Poll of the Day > Why should legal defense cost money?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Case:

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/33778733/ns/technology_and_science-security/t/framed-child-porn-pc-virus/

They had to sell their everything to pay their legal fees and were never able to recover the incidental damages such as the lost job as well as death threats and people slashing their car's tires (of course, they had to sell the car to pay for the legal fees, so... that one might not count)
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then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?
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Muffinz0rz posted...

then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?

Theyd be paid by the state
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Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?

Theyd be paid by the state

Which then would be paid from your taxes.

Because somebody has to pay the costs. The one kinda bs area is that public defenders cost money since they're supposed to be part of the whole, "If you cannot afford a lawyer, one will be appointed." However, keep in mind that there are some lawyers who do pro bono work.

In general, though, a lot of this plays in the idea that people shouldn't have to pay for anything because of results outside their control. However, just like you can buy medical and home insurance to pay for things beyond your control, you *can* buy legal insurance plans.
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And, in general, if our justice system worked better, these issues wouldn't go to trial. The police would be more vigilant in discovering these kinds of deceptions so that charges wouldn't ever be filed.
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For the same reason food and safety isn't handed to you in the wilderness. Humans forget that the Earth has a scarcity problem and that people all have conflicting interests. The illusion of modern living makes you think things could be better, but you never think the cost matters.

Then the minute someone doesn't want to pay your pills, you call them a Nazi.
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I think it should be payed by the losing party
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I can imagine a person walking in the woods when a bear attacks them and begins eating them.

"Why is this Nazi oppressing me!?"
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The real problem is that laws are so complicated you need someone who spent 4+ years studying it to defend you.
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Come to think of it, I'm not even sure if there's a country which offers free (to the consumer, anyway) government-paid lawyers to everybody. I know that some states in the US have played with the idea of covering legal costs for people suffering economic hardship, but that wouldn't cover the kind of lawyer needed to defend a case like the CP frame-up one since you'd need a pretty fucking good lawyer.
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Guys, I think he's asking why legal representation isn't fully nationalized more than asking why lawyers don't work for free.

that's why I support trial by combat
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Zangulus posted...

Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?

Theyd be paid by the state

So... not free.

In a country that allows frivolous lawsuits, bad idea.
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VeeVees posted...

that's why I support trial by combat

But the average person can't afford a good champion!
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Zeus posted...

VeeVees posted...

that's why I support trial by combat

But the average person can't afford a good champion!

Trial by vehicular combat then.
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What I want to know is why does car registration cost money. I shouldn't have to pay a bunch of jerks money every year just because I'm cool and have a car
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There are some countries where if you win a case, the losing party must pay for all your legal fees.

The idea being to discourage people from going through with and fighting lawsuits in which they know they are in the wrong.

Although I have not done the research on the pros and cons of this system.
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SinisterSlay posted...

Zeus posted...

VeeVees posted...

that's why I support trial by combat

But the average person can't afford a good champion!

Trial by vehicular combat then.

Not everybody owns a car.

Mead posted...

What I want to know is why does car registration cost money. I shouldn't have to pay a bunch of jerks money every year just because I'm cool and have a car

It's to pay for all of those wonderful welfare benefits you claim to support.
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Zeus posted...

It's to pay for all of those wonderful welfare benefits you claim to support.

I think you're wrong.

I don't think I ever claimed that I support them either.
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Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?

Theyd be paid by the state

They have those it's called legal aid or some other alternative court program.

You get what you pay for....
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Mead posted...

Zeus posted...

It's to pay for all of those wonderful welfare benefits you claim to support.

I think you're wrong.

I don't think I ever claimed that I support them either.

Car registration money goes to your city and that's usually where it winds up. Gas taxes and/or tolls are what actually pays for your roads and bridges... or they would, but they usually go to entitlements as well. It's why CT has the second or third-highest gas tax in the nation while having the worst roads and third-worst bridges (or maybe third-worst roads and and worst bridges? I can't even remember). Then our ass clown governor -- Dannel Malloy, who has occupied various ranks in the five least popular governors in the country, once or twice ranking right at the bottom or number two -- has repeatedly talked about putting in tolls to help pay for the things which should have been paid for by our gas taxes.

