Current Events > Smash Bros Melee is carried by it's community

(+) Yeah! (+)

the game itself did not age well

The game has so few characters, and even fewer characters even worth playing. It also looks and sounds like ass.
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Imagine being so insanely stuck in the past as Melee players, and having your minority group be so vocal that it still gets this game a spot in Evo. I don't see Marvel VS Capcom fans saying that MvC2 needs a spot at Evo. Not that they're nearly as vocal as Melee players are anyway...
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it has like 5 playable characters

marth, falco, fox, jigglypuff, peach

I haven't played Melee since before Brawl released but I assume it's still fun.

Smash 4 somehow failed to be better than both Melee and Brawl despite its great roster. And I say that as a casual player. Of course part of it may just be that I don't care for Smash anymore.
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I still think it's a really fun game to play with your friends. At a less competitive level of play, I'd say a much larger portion of the cast is viable.
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If you wanna see a pro melee player have an existential crisis, just turn items on.
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Kisai posted...

Imagine being so insanely stuck in the past as Melee players, and having your minority group be so vocal that it still gets this game a spot in Evo. I don't see Marvel VS Capcom fans saying that MvC2 needs a spot at Evo. Not that they're nearly as vocal as Melee players are anyway...

The problem is the top players became e-celebrities

and these e-celebrities are utter dogshit at every other game in existence except maybe MewtwoKing

So they have to keep the game alive to maintain their relevancy.

Mango, Armada, Hungrybox and so on all die with Melee

Even when a new game is released where everyone has the same amount of time to play it, these guys get bodied.

Comparatively, Zero is good at games in general.

He beat the highest ranking Mario Tennis Aces player in the world.
He won both Smash 4 and Smash 5 E3 Tournaments despite only playing each game for only a day.
If you go to his youtube channel, he's actually great at every game he plays.

Mango on the other hand is garbage, gets bodied by literal Clint Stevens when they play games together.

Milkman5 posted...

it has like 5 playable characters

marth, falco, fox, jigglypuff, peach

This is only the case if you're playing competitively. And even then there are plenty of other viable characters that you chose to ignore.
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That's every game
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Carried by it is community?

The hell does that mean?
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/apostrophe
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Super Smash Bros Melee is community by its carried
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Zack_Attackv1 posted...

Carried by it is community?

The hell does that mean?
http://theoatmeal.com/comics/apostrophe

you know what I meant, fam

Milkman5 posted...

it has like 5 playable characters

marth, falco, fox, jigglypuff, peach

yeah if you forget sheik, falcon, pikachu, IC's, samus, luigi and yoshi
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I forgot sheik. The others are bad and don't place

Milkman5 posted...

and these e-celebrities are utter dogshit at every other game in existence except maybe MewtwoKing

leffen is literally a top level dbzf player loool
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Milkman5 posted...

the game itself did not age well

Not true
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Milkman5 posted...

I forgot sheik. The others are bad and don't place

top ten players use yoshi/pika/falcon and as a result those characters regularly top 8

Samus isn't used regularly by top 10 players but HugS and Duck also do well anyway so

*same applies to Icies, though they're more sporadic in their rep/peak rep
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Milkman5 posted...

I forgot sheik. The others are bad and don't place

i mean you said "playable"

and even so characters like falcon, IC's and pikachu are capable of making top 8, that's viable

also armada and leff did play a bit of smash 4 at the beginning and looked p dece

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQ5s_HG7Wwg" data-time="

we gonna pretend that armada and leffen, both strong neutral players, wouldn't stomp dudes in a game all about neutral?
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the last tournament a falcon won was 2005
Yoshi, Pikachu and Samus have never placed

they are not viable

recent falcon players have beaten every god except armada, and even they have come within a stock of taking a set off him

pikachu i'll give you since axe has slipped a bit as the limits of that character have become apparent
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That's bs since people bring out Falcons and Samus pretty often especially the former
If you mean like onetricking, almost nobody onetricks in Melee anyway because of matchup coverage
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Milkman5 posted...

the last tournament a falcon won was 2005
Yoshi, Pikachu and Samus have never placed

they are not viable

viability isn't determined by if a character places first

the barrier that exists to winning is determined generally by the skill of the players involved

Fox is #1 but wins very few majors solo ever at all
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I kinda agree. I still play melee mostly because my friends still play it. But its time to move on. Brawl was pretty trash imo but wasnt awful. The same kinda way DBZ replaced MvC in Evo this year, it was just a bad installment. But I dont understand why we needed Melee AND Smash 4 in Evo. Fucking pick one. Smash 4 improved a lot on Brawl, has sort of a Melee feel to it.
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WaterLink posted...

sort of a Melee feel to it.

That is not true in the very slightest. The closest 4 has to a 'melee feel' is that they gave a bunch of characters ez bake down throw combos. It is so utterly inferior to Melee. I mean it's literally played with two stocks and air is so good that edgeguarding is almost non existent. Then the DLC completely fucked the balance of the game which used to be one of the biggest appeals. Offensive options are: running up and shielding. Unless you're Bayonetta in which case you get a kill off any hit.

