Current Events > Rogue lite/likes are cancer

(+) Yeah! (+)

Highly disagree, they're some of my favorite games. Hades 2020 GOTY

CRON posted...

The Binding of Isaac: Rebirth is one of the GOAT, period, though. It's accessible, humorous, has a great aesthetic and art style, and has borderline infinite replayability.

Hell yeah, one of my most played games on Steam. Looking forward to Repentance in March!

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Completely agree TC

Laziest way to make a game


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D, I've sunk thousands of hours into them between

OG Isaac
Isaac Rebirth + dlc
Gungeon
Dead Cells
Hades

I don't care about levels or level design in video games. I care about getting strong as fuck and erasing bosses.

Conflict posted...

This is exactly how I feel. Never understood the fetishization for games that legitimately don't have level design or depth. Any time I see "rogue" in the description of an indie game I immediately back out.

I like Death Road to Canada because it's super comical with the custom character creation and Crypt of the Necrodancer because of its gimmick but that's it.

Level design isn't absent just because you have PCG. It's different, but people still do level design in most roguelites. And I'm not really sure what depth is supposed to mean here

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game via the rouge mechanics.

Red mechanics lol.

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I wouldn't go cancer, that would be open world. But nearly every rogue like/lite would be better without the gimmick.

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Conflict posted...

Like compare a game like Celeste that has extremely fleshed out levels to shit like Risk of Rain

It's really night and day

Yeah but that doesn't mean that roguelites don't have level design.

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In the absence of an equivalent game, I can accept a roguelike. A Robot Named Fight was extremely fun in the absence of a new Metroid game - it has the chunk problem you mention, but it also has over 50 unlockable elements as you play including weapons, new areas and new skills like the Super Metroid wall jump. It also kept its gameplay fresh with a Boss Rush mode, 4-player Deathmatch and a Mega Map with every environment in the game as opposed to a random selection of 3 that makes up a standard map.

The drawbacks are mitigated by the variety of gameplay elements and game modes it offers. It isn't Metroid, but until a new Metroid comes out, it's a close approximation and it's heavily replayable.

Slay the Spire is fantastic too. It's easy to drop in and out of a game, its card based combat is easy to get into, it's on every last-gen console including the Switch and mobile and it's endlessly replayable with daily challenges and unlockable card types that expand the scope of the game.

Man can't dine on roguelikes alone, but they're a quick and dirty alternative to a type of game that might not be focused on at the moment. When Nintendo makes a new Metroid, I'll play it - until then, A Robot Named Fight scratched that itch. Slay the Spire is just great non-committal fun, and for a card game, it isn't hopelessly up its own ass with stupid effect bullshit.

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Hades is hot garbage. Worst game ever, tbh.


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I'm split on it. Very rarely can I get into roguelikes--I enjoyed FTL, Binding of Isaac, intending to give Hades a spin. I understand and agree with the argument that many roguelikes/lites have very weak level design and many use it to be plain lazy instead. I think cancer is too strong of a word when it just feels like a different strokes thing.

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Conflict posted...

Like compare a game like Celeste that has extremely fleshed out levels to s*** like Risk of Rain

It's really night and day

That doesn't mean one game is better than the other.

Conflict posted...

Death Road to Canada

fuck the rng in that piece of shit game

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Level design isn't the end-all be-all of games, y'know. How the mechanics, movement, and obstacles are balanced takes a lot of time and micro adjusting to be effective.

Calling it lazy is very disingenuous

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dave_is_slick posted...

Don't do that.

hes saying that progression and unlocked stuff doesnt add anything to the experience. RPGs and action games are just the same stuff over and over with flashier abilities, FPS games are the same thing over and over with different guns, racing games are the same thing over and over with different cars, etc etc

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Rogue Legacy is the only one that really caught and held my attention tbh
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one game that caught my attention is noita, i haven't played it yet, but the mechanics seems to guarantee variety enough with the rouge system

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Depends on the game, I suppose.

I loves me some Elona, and was stoked when a mobile version came out since I can't use my PC right now.
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rouge mechanics

Conflict posted...

What he's talking about is how you're just trying to beat short runs over and over again. Unlocked stuff and modifiers just make it easier to eventually beat that run. You definitely can't compare it to RPGs or action games because those games are much more complete with a ton of exploration, and (for RPGs anyway) plot.

You can absolutely put those in a roguelite

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