Current Events > Charlie Kirk believes that the Founding Fathers were NOT in favor of slavery.

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://twitter.com/knownothingtv/status/1422730521797447684?s=21

Big brain, tiny face.

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Facts don't mean anything if they feel it isn't true. That's the conservative way.

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Uh what, is it another Thomas Jefferson I'm thinking of that owned over 100 slaves?

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"Heretical". Oooh, I like that.

Yo motherfuckers, your country was founded by slave owners, and they fucking owned slaves, loved owning fucking slaves and loved fucking owned slaves. I'm the goddamn Heretic. Abolish the USA.

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An oversimplification. George Washington and Thomas Jefferson both came to oppose it during their life times despite obviously having been for it earlier. Really, the Founding Fathers were not a monolith and their attitudes towards slavery varied.

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A few indeed did oppose slavery. Some others opposed it later in life but were silent or supporters before.

A lot of them owned slaves themselves though and either enthusiastically supported it or supported out cowardly greeed.

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There were a few who were vehemently opposed. Not enough obviously, and none of the really huge names

JimmyFraska posted...

There were a few who were vehemently opposed. Not enough obviously, and none of the really huge names

John Adams being the most note worthy.

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And this is why debating intellectually dishonest grifters like Kirk is a waste of fucking time.

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ImAMarvel posted...

...then why did they permit it into the Union? lol

political expediency.

"Let's tell the king to fuck off, and also ditch slavery" would never have gotten the southern colonies to go along.

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He isnt very bright.

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We he's kinda right. Slavery was a contentious issue even then

IShall_Run_Amok posted...

"Heretical". Oooh, I like that.

Yo motherfuckers, your country was founded by slave owners, and they fucking owned slaves, loved owning fucking slaves and loved fucking owned slaves. I'm the goddamn Heretic. Abolish the USA.

Slavery was all over the world. There wasn't anything uniquely awful about America in this regard

au_gold posted...

Stop editing his face to look bigger

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We know the names of Washington's slaves, and he shifted them in and out of Virginia so they didn't go free after a certain amount of time.

The constitution did have a clause that would eventually end the triangle trade, but that was all, it was not a clause to grant equality or citizenship to the enslaved, there was no plan for America to be a country of all people, it was for white people, particularly British people.

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General rule for founding fathers:
Agrarian = slaves, also Thomas Jefferson fucked his slaves.
Lawyers = no slaves
Franklin = inherited slaves somehow, then he became an abolitionist.

unnamedsoldier posted...

Slavery was all over the world. There wasn't anything uniquely awful about America in this regard

What a hot take.

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DeadBankerDream posted...

What a hot take.

It's a fair take.

The US, for about as long as the US has existed, has been very slow to adopt social movements, and then instantly becomes an obnoxious evangelist for that same movement it resisted.

lol Leave it to the republicans to keep pushing their bullshit narrative of "Our white ancestors really weren't pro slavery!" to try and whitewash their cruel, barbaric human rights offences of the past, while also further marginalizing minority contributions to this country. The true enemy of mankind couldn't be anymore obvious.

Number090684 posted...

lol Leave it to the republicans to keep pushing their bullshit narrative of "Our white ancestors really weren't pro slavery!" to try and whitewash their cruel, barbaric human rights offences of the past, while also further marginalizing minority contributions to this country.

Completely fair, if the republicans are claiming John Adams.
The guy was a completely authoritarian dick who gutted everything Washington tried to establish, so yeah, probably.

Is that why my ancestors didn't count as an entire person, Kirk?

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DeadBankerDream posted...

What a hot take.

That dude fits the tag I gave him perfect

lmao vaush sounds like alt left peterson

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Umbreon posted...

Is that why my ancestors didn't count as an entire person, Kirk?

Yes. Yes it is.
The South wanted slaves to count as "persons" for Representatives, but sure as shit wasn't going to let them vote. The northern states had to figure out some way to get the south to go along long enough to get the constitution ratified.

But slavery wasn't outlawed from the very beginning, which is all that matters in determining if they were for it or not.

Of course, slavery still isn't 100% outlawed but that's another story...

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Umbreon posted...

Of course, slavery still isn't 100% outlawed but that's another story...

Elaborate, please.

Some of them weren't.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Elaborate, please.

slavery is still legal for people in prison

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Doe posted...

slavery is still legal for people in prison

13th Amendment

Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

huh. I have to simultaneously agree and disagree.

Questionmarktarius posted...

Elaborate, please.

Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

Or in simple terms.

"Slavery to punish prisoners." Because we still have for profit prisons that benefit more from people being in jail than being rehabilitated.

