Current Events > Alabama to ban transgender surgeries and hormone blockers for teenagers.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Tenlaar posted...

Sigless? Wow, that's probably the most pathetic angle I've seen somebody take to discredit another poster here, and that's really saying something. Congratulations on reaching for the stars and getting there.

Sigless user logic.

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Ryuko_Chan posted...

Sigless user logic.

Yes, you've already said that incredibly stupid thing once. It's lost the shock value and is back to just being an incredibly stupid thing to say now.

Ryuko_Chan posted...

Yes it literally is. I was literally on it.
CPA has also been used as a puberty blocker and hence as an antiandrogen and antiestrogen to suppress puberty in transgender youth
Youre completely uninformed, youre way out of your depth. Stop posting.

Oh, so you got to be on puberty blockers, but now you want to deny it to others? Way to yank the ladder up behind you.

Provide some actual documentation that it's a common puberty blocker. All my research lists a dozen alternatives. Here's some of mine:

https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/teens/puberty/what-are-puberty-blockers

Your information is narrow and out of date. Please stop talking and hurting other trans people. :)

I wouldn't respond to the person who posted 303 anymore, folks. He was transitioning and then changed his mind and claimed he was gaslit by internet trolls into falsely believing he was trans and since then he has gone very hard bashing the trans community.
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Machete posted...

I wouldn't respond to the person who posted 303 anymore, folks. He was transitioning and then changed his mind and claimed he was gaslit by internet trolls into falsely believing he was trans and since then he has gone very hard bashing the trans community.

Ugh, really? That's unfortunate. I didn't realize they had stopped transitioning. It's gross that they've taken that position.

Machete posted...

I wouldn't respond to the person who posted 303 anymore, folks. He was transitioning and then changed his mind and claimed he was gaslit by internet trolls into falsely believing he was trans and since then he has gone very hard bashing the trans community.

he's done nothing but troll ever since claiming to have desisted. I have no idea why anyone would believe all the "I'm trans" stuff wasn't just more bullshit.

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hard bashing
dont be cowardly and talk about me when you have me behind a block

_Rinku_ posted...

Oh, so you got to be on puberty blockers, but now you want to deny it to others? Way to yank the ladder up behind you.

Provide some actual documentation that it's a common puberty blocker. All my research lists a dozen alternatives. Here's some of mine:

https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/teens/puberty/what-are-puberty-blockers

Your information is narrow and out of date. Please stop talking and hurting other trans people. :)

children should not be encouraged to destroy their lives by the government

Tenlaar posted...

Yes, you've already said that incredibly stupid thing once. It's lost the shock value and is back to just being an incredibly stupid thing to say now.

Sigless user logic.

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Tenlaar posted...

You got modded for comparing a child being transgender to wanting to be a fucking dinosaur, don't try to act like it was mod overreach.

actually i used the dinosaur thing as an example of a fanciful, unrealistic desire for the future which is obviously far sillier than being one gender or another, but demonstrates a breadth of desires and ideas where critical thinking is absent because, drumroll... kids are kids. like i said, anything someone says is immediately twisted to be worse, unless it's someone on your side of the argument.

boiling it down, though, the reason i got modded is absolutely mod overreach after mass marking. won't be surprised if this post gets it too.

just funny how elsewhere, when people were harassing me for days and pressuring me to give them my gamertag so they could further harass me off-site, that wasn't trolling, but as soon as a mod decides he personally thinks something is """transphobic,""" the warnings come out quick. mod bias is real, and they protect their team

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Gross, Ryuko. Just gross. I'm sorry that you've become such a hateful person.

Im not judging anyone, Im not even judging anyones actions
how am I hateful

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Ryuko_Chan posted...

?hard bashing?
dont be cowardly and talk about me when you have me behind a block

children should not be encouraged to destroy their lives by the government

Sigless user logic.

Oh, I thought I was still on this account. Anyway, what I said about you is true and you just confirmed it by using the argument "what you said is invalid because you posted it on the wrong account." The blocking is a formality anyway. I do it when I deem someone to be problematic. I meant to post on this account though. There was no attempt at hiding the post from you. I just obviously wouldn't be able to quote you on that account.
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boiling it down, though, the reason i got modded is absolutely mod overreac

it's really not

and this is coming from a user who the mods despise
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UnfairRepresent posted...

it's really not

and this is coming from a user who the mods despise

You don't get modded often, and when you do, it's fair. Your zimmerman tirades for example. You knew exactly what you were doing and where it was going to lead.
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UnfairRepresent posted...

it's really not

and this is coming from a user who the mods despise

then it's due to other users declaring what i must really mean after twisting it and putting words in my mouth. either way the rules get awfully rubbery on a whim

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Machete posted...

You don't get modded often, and when you do, it's fair. Your zimmerman tirades for example. You knew exactly what you were doing and where it was going to lead.

