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ninkendo 08/06/21 10:37:07 PM #1: |
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MZero 08/06/21 10:41:55 PM #2: |
better than Metroidvania imo
--- MZero, to the extreme I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/06/21 10:48:21 PM #3: |
Could also be exploration action, but yeah these names were always better
--- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Underleveled 08/06/21 10:52:43 PM #4: |
To be fair, we don't say "Marionics" or "Dragon Fantasies" or anything like that.
--- darkx Games beaten in 2021 - 30; Most recent - Shantae and the Seven Sirens ... Copied to Clipboard!
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KingButz 08/06/21 10:57:31 PM #5: |
search action is awful
--- rip imgcake ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/06/21 11:00:01 PM #6: |
KingButz posted...
search action is awfulWhy? --- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Leonhart4 08/06/21 11:02:07 PM #7: |
Search action doesn't adequately convey what genre you're talking about. I wouldn't understand what that meant in a vacuum without this topic.
--- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Kenri 08/06/21 11:03:51 PM #8: |
As with all other cases of trying to control language to replace a natural and accepted term with a new, prescribed one: good luck with that!
Edit: Actually it seems more like this is just a direct translation and probably not meant for English audiences at all? Obviously Metroidvania doesn't exist as a term in Japan in the first place. --- Congrats to BKSheikah, who knows more about years than anyone else. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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XIII_rocks 08/06/21 11:08:46 PM #9: |
Well were they actually going to call it "Metroidvania"?
--- Not to be confused with XIII_stones. https://imgur.com/agodP3r ... Copied to Clipboard!
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XIII_rocks 08/06/21 11:09:08 PM #10: |
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Underleveled 08/06/21 11:14:42 PM #11: |
Leonhart4 posted...
Search action doesn't adequately convey what genre you're talking about. I wouldn't understand what that meant in a vacuum without this topic.This is fair. I expected MGS/Splinter Cell. --- darkx Games beaten in 2021 - 30; Most recent - Shantae and the Seven Sirens ... Copied to Clipboard!
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pjbasis 08/06/21 11:18:22 PM #12: |
Underleveled posted...
This is fair. I expected MGS/Splinter Cell. You don't think stealth would be used? --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Epyo 08/06/21 11:20:15 PM #13: |
search action just sounds like knuckles stages
exploration action would be better --- People who don't finish their sentences I'm a Castlevania superfan! Ask me anything! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Tom Bombadil 08/06/21 11:21:36 PM #14: |
Underleveled posted...
To be fair, we don't say "Marionics" or "Dragon Fantasies" or anything like that. Roguelikes! --- pretend there is a trans flag emoji here ... Copied to Clipboard!
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th3l3fty 08/06/21 11:27:34 PM #15: |
Leonhart4 posted...
Search action doesn't adequately convey what genre you're talking about. I wouldn't understand what that meant in a vacuum without this topic. the La-Mulana devs refer to it as "Ruins exploration archaeological action" so I fully endorse exploration action --- thelefty for analysis crew 2008 imo -transience I have a third degree burn in flame-o-nomics -Sir Chris ... Copied to Clipboard!
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FBike1 08/06/21 11:33:58 PM #16: |
Tom Bombadil posted...
Roguelikes!That term has its own problems... ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/06/21 11:38:21 PM #17: |
Leonhart4 posted...
Search action doesn't adequately convey what genre you're talking about. I wouldn't understand what that meant in a vacuum without this topic.Ok now explain how Metroidvania conveys genre in a vaccum. Or RPG or FPS. Genres only mean anything in context in the first place. --- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/06/21 11:40:01 PM #18: |
Epyo posted...
search action just sounds like knuckles stagesThe Japanese word used could be translated as exploration. But also, Knuckles stages are kind of in the same genre as Metroid. --- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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LeonhartFour 08/06/21 11:42:04 PM #19: |
foolm0r0n posted...
