Current Events > Wtf at Lilith in the Bible...shouldn't she be a woman power symbol now?

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Squall28
06/15/19 9:17:16 AM
#1:


In the Book of Lillith (one of the apocryphal books of the Bible) she was Adam's first wife but refused God's word of male dominance and proved it by being on "top" during intercourse. She was banished from the Garden of Eden and was taken in by Satan-el to be one of his many wives.
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pegusus123456
06/15/19 9:19:13 AM
#2:


It's relatively common for her to be used as a feminist thing, I think.

The "mother of demons" thing is just a lot more common.
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KILBOTz
06/15/19 9:24:27 AM
#3:


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilith_Fair

Already is.

And I dont think there is an apocryphal book of Lilith. At least I dont remember it ever being mentioned at Gonzaga when we went through biblical canon and non-canon.
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Shablagoo
06/15/19 9:27:49 AM
#4:


KILBOTz posted...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilith_Fair

Already is.

And I dont think there is an apocryphal book of Lilith. At least I dont remember it ever being mentioned at Gonzaga when we went through biblical canon and non-canon.

From my understanding she was in the apocryphal version of Genesis, which has been edited down to what we see in most Bibles today.
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On_The_Edge
06/15/19 10:17:46 AM
#5:


Lilith is not in the Bible
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EnterTheTekken
06/15/19 10:29:20 AM
#6:


So was Lillith demonized to curb the appeal of women being independent and singular?
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Smashingpmkns
06/15/19 10:31:34 AM
#7:


God is so lame lol
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Turbam
06/15/19 10:42:51 AM
#8:


Wait...Adam remarried?!?
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JlM
06/15/19 10:43:16 AM
#9:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJ3Y2tt3kGA" data-time="

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The Admiral
06/15/19 10:44:33 AM
#10:


Squall28 posted...
In the Book of Lillith (one of the apocryphal books of the Bible)


That's not part of the Bible.
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Doe
06/15/19 10:48:23 AM
#11:


You can't just say what "is" or "is not" a part of the Bible. It's not like God came down and gave a concrete list of books. The Bible's been constructed from various gospels floating around and voted on by a council of geezers. Revelations is still sketchy
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ZEROWOLF
06/15/19 11:02:10 AM
#12:


On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?
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EbonTitanium
06/15/19 11:19:29 AM
#13:


ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

God didn't write the Bible and gave it to people. Humans wrote the Bible.
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KILBOTz
06/15/19 11:47:26 AM
#14:


ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?


Source that suggests your claim is more than likely please. That seems like a pulled from the ass sort of claim.
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Solar_Crimson
06/15/19 11:48:58 AM
#15:


EnterTheTekken posted...
So was Lillith demonized to curb the appeal of women being independent and singular?

Yes. They wanted to show that men were to be the dominant gender.
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Zikten
06/15/19 11:52:30 AM
#16:


KILBOTz posted...
Source that suggests your claim is more than likely please. That seems like a pulled from the ass sort of claim.


before the Nicene council, there was many different beliefs in Christianity. and many different books of the bible that were followed. the council nailed down one specific doctrine. basically before that, there was a bunch of different versions of Christianity. it's possible some people believed in Lilith

the major thing that was debated was the nature of Jesus. some people said he was just a man, like Muhammed. some people said he was a spirit being that was never actually human or even physical. like a ghost. and some people said he was a human body with a god soul. and that's the side that won the council
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DirkDiggles
06/15/19 11:54:08 AM
#17:


Turbam posted...
Wait...Adam remarried?!?


Yeah, to his rib.
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BillyKidd
06/15/19 11:59:22 AM
#18:


Lilith isn't in the Bible. She is a creation of satire founded in the book, The Alphabet of Ben Sira.
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Zikten
06/15/19 12:03:48 PM
#19:


she;s only not in the bible cause it was decided what to put in by humans. what if they got it wrong? it's all just based on their opinions

and I am sure some ancient people believed in her
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Megaman50100
06/15/19 12:08:36 PM
#20:


The canon does say that God first created mankind, male and female, and then created eve later when no suitable helper was found for Adam.
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HylianFox
06/15/19 12:26:24 PM
#21:


On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible

She kind of is.

Genesis states that God created mankind "Male and female" out of the earth, but then later says that man should not be alone and makes a woman out of his rib.

So what happened to the first woman?
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DarkChozoGhost
06/15/19 12:30:02 PM
#22:


Zikten posted...
she;s only not in the bible cause it was decided what to put in by humans. what if they got it wrong? it's all just based on their opinions

and I am sure some ancient people believed in her

For starters, she was never in the bible.

Secondly, the bible is based on faith. To believe in the bible, you have to believe that those councils were guided by God's hand to perfectly compile everything that belonged, and nothing that didn't. If the bible isn't 100% perfect, then there is no validity to any of it, no basis for faith.
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Blitz4532
06/15/19 12:30:21 PM
#23:


HylianFox posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible

She kind of is.

