Current Events > Man, FUCK Disney! My headcanon is Dark Forces/Jedi Knight occurs after Episode 6

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NeonOctopus
05/29/19 7:42:56 PM
#1:


with Kyle Katarn being the main protagonist

VRcYci9
wVbAhYj
https://imgur.com/SXHuXze

Also fuck Disney for killing Star Wars games and never giving us games like this again unless Fallen Order happens to be good >_>
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NeonOctopus
05/30/19 6:32:50 AM
#2:


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fan357
05/30/19 6:59:04 AM
#3:


Isnt Darth Vader in the original Dark Forces?
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NeonOctopus
05/30/19 7:00:10 AM
#4:


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rabbi_baby
05/30/19 7:03:40 AM
#5:


NeonOctopus posted...
fan357 posted...
Isnt Darth Vader in the original Dark Forces?

Yep

For like 5 seconds in 2 cutscreens tho
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NeonOctopus
05/30/19 7:13:48 AM
#6:


rabbi_baby posted...
NeonOctopus posted...
fan357 posted...
Isnt Darth Vader in the original Dark Forces?

Yep

For like 5 seconds in 2 cutscreens tho

Just like Rogue One
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OctilIery
05/30/19 7:17:05 AM
#7:


ok, lets be honest here. Dark Forces/Jedi Knight had some cool characters but not a lot of depth to its stories, and while there were a few great EU stories, the vast majority was bad. Plus, EU post Disney has been extremely high quality. Way better than what we had before.
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CyricZ
05/30/19 7:24:29 AM
#8:


To be honest, Kyle Katarn is a product of the 90s action heroes. Yes, he's awesome and a meme and his beard is so badass it conceals a fist holding a Bryar Pistol, but there's very little to him apart from his ability to deal death and destruction.

The games are awesome, and you can still play them, but I really don't see a place for him in the new canon, or at least certainly not as he is known.

Also Dark Forces takes place after the Battle of Yavin (with the first mission being a prelude to Yavin). Jedi Knight is like shortly after Endor, and then Outcast is several years later (after the Academy has been established), and Jedi Academy is later still.
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Gobstoppers12
05/30/19 7:31:31 AM
#9:


the EU was an ever-expanding mass of bad content and convoluted retcons.
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Chicken
05/30/19 7:32:21 AM
#10:


Imagine getting upset over star wars fanfiction lmao
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OctilIery
05/30/19 7:34:26 AM
#11:


Chicken posted...
Imagine getting upset over star wars fanfiction lmao

It isn't fanfiction though.
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Chicken
05/30/19 7:35:55 AM
#12:


OctilIery posted...
Chicken posted...
Imagine getting upset over star wars fanfiction lmao

It isn't fanfiction though.

From my understanding anything EU from pre-disney is now considered non-canon, making it nothing more than fanfiction.
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OctilIery
05/30/19 7:39:15 AM
#13:


Chicken posted...
OctilIery posted...
Chicken posted...
Imagine getting upset over star wars fanfiction lmao

It isn't fanfiction though.

From my understanding anything EU from pre-disney is now considered non-canon, making it nothing more than fanfiction.

Retconned isn't the same as fanfiction.
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Murphiroth
05/30/19 8:51:53 AM
#14:


Chicken posted...
OctilIery posted...
Chicken posted...
Imagine getting upset over star wars fanfiction lmao

It isn't fanfiction though.

From my understanding anything EU from pre-disney is now considered non-canon, making it nothing more than fanfiction.


It's non-canon in that it's now essentially an alternate universe, so less fanfiction and more like Ultimate Marvel.
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eston
05/30/19 8:55:44 AM
#15:


I thought the EU was always considered non-canon, that's what made it the EU
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Doom_Art
05/30/19 8:59:09 AM
#16:


eston posted...
I thought the EU was always considered non-canon, that's what made it the EU

IIRC LucasArts used to operate the canon under a tier system

So the films would be the highest tier, then the TV shows or stuff like Force Unleashed, then the EU

So essentially stuff from the EU was "canon" assuming it didn't contradict anything in higher tiers
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Murphiroth
05/30/19 9:02:37 AM
#17:


Doom_Art posted...
eston posted...
I thought the EU was always considered non-canon, that's what made it the EU

IIRC LucasArts used to operate the canon under a tier system

So the films would be the highest tier, then the TV shows or stuff like Force Unleashed, then the EU

So essentially stuff from the EU was "canon" assuming it didn't contradict anything in higher tiers


This is correct.

