Current Events > Demon's Souls remake has no difficulty options and people are upset.

(+) Yeah! (+)

I shouldn't respond to a CE topic, but really? really?

Games have only gotten so easy to the point where its just braindead; stop bitching at people who want a actual challenge for once.

The argument is if you keep doing this for every game that it becomes a norm which it has because the industry now thinks that people are too braindead to actually enjoy a challenge.

Basically your problems is making us problems.

As the saying goes - "GET GOOD" it isn't meant to put you down, but stop making excuses.

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Kaliesto posted...

I shouldn't respond to a CE topic, but really? really?

Games have only gotten so easy to the point where its just braindead; stop bitching at people who want a actual challenge for once.

The argument is if you keep doing this for every game that it becomes a norm which it has because the industry now thinks that people are too braindead to actually enjoy a challenge.

Name me one person who wants the whole game to be made easier, rather than an OPTIONAL difficulty.

Optional, btw, means a choice. Something you don't need to pick.

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Funkydog posted...

Just disable PvP if on easy mode then? Seems the obvious thing to do.

That still ruins the online by fracturing the player base. Ds3 is the most popular and it can still take multiple minutes to invade any area outside the designated fight club arenas.

Comfy_Pillow posted...

That still ruins the online by fracturing the player base. Ds3 is the most popular and it can still take multiple minutes to invade any area outside the designated fight club arenas.

The people who play on easy mode aren't likely to be doing PvP or will die immediately anyway, so not seeing the issue.

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Funkydog posted...

Name me one person who wants the whole game to be made easier, rather than an OPTIONAL difficulty.

Optional, btw, means a choice. Something you don't need to pick.

You're missing my point; if you signal to the Gaming Industry is that people are too braindead for actual challenges that it affects business decisions because they want that wide audience as much as possible.

Yes a Difficulty Optional I'm not against, but the higher ups in the Industry fail to see that point.

Instead most of the industry standard is just "just make the game easy for everyone and call it a day because we don't want to put in the resources to make another Game Difficulty".

And they have almost been consistently doing that.

Square Enix for example has been doing that with Final Fantasy almost.

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Funkydog posted...

The people who play on easy mode aren't likely to be doing PvP or will die immediately anyway, so not seeing the issue.

Sounds like you've never played the games.

Hunting down scrubs is like the 2nd main draw of invading outside of fight clubs. The most popular content for the games are destroying people that don't know what's going on.

And it's not a choice to be invaded most of the time.

Kaliesto posted...

You're missing my point; if you signal to the Gaming Industry is that people are too braindead for actual challenges that it affects business decisions because they want that wide audience as much as possible.

Yes a Difficulty Optional I'm not against, but the higher ups in the Industry fail to see that point.

Instead most of the industry standard is just "just make the game easy for everyone and call it a day because we don't want to put in the resources to make another Game Difficulty".

And they have almost been consistently doing that.

This is clearly not true though, given just how well Dark Souls sells with it how it is. Or the numerous roguelike games that sell well.

Really feels like you're complaining about an issue that doesn't exist.

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Funkydog posted...

This is clearly not true though, given just how well Dark Souls sells with it how it is. Or the numerous roguelike games that sell well.

Really feels like you're complaining about an issue that doesn't exist.

See my edit; it does exist.

There was in fact a time Final Fantasy actually had a challenge until they dumbed it down in the remasters and remakes (with few exceptions).

The reason Dark Souls sold well because its a real challenge, so idk where you are not understanding. There is only been a like a few studios following that trend (which they shouldn't need a trend to figure it out) that people want a challenge, but not every studio is onboard with it because again they're set in their ways for that wide audience.

Thankfully Atlus has been consistent when it comes to challenge which is why they've been so popular still, but as I said not every studio has the brains to figure that out yet.

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New year, same ol people crying about difficulty in souls games. The gift that keeps on giving.

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Souls needs harder difficulty modes, not easier.
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You don't get the full experience with an easy mode, and modes make balancing lazy. Easy mode is like watching a movie, and hard modes is just tweaked damage numbers. You don't get a specially tailored experience.

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WallStreetWolf posted...

