Current Events > What exactly is an incel?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Incels be like, "I didn't beat you or rape you!! I'm such a nice guy."

Gladius_ posted...

I am only calling misogynists what they are. Misogynists. Do you know why people call sex having misogynists incels? Because they act and behave like them.

But incels are a relatively new movement from the early 2010s. Sex-havers were doing that stuff first!

Gladius_ posted...

It also pisses them off because they look down on them too. That's why any insult is used. For the record, I try to use incel only when referring to actual incels but I do understand why some use it as an insult. Because it is and should be. Being a hateful person should be degrading. Let's not legitimize hate.

Insulting them for being a hateful person should be enough. Adding celibacy in a case where it's not relevant (i.e. the misogynist is not celibate) means one irrationally views celibacy as a negative. Simple as.

Gladius_ posted...

"Frustrated" Lol. "Poising the image." You mean people who comitted acts of terrorism? Think of the terrorists! I have gotten frustrated in my life. Even at people. I didn't become a racist or sexist over it. I have been assaulted and still don't hate men.

I realize they're already bad enough as it is but it still doesn't justify propaganda beyond the scope of what they're actually guilty of. Like Saddam's Iraq sucked but it was still wrong for Bush to lie about him having nuclear weapons.

Gladius_ posted...

So there's no "you being decent" if you claimed I hate men it would be a ridiculous claim based on a lie.

Decent relative to your nonsensical accusations based on a simple disagreement over when it's appropriate to target sex lives.

Gladius_ posted...

If you know it would get you modded then it's probably not appropriate.

I don't know what gets people modded, it's not consistent at all.

Gladius_ posted...

If you shame a women for their sexuality or sexual practices then you are exhibiting sexism and before you pull the tired "but that's what you're doing!" No I'm not because as repeatedly stated.. I have no issues with men who are down on their luck and feel getting a partner is impossible. That is until said hypothetical guy turns around and hates women over it.

You're still promoting a double standard unless you accept it as fair game for a woman with negative views of men to be attacked over her sexual practices.

TerraSeeker posted...

Someone who wants to have sex but can't. So if you want to have sex tonight but can't tonight that would be you.

Except in pretty much most people's case, can't equals: I don't want to leave the house and talk to people and potentially get rejected.

Gladius_ posted...

You're looking at things too literal. Most people don't care how literal something is. You're arguing when you call someone a turd you should just call out the bad behavior because they weren't released from the bowels. It doesn't matter. Incels are associated with certain behaviors and when people are perceived to have those behaviors they're going to be called incels. If they don't want to be called incels then they shouldn't exhibit incel like behavior. Sometimes the insult is completely misused but that's true of anything and ultimately irrelevant.

Well I think it's relevant and that people should avoid punching down towards disenfranchised groups with their insults. It places undue stigma on incels for every man who hates women to be called an incel. It means that even if the actual incels cleaned up and got their guys to stop being death cults they would still be harassed over what guys who have nothing to do with incels do.

Gladius_ posted...

No one's targeting sex lives. This is a strawman you keep going back to. No one here has bashed virgins, no one here has insulted men for not having sex, we're attacking the misogyny.

Including anything related to the individual's sexual activity in the insult is targeting their sex life.

Gladius_ posted...

So they're not actually incels and this doesn't refute my post that incels are bad and dangerous? Are you really going to pretend someone being called an incel is what I am referring to when I say 99% of incels are dangerous?

I was replying to someone else in that post.

Gladius_ posted...

If you are referring to yourself.. you admitted you have "no chance" and "aren't going to further your gene pool", you jump to the defense of incels in every incel related thread, and have an "opinion on women behaviors" you can't say without fear of being modded. So...

That's a misquote. You may be conflating my comments with those of other people who've discussed similar subjects. I don't recall saying anything about gene pools.

Stalking is also a known incel behavior.

Asherlee10 posted...

What difference does this make? The overlap of misogynists and incels is quite high. I am not understanding the point you are trying to make by fighting this specific thing.

Not really, incels are a fraction of the internet while there are dozens of millions of misogynistic men in general.

Gladius_ posted...

The equivalent to the incel community is the FDS community which teaches men are a commodity to be used and women shouldn't seek long term relationships, use the men for their finances, and ditch them when they're done. This community is as hostile as the incel community and overlaps with the TERF community. It is vile and disgusting and no one here will care if you challenge the FDS mindset or insult them. The FDS community should be equally purged from social media if they haven't already. You won't hear anyone say otherwise.

