Poll of the Day > Demi Lovato's nudes were leaked

(+) Yeah! (+)

For a second I read that as "Danny DeVito" and got excited.

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Sahuagin posted...

LinkPizza posted...

You're right. But it's the same as leaving your door unlocked while you're not home to stop home invaders. If you wanna protect your stuff, lock your door. If you don't want you nudes getting out (then either don't take them, or store them somewhere actual safe. Or something similar. When any of us take nudes, we know there's a chance it can get around...

so?

So, what? I said you're right, but it's also the same as doing that. Most people would say you probably should leave your door unlocked. And if you're worried about your nudes getting out, then you should either not take them, or make sure they're secure. Even then, you should also trust the person you're sending them to. I didn't say we should victim shame. I am saying she did something pretty dumb. As they say, "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes." And that's what happened here. It's not like hacking is new. The Fappening happened before (multiple times, I believe). And will most likely happen again. Especially if people keep giving them more nudes to steal...

Like I said earlier, everyone is taking a chance when taking nudes. Celebrities as well. And their nudes are worth way more than average people. Celebrities are famous, and many are hot...
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Mead posted...

why is it that when anyone says Im just saying or Im simply saying its always something thats a pretty shitty justification for some awful viewpoint

It's a awful viewpoint to not have nudes on your phone and cry when it's hacked? I see.
It's no surprise you think this though.

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wwinterj25 posted...

Not sure where you're getting I'm implying that. I'm simply saying if you run through a fire you're going to get burnt.

I was going to post something like this before but I didn't want to do my usual over-analysis of things. But...

Jen definitely has a point here. There is a sort of moral chain here. To keep it simple:

Is it immoral/unethical to hack someone's phone, take their images, and (let's say "enjoy") them? Yes

Let's break it apart:

• is it immoral to hack someone's phone? Yes
• is it immoral to then copy someone's images? Yes
• is it immoral to "enjoy" someone's images that have been obtained in this way? Yes
• is it immoral to "enjoy" someone's images that have been obtained in this way, if I had another person obtain them for me? Yes

So, at what part of this are you removed from guilt?

The only thing going on here it seems is "mob mentality": everyone else is doing something immoral, which means that it's ok for me to do the immoral thing too.

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Sahuagin posted...

Is it immoral/unethical to hack someone's phone, take their images, and (let's say "enjoy") them? Yes

https://i.imgur.com/QprGM5g.gif

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Sahuagin posted...

I was going to post something like this before but I didn't want to do my usual over-analysis of things. But...

Jen definitely has a point here. There is a sort of moral chain here. To keep it simple:

Is it immoral/unethical to hack someone's phone, take their images, and (let's say "enjoy") them? Yes

Let's break it apart:
* is it immoral to hack someone's phone? Yes
* is it immoral to then copy someone's images? Yes
* is it immoral to "enjoy" someone's images that have been obtained in this way? Yes
* is it immoral to "enjoy" someone's images that have been obtained in this way, if I had another person obtain them for me? Yes
So, at what part of this are you removed from guilt?

The only thing going on here it seems is "mob mentality": everyone else is doing something immoral, which means that it's ok for me to do the immoral thing too.

I think the point that was suppose to be made earlier was Jen said that anyone who looked at the image had low or no moral. Basing our whole morality on this one thing. Which is wrong. People can do something immoral without being completely immoral...
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LinkPizza posted...

So, what?

you're doing your usual thing of arguing with no point. none of what you're saying has any bearing on the moral issue here.

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Sahuagin posted...

you're doing your usual thing of arguing with no point. none of what you're saying has any bearing on the moral issue here.

I mean your long ass post didn't add anything to the discussion either.

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LinkPizza posted...

I think the point that was suppose to be made earlier was Jen said that anyone who looked at the image had low or no moral. Basing our whole morality on this one thing. Which is wrong. People can do something immoral without being completely immoral...

ok, I just take what she said to effectively mean "doing so is immoral". yes, one immoral act doesn't describe everything about you.

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Sahuagin posted...

you're doing your usual thing of arguing with no point. none of what you're saying has any bearing on the moral issue here.