I dont get modded often because I never break the rules much to certain mods annoyance

And nothing I have ever said about the Zimmerman/Trayvon incident has ever been incorrect or inflammatory . All I have ever done Is point out data and evidence backed with sources. Such as Trayvon getting away, going home and coming back or Zimmerman not breaking any laws. Or the dispatcher not telling Zimmerman that he has to stop. Or the fact Zimmerman wasnt a cop.

Those aren't controversial or opinions, they are facts

its just that the facts of the case don't fit the narrative a lot of users enjoy telling.

I can't apologize for reality just because you dont like it. Its actually a massive shame that you intentionally choose not to look into the case and solely believe what you want to be true.

And when asked I'm not going to be threatened or intimidated into lying. You shouldn't be either.
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shockthemonkey posted...

Forcing trans kids to undergo dysphoric puberty is not protecting them. Refusing to treat a medical issue is not protecting them.

Puberty is natural, its biological.

ITT victim blaming and calling someone a troll because you cant brain wash them.

Aw well

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UnfairRepresent posted...

I dont get modded often because I never break the rules much to certain mods annoyance

And nothing I have ever said about the Zimmerman/Trayvon incident has ever been incorrect or inflammatory . All I have ever done Is point out data and evidence backed with sources. Such as Trayvon getting away, going home and coming back or Zimmerman not breaking any laws. Or the dispatcher not telling Zimmerman that he has to stop. Or the fact Zimmerman wasnt a cop. or the fact Stand Your Ground was never used as a defense, Pure 101 generic self defense was

Those aren't controversial or opinions, they are facts

its just that the facts of the case don't fit the narrative a lot of users enjoy telling.

I can't apologize for reality just because you dont like it. Its actually a massive shame that you intentionally choose not to look into the case and solely believe what you want to be true.

And when asked I'm not going to be threatened or intimidated into lying. You shouldn't be either.

So you're denying the embellishment you used with regard to trayvon "100% without any doubt fully intended to kill zimmerman" and your exaggerated descriptions of the confrontation that tried to paint him as some kind of crazed animal?

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Machete posted...

So you're denying the embellishment you used with regard to trayvon "100% without any doubt fully intended to kill zimmerman" and your exaggerated descriptions of the confrontation they tried to paint him as some kind of crazed animal?

The hypocrisy of this post would be hilarious if it wasn't insulting.

But yes I am 100% denying I ever refered to Trayvon as "crazed animal" and you're a horrible Admiralesq human being for lying that I did. That post of yours absolutely is trolling. And I am denying any embellishment. I've always gone out of my way to point out how tragic the event was and how sad it was Trayvon died. He was a teenager.

And yes Trayvon did attempt to kill Zimmerman and easily could have succeeded.

But notice how you ignored all of the facts I pointed out just you could go on a triade accusing me of all sorts of nonsense that I never said or implied just to keep the narrative. That's the thing that bugs me. All I've ever done is point out facts about the case and shot down lies about the case, while what do you do? Disregard it all and accuse me of all sorts of insulting nonsense.
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shockthemonkey posted...

So is cancer. Telling a child to live with cancer instead of treating it isnt protecting them.

why are you comparing puberty to cancer

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Jesus. Thats a new level of shit posting even for Machete. Id say hopefully hell get suspended. But even if he did hed just jump on his alt and continue his non-stop shit posting.

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ColdOne666 posted...

Government shouldn't be funding any of this surgery.

Especially not for children not mature and old enough to understand.

What about every other condition that children aren't mature enough to fully comprehend? Should no surgeries be funded? Should children even receive medical care?

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shockthemonkey posted...

So is cancer. Telling a child to live with cancer instead of treating it isnt protecting them.

Physical and mental health arent comparable like that.

ColdOne666 posted...

Physical and mental health arent comparable like that.

This is the exact kind of mentality that leads to poor treatment of mental health in America.

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hockeybub89 posted...

What about every other condition that children aren't mature enough to fully comprehend? Should no surgeries be funded? Should children even receive medical care?

A hole in the heart is binary

Whether or not a child believes they are the opposite gender is opinion. You can't 100% tell if they will maintain that convinction into adulthood or if they are just confused kids.

Some haven't maintained that conviction. There are lawsuits over it as we speak with people who regret it saying they couldn't consent.

Note they are not claiming that they didn't say they consented at the time, but they are saying because they were children that they could not fully understand what they were saying and as such couldn't consent . And the issue is that there is no 100% way of testing for that.

You can't change your conviction about a hole in your heart 20 years later. It's a physical thing

What concerns me is a lot of people including users like Shock and Tenlaar are dismsising these people as unimportant because they are outliers.

I can't agree with that. It's a big serious issue. These are children we're talking about. People who don't know what Peanut Butter is made of.
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UnfairRepresent posted...

