Board 8 > Ace Attorney Topic Part 6: The Perceiving (Spoilers for AA1-6, AAI1-2)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Currently mired in 4-3, augh

Line count data:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sBPDmATQERIv7R3VvvXx43DRJZNOwnSwmLkZhfWLqSc/edit?usp=sharing

Time stats:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1qSdmjcbQjG_QPBFylHNgk7oVXRbsSjDetdO8w7Ygh8k/edit?usp=sharing
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The "Perceive" mechanic was a bit annoying in AJ, wasn't it?
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Eh, I think Perceive is kind of overhated. It's certainly not great, but at least it's straightforward. I think it was a decent idea with poor execution, and the newer games figured out how to implement it better.

although Brushel sweating out of one armpit is still the only time to date I've ever had to consult an FAQ playing an AA game
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time to keep a running tally of the number of times they force us to watch the video on day 2

already hit the first one when Valant visits the office at the beginning of the day

Valant is another reason day 2 is better than day 1

"A simple sleight of hand, a petite prestidigitation. A modicum of magic from me...to you."

so good
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LeonhartFour posted...

Eh, I think Perceive is kind of overhated. It's certainly not great, but at least it's straightforward. I think it was a decent idea with poor execution, and the newer games figured out how to implement it better.

although Brushel sweating out of one armpit is still the only time to date I've ever had to consult an FAQ playing an AA game

Funnily enough AJ was the first AA game I never had to consult a FAQ for. Didn't realise he only sweats out of one armpit, though - weird!
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it's why the Brushel Perceive is so infamous because why would you think to check the other one if you checked the first one and nothing happened

(Brushel's still a good character though)
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I seriously think y'all crazy on 4-3. It's a great case. I liked it the first time I played it, then people talked me out of thinking it was a good case for a while, and then I replayed it and liked it more the second time. The scenario is really cool and it's the only case where Apollo really gets to shine without anyone helping him through it. Apollo is great on day 2.

It's definitely Apollo's best showing in AJ, but day 1 is also the worst performance by an attorney in the entire series. The case against Machi might be the flimsiest one in the entire series and Apollo can't punch any holes in it and repeatedly draws the wrong conclusions.

That's kind of the story of 4-3. It has good ideas but undermines itself on a regular basis.
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Like the reason Apollo does everything on his own on day 2 is because Trucy and especially Lamiroir are stupid about protecting the secret of the magic trick. AJ's treatment of magic as if it's the most sacred thing in the world is one of its most baffling aspects to me.

I literally started cheering in 6-2 when Trucy decided telling Apollo the truth of how the trick works is more important than guarding her trade secret.
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Leonhart4 posted...

Like the reason Apollo does everything on his own on day 2 is because Trucy and especially Lamiroir are stupid about protecting the secret of the magic trick. AJ's treatment of magic as if it's the most sacred thing in the world is one of its most baffling aspects to me.

I literally started cheering in 6-2 when Trucy decided telling Apollo the truth of how the trick works is more important than guarding her trade secret.

This so hard. (Well I don't think I literally cheered, but my internal reaction was similar.) It's an absolutely idiotic reason for obstructing justice.

Past that, nothing about the prosecution's case on Machi makes a lick of sense (he fired a gun a kid can't possibly fire and then pulled a giant up to a stage to frame himself? wtf?), and I generally find that a bit offputting. Didn't care for any of the characters either.

I mean it's not my most hated case in the game because 4-4 exists and at least 4-3 has a higher density of Apollo/Trucy/Ema interaction which is really the only reason to play AJ, but yeah I don't like it much.
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Yeah, literally the only reason to suspect Machi at all is that he could fit in the air vent, and that's the only argument the prosecution ever really presents. He could not have performed any other aspect of the crime, at least not without an accomplice.

Like I said before though, Klavier wisely just keeps his mouth shut through most of day 1 because apparently nobody else noticed that. The most laughable part is when they start wondering if Machi is an undercover agent.

My head canon has been that Machi is this superhuman specimen that everyone in AJ is aware of but they just forgot to inform the player about it.
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Leonhart4 posted...