Ok now explain how Metroidvania conveys genre in a vaccum. Or RPG or FPS. my point is that there's already a commonly accepted term among gamers, so if you're wanting to replace it, it needs to be something that's more to the point than what's already being used or it won't be accepted although those other terms do convey what type of game it is more than "search action" which just feels like two random words put side by side heck even using "stage clear" to describe Mario games gets the point across better --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/06/21 11:58:22 PM #20: |
It's way more to the point than Metroidvania. For one, the term has nothing to do with 90% of Castlevania games. You have to know that the term was created during a specific time 20+ years ago when SOTN was popular. And it says nothing about what part of Metroid it's about. Is it the aliens, the shooting, the abilities, the exploration, the platforming? Role Playing Game and Roguelike are similarly nonsensical, and FPS is not as intuitive as it seems as first either.
So effectively everyone just memorizes what Metroidvania and other genre terms refer to after a while. It's easy to add Search/Exploration Action in the mix, especially since it's more intuitive than most genres. --- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MZero 08/07/21 12:00:42 AM #21: |
Kenri posted...
As with all other cases of trying to control language to replace a natural and accepted term with a new, prescribed one: good luck with that! Metroidvania is used in Japanese, too --- MZero, to the extreme I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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LeonhartFour 08/07/21 12:01:24 AM #22: |
I'm fine with calling it exploration action since that's actually to the point but search action doesn't adequately sum up a genre because "search" is too vague a term
you "search" for things in most action games after all --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MZero 08/07/21 12:04:23 AM #23: |
foolm0r0n posted...
It's way more to the point than Metroidvania. For one, the term has nothing to do with 90% of Castlevania games. You have to know that the term was created during a specific time 20+ years ago when SOTN was popular. And it says nothing about what part of Metroid it's about. Is it the aliens, the shooting, the abilities, the exploration, the platforming? Role Playing Game and Roguelike are similarly nonsensical, and FPS is not as intuitive as it seems as first either. I actually had no idea what Metroidvania meant, despite hearing the term countless times, until like last year when I played Hollow Knight. I never played Metroid or Castlevania growing up, and assumed it was just side scrolling games that are hard or something --- MZero, to the extreme I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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ninkendo 08/07/21 12:05:08 AM #24: |
I would recommend playing some Castlevania games
IGAvanias are best :D --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MoogleKupo141 08/07/21 12:14:16 AM #25: |
Underleveled posted...
To be fair, we don't say "Marionics" or "Dragon Fantasies" or anything like that. There were a lot of other platformers and JRPGs contemporary to Mario or FF in a way that there kind of wasnt for Metroid/Castlevania. We didnt really need a word for Metroidvania until indie games got more mainstream and suddenly there were a million games like Metroid. --- For your Azuarc . At least Kupo has class and doesn't MESSAGE the people -Dr Pizza ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Kenri 08/07/21 12:14:45 AM #26: |
MZero posted...
Metroidvania is used in Japanese, tooOh that's... legitimately surprising to me, since Castlevania isn't even called Castlevania there. --- Congrats to BKSheikah, who knows more about years than anyone else. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MZero 08/07/21 12:35:35 AM #27: |
ninkendo posted...
I would recommend playing some Castlevania games I did play Rondo of Blood actually, but that was also recently and not a Metroidvania! Kenri posted... Oh that's... legitimately surprising to me, since Castlevania isn't even called Castlevania there. Some of them are, actually. The GBA ones and a few others I think. It's pretty confusing --- MZero, to the extreme I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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paperwarior 08/07/21 12:44:48 AM #28: |
Exploration sidescroller seems more accurate. Aren't they all sidescrollers? Pretty similar otherwise to "action-adventure" when I think about it.
--- "God Hand is the ultimate expression of the joy of humanity, specifically the punching part of the joy of humanity."-Shigeru Miyamoto ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Grand Kirby 08/07/21 12:45:51 AM #29: |
let's just call them frobly-moblys
--- Okay, I rolled a 14. What's that mean? Hsu That you're a cheater. This is a 12-sided die. Chan ... Copied to Clipboard!
