Current Events > Sorry but Killmonger is a villain no matter how much you don't wanna believe

(+) Yeah! (+)

Michael B Jordan says Killmonger is NOT a villain.

https://twitter.com/getFANDOM/status/1470813031869280264?s=20

Didn't he kill a dude?

Turbam posted...

Didn't he kill a dude?

I mean black panther definitely killed some dudes too in that car chase

I mean, he literally is a villain. He might have had noble intentions, but his methods are what made him a villain.

Wanting to topple governments and take over because you think you're superior is definitely not what a villain would do.

it's also about perspective.

people we might see as heroic can be seen as villainous to others, whether it's because they're on "our side", push our interests, propaganda, and so on.

The Founding Fathers are seen as heroes today.
If UK had won, we would view them as terrorists.
It is all about who writes the history books.

Were_Wyrm posted...

Wanting to topple governments and take over because you think you're superior is definitely not what a villain would do.

#Trump2022

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Not exactly a race war but he wanted to put him and his people at power and he would kill anyone and everyone who stands in his way of being in control of the world which includes other Black people who didn't agree with him.

Funkydog posted...

I mean, he literally is a villain. He might have had noble intentions, but his methods are what made him a villain.

I don't even think he had those. Still well written, but only wanted power for himself.

dave_is_slick posted...

I don't even think he had those. Still well written, but only wanted power for himself.

I think the base core of the ideal "free black people" was noble, but the manner in which he wanted to extend it to and the means he'd do it definitely push him into bad guy territory.

Who exactly were his 'people' exactly? It wasn't the ghetto he was born in, nor the country he wasn't even born or raised in.

He wanted to commit genocide, right?

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

If he did that and the black people won, would history judge him as a villain or a hero that saved his race from his evil white overlords?

just like Thanos, i could understand where he was coming from even tho i didnt agree with his actions...

Naw.

I4NRulez posted...

I mean black panther definitely killed some dudes too in that car chase

Pretty sure Cap has killed people too. I mean he's used his shield made of the strongest metal in the MCU against normal thugs + Nazis. No chance some of those have taken that and lived through it. At the very least they'd be really fucked up by it.

Prismsblade posted...

Who exactly were his 'people' exactly? It wasn't the ghetto he was born in, nor the country he wasn't even born or raised in.

Draje

Killmonger is basically Scar and T'Challa is both Mufasa and Simba

when t'challa sided with the cia, killmonger became the hero by default

Debatable. Marvel has many characters like Killmonger who have stated good intentions but questionable methods. Submariner, Dr. Doom, Gen Thunderbolt Ross, Galactus- even the Hulk and Dr. Strange have fulfilled that role.

It's a common Marvel trope since the 1960's. Lee, Kirby and Ditko had extensive discussions on creating "complicated" characters to distinguish themselves from DC.

They did.

brestugo posted...

Debatable. Marvel has many characters like Killmonger who have stated good intentions but questionable methods. Submariner, Dr. Doom, Gen Thunderbolt Ross, Galactus- even the Hulk and Dr. Strange have fulfilled that role.

It's a common Marvel trope since the 1960's. Lee, Kirby and Ditko had extensive discussions on creating "complicated" characters to distinguish themselves from DC.

They did.

Let's not mistaken anti-heroes for villains. There's a line there.

Thanos did nothing wrong

Foppe posted...

The Founding Fathers are seen as heroes today.
If UK had won, we would view them as terrorists.
It is all about who writes the history books.

I mean while true, I'd say your last sentence is only true to a degree.

I dont recall TChalla killing any and all to get what he wanted.

Killmonger was cool with killing anyone in cold blood to reach his goals. Like the museum scene, or his girlfriend.

Veggeta_MAX posted...

Let's not mistaken anti-heroes for villains. There's a line there.

The Punisher and Killmonger are closer than you think. One man's anti-hero is another's villain.

Killmonger is not a hero and while some of his intentions are good the way he wants to go about it is horrible. He has killed people who were not the enemy just to further his goals, look at how easily he threw away his girlfriend without a single fuck given.

he wanted to essentially pull a hitler so i'm not sure how he could be anything but a villain...

monkmith posted...

he wanted to essentially pull a hitler so i'm not sure how he could be anything but a villain...

