Board 8 > All-Purpose Wrestling Topic Part 498 - In Your House

(+) Yeah! (+)

I mean Heyman is a rat-fink too.

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Yeah lets not ignore that the entire run of ECW consisted of a Heyman passing the buck on why people were unhappy
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Jakyl25 posted...

Yeah lets not ignore that the entire run of ECW consisted of a Heyman passing the buck on why people were unhappy

And, you know, not paying them.

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Yeah, but why would they listen to Heyman of all people on who to release? They had such a low opinion of him they just let him go again. Why would they listen to him on who should be released when they never listened to him at any point of his career in WWE on anything else?

Also, Mike Bennett and Maria Kanellis are talking about some really disgusting stuff they were told while in WWE to keep them employed before they were ultimately released as well.

Edit: Also, Bennett apparently never went to WWE for rehab at all and he kicked drugs all on his own.

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TheRock1525 posted...

And, you know, not paying them.

Literally passing the buck
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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

Yeah, but why would they listen to Heyman of all people on who to release? They had such a low opinion of him they just let him go again. Why would they listen to him on who should be released when they never listened to him at any point of his career in WWE on anything else?

AJ is not the sharpest knife in the drawer
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I'm assuming his sales pitch was "hey let's fire the guys that make a lot of money that I don't really have any plans for."

Especially since they overpaid Gallows and Anderson so much, I assume if they didn't get released they'd release several other people who matched the same amount.

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Don't have plans for... Gallows and Anderson continuing their stable with AJ Styles? Like they had been before they were released?

Also, they didn't listen to Paul Heyman on who to push for more than four weeks. Why would they listen to him if he went "Yo you should fire these guys." I can see maybe, huge maybe, that they went to Heyman and asked if he had any plans for them before releasing them, but there is no part of me that Heyman went out of his way to say who WWE should fire and they listened to him, when they gave so little shits about his opinion that they just let him go from his position.

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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

Don't have plans for... Gallows and Anderson continuing their stable with AJ Styles? Like they had been before they were released?

AJ had literally been written off TV and the OC had barely done anything even prior.

Yes, Heyman very likely had no plans for them, especially when he was pushing a youth movement and giving the belts to groups like the Viking Raiders and Street Profits.

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I mean before Covid19 the two were jobbing effortlessly 2 on 1 to DREW MAC.

Which kinda hinted to their standing at the time. They were highly paid stooges for Styles.

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So what's to stop them from continuing the stable when they come back since it was working? And why are you ignoring that there's still no reason they would listen to Heyman on anything and that there's no motivation at all for Heyman to go out of his way to get them fired? Like imagine believing Vince McMahon on anything. Heyman isn't trustworthy either, but he has no fucking power. Vince constantly lies to talent and would say whatever he had to in order to make AJ not upset with him and his company.

Also, another thing they mentioned was that the only reason Gallows and Anderson were feeling less panicked with the Saudi Arabia hostage situation was because Randy Orton was there. Because they thought WWE would be willing to let the midcard die, but not Orton. lol

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I don't believe it because Vince said it. I believe it because AJ had a source independent of both Heyman and Vince who said it.

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Also I find it hard to believe that they never listen to Heyman when somehow Apollo Crews is the US champ.

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Tag...team?

I don't think Vince knows those words.

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If you can't see that Apollo Crews being champion is coinciding with a current movement going on strong today, I don't know what to tell you. WWE is opportunistic and black wrestlers on Twitter have been talking about this the past couple of days.

Let's also keep in mind that it's still Vince's choice to fire Gallows and Anderson. Ultimately, he made that decision, and it doesn't matter what anyone else said, it was still Vince's choice to fire them. When his company had a record breaking financial quarter. During a pandemic. They didn't even need to be fired because WWE is still in tremendous financial stability.

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Apollo Crews and the Street Profits both credited Heyman. And both won their titles before the civil unrest of the George Floyd murder.

I have no idea why you don't believe that Heyman would suggest to Vince to fire two overpriced guys he didn't want in a division he doesn't care about.

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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

Apollo Crews being champion is coinciding with a current movement going on strong today,

This is WWE. Wouldn't they be more likely to push a black dude in 2022 if they were going for topicality?

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WWE is 10 years, if not 20 behind the social curve though. They wouldn't pander to "equality" unless someone threatened to nuke Vince's house.

Who am I kidding? Vince would shoo the nuke away for interrupting his workout....

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Tom Bombadil posted...

This is WWE. Wouldn't they be more likely to push a black dude in 2022 if they were going for topicality?

