Current Events > The story of Moses parting the sea was BS. It was similar to what Irma did...

(+) Yeah! (+)

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2004/jan/22/20040122-113947-8632r/

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A Russian scientist has announced that one of the Old Testament’s most monumental events — Moses’ parting of the Red Sea — was due to stormy weather and a shallow reef rather than divine intervention."

"Mr. Volzinger determined that if a strong wind blew at 30 meters per second over a shallow reef, then yes, it could have blown that reef dry. He also calculated it would have taken the fleeing Jews about four hours to make their crossing."


"Oceanographer Mr. Volzinger studied the conditions on a reef in the northern part of the Gulf of Suez, which some scholars believe is the site where Moses miraculously parted the Red Sea.
Some 3,500 years ago, the reef was much closer to the surface, Mr. Volzinger said.
He set about calculating how much wind speed would have been needed to blow the water from the formation at low tide, how long the area would stay dry and how quickly the seas would come crashing back.
“It would take the Jews — there were 600,000 of them — four hours to cross the 7-kilometer reef that runs from one coast to another. Then, in a half-hour, the waters would come back.”
But the scientist, who specializes in oceanic phenomena, admitted that his approach was “strictly from Isaac Newton’s point of view,” adding that he had yet to inform any religious organizations about his findings."


http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/10/us/shorelines-drained-hurricane-irma-storm-surge/index.html

"Shuyi Chen, a professor of atmospheric sciences at the University of Washington in Seattle, said the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012."
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I don't know what's more stupid.... biblical literalism or people that attempt to use science to explain supposed miracles in the bible.

This is up there with the "Jesus walked on water due to submerged ice" theory.
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But the Pharaoh told Moses he was free to go.
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27_Sandman_40 posted...

Wasn't the whole point that he did it on command

That was the story but was it the reality?
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But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...
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Asherlee10 posted...

K181 posted...

I don't know what's more stupid.... biblical literalism or people that attempt to use science to explain supposed miracles in the bible.

This is up there with the "Jesus walked on water due to submerged ice" theory.

I can understand modern Christians wanting scientific explanations for the stories in the Bible. If you accept that the stories are not true as they are described, that leaves a big open question to the legitmacy of the rest of the Bible.

- Was Jesus real?
- Was Jesus really the son of god?

That's where the faith comes in play, though. If you think that there's a scientific reason for something, then it wasn't divine. You believe that something happened for supernatural reasons, which is inherently non-replicable and not provable or disprovable.

Chasing after scientific explanations for ancient "miracles" is simultaneously non-religious and non-scientific (for the most part). Religious people would believe that something happened and scientific people would think it just didn't happen.
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...

just happens to occur when Moses herds people off towards the Red Sea?
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darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...

just happens to occur when Moses herds people off towards the Red Sea?

Not like if he knew that this event was common from personal experience that he would suggest it as an idea to escape or anything...
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...

just happens to occur when Moses herds people off towards the Red Sea?

Not like if he knew that this event was common from personal experience that he would suggest it as an idea to escape or anything...

this was a common occurrence?
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darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...

just happens to occur when Moses herds people off towards the Red Sea?

Not like if he knew that this event was common from personal experience that he would suggest it as an idea to escape or anything...

this was a common occurrence?

""the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012.""

So the question is did Moses have reason to have witnessed this event enough times that he planned the escape knowing it would happen only under such conditions?
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Asherlee10 posted...

GOATTHlEF posted...

Egypt didn't use slave labor to build the pyramids.

I think that you're right. I feel like I saw a documentary that suggested that those Jews were of many tribes that were known for contract labor (paid labor) and the wages weren't paid right or at all and the left.

They also didn't move the blocks very far and had on site quarries locally.
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I thought Moses predicted when low tide would occur...
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...

just happens to occur when Moses herds people off towards the Red Sea?

Not like if he knew that this event was common from personal experience that he would suggest it as an idea to escape or anything...

this was a common occurrence?

