Board 8 > Persona 5 General Discussion Topic #3 - It's Almost Scary how good I am [spoil?]

(+) Yeah! (+)

Topic 3'time
---

TAGSONA 3!

You should be grateful.
---

Breaking News: Debilitate is still good.
---

Minor vague spoilers: Ann's social link concluded kind of really boring
---

greengravy294 posted...

Minor vague spoilers: Ann's social link concluded kind of really boring

I agree. I also wish I'd known earlier about the time limit???? on Sun.
---

Finally got around to this game, about seven hours in now. This first villain is... Something.
---

greengravy294 posted...

Minor vague spoilers: Ann's social link concluded kind of really boring

I'm only on rank 4 or 5, but that's fitting since it also started really boring.
---

You better not be using that to pull a prank
---

Best party confidant is Yusuke. So great and entertaining
---

Boss of papace 4 was interesting.
---

Just opened Palace 4. Have enough cash to get 4x Invigorate 3 rings before going in too, so hopefully no more SP issues.
---

The Mana Sword posted...

Just opened Palace 4. Have enough cash to get 4x Invigorate 3 rings before going in too, so hopefully no more SP issues.

I'm on Hard and got through palace 5 in one day with only 1

I have to think 3 is overkill
---

I think if you don't mind being particular with micromanaging swapping between members, you can handle the game with 2, at least on normal and not being crazy over leveled.
---

I passed out in the middle of Palace 5 last night

maybe I can finish it before work today
---

Eh, it might be overkill but I can afford them so why not.
---

Yeah, i got 3 and it definitely made the later dungeons less stressful, but at the same time it almost made them only a formality. Rangda made palace 6 a complete joke.
---

Yeah if there's one gameplay balance change I want them to make its to get rid of the SP adhesives or like, make them way harder to acquire somehow (not by money because money is ridiculously plentiful in this game and should probably be rebalanced too)


The more I think about some things in the game the more I can definitely say 'this really does need to have an enhanced version'. Both for gameplay balance reasons and story reasons.

Also unrelated but I can attest that coffee + curry for breakfast is a great combo

SP and money is very difficult and well balanced in the beginning... I think that's fine. Difficulty isn't as important later in the game since you're likely tired of the grind by then. As long as individual boss fights are difficult, it still feels epic.
---

Only in the final dungeon do I realize Kawakami can make coffee without passing time.
---

Man you all are talking about difficulty and balancing, while meanwhile the last JRPG I played was Trails of Cold Steel in which you are pretty much capable of one-shotting many boss fights without even going out of your way to grind or anything like that. (at least in the second game on normal difficulty anyway)

So what I'm saying is it could be a lot worse if you're looking for a game to challenge you.
---

Maxed Lovers S Link that is cool
---

Well Persona 4 also had the Fox making SP restoration trivial about halfway through the game. I think it's fine in this game too. You can only get the accessories at a reasonable price once you have a specific social link at Rank 7 in a game that emphasizes doing Social Links gets you some really good shit. Coffee takes time and I only one-shot dungeon 3 by blowing my entire stockpile. Even if I didn't, I still have a handful of Snuff Souls I could have burned if I wanted to use them. This game mitigates being able to one-shot dungeons by having Mementos as another time-killer and also making boss fights use two days. It's probably something they did intentionally.
---

Yeah I think it's way cooler that social links give you crazy abilities than making them weak to enforce difficulty throughout the game
---

foolm0r0n posted...

SP and money is very difficult and well balanced in the beginning... I think that's fine. Difficulty isn't as important later in the game since you're likely tired of the grind by then. As long as individual boss fights are difficult, it still feels epic.

If you have to grind in a game you're doing it wrong or the game is (and I would say over 80% of the time, especially in well known companies games past the NES and maybe some SNES era, its the player and not the game doing it wrong)

And if you mean 'you're tired of playing the game by then so who cares' then that's a whole other, much deeper problem that shouldn't be brushed aside because you should never get tired of playing a game to the extent you just want to not play it anymore. That means the game is not well made at all, and I would definitely not say that is the case here.

HeroDelTiempo17 posted...

Well Persona 4 also had the Fox making SP restoration trivial about halfway through the game. I think it's fine in this game too. You can only get the accessories at a reasonable price once you have a specific social link at Rank 7 in a game that emphasizes doing Social Links gets you some really good shit. Coffee takes time and I only one-shot dungeon 3 by blowing my entire stockpile. Even if I didn't, I still have a handful of Snuff Souls I could have burned if I wanted to use them. This game mitigates being able to one-shot dungeons by having Mementos as another time-killer and also making boss fights use two days. It's probably something they did intentionally.

You get the ability to make infinite money in the game at rank 2 for Sun. Price is a complete non-issue after that.

And there are plenty of 'crazy abilities' (not that I'd call EITHER of the problem examples here 'crazy abilities' since one is just more options in a shop and one is 'you get all the money ever') in the game that don't completely break it, like pretty much every one of Hifumi's abilities which are all super useful but don't make the game less interesting.

I don't think I have basically ever played an RPG and not been "tired of the grind" by the end. It's just almost no matter what the whole thing becomes formulaic once you figure everything out, and then you just want to push through to the conclusion and move on to the next game or whatever.

Like hell I think the only examples I can think of where that didn't happen to me are SMT: Nocturne and maybe Persona 4.
---

For those people talking about difficulty. I have five words for you.

