Board 8 > ~~Japanese History~~ Mafia Topic 4 - Revere the Emperor, Expel the Foreigners

(+) Yeah! (+)

And really you guys need to let things breathe sometimes. Like let the guy I claimed a scan on reply before going crazy on me. Sheesh. We have so many oldbies that have not been in the corrik era to not expect a gambit so early.

Yes scan was fake. And a lot of people look like shit for their reactions to it

But Pez looks fucking awful. Someone had to tell him to go vote Plum for sure

##Unvote
##Vote: Pez
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pezloco posted...

dowolf posted...

pezloco posted...

But do you read his D1 actions as town at all?

Honestly, I was neutral on Scare d1. Don't recall having a strong opinion one way or the other.

Was the rest of that paragraph correct, i.e. my understanding of your position?

Yeah, pretty much.
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ScareChan posted...

Yes scan was fake. And a lot of people look like shit for their reactions to it

god

l;akwgjl;kawjrg;lawryupoiawru

i hate you so much right now.
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Immediate reactions are that Dowolf is town because he was very hype to have something back up his read

Red would be cautious of me regardless after last few games
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Well Plum is still scum

it just means I was roleblocked or something last night
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ScareChan posted...

Did pez literally come at me then vote plum

I think one of you is scum. I've said I prefer to lynch you. You weren't here to interact with and others preferred Plum who is admittedly my third target. But my first is Death.

To sum up my position for you, I have thought and will continue to think Death is scum. I switched my vote to you because you claimed scanner when KBM was already hinting it. You weren't there, there was no movement on your lynch for the time being, so I switched to Plum. He's blatantly ignored reasonable arguments that he should understand. He's relied too much on Chris. That put him 3rd for me, but people are actually voting for him.

Before anyone asks, what makes this different from D1? My read on all three of these is scummy. I think 2 of the 3 are scummy. So I'll lynch any of them. I didn't have a read on Scept and therefore wouldn't join a lynch train that had little to no basis for the other people who were on it.
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Votals as of post #206 (pezloco)

[5] pezloco - (KBM), Plum, KBM, (SBell), Phoenix, Death, Scare
[3] Plum - (Scare), Lolo, Dowolf, pezloco
[0] Death - (pezloco)
[0] Scare - (KBM), (pezloco)
[0] Sceptile - (Dowolf)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day ends at 9:00:00 PM EDT on Sunday (About 29 and a half hours)
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As you noted in the post below, LoLo was on my concerned list. I had no read on Scept. I didn't like the reasoning on him anymore than the reasoning on Oddity. The difference between the two was my own read. I read Oddity as town and still have no read on Scept. But I thought both lynch trains were bad.

sorry
I just had it in my head that you must have thought sceptile was something towny if you refused to go near his lynch
that other explanation does make sense, and doesnt utterly condemn you without knowing what Lolo or Sceptile are

but I still cant get over that you didnt claim miller until you were caught, you know what millers are
an earlier post indicated as much

also not wanting to go near a bad lynch is fine, but you going silent during the last few minutes is not a good/townlooking approach to deadlines
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goddamnit Scare
stop trying to be IGCD
one of you is more than enough
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masterplum posted...

The best I can come up with in the scare is Town scenario, is scare scanned me with something that isn't definitive but looks like I am scum, and he decided to roll with it seeing if I would crack

A detective scan of mafia godfather/Mafia Assassin/my actual role for example.


It's not completely out of the picture. Could also explain why he is slow to come back and elaborate more.

Or most likely with reaction and him including godfather he is just godfather
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Pez
do you really think scum would fake a scan on scum?

also Scare
why fake a scan on Plum?
(why him is the question here, not why a fake scan)
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So scan was fake but also claiming role blocked? I'm so confused...and annoyed
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##Unvote
##Vote: Death

What he's done today hasn't made me like him any better, in particular the part where I've had to reexplain things to him that I've already said directly to him or elsewhere in the day.

