Current Events > Originally Thor was going to ___ in Endgame (MCU Spoilers)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Fat Thor was going to fight The Dark World Thor on Asgard.

Fat Thor was going to ultimately win after getting his ass kicked (Probably due to an assist from Rocket) when he discovered he was still worthy to lift Mjlnir.

This was scrapped because they completely overhauled the entire Time Heist segment and they thought Cap vs Cap in New York already accomplished the same idea except better..

Which is true but also a shame.

There's a dinstinct lack of Thor kicking ass in the MCU, for supposedly the most powerful hero in the franchise (Bar Odin I suppose) he sure gets humiliated while doing nothing a lot.
---

Yeah Tony was gonna fight Heimdall as well, with a cloaking suit that Heimdall could see anyway.

Would've been fun.
---

America's ass > Fat Thor

---

Is he the most powerful? Isnt Captain Marvel, now?

Regardless, theyre pretty inconsistent with power levels. One example being in Endgame when past-Thanos without the Infinity Gauntlet manages to hold off Iron Man, Thor, and Cap, AND even Captain Marvel for a while.
---

Shablagoo posted...

Is he the most powerful? Isnt Captain Marvel, now?

lol I totally forgot about her.

Yeah I supposed she is more powerful than Thor
---

The problem with power levels in CBMs is that the most powerful heroes always have to face some contrived restriction so that the less-powerful get a chance to shine. This was evident even in the first X-men trilogy, where Xavier was put in a coma, brainwashed, or just killed off to keep him from soloing.
---

The entire plot of Endgame was incredibly stupid. And it was obviously a rushed job at best. This is why you can't just make things up after loosely following a comic book story. Otherwise we go from some idea of logic in one movie to "WOO MAGIC TIME TRAVEL FUCK YEAH CAMEO TIME"

The funniest part is Carol could have easily fucking stopped Thanos in a few seconds. Like she legit just blows up his ship.
Why not ask her to do that? Oh yeah something something let him come to Earth and wreck everything cause y'know we got team Avengers!
---

RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

The entire plot of Endgame was incredibly stupid. And it was obviously a rushed job at best. This is why you can't just make things up after loosely following a comic book story. Otherwise we go from some idea of logic in one movie to "WOO MAGIC TIME TRAVEL FUCK YEAH CAMEO TIME"

At last we got Infinity War which was fantastic and Endgame had plenty of great parts but yeah the plot was pretty stupid.
---

Thanos was originally supposed to enter the battlefield at the end by emerging out of a portal from a decimated 2014 Earth, and he throws 2014 Captain America's head at Steve's feet.
---

Shablagoo posted...

At last we got Infinity War which was fantastic and Endgame had plenty of great parts but yeah the plot was pretty stupid.

Infinity War wasn't bad because it was very loosely based on a comic story.
Endgame was pathetically written by a bunch of idiots and it shows.
---

Hayame Zero posted...

Thanos was originally supposed to enter the battlefield at the end by emerging out of a portal from a decimated 2014 Earth, and he throws 2014 Captain America's head at Steve's feet.

Wasn't that still in the fake script?

I know they purposefully had two complete scripts knocking about while filming just so if it got leaked, you still wouldn't know if it was real or not.

Allegedly Chris Evans and RDJ were the only actors who actually got a complete script. Every other actor just got their scenes, sometimes without context.
---

Maze_ posted...

Wasn't that still in the fake script?

There were multiple rumours and fake scripts
Bruce was supposed to be "in a coma" and eventually they decide to take him off life support and Hulk pops out and is like "nah fuck you, he's not dying". Then it was "he'll hulk out in the hulkbuster suit" then it was "he'll speak as Hulk properly and calmly cause Tasha and him are dating and she likes them both" etc.

All garbage rumours
---

RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

Shablagoo posted...

At last we got Infinity War which was fantastic and Endgame had plenty of great parts but yeah the plot was pretty stupid.

Infinity War wasn't bad because it was very loosely based on a comic story.
Endgame was pathetically written by a bunch of idiots and it shows.

What came after the comic that Infinity War was loosely based on? Did it have a better conclusion?
---

Why wasnt Mjolnir constantly flying off towards Asgard?
---

Shablagoo posted...

What came after the comic that Infinity War was loosely based on? Did it have a better conclusion?