People shouldn't have to come up with mechanics to cheesethe game. It takes barely any effort to create an easy mode with separate settings that affects no one else.

Come on now, dude. I am sorry to hear you have a disability, but maybe it would be more practical to just watch a Twitch stream instead. How does any gamer feel a sense of accomplishment in a game that is supposed to be unforgiving, if its reworked to be as simple as finishing a crayon coloring book?

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I dont understand why people get upset over the fact that a developer doesnt want to compromise their vision.

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ViewtifulGrave posted...

I dont understand why people get upset over the fact that a developer doesnt want to compromise their vision.

It seems to primarily be uppity gaming journalists acting as the mouthpiece for a few nobodies on Twitter pushing shit like this. It's like they want to pretend they're important so they try to fan the flames of minor discontent when people don't unilaterally accept their views. And going by the infamous Cuphead video, their average level of competency might be on the lower end.

While I don't think adding an easy option is really that big a deal, I do find it odd people want a game that sells itself on its difficulty, and dying over and over until you beat the challenge to do away with that. Do what I do and watch people stream it (but more so I don't own a playstation, as would only want to play it as is myself)

Adding various accessibility options though, would be fantastic I think, if they can figure a good way to do it.

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I'm not even sure what difficulty options would be like for Dark Souls

Using 1 as an example, would it just reduce enemy health and damage? Because a lot of deaths from 1 are environmental

So what happens when people play on easy, get shithoused by traps in Sen's Fortress and go online to say "this game fucking sucks"

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This is bullshit. I wanna play through the game but cant cuz every stupid thing that pops out can fucking kill me.

The buyer enjoying the game is, or should be, the goal of the developers. This is just one more example of the fact that developers are making games for themselves and telling us to deal with it, rather than making what the fans ask for.

There is no good reason that every game can't have difficulty settings. And I say that as someone who will buy this game.

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Lorenzo_2003 posted...

How does any gamer feel a sense of accomplishment in a game that is supposed to be unforgiving, if its reworked to be as simple as finishing a crayon coloring book?

Has anyone ever said a game should only have an easy mode?

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southcoast09 posted...

The buyer enjoying the game is, or should be, the goal of the developers. This is just one more example of the fact that developers are making games for themselves and telling us to deal with it, rather than making what the fans ask for.

What? There are plenty of fans who want these games, which is why they're so popular. There's no end to the changes they'd need to make to cater to everyone with a minor opinion.

ViewtifulGrave posted...

I dont understand why people get upset over the fact that a developer doesnt want to compromise their vision.

Artistic vision only works when defending lolis, sadly

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nemu posted...

What? There are plenty of fans who want these games, which is why they're so popular. There's no end to the changes they'd need to make to cater to everyone with a minor opinion.

So developers should listen to no opinions because then they'd have to listen to all?

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southcoast09 posted...

The buyer enjoying the game is, or should be, the goal of the developers. This is just one more example of the fact that developers are making games for themselves and telling us to deal with it, rather than making what the fans ask for.

Do you think people regularly buy Souls games and then don't enjoy them or something?

https://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/dark-souls

https://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/dark-souls-ii

https://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-4/dark-souls-iii

Strange argument

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Things like "you're not the target audience" and "not every game has to be for everybody" are valid responses if somebody is complaining about the storytelling method, the art style, the combat system, etc making them not want to play it. They are fucked up asshole things to say when somebody is talking about a physical disability keeping them from being able to play a game that they want to play, you're essentially saying "the target audience of this game is people who aren't disabled." None of you would be hurt by the inclusion of a more forgiving mode for people who want or need it.

_HayleyWilliams posted...

So developers should listen to no opinions because then they'd have to listen to all?

They shouldn't listen to opinions that would fundamentally change the genre of the game they're making. It's like asking a roguelike maker to change it to a roguelite. That's not what the genre is about. Someone who wants a difficult roguelike doesn't want to have the roguelite pity system, and that's perfectly fine. I also hate sports games and driving sims, and I don't expect the developers to suddenly radically change the system to entice a small portion of people like me.

nemu posted...

