Board 8 > Joe Biden elected the 46th president of the United States

(+) Yeah! (+)

Wanglicious posted...

and yet some of those jokes are winning.
so clearly less of a joke to the courts than to you.

They won the ability to have poll watchers be six feet away instead of ten feet away

Which is really more of a victory for the coronavirus

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What exactly are most media outlets waiting for to call this?

Jesse_Custer posted...

What exactly are most media outlets waiting for to call this?

When it's a statistically impossibility for a comeback. Most don't want to call anything because they don't want to give Trump ammunition for calling anything before the votes are in.

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Jesse_Custer posted...

What exactly are most media outlets waiting for to call this?

According to Nate Cohn they probably wont call it until Bidens margin passes a 0.5% lead, but all of the election guys are saying that its over

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There are a lot of provisional votes left. Haven't heard anyone talking about it so I'm not sure if the election analysts are aware of the potential here.

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Jesse_Custer posted...

What exactly are most media outlets waiting for to call this?

Fox doesn't want to call anything because if they do, Biden wins.
some are waiting for the margins to grow larger in Biden's favor in multiple states. this way even if there are recounts, if votes get thrown out, if any other fuckery occurs and goes in Trump's favor, Biden will still have enough of a lead in enough states that it won't change the conclusion.

to the latter's end, i don't know if they're gonna wait for the initial recount to be done or not, Georgia and PA already said they're starting/plan to start, the rest will follow. but if the gap in numbers is big enough, should see a few outlets call it.

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red sox 777 posted...

There are a lot of provisional votes left. Haven't heard anyone talking about it so I'm not sure if the election analysts are aware of the potential here.

The Nates have talked about them. In PA specifically theyre expected to be quite Democratic because people were being urged to vote provisionally instead of risking mailing ballots last minute and probably not having them arrive in time.

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A 0.5% lead would be like 33k votes, which would be probably beyond the range of the provisional ballots to catch. Also, PA as of this morning has received 30k mail votes after election day. Assuming those went for Biden at as low as a 70/30 clip, that's a swing of 12k right there. At 75/25 it would be 15k. PA has segregated those ballots so that they can be tossed out if SCOTUS gives the order. So if counting is stopped right now, and SCOTUS throws out those votes, Trump should still be in the lead, though he won't be for long.

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LordoftheMorons posted...

The Nates have talked about them. In PA specifically theyre expected to be quite Democratic because people were being urged to vote provisionally instead of risking their mail ballots not arriving in time (you could void your in-transit mail ballot and replace with a provisional vote)

We'll see then. So far they are nearly 80% for Trump out of the 4 counties reporting them so far (all red counties to be fair).

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LordoftheMorons posted...

The Nates have talked about them. In PA specifically theyre expected to be quite Democratic because people were being urged to vote provisionally instead of risking their mail ballots not arriving in time (you could void your in-transit mail ballot and replace with a provisional vote)

From the PA guide for elections workers:

When determining whether to count a provisional ballot, the county board of elections must reconcile provisional ballots with ballots cast in person on election day and with returned absentee and mailin ballots. If a voter cast an election day ballot or voted an absentee or mail in ballot, the provisional ballot shall not be counted.

So it seems that in that case if your mail ballot ended up arriving on time, it counts normally (and probably has already been counted) and the provisional ballot will not count. What I would expect, then, is that the provisional ballots will be a little bit lower for Trump than his election day percentage, which he won 65-34. But hard to have any confidence. I would wait for a little over 0.5% to call it, given the possibility of SCOTUS throwing out 30k votes.

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Wanglicious posted...

it absolutely is.
the argument is that the state has a compelling interest, that businesses can set the rules for entry/services, not that it isn't.

No, it really isnt

Thats like saying drunk driving is political speech
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RaidenGarai posted...

Only a few months until we can start implementing a plan for COVID!

whats the plan though beyond another lockdown

Kureejii Lea posted...

whats the plan though beyond another lockdown

Another lockdown? We never had a lockdown in the first place!

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Once PA passes a .5% lead for Biden and the automatic recount is no longer in effect, I expect a simultaneous call for Biden from most networks.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxjm8egW_wk

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Jakyl25 posted...

