Poll of the Day > Thoughts on THAC0?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Whether you know what it is or don't I'm curious as to what people think of it, ( or what they think it is).
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ThAC0 is WAC0.

I have people try and explain it to me, and I ignore them every time, because I sure as hell don't want that in my brain.

A pointless complication, the D&D 3E Armor Class system is just plain better.

THAC0 is outdated and unnecessary. I personally wonder why anyone thought it was a good idea.

command667 posted...

THAC0 is outdated and unnecessary. I personally wonder why anyone thought it was a good idea.

Better than when it was literally a chart.
Because Gygax gotta Gygax.

shadowsword87 posted...

Better than when it was literally a chart.

I am sorry, but I don't get what you are talking about? Could you be a bit more clear.

Yeah I figured we would generally be in agreement.
I try to explain thac0 to my buddies from time to time just so they understand how jank things used to be.
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Better numbers should be bigger darn it

probably the dumbest thing, in a game that consistently has really dumb rules.
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Worked great for it's time, but doesn't work that well when dealing with epic levels etc. DDO got rid of it, which was kinda sad, but totally made sense long term, since you had a huge range in possible AC on a system based on rolling a 20 sided dice. This led to way too many characters only hitting on a 20, or getting hit on a 20, and many other characters hitting everything on a 2 or higher.

I like the physical resistance rating system to be honest, which increases based on the type of armor you have and other factors. Chance to be missed should always have been based on dexterity/mobility, and should be higher for characters wearing lighter equipment.

I would personally split it all up and make it WAY more complicated. Armor provides damage resistance and reduction based on it's type, magic properties etc. Dexterity and abilities affect your chance to dodge or avoid attacks, and you can take parry/block attempts as a bonus action (or use as many of your attacks as you get per round and the bonus action) as an attempt to parry/block.

Parrying with a weapon uses your base attack rating vs the enemies (if you roll higher, you parry), blocking gets a bonus based on the shield type/size and magical ability added to your attack bonus (still uses an attack to use the shield other then your bonus action).

This all sounds complicated,and it would make combat a bit longer (since people would get hit less often) but it makes far more thematic sense. Shields would be far more useful to have as well, and dual wielding would give you an advantage (more attacks mean more chances to block).

Anyway, it would complicate combat a bit more, but make far more sense, and provide for a much larger range of defense for characters. Thaco was just broken in many ways.
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I love tacos
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THAC0 always felt weird to me. Significantly better systems eventually replaced it.
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I'm just fine with it. I'm also only familiar with 2nd edition, so I'm unaware of the alternatives.
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Person106 posted...

I'm just fine with it. I'm also only familiar with 2nd edition, so I'm unaware of the alternatives.

Play better games, oh my god.

Woah woah woah

Only familiar with it because you don't play anymore or only familiar with it because you haven't played anything else?

Because if it's the latter you need to upgrade your system man!
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It's raining Thaco, from out of the sky, Thaco, no need to ask why, it's raining Thaco!!!
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123pizza2 posted...

Only familiar with it because you don't play anymore or only familiar with it because you haven't played anything else?

I last played D&D in 1999. If I do get around to playing D&D again, I'm not sure if I'll jump straight in to some later edition or if I'll try 2nd edition first.

Fun fact: I sometimes wind down before bed by reading 2nd edition rule books.
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wolfy42 posted...

Anyway, it would complicate combat a bit more, but make far more sense, and provide for a much larger range of defense for characters.

Dude, if you wanted to make defense bonuses better, and more of a whole bunch of actions to do, and a whole bunch of reactions, just play 4th edition.
And that's not a knock or me trying to crap on it, that's literally what 4th edition is all about and there's a bullion books out all for like $5.

darkknight109 posted...

THAC0 always felt weird to me. Significantly better systems eventually replaced it.

This, more or less. It always felt a bit counter-intuitive, and I think it was confusing enough to discourage some people from playing who might otherwise have latched on to a simpler, more intuitive system.


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streamofthesky posted...

A pointless complication, the D&D 3E Armor Class system is just plain better.

streamofthesky posted...

A pointless complication, the D&D 3E Armor Class system is just plain better.

That.

However, Thac0 is so fun to say!

It's not really that complicated, maybe it feels a little weird when lower scores are better
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synth_real posted...

It's not really that complicated, maybe it feels a little weird when lower scores are better

It's counter-intuitive and requires more steps than it actually needs, and doesn't really balance the extra effort with greater utility. That tends to make it feel like poor game design, especially when better options are available.

That being said, it's harder to shit on it because it's older, which means a lot of those better options weren't available at the time, and some of them came into being mainly as an evolution of the older rules, so it's kind of unfair to hold it to those standards.

From the point-of-view of the present, though? It's needlessly clunky.


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