Melee continues to gain viewership and interest while Smash 4 died a laughable death at this EVO. For Melee to still keep gaining interest and playership with people when it's played on CRTs shows how great it is.
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smash 4 is a garbage game

i prefer brawl over it t b h
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Doe posted...

WaterLink posted...

sort of a Melee feel to it.

That is not true in the very slightest. The closest 4 has to a 'melee feel' is that they gave a bunch of characters ez bake down throw combos. It is so utterly inferior to Melee. I mean it's literally played with two stocks and air is so good that edgeguarding is almost non existent. Then the DLC completely fucked the balance of the game which used to be one of the biggest appeals. Offensive options are: running up and shielding. Unless you're Bayonetta in which case you get a kill off any hit.

Melee continues to gain viewership and interest while Smash 4 died a laughable death at this EVO. For Melee to still keep gaining interest and playership with people when it's played on CRTs shows how great it is.

It doesnt have to be played with 2 stocks. Me and my friends play with 4 stocks. Edgeguarding isnt as easy as melee where you can grab the ledge then press shield and prevent the other chacracter from grabbing the ledge. Are you saying thats a bad thing? Because personally I think the edgeguarding in Melee is kinda BS. And spectators are childish, has nothing to do with the game itself.
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Delirious_Beard posted...

i prefer brawl over it t b h

Smash 4 feels very soulless imo. Single player is really trash, I don't like how the artstyle is just 'HD,' 3DS version was a lot more appealing. The stage design is abysmal. New music isn't as good. Disappointing set of newcomers imo outside of a couple, lame cuts from Brawl. Worse items.
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Doe posted...

WaterLink posted...

sort of a Melee feel to it.

That is not true in the very slightest. The closest 4 has to a 'melee feel' is that they gave a bunch of characters ez bake down throw combos. It is so utterly inferior to Melee. I mean it's literally played with two stocks and air is so good that edgeguarding is almost non existent. Then the DLC completely fucked the balance of the game which used to be one of the biggest appeals. Offensive options are: running up and shielding. Unless you're Bayonetta in which case you get a kill off any hit.

Melee continues to gain viewership and interest while Smash 4 died a laughable death at this EVO. For Melee to still keep gaining interest and playership with people when it's played on CRTs shows how great it is.

some of this is patently untrue

-Smash 4 had the same attendance at EVO as Melee and has greater attendance at the upcoming SSC event. Viewership is the only thing that's really suffered at this point. This year has been one of the most attended years for the game and it had its two largest solo events in February and June.

-Melee's viewership seems to have stagnated, as has its attendance as of mid-year (not sure how those stats pin out a couple of months later.) Good example of this is that it's Sunday viewership this year was lower than the last Sunday it had in 2016 by about 40k or so.

Smash 4 has seen attendance growth/viewership decline while Melee, has seen both attendance and viewership stagnation. I have no doubt it will continue to live, but it likely won't grow much more and has since peaked.
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Doe posted...

Worse items.

this is an underrated aspect of why 4 sucks ass

way less interesting mix, plus absolutely stupid broken shit like Gust Bellows, Boss Galaga and the fucking beetle, which might be the worst item in the series

also this might be kind of an unpopular opinion but i don't really like assist trophies, at least in their current state where half of them are just killing machines you can do nothing about
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WaterLink posted...

It doesnt have to be played with 2 stocks. Me and my friends play with 4 stocks.

To keep pace for tournaments to not take a week, yes, it has to be played with two stocks.

You completely miss the point of edgeguarding. Smash is a series about knocking people off of the stage. Therefore, it makes perfect sense that if you're at the point to where you're firmly offstage, you should be in a massive disadvantage state. This was the case in every game before 4, even with Brawl's magnet hands off-stage was still a pretty bad situation. But that said, being offstage doesn't mean you just die; people recover all the time in Melee. It just makes sense that if you've been firmly knocked offstage or below the stage, you should be in a bad spot. If you're in the bottom corner of the screen, you shouldn't come back.

Smash 4 on the other hand, so many characters have crazy good recovery, and air dodges off stage are so good, and so many characters who had powerful options against offstage opponents had them taken away in the transition to 4 (Marth, Falco, as two examples). Recovering for most characters is much less of a disadvantage state which makes stocks last much longer. Pace actually slows when most characters are pushed offstage, which is nonsense, since that should be the most frantic and scary point as that is when people die. What was the end of a stock in Melee, is now moments of dead time as Bayonetta or Fox or Mario flies back to the ledge from the corner. Because of how weak edgeguarding is, characters who actually still have awful recoveries (Ness, Little Mac, Dr. Mario) plummet down the tier list because they're essentially given a unique and crippling weakness.
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Zero_Destroyer posted...

some of this is patently untrue

Hmm from the stats I saw said Melee had increased since their last showing, I don't have statistics or anything on hand though. In any case it has had an impressive life and has deserved it
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Delirious_Beard posted...

