Current Events > Think Persona 6 will stop the trend of mocking gay people?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Its one thing to not have same sex romance options (which keep getting planned and then cut from the games), but its another to just not create gay characters for the sole purpose of mocking them.

P5R edited the homophobic scene, which is a baby step in the right direction. Think P6 will finally join the 21st century?

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No.

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Japan is actually pretty anti gay as a society

Probably when you stop the trend of making aweful topics.

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Zikten posted...

Japan is actually pretty anti gay as a society

Yeah, that's a big thing, you can't exactly cancel a Japanese game.

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How did P4 mock gays? It was ahead of its time with Kanji

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Hm...

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ColdOne666 posted...

Probably when you stop the trend of making aweful topics.

Did I really hurt you that bad? Im sorry baby

NobleWill8 posted...

Yeah, that's a big thing, you can't exactly cancel a Japanese game.

Nobody said anything about canceling. East Asia still has LGBT movements and gay people exist there.

Again, the devs actually have planned same sex romance in multiple games but it keeps getting cut. Its not like this is some outsider trying to influence them. Its coming from within but keeps getting silenced by someone on the team.

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LethalAffinity posted...

How did P4 mock gays? It was ahead of its time with Kanji

After replaying it again on PC, it really isnt. It was so close to not treating his potential homosexuality as a joke. But they repeatedly make jokes about how uncomfortable everyone is about it. They beat that horse to death continuously.

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Eliza3 posted...

LethalAffinity posted...

How did P4 mock gays? It was ahead of its time with Kanji

After replaying it again on PC, it really isnt. It was so close to not treating his potential homosexuality as a joke. But they repeatedly make jokes about how uncomfortable everyone is about it. They beat that horse to death continuously.

iirc, Yosuke is the only one who does so. Which is a major stain on his character, granted. But seeing as how it's a game from 2011, for it's time I feel it was more or less fair
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Honestly, P6 should just add a gay confidant & romance option.

I mean, the protags are always essentially blank slates, and the games are all about being outcasts from society and exploring either breaking away from society's expectations or generally being less accepted...and yet it shies away from really touching upon that particular issue aside from somewhat Kanji, and even he is left ambiguous.

It's also weird that the series was okay with a gay playable character & "romance" option in Persona 2, but then it has since totally backed away from touching that beyond making some fairly one-note jokes, including P5's really awful representation of gay men.

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dotsdfe posted...

P6 should just add a gay confidant

nah

Eliza3 posted...

After replaying it again on PC, it really isnt. It was so close to not treating his potential homosexuality as a joke. But they repeatedly make jokes about how uncomfortable everyone is about it. They beat that horse to death continuously.

It's a 2008 game from Japan centered around teenagers in a rural town. How should they have handled it in your eyes? I thought it was well done. Kanji makes friends who accept him and he accepts himself. He even still likes Naoto after it's revealed she's a girl.


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Persona 6: EVERYONE IS GAY NOW

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LethalAffinity posted...

It's a 2008 game from Japan centered around teenagers in a rural town.

I know. I guess that going for 100% realism isnt the most appropriate decision in fictional media.
If they introduce a black foreign exchange character, the protags shouldnt be mocking/teasing him for being black either (even if Japanese high school kids would IRL).

LethalAffinity posted...

How should they have handled it in your eyes?

By not making it a joke 95% of the time its discussed.

LethalAffinity posted...

He even still likes Naoto after it's revealed she's a girl.

I legitimately dont see what youre getting at here. This is just showing that the devs are too scared to commit to him actually being gay.
Oh dont worry players, the character he likes is actually a girl. Phew! There is no gayness hereee!

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Kaiganeer posted...

nah

why not? Would it make you uncomfortable if there was a character? @Kaiganeer

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Eliza3 posted...

LethalAffinity posted...

It's a 2008 game from Japan centered around teenagers in a rural town.

I know. I guess that going for 100% realism isnt the most appropriate decision in fictional media.
If they introduce a black foreign exchange character, the protags shouldnt be mocking/teasing him for being black either (even if Japanese high school kids would IRL).

LethalAffinity posted...

How should they have handled it in your eyes?

By not making it a joke 95% of the time its discussed.

LethalAffinity posted...

He even still likes Naoto after it's revealed she's a girl.

I legitimately dont see what your getting at here. This is just showing that the devs are too scared to commit to him actually being gay.
Oh dont worry players, the character he likes is actually a girl. Phew! There is no gayness hereee!

See, now you're just committing bi erasure

Bisexuality is perfectly valid. Plus even before Naoto, he gets nosebleeds at the sight of Yukiko and Chie in swimwear. He's pretty obviously bi
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Eliza3 posted...