This is Vince. The BLM guys would be the heels against some police characters.

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They keep letting Big E and Kofi wear arm bands featuring black men, women, and children killed by the police. I wonder if Vince has any idea what's going on with that.

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Reigns and Lesnar aren't there, so he probably doesn't recognize any wrestler enough to care about what they do.

Now, if Kofi looked like Shelton, that'd be a different story.

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IIRC, Crews was made champ the day of the George Floyd murder and subsequent outrage. Not that it matters too much. I'm just pointing out the black wrestlers/fans discussing it. And it's besides the point anyway that there's a noted history of people being Paul Heyman guys and then Vince letting them be pushed for less than a month before being completely forgotten and ignored. That's my point. And Heyman was weeks away from being removed as head producer on RAW as well. They don't give a shit about his opinion, let alone enough to let him be the reason anyone gets fired.

This is literally like all the times people said "Oh, Vince loved me and wanted me to stay, but Johnny Ace/Jim Ross/Paul Heyman..." Vince has a history of passing the blame on people being fired onto literally anyone else, when it's always his choice. He can say "Oh, Heyman wanted them fired" all he wants, but nobody so much as farts in WWE without his say so. Vince wanted Anderson and Gallows fired, so he fired them. It doesn't matter what reason--if he wanted them to stay employed, they would be employed still. Heyman didn't trick anyone, and it doesn't matter if he pushed for it for some bizarre reason.

And please note that they were fired after they were convinced to stay with WWE in the first place because they were told their jobs would be secure. And that they were released when WWE made their record breaking financial quarter. During a pandemic.

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I don't really understand why this is an argument.

"This piece of shit wanted them fired."
"No, it was this piece of shit!"

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That said, regarding the Crews stuff... Crews became champion on May 25th, which, yes, was the day George Floyd died, but it wasn't news at that point. It didn't blow up until the following few days, so it's very unlikely Crews being champ was a reaction to that.

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Crews was made champion because 30-50% of the roster was sick, injured, or stayed home.

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StealThisSheen posted...

I don't really understand why this is an argument.

"This piece of shit wanted them fired."
"No, it was this piece of shit!"

I'm sorry you don't understand but I guess I can explain it to you more clearly.

Vince is saying that Heyman is the reason Gallows and Anderson are fired. AJ and the Good Brothers are agreeing with that while also ignoring that Vince is the only one who makes the decision who is fired or not.

It doesn't matter what Heyman said, if Heyman even said anything at all. Vince fired them and it's ultimately his choice so their anger is misplaced.

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I mean, if they believe Heyman was a catalyst to getting them fired, whether he made the final decision or not, then they have a right to be mad at Heyman.

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Heyman's gone now too right? Are we gettin' worked?

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Hes out of power but he still is affiliated with WWE as a performer
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Joey Ryan just released an hour long video to debunk the allegations. I only watched the first few minutes, but he seems pretty confident that he can debunk all of them.

https://youtu.be/faXJHHMqzpU

Edit: Oh, wow. He actually showed the entire DMs from one of the accusers that pretty much backs up his story entirely. I don't know if the rest are this concrete, but it at least seems like he's going the whole way to back up his claims.

More Edit: Second claim seems pretty cut and dry too. I won't say that he's completely innocent, but so far it's pretty clear that the first two people he's brought up were absolutely lying.

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The smaller accusations against him are STILL gross tbh

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So I got through the whole thing.

Overall, it really does seem like he's telling the truth about all of the accusations he's talking about. He had a lot of text messages to back up stuff. In particular, the ex that he had choked and spit on and whatnot appears to have wanted that sort of roughness and he said it was a toxic relationship with examples of toxicity on both of their ends. There's also explanations for a lot of things wherein he just said he made a move and was turned down and he backed off, which seems like the case for a decent number of these. The Rok-C thing, too, is like entirely bogus too.

I don't know if he addressed all of them or not, and he had a lot more examples for them, and a couple defenses are probably not really phrased very well and seem dubious, and his whole conclusion has a whole "I found God again" kind of speech. A couple of his defenses were also predicated by "I was very wasted there."

He also says that Impact said they were going to do an investigation publicly, didn't actually contact him at all until they said they were firing him via email, and then made a statement saying they had released him. Also, his contract says he can't be fired for anything that happened before he signed the contract which is... a strange clause, but it opens up for a pretty clear lawsuit if what he said about the contract and investigation is true.