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Umbreon posted...

"Slavery to punish prisoners." Because we still have for profit prisons that benefit more from people being in jail than being rehabilitated.

"American Justice" is pretty fucked up, yes.

Umbreon posted...

"Slavery to punish prisoners." Because we still have for profit prisons that benefit more from people being in jail than being rehabilitated.

even then it opens the huge loophole of people getting incarcerated for trivial bullshit like doing marijuana and getting enslaved for it.

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Umbreon posted...

Or in simple terms.

"Slavery to punish prisoners." Because we still have for profit prisons that benefit more from people being in jail than being rehabilitated.

For profit prisons are BS I agree. But let me drop a nugget of truth. Inmates that have jobs tend to get in less bullshit than the jobless ones (like fights or causing the officers problems in general). Profit prisons are BS cause they go outta of there way to try to keep them there as long as possible. I.e. doing everything to fuck up any early release they could get

Where I work a inmate having a job is considered a privellage cause there aint enough to go around. You'd be surprised how many beg for a job. And most of the jobs dont even work them long enough to be normal part time hours.

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Doe posted...

even then it opens the huge loophole of people getting incarcerated for trivial bullshit like doing marijuana and getting enslaved for it.

Exactly.

Oh and depending on the state and/or how much you were caught with, that counts as a felony. Also known as "You get punished even after doing your time".

Voting rights? You're a felon, you don't get that anymore.

Getting a job? Did you check that "Have you committed a felony" box? Sweet, we needed to test out our shredder!

Apparently denying someone rights or the ability to survive after paying their dues is supposed to make them less likely to commit more crime? Or 'crime' if you were just smoking pot and being a danger to absolutely no one.

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mooreandrew58 posted...

For profit prisons are BS I agree. But let me drop a nugget of truth. Inmates that have jobs tend to get in less bullshit than the jobless ones (like fights or causing the officers problems in general).

Yeah, prisons actually working towards rehabilitation probably give legitimate jobs that help people stay out of trouble.

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Umbreon posted...

Exactly.

Oh and depending on the state and/or how much you were caught with, that counts as a felony. Also known as "You get punished even after doing your time".

Voting rights? You're a felon, you don't get that anymore.

Getting a job? Did you check that "Have you committed a felony" box? Sweet, we needed to test out our shredder!

Apparently denying someone rights or the ability to survive after paying their dues is supposed to make them less likely to commit more crime? Or 'crime' if you were just smoking pot and being a danger to absolutely no one.

I have not met a single person in prison for just weed. Like that's not as common as y'all make out. They may go to jail but detainees in jail dont work. At least in my state. Show someome who has felony charges for nothing but a quarter bag of weed. Only people in my unit in for nothing but drugs it was meth at a minimum and even that typically had manufacturing or dealing charges attached

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mooreandrew58 posted...

I have not met a single person in prison for just weed. Like that's not as common as y'all make out.

Tommy Chong went to prison because his son sold bongs.

mooreandrew58 posted...

I have not met a single person in prison for just weed. Like that's not as common as y'all make out.

Fair enough if you haven't met a person like that personally, but even one person going to jail for that is part of the many problems with our justice system.

But switch out drugs with another felony... and we still punish those people after they do their time.

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totalnerdken posted...

I'm annoyed that a rich drug, cocaine has a lighter sentence than a poor drug, crack even though both basically do the same thing.

That's what having two justice systems is about.

They'd make an example out of me for smoking some Mary Jane, but if some rich kid raped someone his daddy would get him off light because "We can't let 30 minutes of fun ruin his entire life! Look at him, he's so sad he can't even eat his steak anymore! "

Also bail is basically a wealth check.

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I keep seeing this as Captain Kirk.


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Umbreon posted...

Fair enough if you haven't met a person like that personally, but even one person going to jail for that is part of the many problems with our justice system.

But switch out drugs with another felony... and we still punish those people after they do their time.

Most crimes are justified in sending them to prison. Most of my unit is sex offenders murderers breaking and entering assaults. Assaults on a female (yea they specify that in the charge) and drugs of a much higher danger than weed. And ive only met one in for only possesion which tells me he had a good amount.

Only guy I know with weed charges had 14 plants plus a murder charge all in the same incident. If hes telling the truth the murder was home defense (I don't say self cause he was allegedly protecting his family too) but due to the plants and the fact other dude was a rival drug dealer. Yeah they threw the book at him

I do feel for him cause as he said he'd gladly take the weed charges but he didnt feel the murder charge was justified. But I understand why they slapped itnon him too

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