Evil Smile and Ghastly Wail

There you go...stupid Skadi killed me twice already. Have fun. No weaknesses by the way.
---

Somebody got SMT'd

Anyways I got to the Saving is recommended as the story will advance rapidly from here point at like 8:30 PM last night. I've spent every waking moment since cursing the fact that I needed to sleep and go to work, because I'm not satisfied with where I had to leave off.

Party members learn such good skills. I am having trouble deciding what to keep since it all seems so good.

tcaz2 posted...

If you have to grind in a game you're doing it wrong or the game is

I don't mean grinding in general, I mean the grind, as in the repetitive gameplay loop that you go through over and over and over (in this case, the combat).

tcaz2 posted...

And if you mean 'you're tired of playing the game by then so who cares' then that's a whole other, much deeper problem that shouldn't be brushed aside because you should never get tired of playing a game to the extent you just want to not play it anymore

The game is 100 hours long. Even if you absolutely love the combat, 100 hours of the same gameplay WILL get stale, unless you're super motivated by extrinsic rewards and don't really care about the gameplay itself like SHINE.

That might be a fundamental flaw of the game, or of JRPGs in general, but I don't think it makes the whole game bad. ESPECIALLY if they specifically put in ways to skip the repetition towards the end, so you can choose how much you want to keep going, which Persona always does. Plus, the important thing is the context of the combat inside the larger year-long daily life loop, which is highly addictive and always changing and interesting. Plus this game adds palaces which are super cool even if you ignore combat.

Games with deeper gameplay can be played for thousands of hours because as you get better at the game, there are more complex nuances revealed, and the gameplay basically transforms into another game. JRPGs like never have that, which is just part of the genre. They don't have the advantage of metas and player competition like multiplayer games.
---

I fell asleep in the middle of a battle in palace 5 last night
---

Hmmm must've missed this red panel in Palace 6 somewhere. Wandering around trying to find it

Entrance near the floor slots...stupid panel
---

tcaz2 posted...

You get the ability to make infinite money in the game at rank 2 for Sun. Price is a complete non-issue after that.

And there are plenty of 'crazy abilities' (not that I'd call EITHER of the problem examples here 'crazy abilities' since one is just more options in a shop and one is 'you get all the money ever') in the game that don't completely break it, like pretty much every one of Hifumi's abilities which are all super useful but don't make the game less interesting.

I mean I realize this is just opinion at this point but I don't even think "infinite" money is that good! Equipment is fairly meaningless, you want good defense gear but the attacking gear just needs to be "good enough." Gear is time-gated so you can't skip ahead to ridiculous levels. The only impressive expensive accessories are the Invigorate ones, but like I said earlier it seems like you're more expected to one-shot dungeons. So, most of my extra money goes to social stuff, or messing around with Persona fusion, which is a GREAT thing given the extra Velvet Room mechanics they added that I would have just ignored if I was constantly broke.

Sun 2 and 5 should probably have been switched just because 2 is just way better. But let's be real, it still requires grinding to get amounts of money where you can buy absolutely everything you want, it just makes it easier.
---

ninkendo posted...

I fell asleep in the middle of a battle in palace 5 last night

I've fallen asleep playing this game no less than 3 times already
---

https://twitter.com/xkxyoux/status/853955912016343040?s=09

Helllllllllo Doc!
---

...

I wish I wasn't at school right now. Sheesh.
---

Strife2 posted...

...

I wish I wasn't at work right now. Sheesh.

greengravy294 posted...

Minor vague spoilers: Ann's social link concluded kind of really boring

This is fitting, as Ann as a character is kind of really boring.

Like, she's not offensively bad or anything (which is to say she's not Ryuji) but she's just kind of... there.
---

Ann is solidly in the boring but fine category

She is the polar opposite of Futaba who alternates between amazing and awful
---

Updated rankings post palace 5

Mona>Makoto>>Yusuke>>Futaba>Ann>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ryuji
---

I'd put Futaba in the boring, but slightly annoying category. Ann is totally inoffensive boring. I'm surprised how little she seems to matter for what everybody thought was going to be the main girl of this game

It's because Makoto and Haru are the main girls.
---

Nobody would've guessed that though. Everybody would've assumed Ann was main because first girl means longest time around and whatnot. She feels less relevant than Ken in P3....

swordz9 posted...

I'd put Futaba in the boring, but slightly annoying category. Ann is totally inoffensive boring. I'm surprised how little she seems to matter for what everybody thought was going to be the main girl of this game

Futaba has some amazing lines. I think she is second only to Morgana in great one liners
---

Well I haven't heard any yet then I guess! Most of the PCs in this game could die and I wouldn't even feel anything because they feel like nothing characters

Ann's problem is she is pretty swiftly relegated to irrelevancy the moment Makoto joins the party. Honestly, Ann suffers from the game's lack of lighter looser scenes of just the team hanging out that were more on the SoL side that allowed Chie to stay in the spotlight in Persona 4. Persona 5 doesn't really have those moments.

There's a scene with Makoto and Ann that might as well have Ann say "Here is the main girl crown. Wear it well"
---

Shadow Dino posted...

https://twitter.com/xkxyoux/status/853955912016343040?s=09

Helllllllllo Doc!

Unf.
---

Xiahou Shake posted...

Shadow Dino posted...

https://twitter.com/xkxyoux/status/853955912016343040?s=09

Helllllllllo Doc!

Unf.

---