Current Events > Michigan court sides against Planet Fitness: 'Trans women aren't women'

(+) Yeah! (+)

A Michigan appeals court has ruled that transgender women are not women and that a former Planet Fitness customer has a legal case against the chain of gyms.

The case dates back to 2015 when Yvette Cormier saw a transgender woman whom she described as a man in the womens locker room of her Midland, Michigan Planet Fitness. She complained to management and warned other customers, which prompted the gym to cancel her membership for inappropriate and disruptive behavior. Cormier sued Planet Fitness for over $25,000 in damages, alleging that she suffered a violation of privacy, as well as embarrassment, humiliation, severe emotional distress, and damage to her reputation.

A Michigan lower court ruled against her and last year, a state court of appeals agreed that she suffered no intrusion of privacy.

But in April, the Michigan Supreme Court revived the case and sent it back to the appellate court to examine a legal question it hadnt initially considered. And this time, the panel found that Planet Fitness violated its own contract with Cormier, but the ruling requires a foundation of transphobia.

Cormier alleged that Planet Fitness misrepresented the nature of its contract when it said that she would have access to a private womens locker room but did not disclose that so, too, would men who self-identity as women. (The court conspicuously refuses to use the word transgender and repeatedly refers to transgender women with this phrase.) This inclusive policy would have affected her decision to purchase a membership and thus is relevant to her claim that Planet Fitness engaged in deceptive business practices.

Plaintiffs actions indicate that she strongly preferred a locker room and a restroom in which individuals who are assigned biologically male are not present, the court wrote, and it is thus reasonable to infer that defendants failure to inform plaintiff of the unwritten policy affected her decision to join the gym.

In other words, the court agreed with Cormiers perspective that transgender women are not women and that she never should have been expected to understand that a locker room for women would include transgender women. By not disclosing that it was taking the opposite position respecting transgender people according to their gender identity Planet Fitness was failing to reveal a material fact in an attempt to mislead or deceive the consumer, as the relevant Michigan law reads.

The decision again tosses the case back to the lower court for further examination. Cormiers lawyer hopes to win the case there without a trial, but such a victory will require the lower court to agree to erase the validity of transgender identities.

https://thinkprogress.org/michigan-court-anti-transgender-planet-fitness-ruling-11d48ac24db8/

More and more reason why Massachusetts will always be my home.
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.....So I can't say I identify as a women and then go in locker rooms and stare at titties all day scot-free? >_>
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Not even that big an issue, but sports records are getting fucked.

Let's fix those.
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Was she post op or was she flapping the feminine penis around?
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Fair as hell, and I bet that woman was seriously disturbed by a male in the womens locker room.
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NeonOctopus posted...

.....So I can't say I identify as a women and then go in locker rooms and stare at titties all day scot-free? >_>

I believe that pre-op trans women should be looked into more with this issue. Seeing a penis in a shower ... I completely understand the stigma against it, but if you are post-op, I don't see the deal.

My issue lies however, in the court outright denying trans women in general the way they did.
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Well, TC, they are correct. A simple DNA test proves it.
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seems odd that the court would choose to make such a broad ruling. they could have simply ruled that this individual trans woman was not a woman, but rather a man attempting to take advantage of the rules, as NeonOctopus jokes.
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Not a story. Women would not feel comfortable around a man in their locker room. Fair, next.
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darkjedilink posted...

Well, TC, they are correct. A simple DNA test proves it.

Nope, not that simple.

https://www.wnycstudios.org/story/dana

RiKuToTheMiGhtY posted...

Fair as hell, and I bet that woman was seriously disturbed by a male in the womens locker room.

Sometimes workers will go in to clean. I've seen women employees in the male locker room for cleaning. Though they put signs to warn when they are in there.
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Just change the locker room signs to 8=> and (i).
Problem solved.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Just change the locker room signs to 8=> and (i).
Problem solved.

Some people have both, though. It's scientifically proven. Some people even have many of each.
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That's a pointy penis >_>
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frozenshock posted...

Some people even have many of each.

I didn't know I had this fetish, until just now.