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WazzupGenius00 08/07/21 12:45:59 AM #30: |
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Mac Arrowny 08/07/21 12:55:07 AM #31: |
Akumetro Draculoid
--- All the stars in the sky are waiting for you. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/07/21 2:09:32 AM #32: |
LeonhartFour posted...
you "search" for things in most action games after allIf you mean audio logs or like ammo packs, it's not the main thing in the gameplay. Every shooter, platformer, and even puzzle game nowadays has RPG mechanics for example, but that doesn't make RPG a bad name (it's bad for other reasons). Some collectathons like Banjo Kazooie are definition "search" games though, but it also makes a lot of sense to put them in the same genre as Metroid. --- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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-hotdogturtle-- 08/07/21 2:19:55 AM #33: |
LeonhartFour posted...
my point is that there's already a commonly accepted term among gamers, so if you're wanting to replace it, it needs to be something that's more to the point than what's already being used or it won't be acceptedThe difference is that this Nintendo post is a formally published article and Metroidvania is a made up term. They (Nintendo) aren't trying to "replace" anything. Your point doesn't apply here; it would only be relevant if, like, a group of gamers was trying to start a cultural movement to convince other people on the internet to start calling Metroidvanias "search actions". Then you could tell them that they were wrong. --- Hey man, LlamaGuy did encrypt the passwords. With what? ROT-13? -CJayC ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MZero 08/07/21 2:46:35 AM #34: |
Epyo posted...
search action just sounds like knuckles stages This is translated by DeepL so it's not actually from Nintendo themselves. Exploration Action is a better translation anyway imo -hotdogturtle-- posted... The difference is that this Nintendo post is a formally published article and Metroidvania is a made up term. They (Nintendo) aren't trying to "replace" anything. It's also explaining what kind of game Metroid is for people who don't know so calling it a Metroidvania probably wouldn't help much! --- MZero, to the extreme I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Murphiroth 08/07/21 2:55:29 AM #35: |
Somewhere Matt McMuscles is screaming "I TOLD YOU SO" because he's been pushing search action in his vids for a while.
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StartTheMachine 08/07/21 3:25:54 AM #36: |
We should have always called them Metroidlikes and not Metroidvanias too. SotN was 3 years after Super Metroid really established the genre, and 11 years after the original Metroid created it to begin with.
--- - Blur - Welcome to your Divinity. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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andylt 08/07/21 8:16:26 AM #37: |
Kenri posted...
As with all other cases of trying to control language to replace a natural and accepted term with a new, prescribed one: good luck with that!This. People already use Metroidvania, attempting to change its name is as pointless as trying to change 'roguelike' or 'role-playing game'. Most genre names are a little ambiguous at best, but they become popular and that's what sticks! I really don't get the fuss people make over this one particular name. -hotdogturtle-- posted... The difference is that this Nintendo post is a formally published article and Metroidvania is a made up term. They (Nintendo) aren't trying to "replace" anything.Nintendo uses the term Metroidvania. In multiple news articles on Switch they have used it to promote a list of games on sale or whatever, and they explain briefly what the genre generally includes. Microsoft also uses the term officially for similar things on Xbox, despite there not even being any Metroids available on that platform! And as Kenri and MZero say, this article is not an official translation and so might not even be accurate. --- Slowly becoming a Final Fantasy aficionado. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Leonhart4 08/07/21 9:00:23 AM #38: |
foolm0r0n posted...
If you mean audio logs or like ammo packs, it's not the main thing in the gameplay. Every shooter, platformer, and even puzzle game nowadays has RPG mechanics for example, but that doesn't make RPG a bad name (it's bad for other reasons). You search for secret exits in Super Mario World, and that's a pretty big part of the gameplay. A lot of traditional platformers have key items you search for in addition to just trying to get to the end of the level. For instance, you can't beat every level in Sonic 3 & Knuckles without finding all the Chaos Emeralds. It's just too vague of a term to capture what they're going for. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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redrocket 08/07/21 9:03:15 AM #39: |
andylt posted...