Would it make you uncomfortable if there was a character?

nah, i just think they're incapable of writing one well and that it would end up having a negative effect on the game as a whole

They seem to up the anty each game. So I assume P6 will be the worst one yet.

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I'm sure this matters a lot in your teen romance video games

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Kaiganeer posted...

nah, i just think they're incapable of writing one well and that it would end up having a negative effect on the game as a whole

oh why do you think they wouldn't be able to do it? Hell, most of the social links that are with males could easily introduce a romantic element if they wanted to. They wouldn't have to change much (and the romances aren't that deep in persona games).

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Zodd3224 posted...

They seem to up the anty each game. So I assume P6 will be the worst one yet.

we will see

Zephyran posted...

I'm sure this matters a lot in your teen romance video games

it matters enough for you to post this super edgy got'em

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teepan95 posted...

See, now you're just committing bi erasure

Bisexuality is perfectly valid. Plus even before Naoto, he gets nosebleeds at the sight of Yukiko and Chie in swimwear. He's pretty obviously bi

I'm doing no such thing and you know that. If he was bi, then make it clear that he is into guys as well. It's introduced ambiguously, but later he even says that he just assumed he was gay because he liked stereotypically feminine hobbies. Making his only actual romantic interest a female is playing it "safe" for their audience.

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Eliza3 posted...

it matters enough for you to post this super edgy got'em

You're the one that made the weird assblasted topic about your game with teenagers not having enough romance options as creepy as that sounds though.

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Zephyran posted...

You're the one that made the weird assblasted topic about your game with teenagers not having enough romance options as creepy as that sounds though.

lol sure kid

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Kanji was gay and they should have let him be gay

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Captain_Qwark posted...

What did p5 do?

Created two extremely stereotypical gay adults who sexually harass one of the male students in multiple scenes. This is contrasted with the other gay character in the game that is presented quite well actually... oh wait... no... there are no other gay characters in P5. Just those two.

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Eliza3 posted...

oh why do you think they wouldn't be able to do it?

because the character being gay and doing "gay things" (from a japanese POV) will be the focal point of the s.link and that's dumb. it'd fine if you got to rank 9 with ryuji and he's like "bruh you wanna put it in my ass after we're done running later?", but they're literally incapable of doing that

Kind of doubt it because a lot of people, even the strong SJWs, still use horribly offensive things about gay people, even if they don't mean it, it still happens. Just go watch the Portland protests on the live streams and count how many times you hear things like, "fuck you, f****," and, "why don't you go choke on a dick!"

I hope it is, because I'm sick of seeing it all the time

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Kaiganeer posted...

yikes. I know you're just concern trolling but I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt.

Bad_Mojo posted...

Kind of doubt it because a lot of people, even the strong SJWs, still use horribly offensive things about gay people, even if they don't mean it, it still happens. Just go watch the Portland protests on the live streams and count how many times you hear things like, "fuck you, f****," and, "why don't you go choke on a dick!"

I hope it is, because I'm sick of seeing it all the time

yea it's a damn shame. I'd at least like my hobbies to not be pointlessly bigoted though. At least let my escapism not be toxic or exclusive.

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There is no such trend. Next.
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Muflaggin posted...

There is no such trend. Next.

lmao its undeniably there.

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mrgoatthief posted...

God I hope so. It's time for Japan's gaming devs to grow the fuck up

we can hope. I think I read the lead dev retired or something after 5, so maybe they can stop with the anti-gay bs now.

actually didnt P3 do the same thing with the two gay men acting like predators? So its 3 for 3 now. Lets break the cycle with 6!

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Eliza3 posted...

we can hope. I think I read the lead dev retired or something after 5, so maybe they can stop with the anti-gay bs now.

actually didnt P3 do the same thing with the two gay men acting like predators? So its 3 for 3 now. Lets break the cycle with 6!

But is it 5/5? You can't 3/3 something when there are 5 of them, lol

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Bad_Mojo posted...

But is it 5/5? You can't 3/3 something when there are 5 of them, lol

I only played from 3 on. I think one of the early titles had a gay character who was actually well-written. So we can say 3/5! Pretty bad percentage if you ask me tho

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Eliza3 posted...

lmao its undeniably there.

False. Next.

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Muflaggin posted...

False. Next.