Scare and Plum are still there, but since the scan is fake, they aren't as strongly tied together.
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Obellisk posted...

So scan was fake but also claiming role blocked? I'm so confused...and annoyed

This, basically.

Clarification plox.
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htaeD posted...

Pez
do you really think scum would fake a scan on scum?

also Scare
why fake a scan on Plum?
(why him is the question here, not why a fake scan)

I've done it as scum and seen it done (in AIM).
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pezloco posted...

What he's done today hasn't made me like him any better, in particular the part where I've had to reexplain things to him that I've already said directly to him or elsewhere in the day.

How is that a scumtell?

Like actually.
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dowolf posted...

pezloco posted...

What he's done today hasn't made me like him any better, in particular the part where I've had to reexplain things to him that I've already said directly to him or elsewhere in the day.

How is that a scumtell?

Like actually.

It feels intentional. As in he's actively trying to twist what I'm saying.
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Can you give specific examples of this?
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Knowing the scan is fake actually makes me feel really good about dowolf

Unless he truly is... Kinzo. >_>
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htaeD posted...

Pez
do you really think scum would fake a scan on scum?

also Scare
why fake a scan on Plum?
(why him is the question here, not why a fake scan)

Because plum seemed most scum to me after yesterday
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ScareChan posted...

Immediate reactions are that Dowolf is town because he was very hype to have something back up his read

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@dowolf

htaeD posted...

Then I'd vote them instead. I was waiting for Death, Leo (who dropped off my list cause Red replaced), LoLo, Dowolf, and Phoenix. None of them voted Scare. Except Dowolf,

probably is a pattern to this random selection of names
since Pez doesnt seem to want to go quiet even with a scan pining him down, he might even explain or point out the source

but there were other players who voted Oddity/Scare and he rarely/never mentioned them before and after the votes.. and I wonder why

Here this is something I made clear in D1. I had my scum list and was watching for one of them to join either lynch train. I'm pretty sure he and I had a discussion about this D1. But if it wasn't with him, I did mention it then. Considering I voted him, I think it's likely I was interacting with him when discussing the why.

htaeD posted...

hmph
not many people talk about pez
scare and sceptile say they like him, but then I liked him too for a while day1, so that doesnt say much to me

also despite pez asking for alternatives to voting me, and sceptile presenting himself, he never took the oppurtunity to vote sceptile

puts attention on sceptile, but not enough
also I would have suspected that push towards sceptile near the end anyway

This is a subject I had to go over multiple times and one I addressed at the beginning of D2 when going back and forth with KBM. I go over it again in post 188.

Finally in my post 198 I point out where he missed an answer I'd already given him.
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@dowolf

Part of my suspicion of Plum is similar. It's his insistence that even in hindsight we had no reason to not lynch Oddity. Despite the fact that in particular I laid out what was wrong with the reasons behind the lynch and had Oddity confirm my reasoning, which means after he flips town it should confirm that oh yeah that wasn't just BS reasoning and getting lucky as he claimed.
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ScareChan posted...

Well Plum is still scum

it just means I was roleblocked or something last night

This is extremely troubling to me.

You pull a gambit on plum for what reason?

You disappear all day only to return and sayou, lol, jk.

You then say oh, plum Is still scum but I was likely role blocked.


None of thelse statements coincide with the other and frankly you're inability to expand any further is negligent to town if in fact you are town.
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Pez I will humor you here
I knew you had 'a scumlist'
and even in that sentence I said you could explain it or point at the source (meaning I might have missed it)
I understood your reason for voting me, but I didnt remember at the time why you picked the other four players
and I was also curious what your thoughts about the other voters on these 'trap' trains were

and okay I missed your answer about sceptile, but thats why I was asking
I wasnt stating things about you when i missed that answer and asked about it
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pezloco posted...