Fair, next

Complete unisex changing rooms with individual lockable stalls for changing clothes and a shared locker room for storage would fix this issue.
Place signs with directions stating "USE STALLS for changing clothes" would fix all of this non-sense.
Make sure to have Anti-peeping grates / fencing above and below the stall so no pervs can spy through the changing stalls.
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I would say disgusting but I'll get modded again
So.....
Disgusting
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did the woman in question have a penis
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Planet Fitness kinda got fucked here, since if they had sided with this woman they would be getting sued by the other party.

But this is a pretty important precedent to establish so it was more or less bound to happen sooner or later.

KillerKhan420 posted...

Not a story. Women would not feel comfortable around a man in their locker room. Fair, next.

It is in fact a story due to transgender issues being a big deal right now and the need to establish a legal precedent on things like this
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frozenshock posted...

Questionmarktarius posted...

Just change the locker room signs to 8=> and (i).
Problem solved.

Some people have both, though. It's scientifically proven. Some people even have many of each.

For the 0.01% of the population who are, they can just go where they feel they would fit in best.

In other words, these 'transgender rights' arguments are kinda a null point. For such a small population, instead of making vast rulings and laws; just have the individuals come to an agreement with others.
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eston posted...

Planet Fitness kinda got fucked here, since if they had sided with this woman they would be getting sued by the other party.

Eh, not really. There's state precedent on bathroom rights.
PF would absolutely be in their right to enforce a "anti-trans" locker room policy.
https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2017/04/transgender_student_gets_help.html
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We need coed locker rooms.
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So glad I don't own or manage a business where customers come on the premises.
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The whole problem is stupid.
The whole transphobia issue boils down to three points
1. Vaginas are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the "women's" room
2. Transgenders are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the men's room
3. Harassment/Assault are already illegal.
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DoomSwell posted...

The whole problem is stupid.
The whole transphobia issue boils down to three points
1. Vaginas are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the "women's" room
2. Transgenders are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the men's room
3. Harassment/Assault are already illegal.

1. lol@calling women "vaginas".
2. Why should their fear take precedent over the vast majority of women?
3. Criminality clearly isn't working to curb it so their fears are legitimate.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

We need coed locker rooms.

I agree, Co-ed locker rooms with many private individual changing stalls that have maximum privacy / anti-peeping / anti-busting in tech.
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DoomSwell posted...

The whole problem is stupid.
The whole transphobia issue boils down to three points
1. Vaginas are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the "women's" room
2. Transgenders are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the men's room
3. Harassment/Assault are already illegal.

A lot of parents probably don't want their daughter walking into the locker room and seeing a big ass dick flopping around
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

DoomSwell posted...

The whole problem is stupid.
The whole transphobia issue boils down to three points
1. Vaginas are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the "women's" room
2. Transgenders are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the men's room
3. Harassment/Assault are already illegal.

1. lol@calling women "vaginas".
2. Why should their fear take precedent over the vast majority of women?
3. Criminality clearly isn't working to curb it so their fears are legitimate.

1. I did it to avoid confusion between women and women.
2. Because it actually happens. Men are much more likely to be violent and homo/transphobic.
3. Thats... I dunno, not true? A problem with the criminal justice system in general?

EndOfDiscOne posted...

A lot of parents probably don't want their daughter walking into the locker room and seeing a big ass dick flopping around

Only because they're scared its a faker (already illegal) or the hormone-shrunken penis is still going to attack them (already illegal)

And nobody is going to flop it in front of kids, theres a thing called discretion. Stalls, facing the walls, etc.
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EndOfDiscOne posted...

A lot of parents probably don't want their daughter walking into the locker room and seeing a big ass dick flopping around

think of the children!
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honestly I have no idea how I should feel about this if she was pre-op, so I'll just mind my own and not have an opinion at all
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KamenRiderBlade posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

We need coed locker rooms.

I agree, Co-ed locker rooms with many private individual changing stalls that have maximum privacy / anti-peeping / anti-busting in tech.

No fuck that, everyone needs to be able to see each other's junk so we can be 100% certain of their sex, and in case there is any doubt we could have sex with each other in the locker room to make double sure.
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EndOfDiscOne posted...

A lot of parents probably don't want their daughter walking into the locker room and seeing a big ass dick flopping around

Did those parents just assume their daughter's gender?
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darkjedilink posted...