If you dont see the point, thats fine. And its not my usual thing. And the moral part I was talking about was when Jen said that we had low or no morals for doing one immoral thing. But whatever...
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wwinterj25 posted...

I mean your long ass post didn't add anything to the discussion either.

well I'm asking you a question. aren't you claiming that you viewing the images is not immoral?

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Sahuagin posted...

well I'm asking you a question. aren't you claiming that you viewing the images is not immoral?

Point to me where I agreed or disagreed with that assumption.
Honestly? I'm indifferent. Some folk won't bat a eyelid while others will get on their soap box about things I like and do. It really doesn't matter to me.

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wwinterj25 posted...

Point to me where I agreed or disagreed with that assumption.

hmmm. ok then, you're position is that it is immoral but you don't care?

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Sahuagin posted...

hmmm. ok then, you're position is that it is immoral but you don't care?

My position is think what you like. It doesn't change what I do because I simply don't care.

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I dont care Im just gonna make fifty posts in this topic I clearly dont care at all and am not the least bit defensive

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Mead posted...

I dont care Im just gonna make fifty posts in this topic I clearly dont care at all and am not the least bit defensive

I'm happy you understand Mead.

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wwinterj25 posted...

My position is think what you like. It doesn't change what I do because I simply don't care.

ok, then: you don't even care to ask whether it is or isn't immoral, or even discuss it here where it is actively being discussed in a conversation that you're actively involved in, and even if it was immoral, you wouldn't care?

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Sahuagin posted...

even if it was immoral, you wouldn't care?

Bingo.


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wwinterj25 posted...

Bingo.

I don't even know what to say. So you are an admittedly immoral person? Are you a psychopath? Do you at least respect the law? Do you just avoid doing things that would get you in trouble, but without that you would commit any kind of evil act? Or in other words, is there a limit somewhere? Stealing? Killing?

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Sahuagin posted...

I don't even know what to say. So you are an admittedly immoral person? Are you a psychopath? Do you at least respect the law? Do you just avoid doing things that would get you in trouble, but without that you would commit any kind of evil act? Or in other words, is there a limit somewhere? Stealing? Killing?

Thats a lot to assume because he likes to look at nude celebrities. Or do you think most of the world in like that? Because I feel like most of he works has looks at a celebs nude pic at least once...
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LinkPizza posted...

Thats a lot to assume because he likes to look at nude celebrities. Or do you think most of the world in like that? Because I feel like most of he works has looks at a celebs nude pic at least once...

That's the problem. It's not just looking at nude celebrities. It's looking at nude photos of people knowing the photos you're looking at are being distributed without their consent.

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Sahuagin posted...

I don't even know what to say. So you are an admittedly immoral person? Are you a psychopath? Do you at least respect the law? Do you just avoid doing things that would get you in trouble, but without that you would commit any kind of evil act? Or in other words, is there a limit somewhere? Stealing? Killing?

1. I do things/would do things that others may think is immoral. Looking at leaked nudes for example.
2. I show no guilt or shame in doing or wanting to do those things.
3. I follow the law however have also broken it before.
4. Define evil.
5. Yes there are things I wouldn't do even if there was no consequences for doing said things.

Wow this has gone deeper than I thought. All based on looking at leaked nudes.


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LinkPizza posted...

Thats a lot to assume because he likes to look at nude celebrities. Or do you think most of the world in like that? Because I feel like most of he works has looks at a celebs nude pic at least once...

it's not an assumption, he specifically declared that he didn't care about morality...

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Sahuagin posted...

it's not an assumption, he specifically declared that he didn't care about morality...

I mean your view on what's moral and isn't won't be shared with everyone.

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Jen0125 posted...

That's the problem. It's not just looking at nude celebrities. It's looking at nude photos of people knowing the photos you're looking at are being distributed without their consent.

And in this case, its a celebrity. But that doesnt change the fact that thats a leap to assume all those things on the fact that he doesnt care that he looked at a photo of a nude celebrity...
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Sahuagin posted...