The comic story is way different.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_Gauntlet#Synopsis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_War
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_Crusade

Never could be done for live action. The thing is even near the start of movie, it could have been salvaged. It's more like that without Mistress Death in it, Thanos' whole idea of "uh not enough resources" is pretty stupid.
---

RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

The entire plot of Endgame was incredibly stupid. And it was obviously a rushed job at best. This is why you can't just make things up after loosely following a comic book story. Otherwise we go from some idea of logic in one movie to "WOO MAGIC TIME TRAVEL FUCK YEAH CAMEO TIME"

No.
---

RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

Shablagoo posted...

What came after the comic that Infinity War was loosely based on? Did it have a better conclusion?

The comic story is way different.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_Gauntlet#Synopsis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_War
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_Crusade

Never could be done for live action. The thing is even near the start of movie, it could have been salvaged. It's more like that without Mistress Death in it, Thanos' whole idea of "uh not enough resources" is pretty stupid.

Ah, interesting, thanks. Funny that

masterpug53 posted...

Xavier was put in a coma, brainwashed, or just killed off to keep him from soloing.

lol
---

Thor and Hulk were always portrayed as the two strongest Avengers in MCU and then they just made a mockery of them in Endgame.

Real good call cutting that since it'd be a bit of a rehash from Cap vs. Cap.
---

Thor talking to his mother works better.

IDK why people shit all over Thor in Endgame. His whole arc is one of the better parts of that movie and dealt with the whole PTSD thing a lot better than Tony having it in Iron Man 3.
---

KillerSlaw posted...

Thor talking to his mother works better.

IDK why people shit all over Thor in Endgame. His whole arc is one of the better parts of that movie and dealt with the whole PTSD thing a lot better than Tony having it in Iron Man 3.

If you say so

Thor's MCU arc is one the most nonsensical and worst written things in the entire MCU.
---

All these haters in here tbh.

Endgame was awesome. Who gives a shit if the time travel mechanics are kinda dumb? I definitely preferred Endgame over Infinity War.
---

GunmaN1905 posted...

Thor and Hulk were always portrayed as the two strongest Avengers in MCU and then they just made a mockery of them in Endgame.

The Hulk thing was my main problem with the movie. I really wanted to see the emotional transition to Proff Hulk, and they just skipped the whole thing. It feels like they just erased a great character who was getting even better in Ragnarok.

I love the Bruce v Hulk dichotomy. I really wanted to see a full scene of those two getting to talk to eachother. Like a big dialogue in Bruce's mind where they have a big argument and hate eachother and wont agree at first but slowly come to terms with eachother. Maybe they laugh at Thor together. And they get mad when they compare and realize that Thor told both of them that he prefers them and not the other one. I really was hoping they would come to an agreement where Hulk gets control half the time but he has to tone down the anger, and Bruce gets half the time.

I feel like they did exactly the opposite of what I wanted and it's fairly lame. I do like the idea of professor Hulk eventually, but idk if it was time.
---

MrNintendo1213 posted...

The Hulk thing was my main problem with the movie. I really wanted to see the emotional transition to Proff Hulk, and they just skipped the whole thing. It feels like they just erased a great character who was getting even better in Ragnarok.

Becase the second movie was a clusterfuck with too many characters in it. Merged Hulk should have been done in Ragnarok.
Hulk liked Valkyrie. Bruce liked Tasha.
Get the fuck over yourself and becmoe one person but instead we got "dabbing Hulk"
---

Endgame was a stupid mess. For a lot of reasons.

Let's pick just one.
Infinity War - Lets dedicate a whole sub plot to explaining that only giant space dwarf Peter Dinklage (and his dead pals) had the knowhow, tools, substance (undisclosed metal) and requiring the power of a star to make the only device in the universe capable of mounting and utilizing all the stones simultaneously because they're just so fucking powerful. And it worked.
Then one year later and written by the same people. Endgame - Stark just makes his own. Oh I guess he maybe had help from Rocket, Banner and Nebula. And even then, even if you say oh he's the smartest person in the universe, blah blah blah. Then after that gauntlet is taken he just throws them on his regular old IM armor and uses then that way.
---

They definitely were over crowded, but they kind of had to be. It is the ultimate culmination of all sorts of crazy different stories coming together.

Poor Drax got shafted.
---

It's sad Thor will probably never be as badass as he was in the final battle of Ragnarok again.
---

All the cut things sound 100x better than the actual movie we got.
---

AmericaTheBrave posted...

It's sad Thor will probably never be as badass as he was in the final battle of Ragnarok again.