Movies were G(eorge) tier and superseded everything else, TCW was on the same tier IIRC, then came stuff like TFU that George at least had some hand in, then the books.
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DevsBro
05/30/19 9:07:19 AM
#18:


NeonOctopus posted...
rabbi_baby posted...
NeonOctopus posted...
fan357 posted...
Isnt Darth Vader in the original Dark Forces?

Yep

For like 5 seconds in 2 cutscreens tho

Just like Rogue One

The Vader/Krennek scene was the one major flaw in RO tbh. Not just because he made a stupid joke, but mostly because it adds nothing whatsoever to the film. Vader already had a short scene that estsblished him as a character who is going to appear later, and he
just tells Krennek the same spiel Tarkin does and tries to mimic his OT body language with no regard to his own dialog. It was a mess of a scene.
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#19
Post #19 was unavailable or deleted.
CyricZ
05/30/19 10:11:09 AM
#20:


Doom_Art posted...
So the films would be the highest tier, then the TV shows or stuff like Force Unleashed, then the EU

Games were EU. Doesn't matter if they were Yoda Stories or Shadows of the Empire (which Lucas had a lot of input in), they were still EU. Force Unleashed included.

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Canon

If you feel like delving into that pile.

But basically the old setup was as follows:

G-Canon - The six movies at the time and whatever George says.

T- Canon - TV Shows, which was just Clone Wars at the time.

C-Canon - The massive bulk of the EU. Books, comics, games, etc.

S-Canon - "Secondary" canon. This is mostly for older stuff that was C-Canon but gets filed here if a future work ignores it, like the old Marvel Star Wars comics.

D-Canon - Specifically made for the 2013 Star Wars "Detours", which was a humorous (I guess?) TV series where characters did non-canon stuff.

Non-Canon - Infinities and works that explicitly state they're non-canon.
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CyricZ
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CyricZ
05/30/19 10:12:43 AM
#21:


DevsBro posted...
The Vader/Krennek scene was the one major flaw in RO tbh. Not just because he made a stupid joke, but mostly because it adds nothing whatsoever to the film. Vader already had a short scene that estsblished him as a character who is going to appear later, and he
just tells Krennek the same spiel Tarkin does and tries to mimic his OT body language with no regard to his own dialog. It was a mess of a scene.

Oh shit. Imagine that Vader doesn't show up for the entire movie until that final scene. I feel like everyone would have lost their shit even more.
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CyricZ
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DevsBro
05/30/19 10:30:07 AM
#22:


CyricZ posted...
DevsBro posted...
The Vader/Krennek scene was the one major flaw in RO tbh. Not just because he made a stupid joke, but mostly because it adds nothing whatsoever to the film. Vader already had a short scene that estsblished him as a character who is going to appear later, and he
just tells Krennek the same spiel Tarkin does and tries to mimic his OT body language with no regard to his own dialog. It was a mess of a scene.

Oh shit. Imagine that Vader doesn't show up for the entire movie until that final scene. I feel like everyone would have lost their shit even more.

Except for the scene where he's in the tank. They can keep that one.
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Skye Reynolds
05/30/19 10:57:04 AM
#23:


Star Wars is a movie series. If it doesn't happen in a live action film, it doesn't count.
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Murphiroth
05/30/19 11:00:27 AM
#24:


Skye Reynolds posted...
Star Wars is a movie series. If it doesn't happen in a live action film, it doesn't count.


Incorrect. Star Wars is a multimedia franchise.
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Skye Reynolds
05/30/19 11:03:43 AM
#25:


Murphiroth posted...
Skye Reynolds posted...
Star Wars is a movie series. If it doesn't happen in a live action film, it doesn't count.


Incorrect. Star Wars is a multimedia franchise.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPcod8IS214" data-time="
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GeneralKenobi85
05/30/19 11:10:50 AM
#26:


I do wish Kyle Katarn could have been made canon somehow, but I think Cyric is ultimately right. He certainly doesn't work in the new canon.

Hopefully Fallen Order will take some inspiration from the Jedi Knight series at least.
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NeonOctopus
05/30/19 11:29:05 AM
#27:


Skye Reynolds posted...
Star Wars is a movie series. If it doesn't happen in a live action film, it doesn't count.

Jedi Knight is a live action game lol
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NeonOctopus
05/30/19 11:49:51 AM
#28:


GeneralKenobi85 posted...
He certainly doesn't work in the new canon.

