Poll of the Day > I liked Fallout 3 (for the looting, same with Skryim), but not Fallout NV

(+) Yeah! (+)

ive stopped listening to games

just read the subtitles whatever
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Sahuagin posted...

- the peaceful music and the combat music
- the real looking and feeling broken concrete and crumbling city, in particular the way the broken concrete looks with rebars sticking out of it, etc.
- the sounds made by mirelurks
- the way the radios sound
- the way the debris objects look and sound (the way nuka cola quantum looks)
- the way gunshots sound and guns are animated
- the way explosions sound
- the way "dismembering" sounds
- the way ghouls sound (which I personally find hilarious)
- the rag-dolling
- probably one the biggest is the explosion system; the way cars explode is *amazing*,
- the projectile system as well, the way you can see bullets whiz by but also *hear* them whiz by (or feel them hit you)
- the lighting system

That's so silly. Every one of those is in NV because they re-used tons of the assets. If anything there's MORE of this stuff because there's more enemies and more guns, etc. There's actual explosive weapons besides the rocket launcher as well so double win.

-shrug-

Some people are just very hard-headed.
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TallTamryu posted...

If anything there's MORE of this stuff

more of what? more sounds? the point is not that it has "gun sounds" it's that the gun sounds are satisfying. listen to the hunting rifle in F3 compared to the guns sounds in NV. the NV guns look duller, sound duller, and IIRC they tend to have more ammo and do less damage, too, requiring more shots. the end result is (to me) a less satisfying experience, despite the pieces being ostensibly the same.
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Sahuagin posted...

more of what? more sounds? the point is not that it has "gun sounds" it's that the gun sounds are satisfying. listen to the hunting rifle in F3 compared to the guns sounds in NV.

Those same sounds are IN NV as well, that's the point. And no, they're definitely not worse. Feel free to watch youtube clips of the guns in both games. Some quite nice sounding stuff in both games, just NV has more of it. Some "meh" and then some amazing ones.

the NV guns look duller, sound duller, and IIRC they tend to have more ammo and do less damage, too, requiring more shots

I feel like you didn't play the game or get very far at all.

I mean I also played FO3 first, but wasn't disappointed at all playing NV second. I get the feeling if you played NV first you'd think the exact opposite. That's the sort of things your posts point to. We'll never know if that would be true or not though.

Only thing that 3 ever did better (besides building the current system the new games are based on) is the neat and iconic environments. In a way Bethesda took the "easy way out" and modeled it after something great in real life most people already know about. So yeah, it's going to look great seeing stuff you've seen before in pictures/person broken down and half destroyed. Its hard to beat that making up your own junk places.

That said Megaton, while a really stupid idea and doesn't even make sense in FO world, looked prettty alright...as did Rivet City.

Silly reasons that sound made up to not like NV though. There's reasons to dislike it, but nothing I've seen listed so far beyond "doesn't feel right to me". -shrug-

I am done.
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You know you guys can just play the games you like

You dont have to convince everyone else that you like the best thing
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Slobs don't get that Fallout New Vegas is very refined throughout, which included loot which the tc somehow has a problem with. In fo3 when you needed anything you just go to the nearest spawned treasure and you usually get what you want. In New Vegas you go to a place that reasonably would have that item, so the parts you need for Prim Slim would be found in the Repcon center. This deliberate kind of searching makes exploration feel like you've earned your loot instead of having been fed like a simpleton by a loot list. Fine tuning each game element from story to sidequest creates a sentient experience, it shows the kind of sophistication fo3 fans have been envious and furious over for over nearly a decade now. It's baffling how jealousy can make an enthusiastic fan hold onto fo3 like an object of affection but kick FNV down because it's seen as an invalidation.

TallTamryu posted...

I feel like you didn't play the game or get very far at all.

played through exactly once from beginning to end. played F3 like maybe 5+ times all the way through.

TallTamryu posted...

I mean I also played FO3 first, but wasn't disappointed at all playing NV second. I get the feeling if you played NV first you'd think the exact opposite. That's the sort of things your posts point to. We'll never know if that would be true or not though.

it's possible but I doubt it. I didn't like F3 at first in fact, it took like my third attempt to play to actually get hooked.

TallTamryu posted...