Whether or not a child believes they are the opposite gender is opinion. You can't 100% tell if they will maintain that convinction into adulthood.

And we're back to this. Being transgender is not something that a person decides, it is literally brain chemistry. Being transgender does not depend on the "convictions" of a person any more than having a fucking club foot does.

Tenlaar posted...

And we're back to this. Being transgender is not something that a person decides, it is literally brain chemistry. Being transgender does not depend on the "convictions" of a person any more than having a fucking club foot does.

We're back to it because I don't want to argue it with you since it's semantics.

We disagree over that but regardless of whether you agree with me or you the fact remains that whatever verbage you use to describe it the outcome is the same.

"They aren't true transgenders" doesn't mean they aren't true victims. The problem is the same. I don't care what words you use to describe it and I don't want to be bogged down in a dumb argument about what words should be used to describe it. The problem is what matters.

And the problem is there is no 100% way to tell what children will hold convictions they have as kids into adulthood. No matter how sincere they are as children.
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shockthemonkey posted...

They are. Healthcare is healthcare. And regardless, should we not treat ADHD or bipolar until someone is 18?

Healthcare is heathcare but mental isn't physical

And transgenderism isn't ADHD or bipolar disorder

Again if another user was trying to claim being trans was the same thing as being bi-polar you would flip out at them

Not to mention, giving drugs that cause massive effects on children with bi-polar disorder or ADHD is a huge controversy and has been for decades now. People are debating it every day. A lot of people oppose it too. Use of Ritalin and Prozac on kids is one of the most debated calls in healthcare today, much much moreso than gender reassignment.
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Whether being transgender is a choice or not is absolutely not semantics, it is the very core of the issue and why transgender children need treatment rather than repression. You do not get to act like whether LGBT people are born that way or choose to be that way is a matter of opinion still up for debate. You just don't.

Tenlaar posted...

Whether being transgender is a choice or not is absolutely not semantics, it is the very core of the issue and why transgender children need treatment rather than repression. You do not get to act like whether LGBT people are born that way or choose to be that way is a matter of opinion still up for debate. You just don't.

Ok?

I never ever ever said it was a choice and never will.

So that post of yours was utterly irrelevant just like Machette's weird crazed animal one.

Don't just lie when you have no argument.
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UnfairRepresent posted...

A hole in the heart is binary

Whether or not a child believes they are the opposite gender is opinion. You can't 100% tell if they will maintain that convinction into adulthood or if they are just confused kids.

Some haven't maintained that conviction. There are lawsuits over it as we speak with people who regret it saying they couldn't consent.

Note they are not claiming that they didn't say they consented at the time, but they are saying because they were children that they could not fully understand what they were saying and as such couldn't consent . And the issue is that there is no 100% way of testing for that.

You can't change your conviction about a hole in your heart 20 years later. It's a physical thing

What concerns me is a lot of people including users like Shock and Tenlaar are dismsising these people as unimportant because they are outliers.

I can't agree with that. It's a big serious issue. These are children we're talking about. People who don't know what Peanut Butter is made of.

There is no issue, though. Children need mental healthcare just like physical healthcare. The brain is just as important as any other organ or body system. The whole point of doctors is to diagnose these things and triage problems. Some people being misdiagnosed for mental issues is no more a final statement than misdiagnoses on physical health. If a doctor can't tell an opinion from a real condition, then they are a fucking quack. There is no tangible reason to worry about this any more than diagnosing children with other mental/developmental disorders or physical orders.

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hockeybub89 posted...

There is no issue, though. Children need mental healthcare just like physical healthcare

Agreed

. The brain is just as important as any other organ or body system. The whole point of doctors is to diagnose these things and triage problems. Some people being misdiagnosed for mental issues is no more a final statement than misdiagnoses on physical health. If a doctor can't tell an opinion from a real condition, then they are a fucking quack.

It's not that simple.

I don't think the reality is fair to go "Everyone who claims they couldn't consent as a child and regrets the transition had a quack doctor!"

Hell there are plenty of adults who transition and transition back and say they regret it.

I don't get what you can do to get 100% accuracy on that and saying "Anyone who has different convictions 20 years later had a quack doctor!" is not an acceptable answer.

There is no tangible reason to worry about this any more than diagnosing children with other mental/developmental disorders or physical orders.

Except there is.

There's a difference between mental health and physical health.

A 6 year old girl who says she believes she is a boy is not the same thing as a 6 year old girl who has a hole in her heart.

A 26 year old woman can't claim she was mistaken about having a hole in her heart in retrospect. It's binary. The hole was there.
The 26 year old man can claim he's actually a girl after all and regrets the transition.

And drugs that block puberty or alter your body are life-altering.
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UnfairRepresent posted...

Ok?

I never ever ever said it was a choice and never will.