Genesis states that God created mankind "Male and female" out of the earth, but then later says that man should not be alone and makes a woman out of his rib.

So what happened to the first woman?

I believe she transitioned and now goes by "Steve".
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Tyranthraxus
06/15/19 12:31:03 PM
#24:


The Bible is a specific set of canonized books. Lilith existed in the source material that was cut up to make the Bible but isn't in the Bible herself.

There's also two different contradictory creation stories in Genesis so I wouldn't take a single line out of it as evidence of Lilith. She's Mara Jade material.
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Esrac
06/15/19 12:32:19 PM
#25:


Solar_Crimson posted...
EnterTheTekken posted...
So was Lillith demonized to curb the appeal of women being independent and singular?

Yes. They wanted to show that men were to be the dominant gender.


Just another way the Bible reflects reality.
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Tupacrulez
06/15/19 12:34:42 PM
#26:


DarkChozoGhost posted...
Zikten posted...
she;s only not in the bible cause it was decided what to put in by humans. what if they got it wrong? it's all just based on their opinions

and I am sure some ancient people believed in her

For starters, she was never in the bible.

Secondly, the bible is based on faith. To believe in the bible, you have to believe that those councils were guided by God's hand to perfectly compile everything that belonged, and nothing that didn't. If the bible isn't 100% perfect, then there is no validity to any of it, no basis for faith.


DING DING DING!
Its like that's the only rational thought!
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UnfairRepresent
06/15/19 12:35:01 PM
#27:


This is why they called Fraisers Cold Girlfriend Lilith in Cheers.

It was supposed to be a throwaway gag but the actress did so well that they brought her back as a regular.
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Zikten
06/15/19 12:35:45 PM
#28:


I'm not gonna mock beliefs but....you can't say something is based on faith and then call that the rational thought. you can believe that God guided their hand as they set up the bible. but that's not a rational thing. it's a faith thing
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HylianFox
06/15/19 12:37:08 PM
#29:


Squall28 posted...
she was Adam's first wife but refused God's word of male dominance and proved it by being on "top" during intercourse. She was banished from the Garden of Eden and was taken in by Satan-el to be one of his many wives.

the way I heard it was because Lilith was made out of the earth at the same time as Adam, she was his equal in every way

Adam didn't like that, and ordered her to be banished

God then made Eve out of Adam's side/rib, which made her subservient to him
This is also why Adam is thrilled at Eve being "bone of my bone, and flesh of my flesh"
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Zikten
06/15/19 12:38:10 PM
#30:


HylianFox posted...
the way I heard it was because she was made out of the earth at the same time as Adam, she was his equal in every w

interesting. never heard this part.
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DarkChozoGhost
06/15/19 12:40:03 PM
#31:


Zikten posted...
you can believe that God guided their hand as they set up the bible

And you have to for any of the bible to have any validity at all
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HylianFox
06/15/19 12:42:15 PM
#32:


I've always been fascinated by apocryphal stuff that didn't quite "make it" into the Bible
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Tupacrulez
06/15/19 12:42:55 PM
#33:


Zikten posted...
I'm not gonna mock beliefs but....you can't say something is based on faith and then call that the rational thought. you can believe that God guided their hand as they set up the bible. but that's not a rational thing. it's a faith thing


I formatted my post poorly.

I should have bolded the part where you said it wasn't valid unless you totally suspended disbelief.

Because you'd have to be a loon to suspend THAT much disbelief. The only rational thought is, "none of it has any validity"
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Shablagoo
06/15/19 12:45:14 PM
#34:


BillyKidd posted...
Lilith isn't in the Bible. She is a creation of satire founded in the book, The Alphabet of Ben Sira.

How related is that to The Wisdom of Ben Sira?
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QuantumTheory
06/15/19 12:58:27 PM
#35:


Zikten posted...
KILBOTz posted...
Source that suggests your claim is more than likely please. That seems like a pulled from the ass sort of claim.


before the Nicene council, there was many different beliefs in Christianity. and many different books of the bible that were followed. the council nailed down one specific doctrine. basically before that, there was a bunch of different versions of Christianity. it's possible some people believed in Lilith

the major thing that was debated was the nature of Jesus. some people said he was just a man, like Muhammed. some people said he was a spirit being that was never actually human or even physical. like a ghost. and some people said he was a human body with a god soul. and that's the side that won the council


What?
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Dathrowed1
06/15/19 12:59:38 PM
#36:


ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

It wasn't, the Nicene councils weren't to decide bible canon
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AwesomeOSauce
06/15/19 1:00:41 PM
#37:


Lilith had 3 sisters. Samael was Lilith's brother. Seduced Eve and Lilith Seduced Adam. They were fallen angels or as christians refer to them "demons" Neither of them wanted to be slaves to YHVH so they followed Lucifer which only wanted absolute free will and knowledge.
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Geist des Durcheinan
06/15/19 1:17:50 PM
#39:


