted...

You're not arguing to ban tall women though.

You know what point I'm making.

What percent of Lia's competitors are as tall as Lia is?

Rayman2943 posted...

You know what point I'm making.

Why don't you just say what point you're making?

CyricZ posted...

Is height what makes a good swimmer?

No, but it can help tremendously in basketball. It's sad the NBA won't let some WNBA athletes be forwards.

CyricZ posted...

Why don't you just say what point you're making?

so you can troll about a dead loved one?

Yeah. Remember when you used to say "moxillaq" to me because you thought it would make me mad?

You're so predictable when you don't have an actual argument.

I have an argument. You don't. You just ask "questions" and try to ban bait people. The fact of the matter is in certain sports being 6 foot 4 or close is an advantage. Now, being a woman and that tall? Absolutely massive advantage. Aren't basketball teams way smaller than Swim teams? Those basketball college players that are as tall as Lia are far far far rarer and elite lol.

Why is there a topic about this anyway? I mean we know why, but still...

If anyone feels the need to complain about this they should take it up with the NCAA or whoever runs these leagues.

Rayman2943 posted...

Now, being a woman and that tall? Absolutely massive advantage

So we should ban all women over a certain height from swimming?

You just ask "questions" and try to ban bait people.

Oh you got me on the asking questions part, but whether people get banned is largely up to them.

https://www2.census.gov/library/publications/2010/compendia/statab/130ed/tables/11s0205.pdf

According to the census, they measured so many women and yet, look at how few women were that tall?

Still don't think its an advantage?

So we should ban all women over a certain height from swimming?

The point being women that tall only exist in the few hundreds in the US potentially. You are talking about such a minority of women that Lia is the only person competing that might be that tall right now.

It's not an advantage. Tall women can play in the NBA and for whatever reason Adam Silver won't let them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silvia_Poll

She's taller than Lia Thomas. Should she be banned from swimming for being too tall?

CyricZ posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silvia_Poll

She's as tall as Lia Thomas. Should she be banned from swimming for being too tall?

Notice how CyricZ intentionally misses the point and tries to bait me into saying something bannable?

CyricZ posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silvia_Poll

She's taller than Lia Thomas. Should she be banned from swimming for being too tall?

Absolutely not. Height does not matter when it comes to competitive advantage in swimming...well unless it was something crazy like 9ft vs 4ft

Rayman2943 posted...

Notice how CyricZ intentionally misses the point and tries to bait me into saying something bannable?

You haven't made a point, unless it's that "height is an advantage".

Well I looked it up and it turns out that height is an advantage for swimmers. So well done I guess.

So what do you propose?

CyricZ posted...

You haven't made a point, unless it's that "height is an advantage".

Well I looked it up and it turns out that height is an advantage for swimmers. So well done I guess.

So what do you propose?

Lia shouldn't compete.

Rayman2943 posted...

Lia shouldn't compete.

Because she's too tall? What do you suggest the height limit is for swimmers, then? 6 feet?

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Define "fair".

trappedunderice posted...

Wouldn't surprise me if tc was a mods alt.

So you are calling the mods "fisherman" then?

CyricZ posted...

Because she's too tall? What do you suggest the height limit is for swimmers, then? 6 feet?

No height limit. But lia shouldn't compete.

Rayman2943 posted...

No height limit. But lia shouldn't compete.

Why not?

We both know why

It's amazing how a mod hasn't shut Kingler down for his incredibly obvious trolling and transphobic bait yet.

Rayman2943 posted...

We both know why

Say it.

Rayman2943 posted...

We both know why

I don't, fill me in

CyricZ posted...

Say it.

Ban baiting again.

No.

Lia trained hard and dedicated herself to rise from #466 to #1. That's all you need to know. There's nothing sinister about it

Rayman2943 posted...

Ban baiting again.

No.

Odd to have an opinion and to stop short of actually giving it because you're afraid of getting banned.

Must be a hell of an opinion.

TMOG posted...

It's amazing how a mod hasn't shut Kingler down for his incredibly obvious trolling and transphobic bait yet.

Because maybe I haven't posted anything transphobic, I'm not trolling, and mods agree with me that Lia Thomas should be able to compete?

CyricZ posted...

Odd to have an opinion and to stop short of actually giving it because you're afraid of getting banned.

Must be a hell of an opinion.

The word you're looking for is "nuanced"