No, it really isnt

Thats like saying drunk driving is political speech

drink driving doesn't make for a good analogy at all.
seatbelts are a better choice, though it wasn't nearly as political as masks have become and is considerably more limited on when you can wear one.

i mean i get that you don't like that it'd be considered as speech but it totally qualifies. not a personal argument, talking about legally.

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Kureejii Lea posted...

whats the plan though beyond another lockdown

Listening to Doctors and Scientists, and no longer pretending it doesn't exist. As far as details, I have no idea, I just trust that Biden is going to do what the the people who have spent their lives studying things like this recommend, instead of pulling a Trump.

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Masks aren't political. The fact that the administration has tried to push otherwise is just an indictment of their embarrassing failures. Not wearing a mask is a sign of pure idiocy, it lining up with Trump supporters is merely a coincidence.

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Dark Young Link posted...

We get to work on that.

I don't think this one is as easy as voting!

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Everything's political. Saying "this is not political" is political.


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Fine.

"Shouldn't" be political.


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Wanglicious posted...

drink driving doesn't make for a good analogy at all.

Why not? When you dont wear a mask in public you are deliberately making a choice that potentially affects the lives of not only yourself but everyone you encounter.

Many drunk drivers make it home without incident. Many anti-maskers go out without infecting anyone. Doesnt matter; youre a threat just by being in that state.
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I definitely look at people not wearing masks I public as a threat to public safety. Comparing it too drunk driving is pretty apt.


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Jakyl25 posted...

Why not? When you dont wear a mask in public you are deliberately making a choice that potentially affects the lives of not only yourself but everyone you encounter.

Many drunk drivers make it home without incident. Many anti-maskers go out without infecting anyone. Doesnt matter; youre a threat just by being in that state.

simplest answer, because it's not something you wear.
mask is something additionally worn, seatbelts are something additionally worn. consumption of alcohol is entirely different.

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Wanglicious posted...

simplest answer, because it's not something you wear.
mask is something additionally worn, seatbelts are something additionally worn. consumption of alcohol is entirely different.

This is quite possibly the worst attempt at splitting hairs I've ever seen.

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Wanglicious posted...

simplest answer, because it's not something you wear.
mask is something additionally worn, seatbelts are something additionally worn. consumption of alcohol is entirely different.

Ok so we can make the vaccine mandatory then since its not something you wear?
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HashtagSEP posted...

This is quite possibly the worst attempt at splitting hairs I've ever seen.

Welcome to Wang.

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Jakyl25 posted...

Ok so we can make the vaccine mandatory then since its not something you wear?

We can't do that, if we do everybody will become chipped by the libs!

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And wait I dont even really get how the seatbelt analogy works since not wearing a seatbelt isnt considered free speech
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There is a difference between illegal to DO something and illegal to NOT do something, psychologically.

I guess drunk driving is something you CAN'T do, and wearing a seatbelt/mask is MUST do.

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I should be allowed to walk around naked wherever and whenever I want! Laws that force me to wear clothes are just political nonsense stifling my freedom!

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HashtagSEP posted...

This is quite possibly the worst attempt at splitting hairs I've ever seen.

Welcome to Wa- damnit

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pjbasis posted...

Everything's political. Saying "this is not political" is political.

A virus doesnt care about politics
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HashtagSEP posted...

This is quite possibly the worst attempt at splitting hairs I've ever seen.

welcome to speech.
there's a lot of hair splitting that occurs.

Jakyl25 posted...

Ok so we can make the vaccine mandatory then since its not something you wear?

mandatory vaccines are a tricky one. usually the defense there has been religion, so still first amendment. federal government has extremely limited power here, this is largely by the state - which is also the case for masks btw, which is why biden can't do anything apart from federal buildings/properties.

state governments meanwhile can't totally force it. there's a strong compelling case that allows them to regulate it and usually make it something you have to have but there is a limit. like the one you'd be trying for with a mask, the argument by the state is that it's a compelling state interest, not that it isn't speech, not that you don't have freedom to wear or not, etc. there's just no legal authority here.

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Jakyl25 posted...