No, that would get pushback because FDS has notable differences from the incel community. There's a reason FDS was never actually banned from Reddit. FDS is more the opposite of the red pill.

Let's get to the heart of the matter. You take umbrage with the label incel, and view it as unfairly attacking a marginalized group with prejudice?

I guess I'm in the "sex-haver" group and need to check my privilege!

Gladius_ posted...

Cults based around sexism is not an oppressed group so there's no punching down.

Groups formed based on exclusion from something or a lack of something are lower in hierarchy than people not facing the same problem.

Gladius_ posted...

If they stopped being incels and move out of the incel cult mindset they'll stop being "Harassed" because they'll no longer be acting with hatred towards women.

No, since as said "incel" is an overused term. People have been called incels simply for not liking Brie Larson saying she doesn't care what middle aged white men think about some movies. That subject doesn't even have anything to do with sex.

Gladius_ posted...

No it's not. The misogyny is being targeted and the fact that the group identifies around the misogyny.

Which is accurate when they're in a group about sexual bitterness. But when they're not in a group about sexual bitterness then it's inappropriate to take a random jab a people who are. That's just hitting the sore points of unrelated unfortunate people for no reason.

CSCA33 posted...

Let's get to the heart of the matter. You take umbrage with the label incel, and view it as unfairly attacking a marginalized group with prejudice?

When it is misused.

Gladius_ posted...

What's your sex life like?"

Inohira: A community that hates women.

"Weird sex life."

You're stripping context. Incels hate women specifically over romantic/sexual exclusion. That is different from how other groups may hate women simply for existing.

Asherlee10 posted...

Why do you feel it's important to split hairs on specifically how two groups hate women?

I just value accuracy and not randomly attacking people already sensitive about their misfortunes in life. I feel not being precise on such matters helps further embitter and alienate people.

Gladius_ posted...

The cause is irrelevant. There's people who hate women because they were abused by a woman. That's also irrelevant. The reason DOES not matter. Nothing justifies sexism.

That's not the point though. The point is that there are different ways to handle different groups. Lazily treating them the same is emotional and unproductive. Attacking a misogynist over stuff that is irrelevant to him (i.e. calling him an incel when he's not) does nothing to get him to reflect on his point and just reinforces his belief that liberals are ignorant morons who don't know anything. And attacking incel misogynists disproportionately relative to oppressive misogynists just reinforces anti-feminist beliefs that the modern movement is about sticking it to men rather than change, explaining why modern feminists so heavily focus on low social hierarchy men who are easy targets instead of the patriarchs, and only really cares about women's struggles while looking for any opportunity to hold men's struggles against them. None of this makes someone on the fence more likely to want to be a liberal. Inaccuracy is bad and there is no excuse for it, either.

It reminds me of how in another area of politics the progressives like Bernie who know how to sympathize with the grievances of the rural white working class are beloved in midwestern swing states while the progressives who just call them racist are utterly despised there. It's the difference between outreach and circlrjerking, and doing the former doesn't even require forfeiting any of your political goals.

Gladius_ posted...

We are jabbing at people who hate women and are misogynists.

Do it accurately is all I'm saying. Bullshit doesn't suddenly become acceptable in the name of civil rights.

There is literally no good reason to call a guy who's not either identifying as one or otherwise expressing entitlement to sex or hatred of women specifically over not having sex an "incel".

Gladius_ posted...

By your logic I'd have a right to hate men since I was assaulted. I don't. It was one man who did that to me. Not the entire sex.

To be fair that is different from the incel thing. In the incel's case all women are actually not having sex with him. >_>

And again I'm not saying different explanations are justifications, but that depending on one's explanation there are different ways to open dialogue with them.

Gladius_ posted...

You're telling me you are so selfish you don't care about future generations of children, simply because you won't be alive to see it, and you won't ever have children, but for whatever reason you have "strong sympathy" for the "incels" for no reason?

I exist in the same space and would prefer not to get killed in a mass shooting or something. And me not caring to sacrifice my personal priorities in favor of future generations does not mean I wouldn't defend them from inaccuracy or other undue stigma.

Gladius_ posted...

