Current Events > "A Year's Worth of Suicide Attempts in 4 Weeks" Consequences of Covid

(+) Yeah! (+)

-19 Lockdowns.

The costs of the government responses to the 2020 COVID-19 pandemic have been severe. New evidence suggests they could be even worse than we imagined.
An ABC affiliate in California reports that doctors at John Muir Medical Center tell them they have seen more deaths by suicide than COVID-19 during the quarantine.

The numbers are unprecedented, said Dr. Michael deBoisblanc, referring to the spike in suicides.
"We've never seen numbers like this, in such a short period of time," deBoisblanc added. "I mean we've seen a year's worth of suicide attempts in the last four weeks."
Kacey Hansen, a trauma nurse who has spent 33 years at the hospital, said she has never witnessed self-inflicted attacks on such a scale.
"What I have seen recently, I have never seen before," Hansen said. "I have never seen so much intentional injury."

To date, there is little evidence that lockdowns have reduced the spread of COVID-19. But even if there were compelling evidence that lockdowns were saving lives, it would be a mistake to ignore the manifold unintended consequences of stay-at-home orders.

As economist Antony Davies and political scientist James Harrigan explain, every human action has both intended and unintended consequences. Human beings react to every rule, regulation, and order governments impose, and their reactions result in outcomes that can be quite different than the outcomes lawmakers intended.
The problem with negative unintended consequences is two-fold.

First, as Ludwig von Mises, observed, every government intervention in markets creates unintended consequences, which often lead to more calls for government interventions which have more unintended consequences, and so on. Second, as Frdric Bastiat pointed out, we tend to focus our attention more on the intended consequences than the unintended ones. (Think of government assistance and the poverty trap.)

The unintended consequences of the COVID-19 pandemic have been severe. Most of the attention, however, has been focused on the economic consequences. Forty million US jobs lost. A looming recession. Hundreds of thousands of businesses wiped out and retirements destroyed.

The psychological and physiological unintended consequences of stay-at-home orders have received less attention. Media have been largely transfixed on COVID-19, reporting daily death tolls and rising case numbers in states easing lockdown restrictions (while failing to note that COVID cases are rising because of expanded testing).

To be sure, measuring the impact on mental health is trickier than measuring COVID-19 fatalities or job losses. But that is no reason to discount the psychological and physical impact of lockdowns, especially when evidence suggests the toll is severe.

A recent Wall Street Journal report shows a surge in the number of people taking drugs for anxiety and insomnia, prompting physicians to warn about the long-term risks of increased prescriptions, which include drug addiction and abuse.
Stay-at-home orders may seem relatively benign, but they are not. Science shows that human beings struggle mightily in isolation from one another.

https://fee.org/articles/a-years-worth-of-suicide-attempts-in-four-weeks-the-unintended-consequences-of-covid-19-lockdowns/#disqus_thread

Nice opinion piece, but I think the question that needs to be asked is, "would more people die from no lockdowns or would more people die from suicide via the lockdowns?" and I don't think we have that answer yet.

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Very questionable source there

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I have no love for Trump whatsoever, but his comment that "the cure cannot be worse than the sickness" resonates. Just not in the way that he intended.

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I heard that the average age of death from the Rona in New York is actually older then life expectancy...I mean...yea.

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this is like the third article I've seen on this. This is NOT worldwide or even countrywide suicides. it's one doctor at one hospital saying they've had more suicides than usual

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pikachupwnage posted...

Very questionable source there

This is actually something my friend sent me, and I checked the source beforehand. It had a "Mixed/Right Center Bias," which isn't the worst ever, but definitely could be better.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/foundation-for-economic-education/

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What's so wrong with death by suicide, provided it's not from mental illness? We allow people to do all manner of things that increase their likelihood of death (smoking, eating to obese levels, sports, guns, hiking, driving fast cars, etc.) and we don't stop them (gun control notwithstanding), but the actual final act is apparently so abhorrent that we don't allow people the freedom of choice and autonomy over their existence.

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Thanks china

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NightMarishPie posted...

Science shows that human beings struggle mightily in isolation from one another.

