Current Events > Am I the only one cheering for Paradis in Attack On Titan S4? (Spoilers to Ep7)

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LostForest
03/10/21 10:31:36 AM
#1:


Like, I know the whole narrative that they set up for season 4 is just "War is hell" and it's trying to make you feel really sympathetic for Marley and its people but like... I'm up to Episode 7 after the shit hits the fan and everything, and the whole time I've been like a giddy schoolgirl, rooting for Eren and crew.

Like, I get that civilians were killed and that war is terrible, but idk. I spent the last 3 seasons watching these characters live in terror, so seeing them go fucking HAM on the nation which was responsible for it is really badass. Yet, from what I've seen in are circles, it seems like most of the AoT community has been the opposite.

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WingsOfGood
03/10/21 10:34:31 AM
#2:


No.

I think most people want Eren to kill everyone.

But what makes AoT good is that it still gives you a real view of how atrocious that is even if you are rooting for it.

Btw everyone hates Gabi.
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PatrickMahomes
03/10/21 10:39:28 AM
#3:


Marlians: *ship off a bunch of devil people to an island and bury the entire rest of the world from them*
Paradis: *don't like that*
Marlians:



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LostForest
03/10/21 10:42:24 AM
#4:


WingsOfGood posted...
Btw everyone hates Gabi.

Oh my God thank God I thought I was the only one.

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DarkChozoGhost
03/10/21 10:52:55 AM
#5:


LostForest posted...
Yet, it seems like most of the AoT community has been the opposite.
That's ridiculous. Most of the fanbase is anti Marley. Like, 85%.

And there's a difference between cheering for Paradis and justifying sacks of shit like Floch that deliberately target civilians.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 10:57:11 AM
#6:


I've been reading the manga and I'm at the point where I just want to see the resolution.

My opinion is that there is effectively no one to cheer for in this story once you reach the late stages. Almost everyone has been consumed in the cycle of violence. There are people who think they're valiant and self-sacrificing, but it's all in service to the machine of eternal conflict.

As they say, it's not about who's right. It's about who's left.

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WingsOfGood
03/10/21 10:59:16 AM
#7:


CyricZ posted...
I've been reading the manga and I'm at the point where I just want to see the resolution.

My opinion is that there is effectively no one to cheer for in this story once you reach the late stages. Almost everyone has been consumed in the cycle of violence. There are people who think they're valiant and self-sacrificing, but it's all in service to the machine of eternal conflict.

As they say, it's not about who's right. It's about who's left.

Not all fiction requires a protagonist. Sometimes it is about world building and seeing how events unfold.
Don't you want to see if Eren wins or fails?
Whether you want him to or not.

But anyways probably they gonna make us cheer for Historia, Levi or Mikasa in the end.
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Legato-and-Vash
03/10/21 11:04:44 AM
#8:


I don't think I've ever felt sympathetic for Marley. Especially when you look at Gabi. In a "she's this way because of Marley" sense.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 11:06:17 AM
#9:


WingsOfGood posted...
Not all fiction requires a protagonist. Sometimes it is about world building and seeing how events unfold.
Don't you want to see if Eren wins or fails?
Whether you want him to or not.
My post stands. I definitely want to see the resolution and what comes of all this.

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LostForest
03/10/21 11:09:40 AM
#10:


DarkChozoGhost posted...
That's ridiculous. Most of the fanbase is anti Marley. Like, 85%.

I edited my post to reflect that it's what I've seen anecdotally. My bad.

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WingsOfGood
03/10/21 11:15:07 AM
#11:


Legato-and-Vash posted...
I don't think I've ever felt sympathetic for Marley. Especially when you look at Gabi. In a "she's this way because of Marley" sense.

Marely are basically supposed to be Nazis.
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DepreceV2
03/10/21 11:17:16 AM
#12:


I'm waiting on Gabi's character to develop and change. If that never happens then I'll hate her forever

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CyricZ
03/10/21 11:55:19 AM
#13:


WingsOfGood posted...
Marely are basically supposed to be Nazis.
It's a bit more complicated than that (vague manga spoilers because this is historical stuff that I don't remember exactly when it was revealed). The exile of the Eldian people, to say nothing of their being segregated, shunned, and forced to carry armbands, are very clear and obvious Nazi Germany analogues, which would make the Eldians the Jewish (and other groups) analogues. I don't know if you'd call it a "problem", but the main difference here is that with the power of the Titans, there is an actual legitimate threat in terms of a power imbalance. In the case of Nazi Germany, the threat of the Jew was propaganda and imagined. In the case of AoT, the threat is real.

