Current Events > Chess is even more sexist than its portrayal in Netflix's 'The Queen's Gambit'

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.insider.com/how-chess-was-more-sexist-than-its-portrayal-queens-gambit-2020-12

Netflix's "The Queen's Gambit" is the most accurate portrayal of chess in Hollywood, but it doesn't go far enough to depict the sexism ingrained in the culture of the sport, female chess influencer Alexandra Botez told Insider. Botez is a Twitch chess streamer who started training with her dad when she was just 6 years old. By the time she was 8, Botez won her first national championship. She said she went on to win six more championship titles by the time she graduated from high school. She holds the International Chess Federation title of Women's FIDE Master. "It's wild what it's been doing to chess in terms of your average person knowing about it," And while the character deals with sexism in the male-dominated game, Botez said it doesn't come close to the reality of misogyny in the chess world, especially for the time period the show is set in. "If the show had been historically accurate, Beth wouldn't have even been able to compete in any world championship events," Botez told Insider, citing the first female Grandmaster Susan Polgar, who qualified for the Chess World Championship in 1986 and was denied the chance to compete because of her gender, according to her biography. "She qualified for the Candidates, which is a tournament where, if you win, then you're competing for the world championships," Botez told Insider. "That means you are at least the second-best player in the world, and she qualified by her rating."

Aside from competing, the show's portrayal of men's behavior towards women in chess also misses the mark, according to Botez. "The way that they were super supportive of her when she won is inaccurate," Botez told Insider. "If you read the real stories from females playing back then, people wouldn't even shake their hands or look at them." In a recent interview with St. Louis Post-Dispatch, Polgar recalls a male player swiping all the pieces off the board in frustration after losing to her. "I had to face sexual harassment, physical intimidation, and, regularly, verbal and mental abuse," Polgar told St. Louis Post-Dispatch of her experience competing in the 1970s and '80s. Botez said she experienced sexism in chess communities growing up. "Sometimes it's the people who are your closest friends that think females are genetically worse at chess," she told Insider. Botez said she's often heard comments like, "you're playing the girl, it's an easy win." In a recent interview with Insider, Magnus Carlsen, the world's top-ranked chess player, said that he still sees sexism in the world of chess. "In general, chess societies have not been very kind to women and girls over the years," he said. "Certainly there needs to be a bit of a change of culture."

Damn. Didnt realize Netflix made it seem better for women than it actually was in the 60's.

---

Its even worse than that

on top of all that, even the non outright hostile people are condescending. "oh you only won because they took it easy on you since you're a girl. They weren't trying."

That's still around today

---

Seemed obvious that it was overly rosey.

---

Well... yeah. Duh. That show was weirdly non-sexist. Every time she beat a man, I was expecting some scene where they freak out and say she didn't belong but they all just congratulate her and become her new ally.

Edit: and honestly I appreciated the show for subverting those expectations. It focused on Beth's drama and didn't distract with what would have been a predictable "man = bad" subplot every episode.
---

lilORANG posted...

Well... yeah. Duh. That show was weirdly non-sexist. Every time she beat a man, I was expecting some scene where they freak out and say she didn't belong but they all just congratulate her and become her new ally.

Edit: and honestly I appreciated the show for subverting those expectations. It focused on Beth's drama and didn't distract with what would have been a predictable "man = bad" subplot every episode.

Yeah, I feel like this is why exactly why they did it that way.

---

Its almost like a pastime that requires obsessive dedication attracts socially maladjusted weirdos who hate women!

---

To be fair, it's not like male chess pros are nice to other male chess pros. There's a lot of animosity in professional chess in general.

BlueTigerLion posted...

Damn. Didnt realize Netflix made it seem better for women than it actually was in the 60's.

Generally speaking when covering historical events about how horrible they are, it's always worse than how it's portrayed.

Serious portrayals anyway. I wouldn't consider Inglourious Basterds to be a part of this family but things like Schindler's List while still very accurate were still slightly nicer than what actually happened. Saving Private Ryan's famous Normandy beach scene was also pretty accurate but still slightly muted.

