Current Events > Stephen King experts. Just watched Dark Tower. Explanation? Spoilers

(+) Yeah! (+)

I have some partial knowledge of things I've picked up over the years. That there are alternate universes but that everything ties back to the Dark Tower.

My biggest questions are, how does it all tie into things like the following

IT and Pennywise
Cujo
Langoliers
Pet Semetary and the Wendigo
The Crimson King
The Stand and Randall Flagg
Gerald's Game and the reference to the Dark Tower, when it was supposed to be all in her head.
Shawkshank Redemption, Shawshank Prison and the Castle Rock show
The Mist
The Shining and Hallorann being referenced in another work I can't remember right now.
Mid-World
All-World
Keystone Earth
Other SK works

And ultimately, when this Randall Flagg is in reference to the one in The Stand? Earlier? Later? In between?

I've just read so many opinions that I'm not sure what's what.

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I doubt a lot of it is going to make sense with just the movie.

Overall, the Dark Tower is the centerpoint of all creation. With the existence of alternate realities, you can kind of just shove any book in there. This is usually the case with a lot of these. I remember Cell having a single reference to Charlie the Choo-Choo and nothing else, but that would be enough to connect it to the Dark Tower.

IT has a counterpart of sorts in the Turtle. A turtle is also one of the Beam Guardians. IT itself is quite similar to something called a todash monster (todash being the nothingness that exists between universes). Alternatively, IT's also quite similar to an emotional vampire named Dandelo that feeds on laughter instead of fear. Overall, IT (the book) generally has a lot of similar mythology to The Dark Tower.

Castle Rock was kind of The Dark Tower before there was a Dark Tower. There are a number of books which take place there and share continuity, Cujo being one of them. These eventually culminate in Needful Things. I don't remember any specific references, but I'm sure there were a few in one of them.

The fissure the plane passes through in The Langoliers is kiiiiind of similar to a thinny, but that's the only vague reference I remember.

The Crimson King is the main antagonist of the entire saga. A lot of the references in various books are vague allusions to him.

The monsters in The Mist seem even more like todash monsters than IT.

Mid-World and All-World are essentially the same thing. They're just the level of the Tower (ie, the dimension) that Roland is from.

In what is probably the weirdest thing in The Dark Tower series, Keystone Earth is our dimension. In the movie, I would assume this is just the world Jake comes from.

I left Randall Flagg for last because he's kind of a special case. Crimson King is the main antagonist of The Dark Tower, but Flagg is undeniably Stephen King's big bad. A lot of these connecting references are due to Flagg (or some other villainous asshole with RF initials) popping up in a story. The Stand is his most prominent role. I don't know if it's ever really explained, but my interpretation is that he has a lot of magical power that he uses to travel across dimensions solely to be a dick. The Stand takes place before the Dark Tower, but time is kind of wonky in the story.

Anything I didn't mention I don't remember a specific reference. It's worth noting that sometimes there aren't references to The Dark Tower specifically, King likes dropping more mundane ones too. The protagonist of Tommyknockers is a western writer who is mentioned in at least one other book. A minor character in Rose Madder becomes a major one in Desperation. The Shop, the main antagonist group in Firestarter, is mentioned as being one of the candidates to deal with the superflu leak in The Stand. etc

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pegusus123456 posted...

I doubt a lot of it is going to make sense with just the movie.

Overall, the Dark Tower is the centerpoint of all creation. With the existence of alternate realities, you can kind of just shove any book in there. This is usually the case with a lot of these. I remember Cell having a single reference to Charlie the Choo-Choo and nothing else, but that would be enough to connect it to the Dark Tower.

IT has a counterpart of sorts in the Turtle. A turtle is also one of the Beam Guardians. IT itself is quite similar to something called a todash monster (todash being the nothingness that exists between universes). Alternatively, IT's also quite similar to an emotional vampire named Dandelo that feeds on laughter instead of fear. Overall, IT (the book) generally has a lot of similar mythology to The Dark Tower.

Castle Rock was kind of The Dark Tower before there was a Dark Tower. There are a number of books which take place there and share continuity, Cujo being one of them. These eventually culminate in Needful Things. I don't remember any specific references, but I'm sure there were a few in one of them.

The fissure the plane passes through in The Langoliers is kiiiiind of similar to a thinny, but that's the only vague reference I remember.

The Crimson King is the main antagonist of the entire saga. A lot of the references in various books are vague allusions to him.