Bull. You made it clear in a previous debate by your own ADMITTANCE you only care about things that pertain to you. So by process of elimination. You're likely an incel and are too ashamed to even admit it. Which is ironic.

I defend all sorts of groups from inaccuracy. I've defended Democrats and Republicans but I can't be in both groups at once. I am also defending sex-havers from being falsely labeled incels along with incels being blamed for things they didn't do, but again cannot be in both groups at once. I also clarified that FDS is not directly comparable to incels, even though I'm definitely not a member of FDS.

I simply have a strong personal commitment to accuracy.

Murphiroth posted...

Cowardly, got it.

And yeah that's definitely not the full context.

Murphiroth posted...

What mod?

I forget the game, but it's character selection allows you to pick the gender options he/him, she/her, or they/them.

Some deeply sad people didn't like that last one, so they made a mod that removes the option to even have a gender in the first place.

Inohira is unable to give a good reason as to why such a mod shouldn't have been removed.

Me. I am an incel. A real incel mind you, not one of those new "incels" who bring dishonor on our incel clan.

I feel like the people who get really invested in "You can be an incel without being misogynistic" tend to just tell on themselves by the end of the conversation anyway. Even if that was true at one point, the people who most loudly and proudly call themselves incels (and even tbh most of the mentality behind identifying that way) should make you *not* want to identify that way even if you qualify as "wanting to have sex but not being successful with women".

Anteaterking posted...

I feel like the people who get really invested in "You can be an incel without being misogynistic" tend to just tell on themselves by the end of the conversation anyway. Even if that was true at one point, the people who most loudly and proudly call themselves incels (and even tbh most of the mentality behind identifying that way) should make you *not* want to identify that way even if you qualify as "wanting to have sex but not being successful with women".

It's not incorrect though. I am an incel but I have a lot of respect for women. I'm more distrustful towards men if anything. My father left me right during a difficult time in my childhood and I was raised by a single mother who taught me to respect people.

It is unfortunate that the term "incel" has another meaning today but I don't have an alternative term to represent my people, few as we may be. I don't feel represented by the "virgin" label. Perhaps we need a new label to distance ourselves from the brotherhood of dark incels.

Gladius_ posted...

and that the right doesn't have their best interests at heart.

As opposed to people who don't care how badly they get misrepresented or what they're even complaining about? That's a tall task.

Gladius_ posted...

Again, I said I don't do this, repeatedly but you're not going to stop people from doing that. Why? Someone who acts like a nazi is going to be called a nazi. Even if there are literal nazi's and the person isn't a literal nazi. People associate incels with sexism. So when people see sexist statements? They're going to draw the line of "Ah, an incel."

And likewise a Republican will clarify, "I'm not a Nazi, I support Israel." And the discussion gets dragged into semantics, deflecting from the actual issue that the Republican is a bigot. It just ain't necessary.

Gladius_ posted...

I would actually argue I have a better reason to hate than they do.

Obviously being physically assaulted is worse than not having sex. That shouldn't require being stated.

Gladius_ posted...

No one cares to open dialogue with them.

That's also fine. But again still doesn't justify misrepresentation.

Gladius_ posted...

My goal is to go around these groups. Showcase how their rhetoric is baseless, how weak their arguments are, how their mindset hurts others, I'm more interested in swaying the people around them, and starving them out of future membership by turning the populace against them.

Judging from how the manosphere groups are growing people are not doing a good job of that.

Again it's cirlejerking vs. outreach, being too broad in your offense is repellant to those on the fence.

being too broad in your offense is repellant to those on the fence.

We got some fence sitters that need kowtowing? Is this a real argument now?

CSCA33 posted...

We got some fence sitters that need kowtowing? Is this a real argument now?

That isn't incorrect though. I'm more of an ass sitter myself but coming on too strong isn't really going to do anyone any favors. I believe it's best to choose your battles carefully so as to maximize impact. You'll convince more people by striking critical blows in their weak spots.

Wait we were talking about debate, not combat...

fence sitters need to figure their shit out. it takes time, I know. they still gotta put in the work themselves to get down from that fence though.

A miserable little pile of secrets!

CSCA33 posted...

fence sitters need to figure their shit out. it takes time, I know. they still gotta put in the work themselves to get down from that fence though.

Remember that Humphrey Dumplestein was on the fence. Instead of getting down carefully, he fell and cracked his ass. None of the king's men and none of the king's horses could get his shit together again.