Those same sounds are IN NV as well, that's the point. And no, they're definitely not worse. Feel free to watch youtube clips of the guns in both games. Some quite nice sounding stuff in both games, just NV has more of it. Some "meh" and then some amazing ones.

it's not about this one specific thing anyway, that was the point. I'm not saying "F3 had better gun sounds, that's why it's a better game". it's the whole package. the subway tunnels, the lighting/pixel shading, the particle system, the music, the enemies, the environments. it all adds up to a very unique experience that can only be had in one place, and not even NV the game most similar to it there will ever be can capture that experience. (it captures its own experience, of course, but one I subjectively enjoy significantly less.)

so, this is like the third "rebuttal" to what I've said that has completely missed the point of what I'm saying.

a proper counter-argument to what I'm saying is to say whether or not you found the "total aesthetic" as I've described it better in NV than in F3. has anyone? maybe you like the game more, but does anyone appreciate the overall atmosphere and aesthetic of NV more than F3? is exploring the mojave a thoroughly more enjoyable and satisfying experience than exploring the DC wasteland?
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3 has more finesse than nv by a mile

it was rushed to come out, and it suffered greatly for that

nv is not a better game than 3 in a single way
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Basically: Should I get FO4 in the Steam Sale or not? The only thing I liked about NV was the Strip itself... not to say I hated the game, but that I would have preferred FO3
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Sahuagin posted...

a proper counter-argument to what I'm saying is to say whether or not you found the "total aesthetic" as I've described it better in NV than in F3. has anyone? maybe you like the game more, but does anyone appreciate the overall atmosphere and aesthetic of NV more than F3? is exploring the mojave a thoroughly more enjoyable and satisfying experience than exploring the DC wasteland?

I would say yes to every single one of those things.

Even at the most basic level, the overall "orange-y/brown" aesthetic that's at the core of NV design looks better to me than the sickly green aesthetic of Fallout 3 (even the amber Pip-Boy filter looks better than the green one). On a more granular level, I'd argue that NV takes most of what 3 does in general with design and tone and does it far better.

In terms of music and general sound, I'd easily say I prefer NV. In terms of mechanics, combat felt more fulfilling in NV (in 3, it felt so crap it made VATS almost a necessity, but in NV I was far more likely to free shoot rather than depend entirely on VATS), and NV added in a lot more complexity that was present in the original Fallout games, but which Fallout 3 stripped out in an attempt to be more generally appealing to casual gamers. In terms of characterization and plot, NV blows 3 out of the water in every possible way.

As for exploration, I'd easily say NV does it far better than 3 does (and honestly, most of the time better than 4 does as well). I've explored every inch of the Mojave multiple times in multiple runs. In Fallout 3, I couldn't even bring myself to care to explore most of the Capital Wasteland even once, because most of what I did find felt utterly pointless and relatively dull. Every minor side-mission in 3 feels like an unconnected anecdote, often built entirely around a single one-note joke that someone in the writing brainstorming session probably thought was funny. NV at least tends to integrate its side-missions into the overall setting and narrative, making it feel like a living, breathing world.

Fallout 3 also has terrible map design, which both NV and 4 do much, much better. Downtown Boston is actually somewhat fun and interesting to explore - downtown Washington DC is a painful slog that you have to endure to get where you're going and unlock the fast travel points so you can avoid ever having to go through downtown again.



helIy posted...

nv is not a better game than 3 in a single way

I can't think of a single thing or aspect of game design that I would say Fallout 3 does better than New Vegas. I consider NV better than 3 in every conceivable way (and better than 4 in a lot of ways).

Even the bugginess (which is something that people tend to bring up in 3 vs NV arguments to support 3) doesn't really mean much to me, because NV is relatively fine post-patching (and no one should ever buy ANY game made in whole or in part by Bethesda at launch, because bugs are expected and will need to be patched over a period of months before the game becomes fully worthwhile). I actually had more crashes, freezes, glitches, and problems while playing Fallout 3 than I did NV (and most of the bugs in NV are generally the fault of being built in Fallout 3's engine with Fallout 3's assets anyway).


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The map felt empty and I didn't like how they forced you to go in a certain path or face those flying fucks wayyyy before you were ready.
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Fallout 3 doesnt have Cazadors

There is that at least
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SmokeMassTree posted...

The map felt empty and I didn't like how they forced you to go in a certain path or face those flying fucks wayyyy before you were ready.

I really don't get the "map felt empty" when spawns are more constant and there are also Legion encounters. New Vegas feels empty because it has to, it's the end of the fucking world pretty much. The only thing I miss from FO3 is the Brotherhood was actually a faction with roaming patrols and stuff and it was funny to see them fighting other factions in random encounters, they're relegated to the Bunker in NV.