He wanted to give people the means to fight back how does that make him Hitler?

Makeveli_lives posted...

He wanted to give people the means to fight back how does that make him Hitler?

He wanted to give his people the means to oppress and dominate others.

Makeveli_lives posted...

He wanted to give people the means to fight back how does that make him Hitler?

...he wanted to take a hyper advanced nations weapons and invade countries to cull the "oppressors"...

wait, do you think that magneto was a hero too? i mean, he just wanted to help the fellow mutant after all...

monkmith posted...

wait, do you think that magneto was a hero too? i mean, he just wanted to help the fellow mutant after all...

hero to some, villain to others

Actually, now that I think about it. I'm curious how much he'd have cared about wakanda if it was just some typical 3rd world with nothing unique or special about it.

Isnt the point of most villains is they had a different way

g0ldie posted...

hero to some, villain to others

"Hero to some, villain to others" doesn't make a character an actual hero.

A character who kills in cold blood isn't a hero.

The methods of how a character willingly reaches their goals do actually matter.

idk if there's some objective standard for what makes a person a hero.

most people might consider someone a hero due their feats as long as their ideals align.

like, the Nazis had their own heroes during WWII, for example, and while we might disagree, it doesn't change how they felt (at the time, at least).

If you genuinely have to question what is a hero and what is a villain then you need to do some real soul searching and reflecting.

monkmith posted...

...he wanted to take a hyper advanced nations weapons and invade countries to cull the "oppressors"...

wait, do you think that magneto was a hero too? i mean, he just wanted to help the fellow mutant after all...

I really hope you're not comparing Magneto to Hitler for fairly fucking obvious reasons

This is too nuanced for CE.

Wherethisfeom posted...

Did BP intentionally kill innocent civilians. Legit question.

I mean no but I guess it depends on how you look at it. He killed henchmen but they are only doing what they are paid to do. He just killed them in his path to get Klaue

Killmonger never killed people that weren't in his way to get to Wakanda. He killed who he saw as oppressors.

What are the few lives of the oppressors vs the freedom of your people.

Veggeta_MAX posted...

If you genuinely have to question what is a hero and what is a villain then you need to do some real soul searching and reflecting.

I'm not questioning anything; I'm just acknowledging that what makes a person a "hero" is often subjective.

I don't consider Killmonger to be a hero, btw, but more a sympathetic villain.

g0ldie posted...

idk if there's some objective standard for what makes a person a hero.

most people might consider someone a hero due their feats as long as their ideals align.

like, the Nazis had their own heroes during WWII, for example, and while we might disagree, it doesn't change how they felt (at the time, at least).

Problem with that is feelings are being confused for reality.

One can "feel" like the Holocaust never happened.
One can "feel" like Tom Bundy has the attributes of a superhero.
One can "feel" the earth is flat.

Doesn't make any of that actually true.

The point being, sure one can feel whatever they want, their feelings is the reality they believe. But what one believes doesn't make it actually true.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

If he was white you would support him

The ends don't justify the means.

t5yvxc posted...

Problem with that is feelings are being confused for reality.

One can "feel" like the Holocaust never happened.
One can "feel" like Tom Bundy has the attributes of a hero.
One can "feel" the earth is flat.

Doesn't make any of that actually true.

The point being, sure one can feel whatever they want, their feelings is the reality they believe. But what one believes doesn't make it actually true.

do you believe that "heroes" or "villains" are concepts that exist in reality outside of individual perspective?

g0ldie posted...

do you believe that "heroes" or "villains" are concepts that exist in reality outside of individual perspective?

There's nothing really to discuss here, if "feelings" is your driving argument.

Is Loki a villain? How many people have died because of him?

Veggeta_MAX posted...

Michael B Jordan says Killmonger is NOT a villain.

https://twitter.com/getFANDOM/status/1470813031869280264?s=20

Counter argument. Michael B Jordan is an idiot.

What a dumb take. Villains can have relatable struggles and relatable goals. You can feel for what they were and recognize how they got to the point of becoming a villain, but evil is evil in this case. You can have grey areas where neither side is right in some works, but it's pretty damn clear he wanted violence for the sake of violence.