I dunno. I feel like a lot of his defenses were extremely strong for some cases which makes me feel better about the ones that he didn't have as much of a defense for? I dunno. It leaves me in a weird place because there are some things that are absolutely 100% false that he completely debunks, but more could be true and there were so many that I find it hard to believe that he's completely innocent?

I guess I feel better to some degree about Joey Ryan, but it's a fucking bizarre feeling.

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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

Also, his contract says he can't be fired for anything that happened before he signed the contract which is... a strange clause,

Almost like there might be things worth firing him over that happened prior to his contract
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Yeah, I find that clause extremely fucking weird, unless it's in other Impact contracts. Unless they're used to hiring people who might have shitty pasts like Sami Callihan and Tessa and said "If we put this here, at least we don't need to fire them for things they did." I don't know. I don't know why you would draft someone's contract like that. I don't know what it says exactly.

It's honestly such a strange video and I've seen people already saying stuff like "He mentions Hana Kimura and equates it to her!" when he said his accuser made some extremely shitty comments telling him that he needs to die and to kill him as evidence that she's a vile person (which is on top of him completely debunking her story), but he never actually mentions Hana at all but just that there was an anti-suicide movement in the community.

There's also people who refuse to even listen and think he's completely full of shit without listening and that everything he's offering with some people being cool and super friendly with him up to just a month before this and messaging him out of the blue to check on him but then coming out with their own stories adds to his defenses too. I went into this thinking he's probably full of it and expecting terrible excuses, but there's a lot of valid reasons to buy a lot of his defenses in it that people are just discounting.

I don't know that he's innocent of everything. I don't know that anyone will know for sure. But there's people who clearly made shit up, and that's fucking wrong and hurts the validity of those who may have suffered actual assault or harassment. Like I don't know why Vanessa Kraven even butted in at all when her claims, as far as I can tell, are that he flirted with her, they kissed once and he put moved on her that she refused and he backed off, and that he filmed her body in an objectifying way on their talk show (which he explains that he didn't intend to, but he was trying to hold the camera in a different way because they didn't have a working tripod or something and he couldn't see where he was filming enough).

He also cited Candace LeRae for some of these, like an incident where a 16 year old was at a bar and they were shocked and weirded out she was allowed there, and so they both invited her to hang out after to not make her feel uncomfortable. Like, I'm willing to buy his word at something like that.

I think he did this in an attempt to save his career, but I think people are already like "20 accusers fuck this guy" and don't want to even give him an attempt to defend himself, which I think is unfair. Even if it's bullshit, at least let someone attempt to defend himself. I don't think he ever goes back to wrestling, even if he's completely innocent of all of this. I don't know that we'll get any lawsuits from this or not though.

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I get why it looks weird to have that in your contract, but stuff like the Guardians of the Galaxy director getting fired over old tweets I would think would start making a clause like that more of a regular thing in any contract of this day and age

Not defending or damning Joey Ryan, just the thought I had about the clause

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Again the most damning accusation via Joey ryan I saw was the one with the underage girl in Britain because of how routine she made it seem for Joey.


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Based on reports tonight, Impact got back EC3 and Young, plus Anderson, Gallows, and Heath from WWE.

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And apparently Heath goes by just Heath and his first thing was to beat up the Impact equivalent of Heath.

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Just started Extreme Rules.

Is it just me or does the intro voice sound like Cody Rhodes circa mask-era? I know it's a take off of Ledger Joker, but still.

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So I'm curious, how did they handle the eye for the eye thing? Like how did they have it happen?

another great chapter in Bray Wyatt Cinematic Matches

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ShatteredElysium posted...

So I'm curious, how did they handle the eye for the eye thing? Like how did they have it happen?

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I'll wait for tomorrow's Raw to determine whether or not Sasha is the new Man after the way her match with Asuka ended.

Nakamura now only needs either world title to achieve the grand slam!

And we're getting Fiend vs Braun at Summerslam. On the plus side, if this feud continues into October, fans can't boo the inevitable Hell in a Cell if they aren't there!

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ZeroSignal620 posted...

fans can't boo the inevitable Hell in a Cell if they aren't there!

just because you can't hear me doesn't mean i'm not booing


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Oh trust me, I'll be booing too if this feud lasts all the way to October

Unique ppv Main Event streak update!
Goldberg
Baszler
Taker
McIntyre
Asuka
Otis
Orton
Wyatt

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So I heard this show described as great wrestling, but horrible booking choices that make people feel bad for the wrestlers involved.

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2 Brauns, no fans

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Rollins blows chunks is now a literal thing

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