I don't even know what to say. So you are an admittedly immoral person? Are you a psychopath? Do you at least respect the law? Do you just avoid doing things that would get you in trouble, but without that you would commit any kind of evil act? Or in other words, is there a limit somewhere? Stealing? Killing?

Dad just doesn't care about leaked nudes, ok?

wwinterj25 posted...

1. I do things/would do things that others may think is immoral. Looking at leaked nudes for example.
2. I show no guilt or shame in doing or wanting to do those things.
3. I follow the law however have also broken it before.
4. Define evil.
5. Yes there are things I wouldn't do even if there was no consequences for doing said things.
Wow this has gone deeper than I thought. All based on looking at leaked nudes.

what kind of person do you think this post describes

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xjayguyx posted...

Dad just doesn't care about leaked nudes, ok?

At least my son understands me.

Mead posted...

what kind of person do you think this post describes

You tell me doc.

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Sahuagin posted...

it's not an assumption, he specifically declared that he didn't care about morality...

Actually, I think he said he didnt care about the immorality of looking at leaked nudes. And based o bios answer, the stuff you just was literally you assuming based on him not caring about the morality of leaked nudes...
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LinkPizza posted...

Actually, I think he said he didnt care about the immorality of looking at leaked nudes.

Yeppers.


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Mead posted...

what kind of person do you think this post describes

A pretty normal human. People do immoral things all the time... depending on what you call immoral. For example, me having sex with my SO would be immoral to many people for different reasons, like were both guys or were not married.

And people dont always feel shame in doing something naughty.

Many people have broken the law before. Maybe stole something from a convenience store. Or looked up porn at a young age, or on the wrong country...

And many people still wouldnt do certain things, even if there were no consequences...
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LinkPizza posted...

I think he said he didnt care about the immorality of looking at leaked nudes

that doesn't make any sense. moral/immoral is the value judgment of the act. if you're saying you don't care about the value judgement of one scenario versus another, then what metric are you using to differentiate them instead?

act A => immoral => ok
act B => immoral => not ok

really I think you're just goal post shifting. you want to be able to be ok with this without having to defend it. I don't know why you'd want to discuss it in that case though.

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LinkPizza posted...

People do immoral things all the time... depending on what you call immoral. For example, me having sex with my SO would be immoral to many people for different reasons, like were both guys or were not married.

yeah, but you wouldn't say you'd still be ok with homosexuality even if it was immoral, you would say that homosexuality is not immoral.

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Sahuagin posted...

yeah, but you wouldn't say you'd still be ok with homosexuality even if it was immoral

How do you know? All your posts have been is on assumptions. You came into this topic making no point at all and continue to drag on this weird ... whatever this is. It seems like I need more nude leaks tbh.

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Sahuagin posted...

that doesn't make any sense. moral/immoral is the value judgment of the act. if you're saying you don't care about the value judgement of one scenario versus another, then what metric are you using to differentiate them instead?

act A => immoral => ok
act B => immoral => not ok

really I think you're just goal post shifting. you want to be able to be ok with this without having to defend it. I don't know why you'd want to discuss it in that case though.

No. Some people dont do certain things based on their own morals. For example, replace act one with sex before marriage. Its considered immoral. But Im ok with it. Replace act 2 with murder. Also immoral, but its not ok. Or course, that also depends on what you consider immoral in the first place. Its not goal post shifting. Its just common sense. Not everybody has the same moral compass. And not everybody is going to feel the same about everything. Were all individuals...

Sahuagin posted...

yeah, but you wouldn't say you'd still be ok with homosexuality even if it was immoral, you would say that homosexuality is not immoral.

Id be ok with it. People do consider it immoral. And I dont care. Its not like it being immoral is going to make me straight. As a kid, I was told it was bad. Guess what? Im still gay. And I didnt care. I just didnt tell people. So, it really does matter. They are immoral things I dont care about.
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wwinterj25 posted...

How do you know? All your posts have been is on assumptions. You came into this topic making no point at all and continue to drag on this weird ... whatever this is. It seems like I need more nude leaks tbh.

NO Dad the harddrive is already full, I can't download anymore games because of all your leaked nude porn :(

xjayguyx posted...