@dowolf

Part of my suspicion of Plum is similar. It's his insistence that even in hindsight we had no reason to not lynch Oddity. Despite the fact that in particular I laid out what was wrong with the reasons behind the lynch and had Oddity confirm my reasoning, which means after he flips town it should confirm that oh yeah that wasn't just BS reasoning and getting lucky as he claimed.

now lets be honest
Obellisk posted...

ScareChan posted...

Well Plum is still scum

it just means I was roleblocked or something last night

This is extremely troubling to me.

You pull a gambit on plum for what reason?

You disappear all day only to return and sayou, lol, jk.

You then say oh, plum Is still scum but I was likely role blocked.


None of thelse statements coincide with the other and frankly you're inability to expand any further is negligent to town if in fact you are town.

I think I get at what Scare is saying, but I would like to hear him say it in detail
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whoops, forgot I was quoting two things there for a second

that sentence was going to end with 'now lets be honest, hindsight is nice. but nobody had to to take oddity for his word at the moment of his lynch, when he said you were right about him'

I mean now we know, but that doesnt make you town
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To be honest, your examples on Death seem more like examples of Death not having perfect memory of everything you've said.
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its more like I a read a hundred of his posts and it all blurred together
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htaeD posted...

Pez I will humor you here
I knew you had 'a scumlist'
and even in that sentence I said you could explain it or point at the source (meaning I might have missed it)
I understood your reason for voting me, but I didnt remember at the time why you picked the other four players
and I was also curious what your thoughts about the other voters on these 'trap' trains were

and okay I missed your answer about sceptile, but thats why I was asking
I wasnt stating things about you when i missed that answer and asked about it

I never did actually get around to answering the question about the others on the train.

[1] Scare - (Chris), (Oddity), (Plum), (Dowolf), VeryInsane

We've covered Chris and Oddity. Dowolf here meant to vote someone else. Plum I don't think I had a strong read on.

[6] Oddity - KBM, Sceptile, Death, Chris, Phoenix, (Scare), Plum

I was actually going to talk to KBM about her vote today. But I was really looking at 3rd or 4th voters. The first two votes don't really make a train necessarily. You voted 3. Phoenix concerned me. But he and I had a little interchange where he explained his word choice and that made me less concerned. Also he's 18. You asked in a different post why that mattered. Yeah that's a little ageism, but basically I expect less coherent arguments from an 18 year old. So, I can see how he thought his posts were actually adding to the discussion. My suspicion of him was being present and pretending to contribute.
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htaeD posted...

whoops, forgot I was quoting two things there for a second

that sentence was going to end with 'now lets be honest, hindsight is nice. but nobody had to to take oddity for his word at the moment of his lynch, when he said you were right about him'

I mean now we know, but that doesnt make you town

I didn't argue that I should be town. I argued that Plum looks scummy because he said that even in hindsight Dowolf (and by extension me) were just lucky that Oddity wasn't scum.
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@dowolf post #231

Yet one more time where he didn't understand what I said. Maybe I'm just a poor communicator. Quite possibly true. Maybe I'm just biased because I already think he's scum. But yeah it feels like he's doing some of it on purpose.
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I understood perfectly what you said that time
I dont feel too harshly about that, so I didnt comment on that aspect
since you always have one or two scum playing the defenddoomedtowntolookgoodnextday game

I commented on the underlying tone of 'look at me, I was right about oddity'

keep in mind, I already believe you to be scum, so its hard to see that from an innocent angle
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We've covered Chris and Oddity. Dowolf here meant to vote someone else. Plum I don't think I had a strong read on.

My name's on that list, what do you think of me?
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VeryInsane posted...

We've covered Chris and Oddity. Dowolf here meant to vote someone else. Plum I don't think I had a strong read on.

My name's on that list, what do you think of me?

That you're inactive?
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pezloco posted...

VeryInsane posted...

We've covered Chris and Oddity. Dowolf here meant to vote someone else. Plum I don't think I had a strong read on.

My name's on that list, what do you think of me?

That you're inactive?