""the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012.""

So the question is did Moses have reason to have witnessed this event enough times that he planned the escape knowing it would happen only under such conditions?

so you believe Moses had not only witnessed several Hurricanes but was also able to witness Hurricanes that shoved water aside creating a path and then put a plan into motion somehow predicting the exact moment when this would occur and having Pharaoh let his people go just in time for him to take them there when this all happened?
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K181 posted...

I don't know what's more stupid.... biblical literalism or people that attempt to use science to explain supposed miracles in the bible.

Definitely the latter: "Oh look at this natural phenomenon that just so happened to occur at exactly the right moment for it to be of perfect use to some ignorant religious person. The miracle was nothing more than just perfect coincidence and not the act of some sky wizard. *tips fedora*"
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darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

But yeah let us act like "the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012." isn't a plausible explanation and that some old guy doing it with magic makes more sense...

just happens to occur when Moses herds people off towards the Red Sea?

Not like if he knew that this event was common from personal experience that he would suggest it as an idea to escape or anything...

this was a common occurrence?

""the weather phenomena is common during extreme storm conditions like Hurricane Sandy in 2012.""

So the question is did Moses have reason to have witnessed this event enough times that he planned the escape knowing it would happen only under such conditions?

so you believe Moses had not only witnessed several Hurricanes but was also able to witness Hurricanes that shoved water aside creating a path and then put a plan into motion somehow predicting the exact moment when this would occur and having Pharaoh let his people go just in time for him to take them there when this all happened?

"Storms"=/="Hurricanes".

And dude, if HE KNEW and KNEW that most people didn't not only would that make it a perfect way to escape, it would explain the stories people invented who didn't understand what they were witnessing but simply knew he directed them and knew about it.
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DawkinsNumber4 topic.
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the whole exodus is bs
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Moses was also said to be 80 around the time this happened so he definitely had plenty of time for this wisdom that others did not have. Also remember that back then the area was much wetter and as a result more storms than there are now certainly took place.
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In the BeyBlade cartoon, Moses parts it with a beyblade
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_Near_ posted...

the whole exodus is bs

No, it isn't. Exodus actually happened.
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

Moses was also said to be 80 around the time this happened so he definitely had plenty of time for this wisdom that others did not have.

he the only 80 year old?

so Pharaoh had no old advisors who could tell him about this? hmm
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But was Moses free to go?
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darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

Moses was also said to be 80 around the time this happened so he definitely had plenty of time for this wisdom that others did not have.

he the only 80 year old?

so Pharaoh had no old advisors who could tell him about this? hmm

You think wretched greedy government people paid attention to that kind of thing?
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

darkphoenix181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

Moses was also said to be 80 around the time this happened so he definitely had plenty of time for this wisdom that others did not have.

he the only 80 year old?

so Pharaoh had no old advisors who could tell him about this? hmm

You think wretched greedy government people paid attention to that kind of thing?

I believe they would especially pay attention to that kind of thing.
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"
"Mr. Volzinger determined that if a strong wind blew at 30 meters per second over a shallow reef, then yes, it could have blown that reef dry. He also calculated it would have taken the fleeing Jews about four hours to make their crossing.""


30 meters per second equals 67.1 miles per hour. A category 1 hurricane is at least 74.
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ManLink4321 posted...

_Near_ posted...

the whole exodus is bs

No, it isn't. Exodus actually happened.

Actually, I don't think there's actually evidence for the exodus other that the biblical source. Not from archeology or other contemporary sources.
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K181 posted...

ManLink4321 posted...

_Near_ posted...

the whole exodus is bs

No, it isn't. Exodus actually happened.

Actually, I don't think there's actually evidence for the exodus other that the biblical source. Not from archeology or other contemporary sources.

Even if it wasn't, then I'd say the evidence supporting it is minimal at best.
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K181 posted...

I don't know what's more stupid.... biblical literalism or people that attempt to use science to explain supposed miracles in the bible.