Yeah I'm not sure I'm that looking forward to the next Thor movie now since they announced female Thor. I'm glad they are bringing back Portman to be honest, and hopefully Kat Dennings will show up as well, but her becoming Thor is just stupid. Aside from the fact Mjolnir is destroyed, even if by some chance it was put back together, and somehow Jane Foster is worthy of lifting it which makes no sense unless she has been training the past five or so years to become a blacksmith, the fact remains that being able to lift the hammer doesn't all of a sudden give you super powers. You can use the hammer, but you don't get super speed and strength and durability and everything else. So the premise makes no sense to begin with.

Also correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this storyline in the comics absolutely hated by most everyone? They keep saying it's one of the most interesting stories the past few years, but all I read is about how much people hate it and wish they would just do away with it like it never happened.
---

Gamerguymass posted...

AmericaTheBrave posted...

It's sad Thor will probably never be as badass as he was in the final battle of Ragnarok again.

Yeah I'm not sure I'm that looking forward to the next Thor movie now since they announced female Thor. I'm glad they are bringing back Portman to be honest, and hopefully Kat Dennings will show up as well, but her becoming Thor is just stupid. Aside from the fact Mjolnir is destroyed, even if by some chance it was put back together, and somehow Jane Foster is worthy of lifting it which makes no sense unless she has been training the past five or so years to become a blacksmith, the fact remains that being able to lift the hammer doesn't all of a sudden give you super powers. You can use the hammer, but you don't get super speed and strength and durability and everything else. So the premise makes no sense to begin with.

Also correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this storyline in the comics absolutely hated by most everyone? They keep saying it's one of the most interesting stories the past few years, but all I read is about how much people hate it and wish they would just do away with it like it never happened.

Yeah I agree the whole female Thor thing is dumb and makes no sense. If you want to give Natalie powers do it I guess, but find a way that makes sense dont just give her someone else's name.
---

Knowledge_King posted...

All the cut things sound 100x better than the actual movie we got.

To be fair, that's because anything we never see has a constant "Benefit of the doubt"

In another universe Fan4stic got canceled and people would be going "Damn that reboot sounded great!" because in their mind they imagined something that didn't suck
---

Maze_ posted...

Wasn't that still in the fake script?

I know they purposefully had two complete scripts knocking about while filming just so if it got leaked, you still wouldn't know if it was real or not.

Allegedly Chris Evans and RDJ were the only actors who actually got a complete script. Every other actor just got their scenes, sometimes without context.

The Russos mentioned it in an interview last month, but said they couldn't pull it off with its rating

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QREOp3p5NkI" data-time="
Around 11:03

---

MrNintendo1213 posted...

Yeah I agree the whole female Thor thing is dumb and makes no sense

"The thing that hasn't happened yet makes no sense"

Erm... ok.

I'd rather see it before I decide that
---

Thor had the best arc lol.

Lets ignore two movies worth of characters from him were killed (not snapped) in back to back films.

Lets ignore that Thor was forced to move the goalposts and destroy his home despite an endgame powerup.

The dude immediately gets destroyed by Thanos and his whole team. As his last 2 remaining original Asgardians are killed in front of him. The dude spends the rest of the movie getting his ultimate weapon. His arrogance botched killing Thanos, as now the galaxy is snapped.

Twice now Thor could not actually beat the bad guy with his resolution. Both times he lost something he swore to protect.

He gets a second chance only to find out Thanos got rid of the stones.

Completely broken that his strong facade is gone, he kills Thanos before any more questions could be asked. Unlike the meme obsessed morons, his I aimed for the head was heart breaking.

Thors thing since the first movie is losing and getting embarrassed, and Thor tries to justify that hes awesome anyway.

Losing his home, family, friends, weapon, and pride in an extremely short time frame. Naturally, when given responsibility again, he runs. Hes tired and scared of failing over and over.

He gave up. But when he was deemed still worthy (something he tried to protect for six movies), he started to believe in himself again. But he comes to terms with Thor. Not Thor, son of Odin and heir to Asgard.

No character comes close to his development.
---

And yet, in his 10,000 year lifetime he never experienced anything like this before?
---

LightningAce11 posted...

And yet, in his 10,000 year lifetime he never experienced anything like this before?

Losing Mjolnir? Having his home obliterated? Losing what little family he had left and half of his entire race? Feeling solely responsible for half the universe's population just fucking vanishing? Most of that happening in the span of like a day? No, I'm pretty sure that's never happened before.
---

Shablagoo posted...

Is he the most powerful? Isnt Captain Marvel, now?

