Current Events > Do you agree with this Pokemon take?

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://mobile.twitter.com/CrungleBungles/status/1489309049338347528

Agreed

Pokemon doesn't need a "mature darker story"

Yeah he's right. Fans would just write edgy shit nonstop lol

I want a game about the pokemon wars mentioned in Red and Blue backstory lore

Edgy isekai is what is popular in Japan. They are more capitalizing on that than anything. Frankly I'm surprised that you aren't forced to wear black.

Acknowledging death is fine, in a game where you are a child that gets attacked by massive, fanged beasts.

Yeah just using the words "death" and "die" doesn't make something mature. The most mature thing a pokemon game could do is tackle the ethical question of capturing creatures, sometimes actual gods that maintain the fabric of reality in their world, in tiny capsules and using them for sport

Which I believe they've already done at some point but it was pretty surface level

Gwynevere posted...

The most mature thing a pokemon game could do is tackle the ethical question of capturing creatures, sometimes actual gods that maintain the fabric of reality in their world, in tiny capsules and using them for sport

That's the entire concept behind Gen 5, and a few characters in Legends have expressed concerns about this as well

Legends ain't even dark.
Darker than the rest of the series? Yeah sure. But it's not dark at all.

I don't think Arceus is edgy in anyway. Given the context of Arceus those lines make perfect sense. You're basically going around the habitats of what are essentially magical wild animals to capture them, to expect them not to fight back is foolish. For example imagine treading in a lion's habitat and not expecting it to pounce on you given the chance. I enjoy that Arceus gave the Pokmon a more natural feel for once, one of the NPCs essentially tells you the same thing, Pokmon at the end of the day are wild creatures.

Piplup_Sniper posted...

I don't think Arceus is edgy in anyway. Given the context of Arceus those lines make perfect sense. You're basically going around the habitats of what are essentially magical wild animals to capture them, to expect them not to fight back is foolish. For example imagine treading in a lion's habitat and not expecting it to pounce on you given the chance. I enjoy that Arceus gave the Pokmon a more natural feel for once, one of the NPCs essentially tells you the same thing, Pokmon at the end of the day are wild creatures.

At the beginning of the game they have you capture three Pokemon as a part of a tutorial. Once you have made it into the town the game makes a huge deal about that fact. They then explain the ranking system to you and how you start at zero stars and how you rank up by catching/discovering more Pokemon. This implies that everyone else, minus your two commanding officers, are all zero stars as well because no one has the ability to do anything as grandiose as what you just accomplished.

That is very edgy.

X/Y Spoilers.

Lysandre dies in Gen 6.

ellis123 posted...

At the beginning of the game they have you capture three Pokemon as a part of a tutorial. Once you have made it into the town the game makes a huge deal about that fact. They then explain the ranking system to you and how you start at zero stars and how you rank up by catching/discovering more Pokemon. This implies that everyone else, minus your two commanding officers, are all zero stars as well because no one has the ability to do anything as grandiose as what you just accomplished.

That is very edgy.

I am all for taking the Pokemon series in a direction where everyone else is a massive loser

SydneySweenHero posted...

Yeah he's right. Fans would just write edgy shit nonstop lol

I played Pokemon Reborn, I know what kind of shitshow I signed up for.

Gwynevere posted...

Yeah just using the words "death" and "die" doesn't make something mature. The most mature thing a pokemon game could do is tackle the ethical question of capturing creatures, sometimes actual gods that maintain the fabric of reality in their world, in tiny capsules and using them for sport

Which I believe they've already done at some point but it was pretty surface level

To be honest Arceus, Dialga, Palkia and the lake trio are cool with you capturing them. It only starts to get more complicated with other Pokmon. The fact that there's stealthy ways to catch Pokmon that are unaware of your presence make it appear like you're just kidnapping them from their homes. The game does try to make it less unethical by telling you released Pokmon leave you little presents.

Turbam posted...

I am all for taking the Pokemon series in a direction where everyone else is a massive loser

I would love a game where you play as Gary. Instead of naming your rival you get to write out a taunt that gets played out after every time you win.

It does fit the description of "more mature," even if the game itself doesn't reach that level. Acknowledging more realistic things like the possibility of death outside of meme Pokedex entries at least brings a bit more weight to it, even if it ultimately just amounts to more flavor text. I don't think anyone wants some edgy shit, but most people would probably like something that doesn't cater exclusively to five year olds. You can have an all ages story that has a more realistic tone.