And wait I dont even really get how the seatbelt analogy works since not wearing a seatbelt isnt considered free speech

seatbelt works better and would be the immediate comparison because it's something you're being told to wear.
people actually have tried to argue about seatbelts using free speech as the argument. it failed. same with personal freedom and privacy, they've gone down the list pretty well on it.

only reason the state can do it is, again, compelling state interest.
now masks at the moment are heavily political. this puts them into a lot trickier waters. if you're trying to talk about them outside of federal stuff then you run into a lot more tricky stuff since that's the state. if the state tries to do it on something like, say, mandatory in the streets, they had better tailor it to specifically when there's a reasonable cause for the state to be concerned, e.g., crowded areas of strangers (Cuomo did this).

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Benjamin Ginsberg (Republican Election Lawyer) saying that there is no evidence, and the lawsuits the Trump campaign have been filing have no chance of standing up in court.

He's saying Trump's campaign had representatives everywhere, and that they made gains in the house and senate, and state races, show that there was no fraud.

He also said he thinks one of the strategies Trump's lawyers could be doing is trying to drag things out until it's too late for states to certify the results.

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Wanglicious posted...

mandatory vaccines are a tricky one. usually the defense there has been religion, so still first amendment.

What religions prohibit vaccines? I guess James Hetfields parents had an anti-science religion to that extent
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Inviso posted...

I should be allowed to walk around naked wherever and whenever I want! Laws that force me to wear clothes are just political nonsense stifling my freedom!

What is the compelling state interest against nudity anyway?
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Jakyl25 posted...

What religions prohibit vaccines? I guess James Hetfields parents had an anti-science religion to that extent

the 3 main ones all have subsections that try to argue it. for the US it's largely been Christians and Jews, though obviously most denominations are fine with it. orthodox jews have a slightly lower vaccination rate iirc but that's the only clean subsection i know. maybe jehovah's witnesses? i do think there's a growing trend that's putting the state's interest ahead of the religious claims but it's not all there yet. give it a generation or two.

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Jakyl25 posted...

What is the compelling state interest against nudity anyway?

children the biggest i can think of, tied to public indecency.


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RaidenGarai posted...

He also said he thinks one of the strategies Trump's lawyers could be doing is trying to drag things out until it's too late for states to certify the results.

So we should expect President Pelosi, then?

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Well I really just care more about legitimate religious claims

Not oh I will use someone elses beliefs as a shieid
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Ashethan posted...

So we should expect President Pelosi, then?

Not sure, but he did say that he doesn't think it's going to reach that point because they have nothing. They're going to court with nothing but allegations with nothing to back them up.

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Inviso posted...

I should be allowed to walk around naked wherever and whenever I want! Laws that force me to wear clothes are just political nonsense stifling my freedom!

Wearing clothes is against my religion. It's how god created us, and intended us to be. Adam and Eve were naked all the time. God eventually gave them clothes because they broke his laws. I desire to bring us back into God's good graces and not have shame for my nudity.

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HashtagSEP posted...

This is quite possibly the worst attempt at splitting hairs I've ever seen.

funny how the hair splitting comes out here and yet equivalences come out for "I've won" vs "I believe we'll win"

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oh. uh... well, obviously keep a very broad scope of "legitimate" here.

impurities to the body that God created/molded in the body of God/other similar statements. basically all comes down to "my body is tied to God and a vaccine separates me." (Christian, probably Catholic specifically but i'm sure there's more)

vaccines that use components derived from a fetus. a significant do use cell lines from aborted fetuses so that's probably the most transparent one. (Christians again, variable denominations)

impurities brought by usage of animals in the vaccine. also fairly straightforward. bear in mind, most don't follow this as they carve out an exception but some extremists will follow it this way. (Jewish, Islamic)

found an article that gets into some of these and targets different religions and cultures. helped me get the 'cell line' term because i just remembered aborted fetuses and vaccines as a thing.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5141457/


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Wanglicious posted...

the 3 main ones all have subsections that try to argue it.

Those same subsections believe italians shouldn't marry greeks because it's interracial

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quick question for you all- which country or state do you think trump will physically be in on march 1st, 2021?

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banananor posted...

quick question for you all- which country or state do you think trump will physically be in on march 1st, 2021?

Denial.

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Real talk though, (non-sexualized) public nudity should be legal

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