Poll of the Day > Gotta Love Texas

(+) Yeah! (+)

Due to the crazy weather and power issues, some people are getting hit with, and I am not joking.... 17k electric bills....

Viva La Capitalism.

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I love texas toast
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Its almost like private companies will totally fuck people over if there arent regulations to keep them from doing so

Who would have thought

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Texas is a failed state.

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None of those people will have to pay that bills

If they made everyone actually pay those, you'd see the biggest riot of this era

Want to stay warm? Burn down the city.

ReggieTheReckless posted...

None of those people will have to pay that bills

If they made everyone actually pay those, you'd see the biggest riot of this era

Want to stay warm? Burn down the city.

not only are you wrong, youre categorically wrong

many of the people facing these charges werent sent a bill, they have already been directly charged

there was just a older guy interviewed who normally pays $200 a month and the power company just withdrew $16,000 from his retirement account for the service they are providing

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Mead posted...

Its almost like private companies will totally fuck people over if there arent regulations to keep them from doing so

Who would have thought

Actually in this case it was mostly Texas that fucked people over.

"On Feb 15, during the power crisis, the state's Public Utility Commission required ERCOT to set the price to the $9000 maximum. The commission reasoned that the trading prices for energy (as low as $1200) were inconsistent with with the supply scarcity."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griddy

Griddy charges $10 a month to allow customers to buy power at wholesale rates, so even with a $17k bill they only see the $10 and the rest goes to the wholesale supplier.

rjsilverthorn posted...

Griddy charges $10 a month to allow customers to buy power at wholesale rates, so even with a $17k bill they only see the $10 and the rest goes to the wholesale supplier.

tell that to the people being charged five figures

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Mead posted...

tell that to the people being charged five figures

I'm not saying the people didn't get hosed, I'm saying they got hosed by Texas and not their utility company. Griddy doesn't generate any power, they buy 100% of it at the wholesale rate, the same rate the customers got billed for.

Power companies in regulated areas are fucking raking in cash there's literally no reason not to regulate other than straight-up greed. They'll make billions either way.

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rjsilverthorn posted...

I'm saying they got hosed by Texas and not their utility company.

Theyre working hand and glove.

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Far-Queue posted...

They'll make billions either way.

Why make billions when you can make... billions?

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Mead posted...

Theyre working hand and glove.

I'm having a hard time seeing how this particular company is profiting from this. They make literally zero more money than normal and get a lot of bad press.

Now how companies that actually generate power and benefit from the increased wholesale price made out is a different question.

Zareth posted...

Why make billions when you can make... billions?

Damn, good point.

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rjsilverthorn posted...

I'm having a hard time seeing how this particular company is profiting from this. They make literally zero more money than normal and get a lot of bad press.

Now how companies that actually generate power and benefit from the increased wholesale price made out is a different question.

I dunno dude youre the one trying to categorize everything. Texans are getting totally fucked over is my point.

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Mead posted...

not only are you wrong, youre categorically wrong

many of the people facing these charges werent sent a bill, they have already been directly charged

there was just a older guy interviewed who normally pays $200 a month and the power company just withdrew $16,000 from his retirement account for the service they are providing

Doubtful? That probably only happened because he had his bills set to autopay and linked to his bank account for direct draw

You can't, as a private company, access someone's 401k or IRA or whatever and just take money from it. That's not possible and again, if it was and it did happen, people would burn down the fucking city.

ReggieTheReckless posted...

Doubtful? That probably only happened because he had his bills set to autopay and linked to his bank account for direct draw

You can't, as a private company, access someone's 401k or IRA or whatever and just take money from it. That's not possible and again, if it was and it did happen, people would burn down the fucking city.

not everyone has their money in an account like that

if you want to dispute the people who are claiming that this is happening to them then youre free to go do that

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The point is that it won't stick. No one is going to let that happen. Even if it takes 5 years of goverment petitioning and intervention, all of those people will get their money back

Lawyers LOVE to get peoples money back after shit like this

If they don't get their money back, they gave up and didn't complain hard enough

I don't get how these people's bills are so high. How are they 10-15-17k for just a week of cold weather? People in the north with normal winters don't have crazy high bills like that. Doesn't make sense to this Northerner, anyone able to explain why theirs are so high?

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ReggieTheReckless posted...