Like the reason Apollo does everything on his own on day 2 is because Trucy and especially Lamiroir are stupid about protecting the secret of the magic trick. AJ's treatment of magic as if it's the most sacred thing in the world is one of its most baffling aspects to me.

I literally started cheering in 6-2 when Trucy decided telling Apollo the truth of how the trick works is more important than guarding her trade secret.

Well see, the thing is, they did it correctly here. In 4-3, the mystery is "what is the magic trick?" but in 6-2, the mystery is figuring out how the murderer sabotaged the trick and proving that he did it.

The mystery is "What is the magic trick?" but they undermine it by giving you stupid motivations for both characters who know not to tell you. At that point, I no longer care about the mystery because I'm frustrated with Trucy and Lamiroir, not to mention the video tape itself.
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Apollo: That's one of those permanent dryer things you find in hair salons.
Trucy: Is that what they're really called? "Permanent dryers?"
Apollo: Do I look like a beautician? I just know they dry your hair and give you a permanent.
Trucy: It just doesn't sound very glamorous, you know?
Apollo: OK, how about a "permachine?!"
Trucy: Or you could go more simple, like "permer!"
Apollo: ...This isn't a bad game, thinking up official names for things. Not that it makes the name actually official or anything.
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Trucy: ...Which reminds me. Daddy's not so good with heights either.
Apollo: Huh, no kidding.
Trucy: He took me on a Ferris wheel ride a while ago, you know! Halfway through, his face got all green and he mumbled "objection" over and over.
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Ema: Why can't we have a normal, straightforward killing once in a while in this country?!
Apollo: I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
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LeonhartFour posted...

Ema: Why can't we have a normal, straightforward killing once in a while in this country?!
Apollo: I'll pretend I didn't hear that.

Well, of course. Apollo wouldn't have much of a career if the Ace Attorney universe had straight forward murders.
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I've been out all day, so I didn't get to play today.

probably for the best
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Trucy: What's wrong, Apollo? You look confused.
Apollo: I was just wondering where the "work chair" in this office was.
Klavier: You're looking at my favorite chair right now.
Apollo: ...That's a massage chair, isn't it?
Klavier: That is an ergonomic, adjustable office--
Trucy: I love the ones with the vibrating rollers on your back! Those feel great!
Klavier: ...
Trucy: Did I say something wrong?
Klavier: No. I merely realized the futility of an explanation.

seriously Klavier is actually pretty cool sometimes outside of court
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4-3 investigation day 2 complete

I wish Apollo had been quick enough to call Daryan's bluff at the end when he takes Machi away because he told you earlier that Klavier took him off the case.

although I'll give Apollo one thing over rookie Phoenix

he didn't have a penchant for doing stuff that would get him assaulted, arrested, and/or have evidence stolen from him
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also Trucy has officially pushed Mia out of the top ten for line count

Apollo passed up Franziska and he has a decent chance of getting past Kay by the end of the case, which would put him just outside the top 5.

The Judge also passed Maya up for third on the first trial day.
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and I guess it should've been obvious, but it looks like Machi is going to shatter the record for fewest lines by a defendant

current record holder is Terry Fawles

most lines for a single case defendant is Ron DeLite

I suppose Dhurke will end up #1 in that category even if it's sort of unfair because he's your investigation partner for a big chunk of the case

pretty sure no one else will come close to Ron though
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Is Orla or Vera likely to have fewer lines than Machi?
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oh right Orla is a defendant too

I tend to think of Sasha as the primary defendant in 5-6, but I guess they both are, so Orla will probably beat out Machi.

Vera definitely won't have fewer lines than Machi because she actually talks quite a bit in the MASON System to Phoenix.
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Orla not being human makes me somewhat less inclined to count her for this.

Ron makes sense as the #1 defendant for lines; defendants are sometimes relatively minor figures in the case (just someone who happened to get framed) but Ron's role in 3-2 is huge. It'll be interesting to see if Dhurke can pass him with just his Ku'rain lines since he's... not actually the defendant in the America/Japanifornia part of the case. Probably not?
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Dhurke is considered to be the defendant in the civil case, yes.
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Bucky's line count should also be quite low but probably not less than Machi.
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Yeah, Bucky's not in the case that much, but he talks a lot when he is.
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Doesn't Bucky tend to say everything at once without interruption? So even though he says a lot, it just counts as one line by your rules.
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I don't think Bucky has more than like... 60 lines.