So that post of yours was utterly irrelevant just like Machette's weird crazed animal one.

Don't just lie when you have no argument.

What exactly do you think that you're saying when you say that whether a transgender child grows up to be a transgender adult is based on whether they continue to hold the same convictions? Do you know what the word conviction means? It is a firmly held belief or opinion.

UnfairRepresent posted...

Agreed

It's not that simple.

I don't think the reality is fair to go "Everyone who claims they couldn't consent as a child and regrets the transition had a quack doctor!"

Hell there are plenty of adults who transition and transition back and say they regret it.

I don't get what you can do to get 100% accuracy on that and saying "Anyone who has different convictions 20 years later had a quack doctor!" is not an acceptable answer.

Clearly they did if the doctor couldn't tell an opinion from a real condition. Again, this is a statement on bad doctors, not the concept of providing healthcare to children.

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3 separate violations in that response. You need to calm down, UnfairRepresent. I never accused you of using any specific words and the fact that you would interpret my post as accusing you of using specific words is a little bit silly because you claimed to be all about "facts" but you are presenting an interpretation of my words (which is incorrect) as fact and yet the whole narrative of "he was definitely trying to kill him and not anything less than that" is an interpretation as well, not a fact. I'm not the one guilty of hypocrisy here. It's offensive to claim his intentions were that extreme with no proof. It's trolling to accuse me of saying something I didn't say... and the insult you threw in there speaks for itself. The fact that you embellished however is an actual fact, and you would not have been warned multiple times for it if it was not... but I don't care to discuss this further because I don't want to derail the topic. I'm just putting out a few final thoughts on the matter because I don't want to see any of that "and he was never seen again" trolling you love to do...

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Tenlaar posted...

What exactly do you think that you're saying when you say that whether a transgender child grows up to be a transgender adult is based on whether they continue to hold the same convictions? Do you know what the word conviction means? It is a firmly held belief or opinion.

That doesn't make it a choice.

No one wakes up one day and goes "I'm a girl now!" and then wakes up the next and goes "Naw I'm a boy!"

Well some people do but they're dumb.

But a child may 100% believe something as much as they believe anything else in the world with an undeveloped brain and strong passionate convictions about it.

Then decades later no longer have those convictions.

When I was a kid I thought animal life should be viewed as equal to human life. A dog has the same value as a human. A man who kills a cat deserves life in prison. There is nothing intrinsically more valuable about a hamster than a human being.

I literally didn't comprehend the value or concept of love and intellect and consciousness and pain and desire and thought.

As an adult I find that stance I used to hold absurd. but I wasnt lying. I didn't "Choose" that belief and I didn't "Choose" to negate it. My convictions just changed. Convictions I was once certain of changed as my brain developed and I understood more of the world around me and what things actually were.

I'm pretty sure it's safe to say you have done the same on different things.

A child can have a 100% earnest conviction they believe as strongly as they believe anything else in life.
The same person can completely reject the same thought decades later without any concious thought or intent.

Remember we're talking about people who we don't consider developed enough to comprehend their own diets or bedtimes or safety. But we are expecting them to comprehend the intricacies of what gender is, gender's place in society and their place in the world.

And also we're simutaniously expecting doctors to be able to tell which of these convictions are permanent and which aren't. Then if the adult doesn't think the same way, it's the doctors fault for not having vague unspecified "Higher Standards" when she was deciding to block puberty.

I just can't accept such a simplistic view on the matter. It seems childish no pun intended.
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UnfairRepresent posted...

No one wakes up one day and goes "I'm a girl now!" and then wakes up the next and goes "Naw I'm a boy!"

Well some people do but they're dumb.

how can you be so disrespectful to genderfluid people like that

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I don't know how many times I can say this, maybe putting it in big bold letters will help?

BEING TRANSGENDER IS NOT A CHOICE. IT IS NOT A BELIEF SYSTEM THAT YOU CAN REJECT LIKE A RELIGION. BEING TRANSGENDER COMES FROM HAVING A BRAIN THAT FUNCTIONS DIFFERENTLY.

I don't know how many times I can say this, maybe putting it in big bold letters will help?

I never said it was a choice and never will
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UnfairRepresent posted...

I don't know how many times I can say this, maybe putting it in big bold letters will help?

I never said it was a choice and never will

You are repeatedly and directly saying how you view being transgender as a belief system rather than a physical difference in the brain.

What's the difference between chemicals in the brain and chemicals in the brain?

Unless you're claiming Transgenders have physically abnormal brains. Which would be weirder flex in the topic so far.

And also would actually make treatment easy to diagnose.
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Yes, I am saying that the brains of transgender people literally resemble the brains of their desired gender rather than their born gender.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/05/180524112351.htm

That's not an abnormal brain dude

That's talking about brain activation patterns. The brains are still brains.

I don't think you're following on this.
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