Regarding Cazadors, they're quite hard if you don't shoot their wings. Once you cripple their wings, they will NEVER catch you if you're weating light armor or no armor. You can just kite away and kill them with a Hunting Rifle or even a shotgun. And I also don't see how you're forced to face them. If you follow the standard route, you don't find them until the wind farm which isn't even a part of the main quest, and even then, there's a bunch of young ones which die pretty quickly.

In fact, there's not a single forced Cazador encounter on the main quest. The ones that come to mind are the ones for the Thorn eggs quest, some around one of the stations for the camp Forlong Hope quest and I think there are some around Calville Bay for the Volare! quest.
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I already expressed in the OP that my main joy with FO3, looting, was weaker in NV
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ParanoidObsessive posted...

Y'all did it now
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I live in dc and I found it boring. I even found the street I lived on.

All 3 was subways and crumbled buildings. It sucked.
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Sahuagin posted...

the enemies

Cazadors are fucking annoying.

Lokarin posted...

Basically: Should I get FO4 in the Steam Sale or not? The only thing I liked about NV was the Strip itself... not to say I hated the game, but that I would have preferred FO3

Only worth it for the GOTY I'd say if you really want it since it has all the DLC as far as I know. The settlement system is the only really bad thing about it.

ParanoidObsessive posted...

I can't think of a single thing or aspect of game design that I would say Fallout 3 does better than New Vegas. I consider NV better than 3 in every conceivable way (and better than 4 in a lot of ways).

No cazadors.

HagenEx posted...

I really don't get the "map felt empty" when spawns are more constant and there are also Legion encounters. New Vegas feels empty because it has to, it's the end of the fucking world pretty much. The only thing I miss from FO3 is the Brotherhood was actually a faction with roaming patrols and stuff and it was funny to see them fighting other factions in random encounters, they're relegated to the Bunker in NV.

Regarding Cazadors, they're quite hard if you don't shoot their wings. Once you cripple their wings, they will NEVER catch you if you're weating light armor or no armor. You can just kite away and kill them with a Hunting Rifle or even a shotgun. And I also don't see how you're forced to face them. If you follow the standard route, you don't find them until the wind farm which isn't even a part of the main quest, and even then, there's a bunch of young ones which die pretty quickly.

In fact, there's not a single forced Cazador encounter on the main quest. The ones that come to mind are the ones for the Thorn eggs quest, some around one of the stations for the camp Forlong Hope quest and I think there are some around Calville Bay for the Volare! quest

I guess you never explore in a Fallout game or try to unlock fast travel points.
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Revelation34 posted...

HagenEx posted...

I really don't get the "map felt empty" when spawns are more constant and there are also Legion encounters. New Vegas feels empty because it has to, it's the end of the fucking world pretty much. The only thing I miss from FO3 is the Brotherhood was actually a faction with roaming patrols and stuff and it was funny to see them fighting other factions in random encounters, they're relegated to the Bunker in NV.

Regarding Cazadors, they're quite hard if you don't shoot their wings. Once you cripple their wings, they will NEVER catch you if you're weating light armor or no armor. You can just kite away and kill them with a Hunting Rifle or even a shotgun. And I also don't see how you're forced to face them. If you follow the standard route, you don't find them until the wind farm which isn't even a part of the main quest, and even then, there's a bunch of young ones which die pretty quickly.

In fact, there's not a single forced Cazador encounter on the main quest. The ones that come to mind are the ones for the Thorn eggs quest, some around one of the stations for the camp Forlong Hope quest and I think there are some around Calville Bay for the Volare! quest

I guess you never explore in a Fallout game or try to unlock fast travel points.

That's the thing. If you're having trouble with Cazadors, then it's because you're trying to skip content. It's only natural that you're getting a challenge when you want to have an alternate route. If you follow the natural main quest progression, by the time you face Cazadors you will be able to cripple one of their wings with a single shot from your trusty Sniper Rifle, That Gun, Lucky, and so on, and from then on, it's a piece of cake.

Also, getting ambushed by them is quite hard, their red indicators on the compass keep moving like crazy and they're easy to spot from afar because of how much they move.
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Cazadors make NV amazing. It's such a terrifying concept.
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EvilMegas posted...

Cazadors make NV amazing. It's such a terrifying concept.

This as well. And hell, it's only fair that there is an actually intimidating enemy, since everyone's just braindead for the most part. Even Deathclaws are damn slow to react.
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HagenEx posted...

That's the thing. If you're having trouble with Cazadors, then it's because you're trying to skip content. It's only natural that you're getting a challenge when you want to have an alternate route. If you follow the natural main quest progression, by the time you face Cazadors you will be able to cripple one of their wings with a single shot from your trusty Sniper Rifle, That Gun, Lucky, and so on, and from then on, it's a piece of cake.