Cuz the new canon is trash lolololololololol
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The_Ivory_Man
05/30/19 1:58:04 PM
#29:


CyricZ posted...
To be honest, Kyle Katarn is a product of the 90s action heroes. Yes, he's awesome and a meme and his beard is so badass it conceals a fist holding a Bryar Pistol, but there's very little to him apart from his ability to deal death and destruction.

The games are awesome, and you can still play them, but I really don't see a place for him in the new canon, or at least certainly not as he is known.

Also Dark Forces takes place after the Battle of Yavin (with the first mission being a prelude to Yavin). Jedi Knight is like shortly after Endor, and then Outcast is several years later (after the Academy has been established), and Jedi Academy is later still.


Katarn definitely has enough development over the course of his lifespan to use him again.

He rips a lot from Han originally, but turns more unique with his flawed view of the force, his fall, cutting himself off, and then getting on point after lessons from Luke.

I actually wish Finn had taken more from him.
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RebelElite791
05/30/19 1:59:30 PM
#30:


Fanfiction nonsense lmao.
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NeonOctopus
05/31/19 11:25:10 AM
#31:


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rabbi_baby
05/31/19 12:11:27 PM
#32:


On a quick side note: I remember going to a local store to pick up the boxxed copy of dark forces when I was a kid. My mom tried to take it away from me because she didn'trealizee it was a star wars game, and thought it was "one of those demonic games". I should still have the disks in a box somewhere.
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HBOSS
05/31/19 12:32:58 PM
#33:


my heart wouldve lept if Dash Rendar, the Outrider, and the Azzameen/Viraxo were seen or mentioned in Rogue One.
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NeonOctopus
05/31/19 12:37:13 PM
#34:


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CyricZ
05/31/19 12:56:01 PM
#35:


DevsBro posted...
CyricZ posted...
DevsBro posted...
The Vader/Krennek scene was the one major flaw in RO tbh. Not just because he made a stupid joke, but mostly because it adds nothing whatsoever to the film. Vader already had a short scene that estsblished him as a character who is going to appear later, and he
just tells Krennek the same spiel Tarkin does and tries to mimic his OT body language with no regard to his own dialog. It was a mess of a scene.

Oh shit. Imagine that Vader doesn't show up for the entire movie until that final scene. I feel like everyone would have lost their shit even more.

Except for the scene where he's in the tank. They can keep that one.

Well the only reason that was there was to be a prelude to the rest of the Mustafar scene. I honestly think we can do without.
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CyricZ
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CyricZ
05/31/19 1:06:37 PM
#36:


NeonOctopus posted...
Wasn't the Outrider in Rogue One as a cameo?

Not according to the 'Pedia.

There was a YT-2400 in Rebels, though.

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Sato%27s_Hammer
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CyricZ
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NeonOctopus
05/31/19 2:17:09 PM
#37:


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Trelve
05/31/19 2:37:19 PM
#38:


They should have adapted the Heir to the Empire trilogy as episodes 7-9 instead of well...what we got.
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The_Ivory_Man
05/31/19 9:03:01 PM
#39:


rabbi_baby posted...
On a quick side note: I remember going to a local store to pick up the boxxed copy of dark forces when I was a kid. My mom tried to take it away from me because she didn'trealizee it was a star wars game, and thought it was "one of those demonic games". I should still have the disks in a box somewhere.


I mean the original is nearly Doom with a Star Wars skin really.

RebelElite791 posted...
Fanfiction nonsense lmao.


Yeah, Dark Forces is shitty.

Thank god we have the superior Disney Canon where Poe has a flatulence party at a friend's wedding.
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Anteaterking
05/31/19 9:08:52 PM
#40:


Chicken posted...
From my understanding anything EU from pre-disney is now considered non-canon, making it nothing more than fanfiction.


I know that some people are just trolling when they say stuff like this, but calling officially licensed novels, etc. "fan fiction" really is stretching the use of the term.
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The_Ivory_Man
05/31/19 10:48:20 PM
#41:


Anteaterking posted...
Chicken posted...
From my understanding anything EU from pre-disney is now considered non-canon, making it nothing more than fanfiction.


I know that some people are just trolling when they say stuff like this, but calling officially licensed novels, etc. "fan fiction" really is stretching the use of the term.


Not to mention Disney started to continue the old EU continuity now, with Star Wars #108

So it's not even arguably "non-canon" anymore when new content is releasing for it.
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