Regardless, theyre pretty inconsistent with power levels. One example being in Endgame when past-Thanos without the Infinity Gauntlet manages to hold off Iron Man, Thor, and Cap, AND even Captain Marvel for a while.

Its like Thanos is incredibly strong or something.
---

Maze_ posted...

MrNintendo1213 posted...

Yeah I agree the whole female Thor thing is dumb and makes no sense

"The thing that hasn't happened yet makes no sense"

Erm... ok.

I'd rather see it before I decide that

I meant in general, like it was in the comics. The movie could definitely be great. I just don't like calling Jane Foster Thor. That is his name, not a title. If she needs a super name find something else. Or just call her Jane. I wasn't a big fan of her character in the first two movies, but Waititi seems to have something up his sleeve for a direction he is really confident about.
---

@MrNintendo1213 posted...

I really wanted to see a full scene of those two getting to talk to eachother. Like a big dialogue in Bruce's mind where they have a big argument and hate eachother and wont agree at first but slowly come to terms with eachother. Maybe they laugh at Thor together. And they get mad when they compare and realize that Thor told both of them that he prefers them and not the other one. I really was hoping they would come to an agreement where Hulk gets control half the time but he has to tone down the anger, and Bruce gets half the time.

sorry but this sounds cringe as hell
---

sktgamer_13dude posted...

Shablagoo posted...

Is he the most powerful? Isnt Captain Marvel, now?

Regardless, theyre pretty inconsistent with power levels. One example being in Endgame when past-Thanos without the Infinity Gauntlet manages to hold off Iron Man, Thor, and Cap, AND even Captain Marvel for a while.

Its like Thanos is incredibly strong or something.

And like, Captain Marvel almost beat Thanos WITH the infinity Gauntlet, this post isn't being super fair. and that Thanos and Captain Marvel legit only dealt with each other, like, once, and that was at the very end, when Thanos had already gotten the Gauntlet

MrNintendo1213 posted...

. I just don't like calling Jane Foster Thor. That is his name, not a title. If she needs a super name find something else. Or just call her Jane.

I've always thought this was a weird complaint. Like yeah, it's his name and not something we'd normally see as a title. But Marvel decided that it is a title and that's that.

Obviously you can think it's a dumb title but it's struck me as a weird issue lots of people are willing to die on.
---

Maze_ posted...

If you say so

Thor's MCU arc is one the most nonsensical and worst written things in the entire MCU.

Imagine actually believing this lmfao
---

AlecSkorpio posted...

Maze_ posted...

If you say so

Thor's MCU arc is one the most nonsensical and worst written things in the entire MCU.

Imagine actually believing this lmfao

I don't have to imagine since it's true

PrideOfLion posted...

LightningAce11 posted...

And yet, in his 10,000 year lifetime he never experienced anything like this before?

I mean tbf the whole concept of long lived races is something people struggle to write.
Thor is supposed to be around 1500 year old in Infinity War, which at best takes place 10 years after the first Thor. Even accounting for him rounding up when talking to Rocket, he had to have been at least 1400 years old in the first movie when his dad took his powers and abandoned him on Earth. All of a week is what it took for him to learn to stop being so arrogant?
Doesn't really make sense outside of it being comic book movie where we just accept that as ok.

Not really.

Being old doesn't mean you can't have character development happen quickly over time

Those 1,500 years were mostly Thor goofing around, fighting idiots and drinking

Think about it, it's like saying "This guy is 48 years old and yet you're saying he changed on the day he was kidnapped and tortured!?"

There's even an (Unsubstantiated) theory that Thanos didn't act until Odin was dying which helps explain why things escalated
---

BLAKUboy posted...

LightningAce11 posted...

And yet, in his 10,000 year lifetime he never experienced anything like this before?

Losing Mjolnir? Having his home obliterated? Losing what little family he had left and half of his entire race? Feeling solely responsible for half the universe's population just fucking vanishing? Most of that happening in the span of like a day? No, I'm pretty sure that's never happened before.

This.

Imagine thinking Thor was poorly written.

Lord forbid a narcissist realized hes not hot shit in the most extreme way possible and acts appropriately.
---

cuttin_in_farm posted...

Imagine thinking Thor was poorly written.

He really really was across the whole MCU

Just look at his character arc:

So he's a 1,500 year old God who is oafish and craves war + ale.

Comes to Earth, has a punch up, is humbled, falls in love with a female human, stops craving war and tempers his violent rage with maturity.

Then he comes back to Earth , has another punch up, insults the humans for being tiny and petty despite bringing the fight to their planet twice.