Boring shitpost #2. *yawn*

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I think it's amusing that in the course of two decades Americans went from censoring anything LGBT in Japanese media to complaining they don't properly represent LGBT in Japanese media. Not that I don't think there are a lot of issues the LGBT community faces in Japan, it's just funny how America wants to pretend they're all ahead now when they were changing gay characters into straight (or weirdly cousins) or removing them completely from Japanese media in the 90s. Japan has an LGBT community and I think they're best qualified to determine how these things should be handled.

Zikten posted...

Japan is actually pretty anti gay as a society

Also is this guys gimmick just posting racist stereotypes about Japan? You could argue the US being less "anti-gay as a society" for a decade at most. For most of Japan's history it has been very permissive of LGBT relationships compared to the West.

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They should should mock everyone.

Who was the planned gay romance in 5? I only know of Yosukes cut content in 4. (And honestly the way his character is written, Im not convinced hes 100% straight. >_>)

Itd be nice, though. The beach bros scene really rubbed me the wrong way.

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ssjevot posted...

If Japan chooses to localize and release games abroad, people have the right to criticize them. Dont pull the you cant criticize other cultures card.

Also who here is saying that America is a model nation for LGBT progress?

AlisLandale posted...

Who was the planned gay romance in 5? I only know of Yosukes cut content in 4. (And honestly the way his character is written, Im not convinced hes 100% straight. >_>)

Itd be nice, though. The beach bros scene really rubbed me the wrong way.

I believe it was the artist. I cant remember the character names from P5 too well.


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The Catherine remake lets you actually marry a transgirl so there is some evidence that Atlus is moving in the right direction.

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DarkRoast posted...

The Catherine remake lets you actually marry a transgirl so there is some evidence that Atlus is moving in the right direction.

I heard about that but never played it. Its some hopeful news. I know eventually theyll move on from the tired and toxic tropes.

And anyone who gets triggered that marginalized groups are asking to just not be the butt of the joke for simply existing... it really says a lot about those people.

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Eliza3 posted...

If Japan chooses to localize and release games abroad, people have the right to criticize them. Dont pull the you cant criticize other cultures card.

Also who here is saying that America is a model nation for LGBT progress?

Completely missing the point. Most of the games and other media from your childhood from Japan had all LGBT characters changed or removed to avoid criticism from superior Western culture master race. Now you're claiming Japan needs to be more like you since some of you learned to stop hating LGBT. They need to do it the Western way, no matter what that happens to be. Japanese LGBT people can decide for themselves what should or shouldn't be acceptable in media. This fake ally stuff needs to go.

You can criticize other cultures. It just comes across as incredibly disingenuous when you do a complete 180 over the course of a decade or two on what you want out of LGBT characters in media. To go from remove or change them so they don't exist, to portray them perfectly to conform to my Western standards is not exactly a realistic standard to expect for Japanese developers. Take it up with the localizers and maybe they can go back to deleting them or changing them to be your ideal or whatever it is you want.

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Just got to the camp scene in P4G, I dont get outraged by these things or anything but that left a bad taste in the mouth

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ssjevot posted...

Completely missing the point. Most of the games and other media from your childhood from Japan had all LGBT characters changed or removed to avoid criticism from superior Western culture master race. Now you're claiming Japan needs to be more like you since some of you learned to stop hating LGBT. They need to do it the Western way, no matter what that happens to be. Japanese LGBT people can decide for themselves what should or shouldn't be acceptable in media. This fake ally stuff needs to go.

You can criticize other cultures. It just comes across as incredibly disingenuous when you do a complete 180 over the course of a decade or two on what you want out of LGBT characters in media. To go from remove or change them so they don't exist, to portray them perfectly to conform to my Western standards is not exactly a realistic standard to expect for Japanese developers. Take it up with the localizers and maybe they can go back to deleting them or changing them to be your ideal or whatever it is you want.

Lmao dear lord. I am part of the LGBT community and have always criticized it. Stop shilling for shitty aspects of a culture just because its Japanese.

Im not criticizing it because its Japanese. Im criticizing it because its homophobic. Is this the argument youre gonna stick with?

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Joenage posted...

Just got to the camp scene in P4G, I dont get outraged by these things or anything but that left a bad taste in the mouth

Yup thats where I had to put the game down while playing the PC version.

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ssjevot posted...

I think it's amusing that in the course of two decades Americans went from censoring anything LGBT in Japanese media to complaining they don't properly represent LGBT in Japanese media.

are you aware that the Americans censoring anything LGBT are not the same people as the people complaining that they dont properly represent LGBT in Japanese media?

Like, you HAVE to know that nobody in this topic was on the localization team that turned Sailor Uranus and Neptune into cousins.

you HAVE to know that the people complaining now were also complaining back then. >_>

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