Current Events > Is death just like before you were born?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I mean, can anybody give me an answer here

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Probably

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Dunno, that's what I hope for and I've got no reason to think it'll be anything else.

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That's impossible to say.

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Billyionaire posted...

I mean, can anybody give me an answer here

Nope.

Crono99 posted...

Timeline

------[not alive]----------x(birth)-------[alive]----------------x(death)------------[not alive]-----------

Seems the same to me

Then again it begs the question... if you were not alive once before, and you just return to that, how do we know the cycle doesn't just repeat and then you get born again as a spider or dinosaur or something

Don't Buddhism have the answer to that?

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yes

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Crono99 posted...

It's mired in weird sexual references, but kinda I guess

What version of Buddhism are you studying/practicing? Because my translations of the sutras aren't super sexual, at least no where near to the extent of Hinduism

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Crono99 posted...

Timeline

------[not alive]----------x(birth)-------[alive]----------------x(death)------------[not alive]-----------

Seems the same to me

Then again it begs the question... if you were not alive once before, and you just return to that, how do we know the cycle doesn't just repeat and then you get born again as a spider or dinosaur or something

No, you just don't exist and you don't get to be reborn. It's a difficult thing to accept but there's nothing you can do about it.

Crono99 posted...

Then again it begs the question... if you were not alive once before, and you just return to that, how do we know the cycle doesn't just repeat and then you get born again as a spider or dinosaur or something

We don't know, but there's no reason to believe that, either. Like, ice cream could, theoretically, appear spontaneously out of the aether. But I wouldn't bet on it.

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Unless you believe in immaterial things like souls there is no other possibility. The physical aspect that makes your perception, your brain, no longer functions after death.

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ssjevot posted...

Unless you believe in immaterial things like souls there is no other possibility. The physical aspect that makes your perception, your brain, no longer functions after death.

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No. Our aether goes back into the aetherial flow and we're reborn as a new being.

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We ultimately have no way of knowing for sure.

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No because you go to heaven afterwards

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Guide posted...

We don't know, but there's no reason to believe that, either. Like, ice cream could, theoretically, appear spontaneously out of the aether. But I wouldn't bet on it.

There are some physicists out there that believe that spacetime is cyclical and that eventually time will repeat. Not exactly like what happened in our own time but the basics will still be the same. Kinda like what Nietzsche suggested via eternal recurrence.

Really this is more a matter of philosophy than anything really.

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you go to heaven in my opinion

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There is no phsyical indication otherwise.

Pre-birth you don't think because you've yet to form. Post-death you don't think because your form is lost. Either way you're not in a state to think.

People say "we don't know" but that's in as much of a technical sense as us not knowing whether there's pizza on Pluto. It's possible there is, but there probably isn't and we have no decent reason to think otherwise.
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AlphaCuck posted...

you go to heaven in my opinion

Who goes to heaven? You as you are when you die? You as you saw yourself at some point in your life? You how other people saw you? As how God sees you? You as some ideal form of yourself? If it's any of the latter how can you say it's actually you? What is heaven? Can you feel emotions there? Can you be sad in heaven? If you can how can it be heaven, if you can't how can you still be you?

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AldousIsDead posted...

Who goes to heaven? You as you are when you die? You as you saw yourself at some point in your life? You how other people saw you? As how God sees you? You as some ideal form of yourself? If it's any of the latter how can you say it's actually you? What is heaven? Can you feel emotions there? Can you be sad in heaven? If you can how can it be heaven, if you can't how can you still be you?

you when you were your hottest and you probably can be sad but you won't since you can easily see womens breasts

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Scientifically it should be according to logic.

But who knows? Makes death fun as hell to think about which is a better mindset than being petrified of the inevitable. When it's your time, what's going to happen?? You can't know and literally anything is possible, so be ready to embrace it!

AldousIsDead posted...

Who goes to heaven? You as you are when you die? You as you saw yourself at some point in your life? You how other people saw you? As how God sees you? You as some ideal form of yourself? If it's any of the latter how can you say it's actually you? What is heaven? Can you feel emotions there? Can you be sad in heaven? If you can how can it be heaven, if you can't how can you still be you?

I wish I would of thought of these questions when I was a kid in Sunday school.

Its nothing, but you are no longer aware so it doesnt matter

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Graycap posted...

People say "we don't know" but that's in as much of a technical sense as us not knowing whether there's pizza on Pluto. It's possible there is, but there probably isn't and we have no decent reason to think otherwise.

Is it really the same though?

I get that we can dismiss most specific spiritual beliefs based on their overall contradictions with reality and/or themself, but does that truly rule out ANY possible kind of afterlife, rather than merely ruling out those particular ones?

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Graycap posted...

There is no phsyical indication otherwise.

Pre-birth you don't think because you've yet to form. Post-death you don't think because your form is lost. Either way you're not in a state to think.

People say "we don't know" but that's in as much of a technical sense as us not knowing whether there's pizza on Pluto. It's possible there is, but there probably isn't and we have no decent reason to think otherwise.

The beliefs or responses to we dont know stem from thousands of years of discovery and proven theories though. At one point someone asked if the world was round or flat, it could be said, We dont know until someone explored and discovered an answer that is generally accepted as fact.