Then he takes Loki and the Stone for " safe keeping " on Asgard but ultimately losses both

Then Loki takes over Asgard and it seems to prosper. Thor stops him. His sister turns up and kicks his ass + breaks his hammer

Helpless powerless Thor is then humbled again as he tries to save his home. Only to learn that the power was in him the whole time and he never needed the hammer.

Also that home is people, not places so he sacrifices Asgard to save the people

Then Thanos immediately turns up and kills half his people. Thor decides he is powerless until he gets a new hammer. (wut)

Thor gets a new hammer but is having emotional problems dealing with loss and failure

Thor attacks and defeats Thanos but doesn't go for the head for some reason so Thanos wins anyway.

Thor becomes fat and depressed, is convinced to help but just gets in the way. His mom tells him to stop trying to be a leader... which he wasn't doing anyway.... But he always wanted to be one for 1500 years.

Then Thor gets hid hammer back so now with 2 weapons is more powerful than ever despite the power being within him not the hammer

Thor asks to use the gauntlet and they tell him to fuck off.

Then fat Thor does nothing while Iron Man saves the universe

Then he abandons his people/Jane leaving them to be run by a former slaver who is completely out of touch with their society and goes off with Rocket Raccoon bumming around in space...

What the hell kind of character progression is that?

Sure you take random scenes and praise small details but taken as a whole, it's one of the worst character arcs in all of cinema history. It's all over the place and inconsistent. Nothing he does previously is reflected in his development and flat out contradicts it
---

Maze_ posted...

it's one of the worst character arcs in all of cinema history.

:/
---

Maze_ posted...

What the hell kind of character progression is that?

Sure you take random scenes and praise small details but taken as a whole, it's one of the worst character arcs in all of cinema history. It's all over the place and inconsistent. Nothing he does previously is reflected in his development and flat out contradicts it

Thor never learns much, in actuality. At least not what Thor thinks he learns. He still thinks hes above humans after Thor 1. He needs the Avengers to teach him that. He never really thinks hes beneath anyone though because hes worthy. Thats why he gets worried when Cap nudges the hammer, and tries to sweep Vision casually lifting it under the rug. Hes defined himself by being this all powerful guy. His personality from Thor 1-Age of Ultron is the same. Just altered priorities here and there.

However, he still views himself as hot shit. That is consistent until Infinity War. In Thor 3, he realizes he relied on the crutch of his hammer when Hela appears. He gets embarrassed (again) throughout the movie.

Lokis reign was not prosperous. The other realms were increasing in tension. And Thor prevents Sutr or whatever from getthis plan going early. But Thor assumed he could stop Ragnarok. Fast forward to him getting his ass kicked despite being the God of Not Hammers. Thor spins it to fit his narrative. Oh! Im not suppose to stop Ragnarok. I gotta cause it! Of course!

This is his arrogance and pride again. He just got a mental power boost, and Hela is still rocking him. Thor was forced to flee. Thats not a win. But hes too far up his own ass to acknowledge that.

Thanos comes. Kills Heimdal and Loki. And half of Asgard, the people. Thor is running out of justifications at this point. He did not save Asgard the place, or the people. Discovering he didnt need his hammer made him still go 0-2 in his next two fights. Jane dumped him as salt in the wound ig. The only thing left in his mind is that he never loses (he does. He just always moves the goal posts instead).

Needing Stormbreaker doesnt reverse his development in Ragnarok. It just means going up against fucking infinity stones unarmed when Thor is predominantly a weapon user is stupid. Thor just migrated from I can weild Mjonir, so Im badass to Im badass.

This mindset hits a brickwall when he had Thanos on the ropes just to fuck it up because he wanted to gloat. Mr. badass realizes very quickly that he failed AGAIN and this time half the universe is wiped.

On edge, he tries again when Captain Marvel is recruited, realizes theres no reversing, and FINALLY Thor has to admit he fucked up. Something he hasnt done to this point.

He avoids responsibility out of fear in Endgame, but still kinda wants a chance at redemption. When the time comes, he chickens out. Especially when thrown into a past failure with his mom. Mom gives speech not about leadership. But that failing at what you think you should be (Thors Im badass persona) is normal, and to focus on what he actually is (Which Thor is trying to find currently with the Guardians). He discovers hes still worthy, and has the mental space to confront Thanos again. Hes still out of shape though, so no Wakanda Thor.

Seems consistent to me. Unlike Tony or Steve, his arc isnt done.
---