I can't tell if people are talking about this as if it's real or not...
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spudger
06/15/19 1:20:42 PM
#40:


this topic just proves the bible is bullshit
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ZEROWOLF
06/15/19 1:27:43 PM
#41:


Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

It wasn't, the Nicene councils weren't to decide bible canon


You're right. It was the Council of Trent that discussed and set bible canon. It stemmed from the Nicene councils.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_Trent
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Dathrowed1
06/15/19 1:39:56 PM
#42:


ZEROWOLF posted...
Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

It wasn't, the Nicene councils weren't to decide bible canon


You're right. It was the Council of Trent that discussed and set bible canon. It stemmed from the Nicene councils.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_Trent

That council happened way after the bible canon was confirmed
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Umbreon
06/15/19 1:39:58 PM
#43:


I imagone certain types don't like the whole "Woman taking charge" thing.

Which is a shame, because a confident and dominant woman can be damn hot.
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Paragon21XX
06/15/19 1:43:28 PM
#44:


spudger posted...
this topic just proves the bible is bullshit

lolwut
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EbonTitanium
06/15/19 1:43:53 PM
#45:


ZEROWOLF posted...
Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

It wasn't, the Nicene councils weren't to decide bible canon


You're right. It was the Council of Trent that discussed and set bible canon. It stemmed from the Nicene councils.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_Trent

The Nicene council goal was to decide "what Jesus was".
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Letron_James
06/15/19 1:47:57 PM
#46:


And worst of all she went on to act in Two and a Half men.
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ZEROWOLF
06/15/19 2:06:15 PM
#47:


Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

It wasn't, the Nicene councils weren't to decide bible canon


You're right. It was the Council of Trent that discussed and set bible canon. It stemmed from the Nicene councils.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_Trent

That council happened way after the bible canon was confirmed


So they had to reconvene to set canon that was already established? Like I said; man made doctrine. The bible is completely different than what was originally intended, if it had any meaning at all. And yes the Nicene councils were to establish the divinity of Jesus but isn't it the least bit curious that it took all those years later to come up with this idea. Shouldn't it have been obvious from the get go? The whole thing makes little sense as well. So jesus is God and he sacrificed himself for himself unto himself? And for what? His little stunt didn't work at all. Epic fail.
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loafy013
06/15/19 2:18:06 PM
#48:


Zikten posted...
HylianFox posted...
the way I heard it was because she was made out of the earth at the same time as Adam, she was his equal in every w

interesting. never heard this part.

Version i remember reading comes from the sandman comic books. God first created one being, then separated them into Adam and Lilith, hence why Lilith felt she should be adam's equal. Adam had a bitch fit and got her kicked out. God then made a separate woman, but Adam saw her being formed from the inside out and was repulsed by the thought of her, so she left the garden a virgin. After that is when Adam was put to sleep, had his rib turned into Eve, and that is the version in the bible, only it refers to her as his first wife and not his third.
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Dathrowed1
06/15/19 2:19:35 PM
#49:


ZEROWOLF posted...
Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
Dathrowed1 posted...
ZEROWOLF posted...
On_The_Edge posted...
Lilith is not in the Bible


More than likely it was taken out of canon at one of the Nicene councils which makes you wonder; Are you really following the word of God or some made up man-made doctrine?

It wasn't, the Nicene councils weren't to decide bible canon


You're right. It was the Council of Trent that discussed and set bible canon. It stemmed from the Nicene councils.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_of_Trent

That council happened way after the bible canon was confirmed


So they had to reconvene to set canon that was already established? Like I said; man made doctrine. The bible is completely different than what was originally intended, if it had any meaning at all. And yes the Nicene councils were to establish the divinity of Jesus but isn't it the least bit curious that it took all those years later to come up with this idea. Shouldn't it have been obvious from the get go? The whole thing makes little sense as well. So jesus is God and he sacrificed himself for himself unto himself? And for what? His little stunt didn't work at all. Epic fail.

Yes the Nicene councils were to decide pretty much that canonicity of the Trinity within Christendom which I don't think the bible actually presents
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EnterTheTekken
06/15/19 2:30:42 PM
#50:


So if a woman pegs a man, is she invoking the true spirit of Lilith?
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Zikten
06/15/19 2:59:10 PM
#51:


QuantumTheory posted...
Zikten posted...
KILBOTz posted...
Source that suggests your claim is more than likely please. That seems like a pulled from the ass sort of claim.


before the Nicene council, there was many different beliefs in Christianity. and many different books of the bible that were followed. the council nailed down one specific doctrine. basically before that, there was a bunch of different versions of Christianity. it's possible some people believed in Lilith

the major thing that was debated was the nature of Jesus. some people said he was just a man, like Muhammed. some people said he was a spirit being that was never actually human or even physical. like a ghost. and some people said he was a human body with a god soul. and that's the side that won the council


What?

yea. in early Christianity, the actual beliefs were not yet ironed out. and there were some debates on what Jesus actually was. the popular concept everyone treats as obvious now, was not what every single person agreed on back then.
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