Boss Galaga and the fucking beetle

I think if you're low percent you can actually mash out of these guys if your fingers are fast. But assist trophies in 4 suck total ass. Ultimate letting you hit them is a fantastic change.
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Doe posted...

Zero_Destroyer posted...

some of this is patently untrue

Hmm from the stats I saw said Melee had increased since their last showing, I don't have statistics or anything on hand though. In any case it has had an impressive life and has deserved it

melee had better viewership than last year, but last year was a Saturday slot, which itself was a giant decline from 2015/2016's sunday slots

so it's really a timeslot/day issue
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WaterLink posted...

Doe posted...

WaterLink posted...

sort of a Melee feel to it.

That is not true in the very slightest. The closest 4 has to a 'melee feel' is that they gave a bunch of characters ez bake down throw combos. It is so utterly inferior to Melee. I mean it's literally played with two stocks and air is so good that edgeguarding is almost non existent. Then the DLC completely fucked the balance of the game which used to be one of the biggest appeals. Offensive options are: running up and shielding. Unless you're Bayonetta in which case you get a kill off any hit.

Melee continues to gain viewership and interest while Smash 4 died a laughable death at this EVO. For Melee to still keep gaining interest and playership with people when it's played on CRTs shows how great it is.

It doesnt have to be played with 2 stocks. Me and my friends play with 4 stocks. Edgeguarding isnt as easy as melee where you can grab the ledge then press shield and prevent the other chacracter from grabbing the ledge. Are you saying thats a bad thing? Because personally I think the edgeguarding in Melee is kinda BS. And spectators are childish, has nothing to do with the game itself.

edgeguarding is an integral part of every smash bros game prior to 4

and yes, the removal of it in smash 4 actively hurt the game. it was completely unnecessary thanks to the removal of ledge stalling by way of not refreshing invincibility by regrabbing the ledge from below

sakurai went overboard and the ledge in smash 4 is the worst it's ever been. even 64 has more interesting ledge mechanics
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To all the naysayers of 4, I present this to you:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZEchgB2Rek" data-time="
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Garioshi posted...

To all the naysayers of 4, I present this to you:

Casual Brawl and Melee are even more fun tho *shrug*
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casual smash 4 is great, and i mostly like comp smash 4

the single player is fucking awful though, I posted this a while back about it on reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/8rjwzo/a_long_plea_hoping_for_better_single_player_in/
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smash 4 single player is less desirable than some shovelware i've played btw
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know what the most underrated single player thing in the smash series is?

coin launcher

BRING IT BACK
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Doe posted...

Garioshi posted...

To all the naysayers of 4, I present this to you:

Casual Brawl and Melee are even more fun tho *shrug*

Casual Melee is trash. Brawl is superior, though, I'll admit.
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Garioshi posted...

Casual Melee is trash.

Maybe if you're too used to buffer
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i think the decision to add 8 player smash events to single player to be the most baffling thing sakurai did

what was this dude doing for most of the development process? brawl he was at least working on subspace (a huge mistake btw) but what's his excuse for the sorry state of smash 4 content-wise?
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Doe posted...

Garioshi posted...

Casual Melee is trash.

Maybe if you're too used to buffer

No, it's trash. Melee's stages are generally uninteresting and unconducive to casual play and the items are the series low. Add in the fact that Brawl's broken mechanics haven't been added in yet and you've got a very unfun casual experience.
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Delirious_Beard posted...

i think the decision to add 8 player smash events to single player to be the most baffling thing sakurai did

what was this dude doing for most of the development process? brawl he was at least working on subspace (a huge mistake btw) but what's his excuse for the sorry state of smash 4 content-wise?

Trying to make the game work for the 3DS probably took up a lot of R&D time for Smash 4.
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Garioshi posted...

the items are the series low

There's almost no shit items in Melee's list and the ones that are there are fun

Melee's stages are generally uninteresting and unconducive to casual play

Add in the fact that Brawl's broken mechanics haven't been added in yet

I'm not sure if you mean footstooling or what
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Who cares? Smash is the only fighting game anyone cares about anymore and that still pales in comparison to the days of arcades booming and fighting games being the talk of the country.

The amount of people who care about the genre altogether is dwindling so enjoy it when any fighter holds relevancy for any decent amount of time.

Garioshi posted...

Melee's stages are generally uninteresting and unconducive to casual play

?

what does that even mean? not enough garbage hazards that require you to pay more attention to the stage than what's actually going on between players?

melee has the best stage selection in the series

smash 4's is complete trash by comparison

Prestoff posted...

Trying to make the game work for the 3DS probably took up a lot of R&D time for Smash 4.

that's a good point. honestly the 3DS version should have just not happened
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Doe posted...

There's almost no shit items in Melee's list and the ones that are there are fun

Items didn't get good until Brawl. Melee's items play it way too safe.

Doe posted...

I'm not sure if you mean footstooling or what

Absurd SDI, absurd hitlag, Brawl Ganondorf in general, Brawl Falcon in general, and the introduction of tons of fantastic items and Pokemon, including rolling crates, assist trophies, the Smash Ball, and Brawl Meowth, the most broken thing in existence.
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