Well no shit. Humans are social creatures and solitary confinement is a cruel and inhumane punishment. On top of that many peoples sense of worth and well-being is directly tied to their livelihoods and when you unjustly yank that away from them and islolate them you have a recipie for distaster.

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Hey, I doubt it!

NightMarishPie posted...

To date, there is little evidence that lockdowns have reduced the spread of COVID-19.

I stopped reading here.

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thronedfire2 posted...

this is like the third article I've seen on this. This is NOT worldwide or even countrywide suicides. it's one doctor at one hospital saying they've had more suicides than usual

This. PLEASE start reading the actual articles and not the headlines

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is this only in america?

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NightMarishPie posted...

To date, there is little evidence that lockdowns have reduced the spread of COVID-19.

Writer is a moron that no one should take seriously. Don't ever link this again

To date, there is little evidence that lockdowns have reduced the spread of COVID-19. But even if there were compelling evidence that lockdowns were saving lives, it would be a mistake to ignore the manifold unintended consequences of stay-at-home orders.

Also, the important factor on MBFC is the accuracy level, which is just mixed.

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Hinakuluiau posted...

What's so wrong with death by suicide, provided it's not from mental illness? We allow people to do all manner of things that increase their likelihood of death (smoking, eating to obese levels, sports, guns, hiking, driving fast cars, etc.) and we don't stop them (gun control notwithstanding), but the actual final act is apparently so abhorrent that we don't allow people the freedom of choice and autonomy over their existence.

Uh

Assuming the suicides are not due to the loss of a loved one or the loss of a job/financial ruin, the suicide stuff is silly.

yes, social distancing is lonely. So? Is staying at home a couple months worth committing suicide? Pleaaasseeee.

the same people who began 2020 saying fuck your feelings, snowflakes and need a safe space, liberals? And *sips lib tears* are now oddly concerned about peoples feelings and consider not being able to go to the bar or gym something that can lead to suicide, its the ultimate irony

NightMarishPie posted...

This is actually something my friend sent me, and I checked the source beforehand. It had a "Mixed/Right Center Bias," which isn't the worst ever, but definitely could be better.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/foundation-for-economic-education/

the bias isnt the part you should be checking tbh.

bias is almost always gonna be there but even the worst bias can be managed.

what you should check is factual reporting: mixed.


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Not sure if anyone actually clicked on the article, but it's all cited and has links to a lot of the claims in it, especially the "little correlation" comment.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020-opinion-coronavirus-europe-lockdown-excess-deaths-recession/


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NightMarishPie posted...

This is actually something my friend sent me, and I checked the source beforehand. It had a "Mixed/Right Center Bias," which isn't the worst ever, but definitely could be better.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/foundation-for-economic-education/

That is fairly bad actually

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NightMarishPie posted...

New evidence suggests they could be even worse than we imagined.

I guess some people just have no imagination.

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The_Bitcoin posted...

Assuming the suicides are not due to the loss of a loved one or the loss of a job/financial ruin, the suicide stuff is silly.

yes, social distancing is lonely. So? Is staying at home a couple months worth committing suicide? Pleaaasseeee.

the same people who began 2020 saying fuck your feelings, snowflakes and need a safe space, liberals? And *sips lib tears* are now oddly concerned about peoples feelings and consider not being able to go to the bar or gym something that can lead to suicide, its the ultimate irony

For some people, yes, staying home for a couple of months can lead to suicide. People with mental illnesses aren't always rational.

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At least we kept some olds alive instead.

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Hinakuluiau posted...

What's so wrong with death by suicide, provided it's not from mental illness? We allow people to do all manner of things that increase their likelihood of death (smoking, eating to obese levels, sports, guns, hiking, driving fast cars, etc.) and we don't stop them (gun control notwithstanding), but the actual final act is apparently so abhorrent that we don't allow people the freedom of choice and autonomy over their existence.

dawg...

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Still can't believe there are people so dumb that they think the lockdown is to stop the spread instead of flattening the curve.