What made you different than LoLo and therefore not on the scumlist I was watching for was you were just inactive. Something Red used to be famous for. LoLo actively flaunted his lack of contribution. And made a weird vote on Scept that stayed.
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Darn. I thought Scare would probably come in claiming to have been bluffing, but it would be more interesting for him to stick to it. Honestly I think that is relatively plausible.

Pez is probably scum though. The odds that he got scanned scum as Miller are just so low. Not worth playing on that outcome.

I disagree that dowolf looks better for buying Scare. Since scum knew Scare was bluffing, they could fabricate whatever attitude they like. It is a WIFOM argument.
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I'm not sure what to think of the Scare thing right now. Especially since the push on plum felt like it kept up steam even when Pez should have felt like an inevitable lynch.
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ScareChan posted...

Well Plum is still scum

it just means I was roleblocked or something last night

What
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Sceptilesolar posted...

Darn. I thought Scare would probably come in claiming to have been bluffing, but it would be more interesting for him to stick to it. Honestly I think that is relatively plausible.

Pez is probably scum though. The odds that he got scanned scum as Miller are just so low. Not worth playing on that outcome.

I disagree that dowolf looks better for buying Scare. Since scum knew Scare was bluffing, they could fabricate whatever attitude they like. It is a WIFOM argument.

I was going to ride it out but

Pez switching me to plum looks very bad

I feel like plum is godfather

If not that I may have been role blocked last night with the way people reacted to me

So there is more reasons to just let it go than ride it out
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Sceptilesolar posted...

I disagree that dowolf looks better for buying Scare. Since scum knew Scare was bluffing, they could fabricate whatever attitude they like. It is a WIFOM argument.

You are 100% confident Scare is town, then?
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And the thing is dowolf felt genuine more than anything else
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Sceptilesolar posted...

Darn. I thought Scare would probably come in claiming to have been bluffing, but it would be more interesting for him to stick to it. Honestly I think that is relatively plausible.

Pez is probably scum though. The odds that he got scanned scum as Miller are just so low. Not worth playing on that outcome.

I disagree that dowolf looks better for buying Scare. Since scum knew Scare was bluffing, they could fabricate whatever attitude they like. It is a WIFOM argument.

okay I can think of a few reasons as to how scum would know that Scare was bluffing
but why do you sound certain they knew?
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also what dowolf said
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dowolf posted...

...You think it is abnormal to not want your town reads to be lynched?

Though that doesn't really apply here. I simply want Plum dead. If Plum is town, we lynch Scare and Pez in that order. If Plum if scum, we figure things out from there.

I don't think that's abnormal, but that the way you're going about doing it is.
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ScareChan posted...

And really you guys need to let things breathe sometimes. Like let the guy I claimed a scan on reply before going crazy on me. Sheesh. We have so many oldbies that have not been in the corrik era to not expect a gambit so early.

Yes scan was fake. And a lot of people look like shit for their reactions to it

But Pez looks fucking awful. Someone had to tell him to go vote Plum for sure

##Unvote
##Vote: Pez

Why did you fake a scan on Plum,if you don't mind me asking
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Phoenix-Smasher posted...

I don't think that's abnormal, but that the way you're going about doing it is.

how so?

Is the FLAMING FIRE OF MY PASSION too hot for you to handle?
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So scare,

So I understand, you are sure I am scum but you think the reason I was so confident was because you were roleblocked?
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I'm more concerned Pez is RB'er or something scum doesn't want to lose here. The pushback was real for awhile. Going to be a matter of figuring out which scum was doing the pushing tomorrow, I think.
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htaeD posted...

Pez
do you really think scum would fake a scan on scum?

also Scare
why fake a scan on Plum?
(why him is the question here, not why a fake scan)

Oh Death already asked... awkward.ScareChan posted...

htaeD posted...

Pez
do you really think scum would fake a scan on scum?

also Scare
why fake a scan on Plum?
(why him is the question here, not why a fake scan)

Because plum seemed most scum to me after yesterday

That's a fair enough answer. I'll take it.
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