Also, getting ambushed by them is quite hard, their red indicators on the compass keep moving like crazy and they're easy to spot from afar because of how much they move.

You can't skip content like that. The only path to New Vegas is set since deathclaws are in the way if you try going directly there. I guess you could just try to outrun them.
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There's not one path. You can go where ever but you'll get your shit pushed in if you choose the harder path.
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EvilMegas posted...

There's not one path. You can go where ever but you'll get your shit pushed in if you choose the harder path.

There's no path through the cazador section.
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Revelation34 posted...

Mead posted...

What

No

Yes.

TallTamryu posted...

Hilarious and incorrect.

Well the truth is usually funny.

The truth is you never played fallout 1,2 or tactics.
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cazadors aren't shit, tf is this

they're easy as hell to kill
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Yeah on easy, boi.
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They zoop around all crazy like and their poison kills you in like a second
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EvilMegas posted...

Yeah on easy, boi.

survival 4 lyfe
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I always think Ill like playing survival on FO4 and then a few hours in I get killed half an hour after sleeping in a bed and Im all
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Lokarin posted...

I already expressed in the OP that my main joy with FO3, looting, was weaker in NV

What. How.

NV has like 10 times as many different items to loot.
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Zareth posted...

Lokarin posted...

I already expressed in the OP that my main joy with FO3, looting, was weaker in NV

What. How.

NV has like 10 times as many different items to loot.

Well, in FO3 I got the Scrounger perk and was all like "oooooooo", and I was excited every time I saw a Nuka Cola Quantum on the ground...

It's kinda like the difference between Nirnroot in Obvlion, which I liked, Vs. Nirnroot in Skryrim which was just.... meh
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Lokarin posted...

It's kinda like the difference between Nirnroot in Obvlion, which I liked, Vs. Nirnroot in Skryrim which was just.... meh

Because they're far more common in Skyrim?
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Lokarin posted...

Zareth posted...

Lokarin posted...

I already expressed in the OP that my main joy with FO3, looting, was weaker in NV

What. How.

NV has like 10 times as many different items to loot.

Well, in FO3 I got the Scrounger perk and was all like "oooooooo", and I was excited every time I saw a Nuka Cola Quantum on the ground...

It's kinda like the difference between Nirnroot in Obvlion, which I liked, Vs. Nirnroot in Skryrim which was just.... meh

Different locales have different things? Weird.
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Did NV not have nuka cola quantum?
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Mead posted...

Did NV not have nuka cola quantum?

It is in the game files but you can only get it through the console. The equivalent in NV is Nuka Cola Victory.

Edit: Looking at the wiki, it says there are TWO in Lonesome Road, but I've never got them. Gonna see where they are.
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Mead posted...

Did NV not have nuka cola quantum?

They had sasparilla, which makes sense because only having one type of soda in existence is dumb
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EvilMegas posted...

Mead posted...

Did NV not have nuka cola quantum?

They had sasparilla, which makes sense because only having one type of soda in existence is dumb

Could have sworn there was still nuka cola as well

Its been a few years since Ive played it though
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ParanoidObsessive posted...

I would say yes to every single one of those things.

k, great, although it'd be a lot better to hear that from someone who isn't a contrarian

Even at the most basic level, the overall "orange-y/brown" aesthetic that's at the core of NV design looks better to me than the sickly green aesthetic of Fallout 3 (even the amber Pip-Boy filter looks better than the green one). On a more granular level, I'd argue that NV takes most of what 3 does in general with design and tone and does it far better.

k, but it's not supposed to be "I like particular thing better", or "I'd argue that X is better", it's supposed to be that the whole qualitative experience is thoroughly more enjoyable to you, regardless of the individual pieces.

the rest of your post just mentions particulars.
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Mead posted...

EvilMegas posted...

Mead posted...

Did NV not have nuka cola quantum?

They had sasparilla, which makes sense because only having one type of soda in existence is dumb

Could have sworn there was still nuka cola as well

Its been a few years since Ive played it though

They do but it's more rare.
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I never finished either so I'm really not sure which I liked more. Both were fun games. Well technically I did finish Fallout 3 but never played the post game quests. I guess New Vegas had better exploration since you didn't have to go through so many subways that looked the same.
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Sahuagin posted...

k, great, although it'd be a lot better to hear that from someone who isn't a contrarian

You're confusing me with helly.


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