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These article never have numbers. Its always just anecdotal evidence, this doctor at this place said this, type stuff

here are some numbers.

in 2017, 47,000 people died by suicide. That comes to 129 per day. 14.5/100,000 per year

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/suicide.htm

during the Great Depression, which lasted years, the suicide rate increased from about 17/100000 to 21.3/100000, over the course of three years. This is an increase of about 25%

https://www.history.com/.amp/news/stock-market-crash-suicides-wall-street-1929-great-depression

so we can extrapolate this to our current suicide rate of 129 suicides per day and see that a 25% increase would mean 161 people per day. Meanwhile covid is still averaging 1000/day. At its peak over 3000/day. 100,000 in two months.

a literally unprecedented 300% increase in suicides to 387 per day still wouldnt come close to the amount of deaths being caused by Covid.

and here were comparing this to the worst economic crisis in modern history. If you think for some reason this is comparable to the Great Depression, why is our economy so precarious that people want to push a narrator that a shutdown of a couple months literally drives people to suicide? Likewise why is our healthcare so bad That we cant address the mental health issues that would lead to it?


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LightHawKnight posted...

Still can't believe there are people so dumb that they think the lockdown is to stop the spread instead of flattening the curve.

What do you expect? There are people calling this recession the "Trump recession."

NightMarishPie posted...

To date, there is little evidence that lockdowns have reduced the spread of COVID-19.

What do they think caused the rapid growth in cases and deaths to slow down and reverse?

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TheGoldenEel posted...

These article never have numbers. Its always just anecdotal evidence, this doctor at this place said this, type stuff

here are some numbers.

in 2017, 47,000 people died by suicide. That comes to 129 per day. 14.5/100,000 per year

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/suicide.htm

during the Great Depression, which lasted years, the suicide rate increased from about 17/100000 to 21.3/100000, over the course of three years. This is an increase of about 25%

https://www.history.com/.amp/news/stock-market-crash-suicides-wall-street-1929-great-depression

so we can extrapolate this to our current suicide rate of 129 suicides per day and see that a 25% increase would mean 161 people per day. Meanwhile covid is still averaging 1000/day. At its peak over 3000/day. 100,000 in two months.

a literally unprecedented 300% increase in suicides to 387 per day still wouldnt come close to the amount of deaths being caused by Covid.

and here were comparing this to the worst economic crisis in modern history. If you think for some reason this is comparable to the Great Depression, why is our economy so precarious that people want to push a narrator that a shutdown of a couple months literally drives people to suicide? Likewise why is our healthcare so bad That we cant address the mental health issues that would lead to it?

Hell yeah man

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Rainbow_Dashing posted...

I stopped reading here.

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TheGoldenEel posted...

These article never have numbers. Its always just anecdotal evidence, this doctor at this place said this, type stuff

here are some numbers.

in 2017, 47,000 people died by suicide. That comes to 129 per day. 14.5/100,000 per year

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/suicide.htm

during the Great Depression, which lasted years, the suicide rate increased from about 17/100000 to 21.3/100000, over the course of three years. This is an increase of about 25%

https://www.history.com/.amp/news/stock-market-crash-suicides-wall-street-1929-great-depression

so we can extrapolate this to our current suicide rate of 129 suicides per day and see that a 25% increase would mean 161 people per day. Meanwhile covid is still averaging 1000/day. At its peak over 3000/day. 100,000 in two months.

a literally unprecedented 300% increase in suicides to 387 per day still wouldnt come close to the amount of deaths being caused by Covid.

and here were comparing this to the worst economic crisis in modern history. If you think for some reason this is comparable to the Great Depression, why is our economy so precarious that people want to push a narrator that a shutdown of a couple months literally drives people to suicide? Likewise why is our healthcare so bad That we cant address the mental health issues that would lead to it?

This is my biggest issue with conservative commentary along with cherrypicking anecdotal evidence. Its this implication that the correct course of action is never doing anything because everything was already perfect. Its always stuff like lockdowns are bad for the economy and bad for people, but never years of degradation in the workplace and social security coupled with a mistrust in science caused this issue and then made it worse, and the people in power arent doing anything to make it better even though all that information is right in front of them. Ive never seen a worse case of collective denial.

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