Nah, probably not, but Machi's going to end up with probably half that at most.
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I decided to watch a few more videos of the DGS2 LP now that they've finally started subbing videos game (still not even done with the second case yet and the game's nearly been out for a year now). I really wish we could get a proper version of the DGS games. Susato is such a great assistant.
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Are they still going? I noticed their twitter went down a week or two ago. I was waiting to watch case 2 until after they were done with it and now I don't know if they will finish it.
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Well, it looks like they recently resumed it because one of their videos went from unlabeled to [SUBBING] just a few days ago, which is why I started watching it again.

we need dowolf on the case
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I guess I'll count these lines where Lamiroir is translating for Machi for her since she's the one doing the actual speaking here.

also we're up to 4 different instances where they've shown part or all of the concert video, although a couple of them were only a handful of seconds
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People overrate how much they show the concert video. There's like two really egregious times they play way too much of the video, unskippably, for almost no reason, but it's not quite as excessive as people say it is imo.

4 already feels like quite a bit and there's still more to come

we're not even breaking down the magic trick yet

trial day 2 has already been overusing flashbacks as it is

they decided to replay the entire end of trial day 1 as well as the end of investigation day 2 (twice) and I'm barely on the first testimony
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Apollo: Wouldn't it be difficult for him to perform without knowing the meaning of the lyrics?
Lamiroir: He did know what the song was about, its mood, shall we say. This was enough to play by. I told him it was a song about "a guitar in love."
Klavier: It's...not actually the guitar that's in love, strictly speaking.
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I like how Machi screams in Borginian when he's still pretending he doesn't understand English, and then he screams in English once you completely break his lie as if each language has its own scream
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I wonder if the anime will ever get far enough to have to deal with that.
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You mean will they ever have to actually make up a spoken form of Borginian?

I'm sure they can work around it somehow. It's not like Machi says a lot to begin with.
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Yeah. They can probably just make something up.
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Apollo: Hold on! I think the identity of the killer is a little more important, don't you?
Judge: Importance shmortance! Objection overruled! Tell us about the illusion!

the Judge's childlike wonder makes this a little more bearable
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Hit the checkpoint on trial day 2. Line count is already pretty high, and Daryan hasn't even taken the stand yet!

I think we're up to like a dozen cuts to the video tape. We took our first trip to the mixing board, too. Still got a few more instances of that.
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also I'm pretty sure Lamiroir has to have the record for most testimonies by a character in a single case

she has seven in 4-3

I can't think of anyone in DD or SoJ who can beat that.

4-3 in general has a crazy number of testimonies for a non-epic case, I think. We're up to 9 now, and I'm pretty sure Daryan has at least three.
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"Grr! Forget cool! I want this guy's head on a stick!"

that's one of my favorite Apollo lines in AJ, especially because it's something you'd never hear Phoenix say

also smart move using Allegro for all of Daryan's testimonies because AJ's Allegro is super good
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"Man, man, man! How many times do we have to listen to the same thing?"

I feel you, Daryan, I feel you
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Huh my old notes I took on the games say Lamiroir only had 6 testimonies, but I'm sure you're right (and am not about to replay the game to check my error). Daryan does indeed have 3.

Both 4-3 and the all the original trilogy's case 3's have 12-13 testimonies each, it's pretty standard. (The more recent games don't really get more testimonies, they pad length with other things.)
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I wonder how many lines Lamiroir is gonna have in 4-3. She talks a hell of a lot.

NeoElfboy posted...

Huh my old notes I took on the games say Lamiroir only had 6 testimonies, but I'm sure you're right (and am not about to replay the game to check my error). Daryan does indeed have 3.

Maybe you counted the one where she interprets for Machi as something else? That's all I can think of.

Anyway, 4-3 is finally complete. Numbers soonish.
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