They shouldn't listen to opinions that would fundamentally change the genre of the game they're making. It's like asking a roguelike maker to change it to a roguelite. That's not what the genre is about. Someone who wants a difficult roguelike doesn't want to have the roguelite pity system, and that's perfectly fine. I also hate sports games and driving sims, and I don't expect the developers to suddenly radically change the system to entice a small portion of people like me.

But it wouldn't radically change the game. Adding difficulty or accessibility options wouldn't change the genre. Disabled people can't play most games without some options for them. Being hard is not a genre and options would not remove the ability to choose to challenge yourself

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_HayleyWilliams posted...

But it wouldn't radically change the game. Adding difficulty or accessibility options wouldn't change the genre. Disabled people can't play most games without some options for them. Being hard is not a genre and options would not remove the ability to choose to challenge yourself

If the accessibility options fundamentally change the gameplay, then they shouldn't be taken into account. Stuff that doesn't affect gameplay like free button-remapping for specialty controller usage, options for color blind people, etc should be standard, but not every game needs to be 100% accessible to everyone at the cost of general gameplay features.

Im still confused what disability is gate-kept by game difficulty in this example. Im assuming to at least have eyesight, hearing, and the ability to have controller input. A vast majority of games require being able to see, though Ive seen blind people beat Zelda dungeons and such. And color blindness is often considered. Hearing is typically optional though some games have audio puzzles or at least audio cues that help you. Theres an argument to be made there. Input of some sort is an absolute requirement to be considered a game.

Is it something that physically or mentally keeps you from pressing inputs quickly enough to accommodate the type of gameplay? Because the lovely thing about these games is you CAN control difficulty...its built into the gameplay and lore. You can control the level of your character. Having trouble? Farm souls. You even get 5 freebies early on. Use an ember. Play in offline mode. Options. (I just realized Im talking about DS3 for some reason, but generally these things exist in some form for all the games) Finally theres the ol git gud. If people can speedrun the game at level 1 with no blocking or rolling, then theres something to be said of tackling a heightened challenge.

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Lmao bruh the whole point of the game is to die over and over, if you wanted easier theres a plethora of other games

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CapnMuffin posted...

Im still confused what disability is gate-kept by game difficulty in this example.

A potential one is cerebral palsy. I hear about gaming with that once in a while in terms of accessibility.

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Git gud, ya pansies

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People don't understand that the games suck when they're easy.

The reason why the games are good in the first place is because you have to change your strategies and approaches to fights because fighting it any other way is nigh impossible. So you're forced to interact with the world around you and there's where all the good parts of the gameplay come from.

Without the difficulty, the games are very, very bland.

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CapnMuffin posted...

Im still confused what disability is gate-kept by game difficulty in this example. Im assuming to at least have eyesight, hearing, and the ability to have controller input. A vast majority of games require being able to see, though Ive seen blind people beat Zelda dungeons and such. And color blindness is often considered. Hearing is typically optional though some games have audio puzzles or at least audio cues that help you. Theres an argument to be made there. Input of some sort is an absolute requirement to be considered a game.

Is it something that physically or mentally keeps you from pressing inputs quickly enough to accommodate the type of gameplay? Because the lovely thing about these games is you CAN control difficulty...its built into the gameplay and lore. You can control the level of your character. Having trouble? Farm souls. You even get 5 freebies early on. Use an ember. Play in offline mode. Options. Finally theres the ol git gud. If people can speedrun the game at level 1 with no blocking or rolling, then theres something to be said of tackling a heightened challenge.

This, even Bloodborne can played in such a way that split second timing (parrying and rolling iframes mostly) are completely unnecessary. All that is needed in any of the games is to simply learn what the enemies can do, figure out all the visual and audio telegraphing and resist greed/button mashing. A friend of mine with cerebral palsy beat Bloodborne, I helped her beat Orphan of Kos and Ludwig but she otherwise made it through just fine by being observant and careful. This isn't an accessibility issue, some people just quit in the face of any hardship and want the story (which is super minimalistic in these games anyway) handed to them on a silver platter. Maybe I shouldn't say 'them' as it can be misleading and vague, mostly shit tier "professional" game "journalists" drunk on self righteousness offended on the behalf of others and the Resetera crowd are who is being discussed, to be clear. Most that don't like the gameplay of a game just find a different game.