Zikten posted...

I want a game about the pokemon wars mentioned in Red and Blue backstory lore

the war in XY lore is stopped by a giant Pokmon nuke laser

spikethedevil posted...

X/Y Spoilers.

Lysandre dies in Gen 6.

Does he? He's in Master Sex tho

SydneySweenHero posted...

Does he? He's in Master Sex tho

Must be a different Dimension version.

I actually really hate the story in this game. Characters talk in circles about the same crap for minutes on end. Can I just get out into the map please? I dont care about how much you believe in your clan.

The problem with Pokemon being edgy and having the topic of death come up is that a large number of creatures are far too friendly or derpy looking to take it seriously. The very first threatening Pokemon you encounter is Shinx and, well...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/2/2/3/AALj7bAAC5W3.png

The colosseum games were a nice, darker tone for Pokemon.

In the first game, you're an (ex) criminal. The first MC that wasn't 100% squeaky clean. In both games, you have Pokemon tortured to the point they're willing to directly attack humans(As in try to harm them, not 'challenging' you in the wild).

Also, while it wasn't directly stated, Cipher absolutely murdered people. Just look at the opening cutscene in XD. Those people aren't seem again.

They're probably the most evil villain team. Sure Team Flare are rich elitists that wanted to genocide everyone else, but they're both utter dorks and so irrelevant that their admins don't have names(Something even Team Rocket admins got in the G/S/C remakes). It's hard to take them seriously at all.

Are fans really asking for a mature pokemon story, or did ond asshole on twitter make that up?

I've never heard that and it sounds so fucking stupid I refuse to believe there are more than 7 people who want that.

Honestly, just making it so you can get a Game Over on certain fights would be a step in the right direction.

You see some villains, Archie/Maxie, or Lusamine talk about how you need to 'disappear' or need to be 'silenced'... but nothing happens when you lose outside of you losing money. Hell, Ghetsis directly makes an attempt on your life... and you can lose to him like any other trainer just fine.

Make it so you can walk away prior to these fights so kids don't get softlocked.

Literally could not care less about the dialogue. When I say I want a "mature" Pokemon game I just want a game that is challenging and doesn't hold your hand every second of gameplay. Legends: Arceus does a decent job of this for the 15 hours I've played so far. Its got its tutorial moments but mostly it cuts you loose in a world without pulling punches

DeadBankerDream posted...

Are fans really asking for a mature pokemon story, or did ond asshole on twitter make that up?

I've never heard that and it sounds so fucking stupid I refuse to believe there are more than 7 people who want that.

I'm one of those 7 people I suppose. A mature story can work fine, it just needs to be done well. Admittedly, Gamefreak's ability to do that is questionable at best.

It doesn't have to be grimdark, and honestly it shouldn't be. I just think they can treat their audience like they're a little older every now and then. They did it with Black and White (Where the MCs are blatantly older teens instead of adolescences).

ellis123 posted...

This implies that everyone else, minus your two commanding officers, are all zero stars as well because no one has the ability to do anything as grandiose as what you just accomplished.

There are multiple divisions. Presumably each division has its own ranking systems, and you're realistically the only person on the Research Comission that rankings would actually apply to. (I guess there's Rei / Akira but all they do is munch on Mochi). Everyone else spends their time contructing houses, healing the sick, or guarding the town, so ranking them based on their ability to catch pokemon seems rather stupid.

As for the topic at hand. I don't think Pokemon fans really want super grimdark murder stories. At least I certainly don't. I just want them to tackle themes and ideas deeper than "wow isn't pokemon fun, say you love Pokemon" > No > "Wow you must SUPER LOVE POKEMON". PLA delivers on that. It's not super deep, but the themes of overcoming fear and adversity and connecting with the world you find yourself in is a good example of more mature storytelling than Pokemon has had since at least Gen 5, imo. (Though Gen 8 is clearly the worst offender of this)

TLDR: I want stuff more in the vein of Amphibia, Avatar, and The Dragon Prince. Less stuff in the style of Despicable Me, Boss Baby, and Dora.

SydneySweenHero posted...

Does he? He's in Master Sex tho

Master Sex is its own thing, he very clearly dies in game.