Poll of the Day > Canada will issue PROOF of VACCINATION CARDS and BAN people who DON'T take it!!!

(+) Yeah! (+)

As Canada anxiously awaits the Pfzier vaccines for its first shipment which is expected to only be 249,000 doses, Ontario, the largest province in the country will issue proof of VACCINATION CARDS for those who receive their shots!!

Canada has NOT mandated the vaccines to be mandatory but many are already planning proof of vaccination from these cards and those who REFUSE to take it will be BANNED from entering businesses with crowded people such as movie theatres and restaurants and air travel

Conservative Ontario Health Minister, Christine Elliot said "That will be very important for people to have for travel purposes and perhaps work purposes or going to theatres or cinemas or any other place where people will be in close physical contact when we go through the worst of the pandemic. So Yes, that will be essential for people to have that"

Elliot said these vaccines are not mandatory but those who refuse will be BANNED from some activities

Ontario is one of the hardest hit in the country with more than 1600 cases a day

Vaccine distribution will be challenging for Canada as Prime Minister Justin Trudeau must decide how each province will get a vaccine later this month and how many will go to where given very limited supply but it's likely Ontario will get the most given its a per capita basis distribution

He is also not worried about the threat of Trump banning number of export of these vaccines to other countries as it's also revealed Trump did NOT order more vaccines when he had a chance to

Each province must store these in -80C freezers which will also be very challenging as well as giving 2 shots to every person.

Should the proof of vaccination cards goes through, that will give comfort to place of businesses with large groups of people but worry those in the black market may exploit this by selling fake cards to anti-vaxxers

Do you think proof of vaccination cards are good to track people who took the shot and those who are anti-vaxxers?

https://i.imgur.com/F1OZpnX.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/d5TRVTY.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/QUsU8QD.jpg
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So how many people are going to buy/make counterfeit cards

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papercup posted...

So how many people are going to buy/make counterfeit cards

None, they're Canadian.
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This isn't going to be super relevant in the short term. I believe in the first quarter of 2021 were expecting only 3 million vaccines, going exclusively to the elderly and front line workers. Supposedly by September there should be enough vaccines "for those who want them". I suspect after that point is when we might start to see vaccine "discrimination".

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This is sad - Canada has always worked on the honour system before

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Kyuubi4269 posted...

None, they're Canadian.

surprisedpikachu.jpg

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Seems a little too 1984 for my taste

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Muscles posted...

Seems a little too 1984 for my taste

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZITP93pqtdQ

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papercup posted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZITP93pqtdQ

I agree with Johnson, and the the people booing him are going too far towards anarchy, so whats your point?

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Communist Canada much?

Muscles posted...

Seems a little too 1984 for my taste

It's not really any different from mask mandates: If you can't demonstrate that you're taking the best available precautions to avoid endangering people within a place of business, you aren't allowed in.

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So the 'don't tread on me' folk are ok with a business' right to refuse service if a gay couple wants a wedding cake, but not ok with the right to refuse service if a business decides to 'discriminate' against their decision to risk catching and spreading a disease to said business's employees and other customers. Got it. Seems to me that certain people seem to emphasize the 'muh' in 'muh freedoms'

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BADoglick posted...

So the 'don't tread on me' folk are ok with a business' right to refuse service if a gay couple wants a wedding cake, but not ok with the right to refuse service if a business decides to 'discriminate' against their decision to risk catching and spreading a disease to said business's employees and other customers. Got it. Seems to me that certain people seem to emphasize the 'muh' in 'muh freedoms'

If the government makes it mandatory how will it be the business's choice? I don't disagree at all on your actual post, if a business wants you to wear a mask or get a vaccine then do it or shop somewhere else but if it's not their rule then it's a moot point

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BADoglick posted...

So the 'don't tread on me' folk are ok with a business' right to refuse service if a gay couple wants a wedding cake, but not ok with the right to refuse service if a business decides to 'discriminate' against their decision to risk catching and spreading a disease to said business's employees and other customers. Got it. Seems to me that certain people seem to emphasize the 'muh' in 'muh freedoms'

If a business wants to say you require ______ to enter, that is fine. A business should be able to refuse service or entry to any person for any reason. If the government want to say you can't enter without _______, they can fuck right off. That is between the business and customer.
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BADoglick posted...

So the 'don't tread on me' folk are ok with a business' right to refuse service if a gay couple wants a wedding cake, but not ok with the right to refuse service if a business decides to 'discriminate' against their decision to risk catching and spreading a disease to said business's employees and other customers. Got it. Seems to me that certain people seem to emphasize the 'muh' in 'muh freedoms'

Don't try to rationalize their thought process.

Most the people waving a "don't tread on me" flag seem to sympathize with or even outright wave the flag of "blue lives matter" despite that those two flags represent the literal polar opposite of one another.

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Maybe wrist tattoos will be a better system.

...none shall buy or sell...

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Muscles posted...

If the government makes it mandatory how will it be the business's choice? I don't disagree at all on your actual post, if a business wants you to wear a mask or get a vaccine then do it or shop somewhere else but if it's not their rule then it's a moot point

The government isn't mandating the vaccine, they're simply encouraging businesses to verify that their customers have been vaccinated. I would imagine not verifying everyone could lead to loss of legal protections should an incident occur, but a business is still free to assume that risk

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I dont see how anybody cant see whats going on here. Its actually straight denial at this point.

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zebatov posted...

I dont see how anybody cant see whats going on here. Its actually straight denial at this point.

idk, if you wanted to attend a blood orgy you'd need proof you don't have HIV

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Lokarin posted...

idk, if you wanted to attend a blood orgy you'd need proof you don't have HIV

I dont need a blood orgy to live. And if it came to it, I wouldnt card someone who was bringing food to my door for me, nor would I force them to wear a mask.