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MutantJohn posted...

People don't understand that the games suck when they're easy.

The reason why the games are good in the first place is because you have to change your strategies and approaches to fights because fighting it any other way is nigh impossible. So you're forced to interact with the world around you and there's where all the good parts of the gameplay come from.

Without the difficulty, the games are very, very bland.

The games would be incredibly short and getting that item full of lore wouldnt be as satisfying.. theres hardly any story thrown in your face lol

Good post


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Jabodie posted...

A potential one is cerebral palsy. I hear about gaming with that once in a while in terms of accessibility.

Good example. My brother has cerebral palsy along with some mental disability. Difficulty setting can only go so far. At some point you basically have to craft a new game to be completely accessible. He loves Batman, for instance, but even if you could one-shot every enemy in the Arkham games theres still a minimum required amount of mental and physical capacity to complete the games objectives.

The same goes for any game. He couldnt complete every book or sport without inordinate challenge. Me neither, for that matter. Its all relative. Fortunately he can watch me or LPers and share in the experience, which is one beauty of todays technology.

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MutantJohn posted...

People don't understand that the games suck when they're easy.

That's an opinion.

Many games are piss easy and still extremely fun. People don't want easier options because "Reee casuls!"

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Captain_Qwark posted...

Damn 1 series out of countless that are basically walking simulators.

Better complain until they change it. Fuck off you entitled piss babies

Imagine being snobby about fucking video games

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Are people still pretending it's about disabled people?

Because 99.9999% of the complaints are always from journalists and people too lazy to learn how to play and do well.


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People are snobby about film, books, and music. Shit, they're snobby about food, that thing we need as a baseline of existence itself. I don't see why the vidya should escape being a source of snobbiness.

That said, not every game needs to be made with every possible and conceivable consumer in mind.

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CasualGuy posted...

Are people still pretending it's about disabled people?

Because 99.9999% of the complaints are always from journalists and people too lazy to learn how to play and do well.

Able-bodied people should be able to choose how much challenge they want out of a game. Games that do should also stop locking people into a difficulty setting if they want to increase or decrease after the initial selection.

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I would never play a DS game/FromSoft game on an easy difficulty. The high I felt after beating Friede for the first time solo? Lord have mercy, I almost jumped through the roof. I felt on top of the world. I even screamed. Good stuff! The reward for overcoming a challenge is unmatched by any other game (besides maybe Nioh or a similar game in the genre, haven't played many difficult games besides FromSoft games). IMO of course

BUT, I have absolutely no problem with an easy mode being implemented because it would do absolutely NOTHING to hinder my experience (unless they designed the game from the ground up with easier difficulty in mind, but I don't think FromSoft would do such a thing, ever). It's extremely comical when I see people get defensive or upset (not saying anyone in this topic is) because someone suggests an easy mode for DS. If that gets you upset, it says so much more about you than anyone else.

I know nothing about game design so I won't say whether they should have one or not have one (I don't know what kind of technical trickery or lack-thereof has to be conducted behind the scenes to implement such a mode in a Dark Souls game), but ultimately the guy who posted that tweet has a point


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_HayleyWilliams posted...

Able-bodied people should be able to choose how much challenge they want out of a game. Games that do should also stop locking people into a difficulty setting if they want to increase or decrease after the initial selection.

You can do that in 14,000 other games you could play.

Entitled gamers need to Stop trying to to force devs to cater to your whims

They don't want to do it. They arent going to. So Shut the fuck up.

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just let the modding community make an easy mode or whatever
everyone wins

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RaulJenkins posted...

BUT, I have absolutely no problem with an easy mode being implemented because it would do absolutely NOTHING to hinder my experience (unless they designed the game from the ground up with easier difficulty in mind, but I don't think FromSoft would do such a thing, ever). It's extremely comical when I see people get defensive or upset (not saying anyone in this topic is) because someone suggests an easy mode for DS. If that gets you upset, it says so much more about you than anyone else.

this game has the most insecure fanbase

Karen's child: "wahhh they're not playing the game they paid for the same way I am. they're TRIGGERING ME!"

Karen: "stop having options in your game developer san! you're upsetting my precious baby!"

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