Reality just doesn't make a good movie.

---

jeffhardyb0yz posted...

it doesnt have to be man = bad every episode but it should address that issue. Idk why men get offended when shows touch up on this aspect. Sexism surrounds women in so many industries, especially competitive sports/games.

Men don't experience it so it obviously doesn't exist.


---

First y'all tell me gamers are sexist now chess players are sexist man I'm done with this shit

---

You can win at chess without a queen, but you can't win without a king.

---

jeffhardyb0yz posted...

it doesnt have to be man = bad every episode but it should address that issue. Idk why men get offended or annoyed when shows touch up on this aspect. Sexism surrounds women in so many industries, especially competitive sports/games. To sweep over that doesnt do the struggle justice

That's not what the show was about so there's no need to cram in some other topic they didn't feel like covering.
---

Relatively recently a famous English international master said in an interview that there are less female GMs because 'their brains are coded differently' or some such >_>

That's the thing with communities that are that sexist, it's so insulated that some members don't even realize how sexist it is.

Saying this as a tournament chess player BTW

---

Chess is one of these things where Im not sure why they have separate divisions for women. Get rid of that to start.

---

whitelytning posted...

Chess is one of these things where Im not sure why they have separate divisions for women. Get rid of that to start.

It's there to highlight the female players. Otherwise the leagues are just going to be 99% men. Women compete in them but because there's just so many men the chances of a woman making it to a high stage in the tournaments are pretty low.

---

jeffhardyb0yz posted...

1.) Actually there are very much subtle subplots that address sexism that the show takes

2.) blatantly Addressing it is not cramming it in

1) yes, to its benefit

2) if it's not something the creators wanted to incorporate and would hurt the flow of the story, then it would very much be crammed in. And that's why they chose to do what they did.
---

Tyranthraxus posted...

It's there to highlight the female players. Otherwise the leagues are just going to be 99% men. Women compete in them but because there's just so many men the chances of a woman making it to a high stage in the tournaments are pretty low.

What do you mean the chance? Like, if chess is about ability where the better player is going to win most of the time isnt it just exacerbating sexism to have a separate division.

If men dont have some kind of inherent advantage, like they do in power lifting, why not just let the women compete. If they are good enough they will win and chance or luck doesnt have that much to do with it.

---

whitelytning posted...

What do you mean the chance? Like, if chess is about ability where the better player is going to win most of the time isnt it just exacerbating sexism to have a separate division.

At the professional level, the top players are all going to have roughly the same level of skill. It's not a coin flip exactly but it's rare to have someone who dominates year after year like prime Tiger Woods.

whitelytning posted...

If men dont have some kind of inherent advantage, like they do in power lifting, why not just let the women compete. If they are good enough they will win and chance or luck doesnt have that much to do with it.

They do compete and some even get to the top brackets but even when they do is like the one woman among 31 men.

---

whitelytning posted...

Chess is one of these things where Im not sure why they have separate divisions for women. Get rid of that to start.

The reality is, the GOAT female chess player peaked at #8 in the world. Now that's certainly impressive and there's probably no man to ever play that she wouldn't be able to beat every now and then but #1 in the world was simply not within her reach. And she was the best female to ever play. For whatever reason, aside from her no woman has ever even really been competitive at that level so having the Women's World Chess Championship makes sense.

Is there any competitive event where the best ever is a woman?

---

Tyranthraxus posted...

At the professional level, the top players are all going to have roughly the same level of skill. It's not a coin flip exactly but it's rare to have someone who dominates year after year like prime Tiger Woods.

They do compete and some even get to the top brackets but even when they do is like the one woman among 31 men.

Doesnt Magnus Carlsen kind of dominate?

---

Tyranthraxus posted...

Reality just doesn't make a good movie.

This, you can only portray so much and you have to make sure it doesn't impede on the narrative they're trying to show in the story.

---

A community mostly populated by nerds and Russians is hostile to women? Huh.

---