This is up there with the "Jesus walked on water due to submerged ice" theory.

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BootyGif posted...

K181 posted...

I don't know what's more stupid.... biblical literalism or people that attempt to use science to explain supposed miracles in the bible.

This is up there with the "Jesus walked on water due to submerged ice" theory.

So you assume the stories are entirely made up and aren't "based on a true story"? The bible seems like the ancient hollywood movie.
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Kim Kusanagi posted...

But the Pharaoh told Moses he was free to go.

But that means he was also free to stay, right?

*headbutts Egyptian chariot*
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

BootyGif posted...

K181 posted...

I don't know what's more stupid.... biblical literalism or people that attempt to use science to explain supposed miracles in the bible.

This is up there with the "Jesus walked on water due to submerged ice" theory.

So you assume the stories are entirely made up and aren't "based on a true story"? The bible seems like the ancient hollywood movie.

No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them.
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K181 posted...

No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them.

"No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them."


"or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this)"


This sounds more like a great plan than a coincidence.
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NES4EVER posted...

Kim Kusanagi posted...

But the Pharaoh told Moses he was free to go.

But that means he was also free to stay, right?

*headbutts Egyptian chariot*

Imma fire my current scribe because he doesn't know the Pharaonic law like I do.
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DawkinsNumber4 posted...

K181 posted...

No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them.

"No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them."


"or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this)"


This sounds more like a great plan than a coincidence.

... what? So you quoted me twice and then a part of it a third time and then made a nonsensical statement.
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K181 posted...

DawkinsNumber4 posted...

K181 posted...

No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them.

"No, but I am saying that attempting to scientifically prove the conditions of a biblical miracle is inherently unscientific as you're using biased sources as proof and don't have remotely enough information at hand, not to mention that doing so often would assume utter stupidity on the people there to witness it if it did happen (Jesus was actually on ice and nobody noticed) or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this). Much easier and more scientific to state that the miracle stories were inflated or made up if your goal is to disprove the divine nature of them."


"or was the result of an unfathomable number of coincidences all taking place at once (this)"


This sounds more like a great plan than a coincidence.

... what? So you quoted me twice and then a part of it a third time and then made a nonsensical statement.

I quoted you. I then isolated the part I would respond to with the 2nd quote. I then explained what I had stated already, that was that it seems like it would have been a wonderful plan and that seems more plausible to me than assuming it be a coincidence.
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*bump*
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Asherlee10 posted...

- Was Jesus real?
- Was Jesus really the son of god?

probably not
nope

27_Sandman_40 posted...

Wasn't the whole point that he did it on command

The story is that he did it on command.
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or, you know... moses wasn't real
I thought archaeologists (and israeli ones at that) found that the jews never actually were in egypt that early on in history and that the story of moses and the enslaved jews of egypt is essentially their cultural creation story (I'm sure there's a better term for what I mean, but I'm drawing a blank atm)
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Kim Kusanagi posted...

But the Pharaoh told Moses he was free to go.

lmfao underrated post. @Kim_Kusanagi we are friends now.

*high five*
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I thought TC was in jail what happened
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I've heard most of the miracles and plagues during the Exodus could be traced to a volcanic eruption that occurred around the same time.

Sure is impressive that Moses knew all these things were going to happen.
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M-Watcher posted...

I've heard most of the miracles and plagues during the Exodus could be traced to a volcanic eruption that occurred around the same time.

Sure is impressive that Moses knew all these things were going to happen.

Yeah. It's almost like these things happened first and then a story was written about these events after the fact.
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Asherlee10 posted...

GOATTHlEF posted...

Egypt didn't use slave labor to build the pyramids.

I think that you're right. I feel like I saw a documentary that suggested that those Jews were of many tribes that were known for contract labor (paid labor) and the wages weren't paid right or at all and the left.

is there actually evidence for this or is it just a case of the victors writing history? would egypt really admit or maintain that they used slaves to build their prized landmarks?