As for your support, if you've truly never claimed to support them, you certainly defend them far more than I wind up defending Trump which I'm forced to do because nobody else wants to be the voice of reason.
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well in this case you'd want the person who did the framing to pay for the legal fees. but since you dont know who that is....yeah it kinda sucks. *shrug* i think the real problem is the legal system. the fact that it takes so much damn money to just UNDERSTAND our legal system is really messed up.
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Conner4REAL posted...

Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?

Theyd be paid by the state

They have those it's called legal aid or some other alternative court program.

You get what you pay for....

Then there shouldn't be a second payer system where rich people can get BETTER defense
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The FDA takes your tax money and buys ad blitzes to preach against smoking. The same taxes are used to subsidized tobacco farming.

Think about that for a second.
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ssj4supervegeta posted...

well in this case you'd want the person who did the framing to pay for the legal fees.

Usually I think there's some indemnity where you can either put the person in prison or you can sue them (or maybe that depends on the crime?). In this case, they'd be going to prison regardless.
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Lokarin posted...

Conner4REAL posted...

Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

then why would anyone be a lawyer if you dont get paid?

Theyd be paid by the state

They have those it's called legal aid or some other alternative court program.

You get what you pay for....

Then there shouldn't be a second payer system where rich people can get BETTER defense

Then why bother trying to get a good job and get rich when your self-earned money can't buy you anything better than what you'd get working for $10/hr?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to defend the hyper-wealthy capitalist billionaires. I'm just saying that if you have more money, you're going to spend more of it for better quality things, a la cars, houses, legal defense, etc.
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Muffinz0rz posted...

Then why bother trying to get a good job and get rich when your self-earned money can't buy you anything better than what you'd get working for $10/hr?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to defend the hyper-wealthy capitalist billionaires. I'm just saying that if you have more money, you're going to spend more of it for better quality things, a la cars, houses, legal defense, etc.

Justice is not a luxury
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Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

Then why bother trying to get a good job and get rich when your self-earned money can't buy you anything better than what you'd get working for $10/hr?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to defend the hyper-wealthy capitalist billionaires. I'm just saying that if you have more money, you're going to spend more of it for better quality things, a la cars, houses, legal defense, etc.

Justice is not a luxury

It kind of is. Non luxurious justice would be taking a gun and shooting the bastard who raped your daughter rather then getting a prison to torture him for the rest of his life.
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Zeus posted...

you certainly defend them far more than I wind up defending Trump

False, and literally not even humanly possible.
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I'm all for welfare when we can do it without sacrificing growth and dip into scarcity with billions of useless babies.

I want to get in space. That should be our primary goal and 75% of our budget. The ability to automate everything and utilize unlimited energy is out there and all we're doing is loading down growth and progress by giving whole neighborhoods of people a free ride.

Very few people have gotten us to this level of tech and we are THIS CLOSE to making major leaps and bounds.
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Lokarin posted...

Justice is not a luxury

Neither is health care but there you go
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Lokarin posted...

Muffinz0rz posted...

Then why bother trying to get a good job and get rich when your self-earned money can't buy you anything better than what you'd get working for $10/hr?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to defend the hyper-wealthy capitalist billionaires. I'm just saying that if you have more money, you're going to spend more of it for better quality things, a la cars, houses, legal defense, etc.

Justice is not a luxury

Which is why people who can afford more spend more for lawyers... Bearing in mind that pretty much everybody who needs access to a lawyer can get one already, so the necessity part is covered. Anything beyond that is like eating filet mignon instead of hamburger: Both will fill you up, but one is a better quality.

Mead posted...

Zeus posted...

you certainly defend them far more than I wind up defending Trump

False, and literally not even humanly possible.

You defend entitlements whenever the subject comes up and, unless you're inhuman, clearly it's humanly possible.

Doctor Foxx posted...

Lokarin posted...

Justice is not a luxury

Neither is health care but there you go

Neither is housing, food, beverages, heat, transportation, etc, etc, etc. However, there are cheap versions available and better versions.
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