It's one of the reasons that people have a tough time with the themes behind the series and have reservations about what Isayama is trying to say through his work. Here we have what would in any other story be a clear setting of prejudice upon a downtrodden people, but the "kicker" is that those being oppressed can in fact use their genetic ability, a power they have as part of their heritage and who they culturally are, to get bloody revenge and exercise a power against their oppressors that is woefully imbalanced against the oppressor. In this case, the fear that "the Nazis" have against those they oppress is actually justified.

I took a look at the latest episode synopsis so I can see where the anime is compared to the manga and it's not quite to the point where we should be discussing without tags what comes after the opening assault on Marley, but let's just say even at that point in the manga I was having serious reservations about "cheering for Paradis".

But then that makes sense: up to this arc in the series, the entire story has been about "we need to defeat the Titans and find the truth about our world" and the truth, of course, ends up making everything far more complicated rather than simple, which is a stroke that I like. I just hope it can stick the landing.

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LostForest
03/10/21 12:28:53 PM
#14:


CyricZ posted...
I was having serious reservations about "cheering for Paradis".

But then that makes sense: up to this arc in the series, the entire story has been about "we need to defeat the Titans and find the truth about our world

That's more or less what I'm getting at. I know the point of the plot right now is to make it complicated, and make you question who's really the "good guys". But like I can't help but say fuck it and just want Paradis to fuck everybody up because it's a product of how the story was told. I know those characters better and know their plight better, therefore I don't care what they do to get revenge lol.

Also this isn't me criticizing the writing by any means, I think it's great. It's more of a matter on my own preference for plots to not be morally grey, hence why this is a generic "Am I the only one who?" topic lol.

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ZeroX91
03/10/21 12:37:53 PM
#15:


If you rooting for Erin you in the wrong...the whole totally not jews thing falls apart when they actually have superpowers and actively want to kill everyone that isn't from their island. Rememeber folks Marco and that one kids mom are the only ones that didn't do anything wrong, The Warriors did a lot of wrong shit but did it to survive, The Warriors candidates are actively brainwashed child soliders, and Eren never changed just gained more knowledge.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 12:45:04 PM
#16:


ZeroX91 posted...
that one kids mom
My favorite character.

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Trelve
03/10/21 12:47:03 PM
#17:


Gabi is just a brainwashed kid who's entire worldview is based on a lie. She's just like Eren with her thirst for revenge. Both her and Reiner are the most interesting characters in the show right now.
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ZeroX91
03/10/21 12:47:26 PM
#18:


CyricZ posted...
My favorite character.
At the orphanage..it's a good scene.

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DepreceV2
03/10/21 12:49:07 PM
#19:


I still want to see what role Annie plays in all of this

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ZeroX91
03/10/21 12:49:56 PM
#20:


Trelve posted...
Gabi is just a brainwashed kid who's entire worldview is based on a lie. She's just like Eren with her thirst for revenge. Both her and Reiner are the most interesting characters in the show right now.
Yup. The hate for Gabi is dumb. She is just Eren with boobs and Shashas face. Falco is like a Riner Armin hybrid, I like him too.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 12:50:19 PM
#21:


Trelve posted...
Gabi is just a brainwashed kid who's entire worldview is based on a lie. She's just like Eren with her thirst for revenge. Both her and Reiner are the most interesting characters in the show right now.
I'm with you on Reiner. Dude's pretty much a deuteragonist in the arc.

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CyricZ He/him
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ZeroX91
03/10/21 12:55:38 PM
#22:


Super spoilers.
i like how Zeke's plan is to just reenact the shit that happened a hundred years ago, then Eren tries to fuck it up just solidifying the loop. Yimer is a spitefully 1000 year old loli titan everything is just set up to play out the same way again in another hundred or so just with the Attack titan removed from the cycle and a new birdy titan assuming they do stop Eren.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 12:58:21 PM
#23:


ZeroX91 posted...
spoilers.

To be fair.

Ymir has PLENTY to be spiteful over. It really underlines an ongoing theme that this entire conflict is cycles of very personal revenge rather than being resource based or ideology based.


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ZeroX91
03/10/21 1:00:40 PM
#24:


CyricZ posted...
To be fair.