Well, TC, they are correct. A simple DNA test proves it.

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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

1. Vaginas are scared of getting harassed/attacked in the "women's" room

Just for the record, this isn't unwarranted in a lot of cases.

I used to work in an office building that had a gym that the patrons could use. The men's changing room was free for anyone to go into but you had to have your key card activated with certain privileges in order to get into the women's locker room.

This wasn't done for no reason. One of the security guys told me that this is because there had been repeated incidents of different male offenders going in there. Never had one incident of a woman doing the same in the men's locker room. I'd imagine that the former happens far more often in general than the latter.
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Make a third changing room. In Thailand they have "third gender" restrooms

P4wn4g3 posted...

No fuck that, everyone needs to be able to see each other's junk so we can be 100% certain of their sex, and in case there is any doubt we could have sex with each other in the locker room to make double sure.

Sorry, the locker room isn't your personal Orgy Room / Pickup joint / Peeping Room; you're just being a creep at that point by wanting to check out everybody's junk.
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Finally some sense in the justice system. Hopefully this goes to SCOTUS and gets affirmed.

Watch as the very same leftists who make a mockery of transgenderism by insisting "there's infinite genders!" and all that crap, get all pissed over a decision like this that their stand directly results in by making everyone think legitimate transgenderism is fake too.
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Planet Cisness

KamenRiderBlade posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

No fuck that, everyone needs to be able to see each other's junk so we can be 100% certain of their sex, and in case there is any doubt we could have sex with each other in the locker room to make double sure.

Sorry, the locker room isn't your personal Orgy Room / Pickup joint / Peeping Room; you're just being a creep at that point by wanting to check out everybody's junk.

Don't be a pervert. This is just so we can solve a societal problem.
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Anarchy_Juiblex posted...

eston posted...

Planet Fitness kinda got fucked here, since if they had sided with this woman they would be getting sued by the other party.

Eh, not really. There's state precedent on bathroom rights.
PF would absolutely be in their right to enforce a "anti-trans" locker room policy.
https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2017/04/transgender_student_gets_help.html

Did you link to the wrong article or something? That is definitely not on point with this case.

P4wn4g3 posted...

Don't be a pervert. This is just so we can solve a societal problem.

Or we can just have "Private Individual Changing stalls" so people don't get weirded out by seeing each others junk.

Sometimes it's nice to have NO ONLOOKERS!
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I believe that pre-op trans women should be looked into more with this issue. Seeing a penis in a shower ... I completely understand the stigma against it, but if you are post-op, I don't see the deal.

Your presentation does not determine your gender identity. Also, keep in mind that not every trans person is able to medically transition.

KamenRiderBlade posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Don't be a pervert. This is just so we can solve a societal problem.

Or we can just have "Private Individual Changing stalls" so people don't get weirded out by seeing each others junk.

Sometimes it's nice to have NO ONLOOKERS!

Nobody likes your thought police bullshit. Move to North Korea if that's how you want to live.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

Nobody likes your thought police bullshit. Move to North Korea if that's how you want to live.

Nobody likes perverts, you should be hauled away for sexual harassment.
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KamenRiderBlade posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Nobody likes your thought police bullshit. Move to North Korea if that's how you want to live.

Nobody likes perverts, you should be hauled away for sexual harassment.

More thought policing. Way to double down.
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P4wn4g3 posted...

More thought policing. Way to double down.

Way to continue with your perversion.
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KamenRiderBlade posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

Don't be a pervert. This is just so we can solve a societal problem.

Or we can just have "Private Individual Changing stalls" so people don't get weirded out by seeing each others junk.

Sometimes it's nice to have NO ONLOOKERS!

I've always thought this would be the best solution to the whole transgender bathroom / changing room issue. Get rid of gendered rooms in the first place and just have single-user (gender-neutral) ones.

Aside from fixing the entire "which one should trans people use" issue, it also fixes the (admittedly, less significant) "I don't want people listening to me take a shit" issue too.
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alleging that she suffered a violation of privacy, as well as embarrassment, humiliation, severe emotional distress, and damage to her reputation.

lol wut?
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