Even though we currently dont get our minds blown by being educated about all of these discoveries because theyre now known or at least validated to us with proof, the same could in theory exist about life and death. We just have to discover the correct answer. Whereas, pizza existing on Pluto would require someone making that pizza. The decent reason to think otherwise in that example is because people make pizza and so if there is nobody on another planet, there would be no reason pizza would be there. So the question is actually, are there other beings that would eat pizza on Pluto? So we attempt to prove that or not.

Whereas, we cant create life currently or extend it past the physical aspect. It sounds unbelievable to us now but maybe in 1000 yrs we can transplant that consciousness into a different body and preserve someones soul or whatever other craziness we currently cant even conceive outside of a fantasy sci-fi story, or maybe even build an entirely new but same body that your brain is transplanted to and you live forever continuing to learn more and more, defeating the question of death as something we even have to fear.

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I don't think so.

Death is like an eternal sleep paralysis
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ssj3vegeta posted...

Death is like an eternal sleep paralysis

So everyone goes to hell? Yeesh.

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Until someone can explain what it was like before you were born, this is a meaningless thing to ask. If someone somehow confirmed that yes this was true, you'd be no closer to understanding what it's actually like to be dead. If there's something I'm missing about this question, I'd be very interested in understanding that.

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One problem I have with this line of thinking is that even if the physicalist underpinnings here are true there's a big difference between life before one was born and life after one has died. The difference being that we have a pretty damn good idea of what life was like for other people before we were born via the work of historians, anthropologists and archeologists. Not a perfect framework of absolute knowledge (which is impossible) but it's quite easy to paint a picture of how our predecessors lived their lives.

The future is a much different story. Even if futurologists do their best to forecast what technologies will show up when they can't show with certainty what events will capture the zeitgeist of future generations and how that will affect pop culture of even what works will come out a hundred years from now. (Except for that sealed film from a few years ago of course.)

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ForsakenHermit posted...

So everyone goes to hell? Yeesh.

we'd be lucky if it even exists. I want to take my memories with me.

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MI4 REAL posted...

we'd be lucky if it even exists. I want to take my memories with me.

obviously hell is metal af

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I'm shooting for limbo.

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AlphaCuck posted...

obviously hell is metal af

Is Heaven Soul then? Cause I wanna watch Anthony Hamilton in concert instead.

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While theres no way to prove it, theres no way it isnt the same thing. you aren't existing. it should be the same nothingness.

however, I do believe in reincarnation. my living body will remember absolutely nothing. but I can't imagine that... something I guess who isn't me will live. I will live as something. It will definitely be a drastically different being, like a fucking small cell in someones body. but maybe i wont idk. maybe the universe is just insane.

i refuse to accept the fact that I'm just nothingness for forever. i wont know it but i will be something eventually.. i think

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If your soul existed you could remember things even when your body is highly compromised.

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Lost_All_Senses posted...

Is Heaven Soul then? Cause I wanna watch Anthony Hamilton in concert instead.

yeah that sounds right

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I certainly hope so

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AlphaCuck posted...

yeah that sounds right

Thank you. I feel better now.

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I think there is something after death and something before life. There must be more purpose to this existance because if there isn't then our lives are extremely valuable and lucky. One day all of life could end from something cataclysmic - all of our struggles would be for nothing. All of our work gone. What kind of sick universe would allow that unless....there is something more to this universe than meets the eye...maybe it is a simulation

romans 1:20 basically says that the natural world is proof of god and i think that's true

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MI4 REAL posted...

If your soul existed you could remember things even when your body is highly compromised.

Not if the hippocampus is compromised so that your brain cant write the memories in a readable way that you can then take with you when no longer compromised.

By compromised, Im going to assume you mean unconscious or in a coma, blacked out from intoxication, or some state of sleep that isnt natural?

Our brains are like a computer with certain parts being the hard-drive, our nerves are like the cables that send the data from the CPU and GPU, and it has to be written and saved properly. If something is compromised and gets erased, its no longer readable on the harddrive, so even placing that harddrive into a new computer wouldnt make that file retrievable. I guess thats how Id perceive it, even if your soul could remember everything without your current body, those memories are like corrupted files that arent readable by your system in a way that is understandable enough to show what the memory was.

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Trumble posted...

Is it really the same though?

I get that we can dismiss most specific spiritual beliefs based on their overall contradictions with reality and/or themself, but does that truly rule out ANY possible kind of afterlife, rather than merely ruling out those particular ones?

Nothing is ruled out in terms of afterlife, or prelife, since they're hypothetical concepts. But we have yet to find physical evidence of these, and occam's razor suggests that the simplest answer (in this case, "it's not there") is the safest one. But people are allowed to have opinions that deviate from the likeliest scenario, in cases where said opinion is not outright proven false. The simplest answer hasn't always been right.

Conker posted...

So the question is actually, are there other beings that would eat pizza on Pluto? So we attempt to prove that or not.

Though effectively the answer is unknowable to us specifically because the technology to determine this for sure won't exist in our likely lifetimes. People living today have the choice of simply dismissing the question outright, or relying on assumption to answer it. The safest answer simply being that it never happened, even though such an event technically isn't physicallly possible.
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As far as human experience is concerned, death is best understood as the permanent loss of any sort of consciousness. So far as we can tell, consciousness depends on the brain structure, which is disintegrated at death.

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In hoping to see everyone in heaven because I believe Jesuss word

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