I always open my pickle jars. My hands are very small and frail though so I wear special grip strengthening gloves and use many tricks and tools.

Y'all just want to argue in favor of your own position, don't you?

When I provided a reasoned response earlier in the topic I stopped getting replies.

Interesting.

BloodMoon7 posted...

Remember that Humphrey Dumplestein was on the fence. Instead of getting down carefully, he fell and cracked his ass. None of the king's men and none of the king's horses could get his shit together again.

Lol

KanWan posted...

An incel is a topic on GameFAQS

This is a fun one. Keep going y'all!

Gladius_ posted...

Some men have been poor at adapting. Either because they're too shy to make an effort to approach a woman, too beaten down on rhetoric telling them it "isn't manly" to seek help, support networks, etc or are too set in old fashioned thinking that women by and large want nothing to do with other than move away from.

I imagine modern teachings are contributing to making more men too shy to approach women. Hence why the red pill is promoted as a course correction.

Gladius_ posted...

That's why you try to de-platform and discredit the groups that are advocating people to give up. Regardless, so long as we eliminate the right wing groups long enough, the situation will balance itself out. Why? Those who can adapt and reproduce? Are going to create the next generation. Those that can't? Are going to move out of the gene pool.

But again that's the just world fallacy at work. The men failing to reproduce are not any more likely to be morally negative than the men who do. Studies have found that bullies and sociopaths actually have more sex. Dominant, aggressive men are still out getting laid, as shown by rising domestic abuse rates.

People are assuming nature's working as intended and that the decrease in men having sex is just liberated women rightfully shunning terrible men at rates they once couldn't afford to. But that's just not reflected in the statistics. The reality is that many decent men are also falling through the cracks. They get taught all sorts of stories about creepiness and etiquette and lose the confidence to approach at all because they don't want to bother women. And of the men still willing to pursue women, a higher percentage of them than previously are selfish and inconsiderate in nature.

Gladius_ posted...

There you go defending the right again. Didn't take long for that to happen.

I'm just saying I've seen it happen before to the benefit of the right. There was Gamergate, which was created by misogynistic culture warriors, but ended up exposing legitimate ethical concerns in gaming journalism that drew normal hardcore gamers into the fight. But liberal/feminist media treated the latter the same as the former and dismissed it all as misogyny, even the valid complaints. Steve Bannon and Milo Yiannopolous opportunistically used the dispute to funnel these otherwise non-partisan gamers into the alt-right and eventually to Trump, simply by providing the only major media outlet willing to platform the more legitimate complaints (even if it was alongside the misogyny).

Likewise with the men's rights, it started as and for decades was purely a reactionary anti-woman movement, but as society grew more progressive lured in men who genuinely just wanted to shine a spotlight on how men are penalized by outdated gender expectations. But many feminists treat the latter the same as the former, simply for identifying with the MRM, risking making those men direct enemies of feminism when they may not have otherwise been.

And everyone's seen the Trump voter - non-voter debate play out. I just don't believe in absolutism. I don't think everyone not on my side is equally opposed to my side. And I try to find the validity if any behind what they're saying before deciding how I respond to them, unless they've made civil discourse impossible.

TC is a known alt-right Trumper who spends most of their time suspended. Is there another reason this topic got so many replies, or did people just take the bait?

U guys write alot

StealThisSheen posted...

TC is a known alt-right Trumper who spends most of their time suspended. Is there another reason this topic got so many replies, or did people just take the bait?

When have u seen me make one smart comment about politics?

Jx1010 posted...

When have u seen me make one smart comment about politics?

This post literally only agrees with what my post says. Thanks for admitting it?

StealThisSheen posted...

This post literally only agrees with what my post says. Thanks for admitting it?

U still didnt answer my question, when have u seen me make one smart comment about politics?

Jx1010 posted...

U still didnt answer my question, when have u seen me make one smart comment about politics?

That's literally my point. You never have. You only ever regurgitate alt right bullshit. Again, all you're doing is agreeing with me.

StealThisSheen posted...

That's literally my point. You never have. You only ever regurgitate alt right bullshit. Again, all you're doing is agreeing with me.

I get all my political stuff from south park or whatever meme I see online, yet people like u get triggered. One cant make fun of politics geez, lighten up

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


he did walk right into that one huh?