And as Kenri and MZero say, this article is not an official translation and so might not even be accurate. SHINE lied to us about video games? I feel lost --- It's like paying for bubble wrap. -transience on Final Fantasy: All the Bravest ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Leonhart4 08/07/21 9:12:52 AM #40: |
redrocket posted...
SHINE lied to us about video games? I feel lost is this your first ninkendo topic He posts topics that are as misleading and vague as the term "search action" all the time...! --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Radix 08/07/21 9:51:25 AM #41: |
i think i prefer action-explorer to search/exploration action imo
(all are better than metroidvania) --- congrats to azuarc for victorying GotD guru https://imgur.com/fKQfZ0Q ... Copied to Clipboard!
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WazzupGenius00 08/07/21 10:15:12 AM #42: |
the term they use is "tansaku akushon"
tansaku - search/explore akushon - literally the english word action I think you can safely say the translation is accurate in that regard --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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ninkendo 08/07/21 10:37:15 AM #43: |
I only provide accurate news to the masses
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andylt 08/07/21 11:59:12 AM #44: |
I don't think it's an official endorsement of a genre name! And if it is then Stage Clear is also a genre now according to Nintendo.
--- Slowly becoming a Final Fantasy aficionado. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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foolm0r0n 08/07/21 12:09:57 PM #45: |
Leonhart4 posted...
You search for secret exits in Super Mario World, and that's a pretty big part of the gameplay. A lot of traditional platformers have key items you search for in addition to just trying to get to the end of the level. For instance, you can't beat every level in Sonic 3 & Knuckles without finding all the Chaos Emeralds. It's just too vague of a term to capture what they're going for.You can beat 90% of those games without exploring --- _foolmo_ he says listen to my story this maybe are last chance ... Copied to Clipboard!
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paperwarior 08/07/21 12:21:11 PM #46: |
What's a better term for RPG, though?
--- "God Hand is the ultimate expression of the joy of humanity, specifically the punching part of the joy of humanity."-Shigeru Miyamoto ... Copied to Clipboard!
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MZero 08/07/21 12:21:45 PM #47: |
WazzupGenius00 posted...
the term they use is "tansaku akushon" context is important! it's not inaccurate per se but explore is much better. When describing games, it's usually used in the context of like "explore dungeons" or "explore an open world" where search wouldn't really make sense. --- MZero, to the extreme I never saw azuarc coming, but he won the Guru! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Lightning Strikes 08/07/21 12:23:16 PM #48: |
Exploration action>Search action.
StartTheMachine posted... We should have always called them Metroidlikes and not Metroidvanias too. SotN was 3 years after Super Metroid really established the genre, and 11 years after the original Metroid created it to begin with. This is absolutely right. I adore Castlevania and especially the Iga ones, however it is definitely an imposter here. The gap between Metroid 1 and Symphony of the Night is 1.5x the gap between Symphony of the Night and Cave Story, and most Castlevania games arent even Metroidvanias in any way. --- I just decided to change this sig. Blaaaaaaargh azuarc ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Leonhart4 08/07/21 12:24:04 PM #49: |
foolm0r0n posted...
You can beat 90% of those games without exploring You can, which is why they're categorized as "stage clear" games by Nintendo. The ultimate goal is still just to beat the level. But if you're enough of a gamer that you'd actually encounter the phrase "search action," you've probably done a lot of exploring in those games. Same with something like DKC, which prides itself on having tons of hidden collectibles. And if you have to describe what it is to someone with "you know, like Metroid," you might as well just stick with Metroidvania. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Leonhart4 08/07/21 12:28:11 PM #50: |
And really, "search" fits something like finding collectibles because it's a tangible thing you're attempting to find. With a Metroidvania, exploration fits better because the goal isn't necessarily to find some tangible thing. It's to go everywhere there is to go.
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