The point is that it won't stick. No one is going to let that happen. Even if it takes 5 years of goverment petitioning and intervention, all of those people will get their money back

Lawyers LOVE to get peoples money back after shit like this

If they don't get their money back, they gave up and didn't complain hard enough

okay dude this is obviously very important and not at all pedantic while theyre going through a crisis

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ReggieTheReckless posted...

The point is that it won't stick. No one is going to let that happen. Even if it takes 5 years of goverment petitioning and intervention, all of those people will get their money back

Lawyers LOVE to get peoples money back after shit like this

If they don't get their money back, they gave up and didn't complain hard enough

I just hope it's Texas itself that eats the loss and has to pay out.
I'll be super fucking pissed off if they get a federal bailout to repay all these people.

After years of gleefully shepherding companies and jobs to Texas from other states because of low taxes and no regulations, to then get a bailout to cover the cost of said low taxes and no regulation...
It's basically inter-state theft at that point. Stealing from the more stable and regulated economies and then double-stealing thru a bailout for their own actions without changing anything.

Decoy77 posted... I don't get how these people's bills are so high. How are they 10-15-17k for just a week of cold weather? People in the north with normal winters don't have crazy high bills like that. Doesn't make sense to this Northerner, anyone able to explain why theirs are so high?

Short answer: Capitalism
Longer answer: When people are literally freezing to death, they'll pay anything to like...not freeze to death. Literally a hostage customer base. Without regulations in place to prevent companies from price gouging people in their time of need, they can get away with it and make obscene profits with ease. Without anything to regulate capitalism, a company will do anything it can to maximize profits. The Marquis de Sade literally warned of this 200 years ago, that it's basically just "The State of Nature" Redux, with "poor" replacing "weak" and "rich" replacing "strong".

Decoy77 posted...

I don't get how these people's bills are so high. How are they 10-15-17k for just a week of cold weather? People in the north with normal winters don't have crazy high bills like that. Doesn't make sense to this Northerner, anyone able to explain why theirs are so high?

The people in question were buying electricity at the wholesale price, which is generally only used to sell electricity between utilities. The price there changes every 5 minutes to reflect real time changes in supply and demand and this particular storm caused a surge in demand and decrease in supply due to various failures associated to the cold temperatures. This caused the wholesale price to hit the maximum allowed rate of $9 per KW/H, which is astronomically high when you consider the average is around $0.05.

streamofthesky posted...

When people are literally freezing to death, they'll pay anything to like...not freeze to death. Literally a hostage customer base. Without regulations in place to prevent companies from price gouging people in their time of need, they can get away with it and make obscene profits with ease. Without anything to regulate capitalism, a company will do anything it can to maximize profits.

See: pharmaceutical industry

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keyblader1985 posted...

See: pharmaceutical industry

Yeah, as I was typing the first part I immediately thought of the "Bitter Pill" story about outrageous drug and medical prices, and how the author wrote that he had a nightmare about going into the ER and being desperate for aid and willing to pay anything to receive it.
But I didn't want to derail the topic.

Same idea, though.

streamofthesky posted...

Without regulations in place to prevent companies from price gouging people in their time of need, they can get away with it and make obscene profits with ease. Without anything to regulate capitalism, a company will do anything it can to maximize profits.

Last I checked there were in fact things in place for this. Like gas stations raising gas prices to price gouge is illegal. This is a thing, so how would it not be a thing for other forms of energy too? Same for bottled water in an emergency etc. There are rules and laws already against this. Now there is nothing stopping places from trying it, but there are crimes being committed and they could be punished for it.

Now as the next person responded after you if the home owner is in an agreed upon contract with an energy provider and they are in fact buying at wholesale prices which can be a variable rate with supply and demand... well I hate to break it to them then that is their own doings and they should in fact be charged that amount. Sorry, you agreed to it.

This is why you can establish your gas rate for a year at a time, at least here in Ohio that's what we do.

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Texas decided to go full RollerBall, but forgot the, you know, RollerBall part.

Jonathan E is supposed to be playing in Houston, dammit!

streamofthesky posted...

I just hope it's Texas itself that eats the loss and has to pay out.

Abbott or whoever, to their very, very small credit, did recently say that Texas (the state) should foot the bill. Which is a more stupid variation of "should regulate their energy so insane bills like this can't happen" but, you know: Republicans and baby steps.

The best part is, about 10% of Texas doesn't run on ERCOT, due to being too far away (Like El Paso), and instead run on power from neighboring states/built their own stations.

All these regions were fine and didn't suffer like the other 90% of Texas.

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