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Canada has a parliamentarian system; so I can't comment on whether their government has the right to ban people who refuse to get vaccinated or not. All I know is that idea would be instantly met by "it's 1984" or "Big Brother is watching us" and "I have a God given right to do what I want when I want without the government telling me what to do" in the US.

Can't have voter ID but want to have a covid vaccination id? really? HAHA screw off!

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Yeah well, I needed proof of a TB test before getting into a medical program.

It'll be interesting for it to play out. I really enjoy George Orwell, and usually recommend 'Homage to Catalonia'. It's crazy how pretty much anyone can interpret 1984/Animal Farm to justify their views. Those books have been beaten to a pulp.

Anyways, I don't think it's very "Orwellian" to have vaccination cards. My older roommate is anti-vaxx, but he's still a chill guy to live with. The last joke I made to him was "Could they PAY you to take it?". He laughed and said "we'll see how it goes". I doubt I can convince him it's not insidious, but who knows.

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Decoy77 posted...

Can't have voter ID but want to have a covid vaccination id? really? HAHA screw off!

what do you mean "can't have voter ID"?

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Show me your papers!

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From what I unserstand, it will be a government issued ID, but it will be up to the business if they will be checking and denying people service.
I do think it is needed (and on an international level) as proof, and definitely needs to be needed for getting on a plane, and cross boarder traveling.

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Full Throttle posted...

Do you think proof of vaccination cards is a good idea to ban anti-vaxxers from entering crowded businesses like movie theatres and restaurants?

We have appointment cards at the moment with no plans to have a proof of vaccination card. I'll be honest the hospitality industry in the UK is screwed so I don't think it'll be a good idea to turn folk away while they are trying to get back on their feet. Hell in my city the hospitality industry is still closed and we have the first wave of vaccines been given to people already. I believe it won't be until late next year that it becomes available to everyone as they are going by who's most at risk first. To turn folk away who can't get it yet seems a bad idea.

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zebatov posted...

I dont need a blood orgy to live.

You also don't need movie theatres, restaurants, or planes to live. Presumably, essential businesses would be prohibited from requiring these, since that would obviously be really, really bad, but it's fair game for non-essential stuff.

ReturnOfFa posted...

Yeah well, I needed proof of a TB test before getting into a medical program.

Eeyup. There's ample precedent for requiring proof of vaccinations for any job where you're working with particularly high-risk people.

ultra magnus13 posted...

If the government want to say you can't enter without _______, they can f*** right off. That is between the business and customer.

If we could trust businesses to place the interests of public health ahead of their own prosperity, that'd work fine. But we can't. That's the whole reason the entire FDA exists in the first place: To prevent products and services from being offered that will harm the public (or if a harmful product is permitted, such as cigarettes, to ensure the public is fully informed of the risks involved). There's ample precedent for government intervention to ensure that businesses don't harm the public for the sake of their bottom line (particularly when it comes to issues that are too complex or controversial for the public to be reasonably able to make informed decisions), and this falls well within that concept.

In practice, what's likely to happen is that businesses that don't require these cards for entry will be required to continue operating at distancing-friendly capacity and mandating masks. If all patrons are vaccinated, that should obviate such measures, which is generally going to be very attractive for businesses. Presumably, once the vaccination campaign reaches the herd immunity threshold and the virus disappears, the program will stop being beneficial enough to justify the administration expenses, so it'll be scrapped. That will depend on how the numbers look moving forward, though.

wwinterj25 posted...

To turn folk away who can't get it yet seems a bad idea.

I'll heartily agree with this, though I'm fairly certain nobody's planning on implementing such a program until vaccines are widely available. That would very obviously be a bad idea, especially while we can still rely on less effective measures than vaccines to keep businesses operating. That said, I don't know how this will handle people that genuinely can't get the vaccine (allergies, etc.), since that is a substantial problem with the idea.

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adjl posted...

That said, I don't know how this will handle people that genuinely can't get the vaccine (allergies, etc.), since that is a substantial problem with the idea.

That too. Some folk are already having a allergic reaction to it over here. Perhaps a exempt card for those(like with masks) will be the idea but it's not really worked for masks as some folk will always try to pull a fast one. We shall see.

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wwinterj25 posted...

That too. Some folk are already having a allergic reaction to it over here. Perhaps a exempt card for those(like with masks) will be the idea but it's not really worked for masks as some folk will always try to pull a fast one. We shall see.

Hard to say. I know a lot of places here have been mandating masks regardless of exemptions, requesting (usually quite politely) that anyone that can't wear a mask for whatever reason call them to do a curbside pickup, so that might be the way to go for people that can't be vaccinated. That won't help them access stuff like movie theatres or flights, though.

In terms of fairness, I like the idea of letting vaccine-allergic people get out of needing the cards, but at the same time, that does undermine the whole point of the cards (that is, to ensure that Covid isn't being brought into the establishments in question and spread among a crowd that isn't avoiding it). Of course, they're a pretty small minority and everyone else in the establishments will be vaccinated (vaccines aren't perfect, but vaccinated people are still vastly safer), so maybe that won't be too big of a deal. I guess we'll see what governments decide, since presumably they've thought of this issue as well.

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Decoy77 posted...

Can't have voter ID but want to have a covid vaccination id? really? HAHA screw off!

In Canada you DO have voter ID

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Yeah. Keep the fucking "muh freedom" diseased-mouthbreathers in check. Refusing vaccines is indicative of other shitty opinions in most cases. Probably nothing but trouble. And contrary to popular belief, nobody has the right to disobey public safety nor do they have the right to just go into another country because they want to and pick and choose what rules they like there.