NO Dad the harddrive is already full, I can't download anymore games because of all your leaked nude porn :(

I know what. I'll put it on my list to Santa!

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wwinterj25 posted...

I know what. I'll put it on my list to Santa!

You're not going to eat all the cookies this year are you?

xjayguyx posted...

You're not going to eat all the cookies this year are you?

I'll leave the carrot for your mother. I promise!

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wwinterj25 posted...

I'll leave the carrot for your mother. I promise!

Carrot haha wtf

wwinterj25 posted...

You came into this topic making no point at all and continue to drag on this weird ... whatever this is.

no point at all? this is a clearly immoral act that you are "defending" for some reason.

(personally I enjoy a good philosophically interesting conversation. this is something I'm not decided on and would have naively sided with you when I first entered the thread; I may yet given the right argument.)

you guys are conflating the concept of considering an act to be immoral oneself, and for "society"/everyone-else considering an act to be immoral. obviously you don't care if everyone else thinks something is immoral if you don't agree. the question is, do you care if you think it's immoral?

I guess a conversation like this can only go on so long since we start to lose grasp of the flow of the conversation over time.

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Sahuagin posted...

no point at all? this is a clearly immoral act that you are "defending" for some reason.

(personally I enjoy a good philosophically interesting conversation. this is something I'm not decided on and would have naively sided with you when I first entered the thread; I may yet given the right argument.)

you guys are conflating the concept of considering an act to be immoral oneself, and for "society"/everyone-else considering an act to be immoral. obviously you don't care if everyone else thinks something is immoral if you don't agree. the question is, do you care if you think it's immoral?

I guess a conversation like this can only go on so long since we start to lose grasp of the flow of the conversation over time.

This all started from someone caring about a drug addict celebrities leaked pics... lmao

Sahuagin posted...

you guys are conflating the concept of considering an act to be immoral oneself, and for "society"/everyone-else considering an act to be immoral.

But that brings another question... Does everyone else in the world see it as immoral, or as stupidity on her part? You say that's we're talking about our morals, but the same could be said for you. Just because you say people should victim shame doesn't mean the whole world will agree. Especially after her nudes were leaked AFTER a bunch of other celebrities were hacked. Some people may think that she brought this on herself. And some may even think it's not a real leak. Or that she wanted to get those photos out. If a majority of the world thinks it's not immoral, does that make it not immoral? What would "society" as a whole think? Who's to say what is an isn't immoral. The church may say I'm immoral because I've had a shit ton of premarital, gay sex. That's a twofer. But I don't consider it immoral. Who's right? Who gets to choose? And why do they get to choose? And why is it immoral?
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Sahuagin posted...

no point at all? this is a clearly immoral act that you are "defending" for some reason.

(personally I enjoy a good philosophically interesting conversation. this is something I'm not decided on and would have naively sided with you when I first entered the thread; I may yet given the right argument.)

you guys are conflating the concept of considering an act to be immoral oneself, and for "society"/everyone-else considering an act to be immoral. obviously you don't care if everyone else thinks something is immoral if you don't agree. the question is, do you care if you think it's immoral?

I guess a conversation like this can only go on so long since we start to lose grasp of the flow of the conversation over time.

Morals are subjective so there is no clear
immorality.
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Revelation34 posted...

Morals are subjective

disagree but I already spent all my energy

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If you were hot it would be immortal to withhold your nudes from the world.

Gonna get drunk

Sahuagin posted...

disagree but I already spent all my energy

There's nothing to disagree with. People have different moral compasses. Subjectivity is not objectivity.
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Revelation34 posted...

There's nothing to disagree with. People have different moral compasses. Subjectivity is not objectivity.

morality is about rules that help groups succeed. such rules are objectively true. they objectively promote the success of groups. you can argue that they are partly subjective and partly objective, but the same can be said for most or all things. everything has a subjective component, because we can only observe it through our own perceptions; everything has an objective component since/if it exists. (probably exceptions somewhere.) but the notion that whatever you decide is moral is what is moral is false. moral rules promote the success of groups; anything else is not moral (or possibly amoral).

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