Ymir has PLENTY to be spiteful over. It really underlines an ongoing theme that this entire conflict is cycles of very personal revenge rather than being resource based or ideology based.
why she gotta do Historia like that tho? She a spiteful lil bitch

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CyricZ
03/10/21 1:07:18 PM
#25:


ZeroX91 posted...
why she gotta do Historia like that tho? She a spiteful lil bitch
Hang on. Is this something post Chapter 130? That's as far as I am (the English release).

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ZeroX91
03/10/21 1:11:09 PM
#26:


CyricZ posted...
Hang on. Is this something post Chapter 130? That's as far as I am (the English release).
Maybe? she just is kinda forcing Historia to fill her role where she has to poop out babies with someone she hates instead of being an active participant seems real shitty to me.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 1:18:17 PM
#27:


Oh okay no that's been established for a while, or at least since the Marley arc began.

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LostForest
03/10/21 1:44:17 PM
#28:


ZeroX91 posted...
Yup. The hate for Gabi is dumb. She is just Eren with boobs and Shashas face. Falco is like a Riner Armin hybrid, I like him too.

No tho?

Eren's thirst for revenge was fueled by watching his hometown get fucking stomped, his house being destroyed, and his mother getting killed in front of his eyes.
Gabi's is just fueled by propaganda, unless they give her some sort of tragic backstory.

Either way, the hate is justified since people hate Eren too lol.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 2:05:38 PM
#29:


LostForest posted...
Eren's thirst for revenge was fueled by watching his hometown get fucking stomped, his house being destroyed, and his mother getting killed in front of his eyes.
Don't forget his negotiation with Mikasa's kidnappers lol.

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CyricZ He/him
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Legato-and-Vash
03/10/21 3:11:12 PM
#30:


Eh, I think Gabi is already unforgivable. Especially with how she took joy in it. Falco is much more sensible.

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ZeroX91
03/10/21 3:20:05 PM
#31:


LostForest posted...
No tho?

Eren's thirst for revenge was fueled by watching his hometown get fucking stomped, his house being destroyed, and his mother getting killed in front of his eyes.
Gabi's is just fueled by propaganda, unless they give her some sort of tragic backstory.

Either way, the hate is justified since people hate Eren too lol.
And seeing her home town flatten and he friends right in front of her eyes. They the same character placed in different circumstances.

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LostForest
03/10/21 3:38:31 PM
#32:


ZeroX91 posted...
And seeing her home town flatten and he friends right in front of her eyes. They the same character placed in different circumstances.

Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.

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CyricZ
03/10/21 4:00:20 PM
#33:


LostForest posted...
Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died.
I once again reference the Mikasa kidnappers. Maybe he didn't want to join up with the military, but Eren is no stranger to using violence.

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ZeroX91
03/10/21 4:11:25 PM
#34:


LostForest posted...
Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.

LostForest posted...
Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.

LostForest posted...
Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.

LostForest posted...
Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.

LostForest posted...
Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.

LostForest posted...
Nah, they're opposites.

Gabi was angry, vicious, and a skilled fighter, actively participating in combat before that incident.

Eren wasn't interested in fighting or anything until his mother died. And even after that, he sucked at everything until he got the ultimate plot-armor.
Eren wasn't interested in fighting...you might wanna reread/watch man
...
Why the fuck does my tablet keep doing that? Only pressed quote once. :\

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LostForest
03/10/21 5:01:39 PM
#35:


ZeroX91 posted...
Eren wasn't interested in fighting...you might wanna reread/watch man


CyricZ posted...
I once again reference the Mikasa kidnappers. Maybe he didn't want to join up with the military, but Eren is no stranger to using violence.

I guess I should. I mostly just remember that he didn't want to join the military and fight the titans. Also, like I said, he was a loser. Gabi is good at everything, it's key to her character.

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ZeroX91
03/10/21 5:04:21 PM
#36:


LostForest posted...
I guess I should. I mostly just remember that he didn't want to join the military and fight the titans. Also, like I said, he was a loser. Gabi is good at everything, it's key to her character.
I mean she also is a Mikasa but that makes Falco an Eren which he isn't dude is a good lad

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ChrisTaka
03/10/21 8:58:15 PM
#37:


LostForest posted...
I guess I should. I mostly just remember that he didn't want to join the military and fight the titans.

You're half right, he wanted to join the military but mostly because he wanted to see outside the walls

https://youtu.be/NeO9leQBcFk

His mom dying was just the final nail in the coffin.

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