The monsters in The Mist seem even more like todash monsters than IT.

Mid-World and All-World are essentially the same thing. They're just the level of the Tower (ie, the dimension) that Roland is from.

In what is probably the weirdest thing in The Dark Tower series, Keystone Earth is our dimension. In the movie, I would assume this is just the world Jake comes from.

I left Randall Flagg for last because he's kind of a special case. Crimson King is the main antagonist of The Dark Tower, but Flagg is undeniably Stephen King's big bad. A lot of these connecting references are due to Flagg (or some other villainous asshole with RF initials) popping up in a story. The Stand is his most prominent role. I don't know if it's ever really explained, but my interpretation is that he has a lot of magical power that he uses to travel across dimensions solely to be a dick. The Stand takes place before the Dark Tower, but time is kind of wonky in the story.

Anything I didn't mention I don't remember a specific reference. It's worth noting that sometimes there aren't references to The Dark Tower specifically, King likes dropping more mundane ones too. The protagonist of Tommyknockers is a western writer who is mentioned in at least one other book. A minor character in Rose Madder becomes a major one in Desperation. The Shop, the main antagonist group in Firestarter, is mentioned as being one of the candidates to deal with the superflu leak in The Stand. etc

Wow, I have so many more questions now, but this was very helpful in understanding things. I figured Keystone was our universe, but then I heard there's a universe where Stephen King is writing all this, not sure.

I would love to hear more connections and whatnot from you and others. I know Octillery used to know a very great deal, but he left about a year ago.

One thing, if anybody can answer, is something I'm still trying to understand. I've read that Pennywise, The Wendgio from Pet Semetary and The Crimson King might be all one entity. How strong is this theory among actual Stephen King experts? I know Crimson King is the Morgoth to Randall Flag's Sauron. I just never liked imaging that Pennywise could be the Crimson King, making him the ultimate bad. Also I've heard of Dandelo. I think he shows up in one of the movies. People said that he is Pennywise's brother.

Another two questions, are there any relevant connections to Needful Things? I'd like to imagine that old dude's house was like another "house on Neibolt Street" from IT.

Second, does any other works besides the Dark Tower ones take place in Mid-World/All-World? Jake mentions old theme parks, so that was very interesting.

Thanks for the thorough explanations.

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This is the first time I've heard that Pennywise, the Wendigo, and the Crimson King are the same entity. I don't know why people think that because they're all very different. In fact, one of the most prominent Crimson King appearances has him reference IT which would be weird if he is also IT. Admittedly, that book is described as feeling "false" in one of the Dark Tower books.

There aren't any meaningful connection to Needful Things that I remember. The only possible one is that one of the phases of the moon in a part of Mid-World is called the Peddler's Moon. It's called that because the face of the moon looks like a "demonic peddler with a sack full of souls."

The Wind Through The Keyhole is the only other book I know that's explicity set in Mid-World and it's just a side-story about Roland and his group. The Talisman and Black House involve an alternate world that's quite similar to Mid-World, but I don't think it's the same one. Hearts in Atlantis takes place in the real world (well, a meaningful comparison to it), but one of the stories in it is essentially backstory for a minor character from the later books.

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I've read through The Dark Tower (and The Talisman and Black House), but few of other of King's works, so I feel like I missed out on a lot of references.

and maybe the Crimson King was better depicted in another book, because how he was portrayed in The Dark Tower was really disappointing, lol.

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pegusus123456 posted...

This is the first time I've heard that Pennywise, the Wendigo, and the Crimson King are the same entity. I don't know why people think that because they're all very different. In fact, one of the most prominent Crimson King appearances has him reference IT which would be weird if he is also IT. Admittedly, that book is described as feeling "false" in one of the Dark Tower books.

you would be correct

https://stephenking.com/darktower/connections/

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archedsoul posted...

Pet Semetary and the Wendigo

I've never heard the theory that the Wendigo is Pennywise/Crimson King. There is a passage in Pet Sematary when Louis is in the Micmac burial ground, and he looks up at the stars but sees no familiar constellations or celestial landmarks. While there's nothing that explicitly says so, I've always assumed the burial ground is in another universe entirely and people pass through a thinnie to get there. Again, just my personal theory, but it fits as far as I can tell. Father Callahan in TDT refers to hidden "roads" and "paths" that lead between universes, so I take that combined with Loius' inability to recognize constellations to mean the burial ground is outside our reality in some capacity.

Could Roland kill IT with his guns?

if ka wills it

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