Board 8 > Chris' political topic. Where Chris posts super casually about political stuff.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Corrik posted...

I think a lot of people do not like to see just where they truly are on a chart.

Like I think a lot of you want to feel you are not so extreme and are center, when you truly are.

I also think people very often misrepresent where they truly are politically in their arguments because they think it gives them clout or credibility.

I am very happy with where I am on the chart.

The fact I am further to the left of Sanders is insane. There is no issue where he was right of where I was.

The fact that Obama 2012 is essentially the same as Romeny/Jeb/Rubio and close to Trump is also insane. There are substantial differences between the two parties in 2008, 2012, 2016, and there will be again in 2020.

There are plenty of other places that score these things, and none of them have Obama as a Republican:

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-liberal-is-president-obama/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2014/02/04/is-barack-obama-the-most-liberal-president-ever/?utm_term=.3f98166abf67
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Yeah, I feel like that chart is yet another in a long string of "oh, both sides are bad, therefore the Republicans aren't THAT much worse than the Democrats" arguments that you really only ever see Republicans making to try and make left-wing liberals feel less enthusiastic about the Democratic party as a whole.
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https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=65.9&d=58.5&g=68.8&s=81.9

This also looks about right to me!
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8vals



back to me questioning Liberty / Authority but maybe Americans are just a ton more authoritarian I look super libertarian?
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https://www.isidewith.com/profile/3499509950/parties
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Corrik posted...

https://www.isidewith.com/profile/3499509950/parties

Should Gay couples have the same adoption rights

Your answer: No.

What the fuck
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Corrik posted...

https://www.isidewith.com/profile/3499509950/parties

Should Gay couples have the same adoption rights

Your answer: No.

What the fuck

Yeah I disagree.
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I am curious, why?
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We had this conversation in the politics topic before.

I do not believe a child of a less than fully developed mind and body has the necessary tools to understand sex and sexuality at young ages. Thus, I feel children should not be put into households they cannot properly understand yet and may cause confusion within the child, ostracision from peers, and feelings of fear, depression, and/or dissatisfaction due to such situations.

I believe if a same sex couple wishes to adopt a child that the child should be 13 years or older and also willingly sign off on being adopted by the couple.

I believe that because I believe that the protection and well being of the child is utmost and paramount in the situation.
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I know little about adoption but don't you need that second part for a child of any age where they can talk? Do they make kids be adopted into homes they don't want to be in?

I understand where you are coming from, but feel that social standards change with time and part of that change is pushing forward. I am sure a lot of kids had severe problems due to interracial marriage in decades past but it didn't mean that should be less.

I get it though.
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

I know little about adoption but don't you need that second part for a child of any age where they can talk? Do they make kids be adopted into homes they don't want to be in?

I understand where you are coming from, but feel that social standards change with time and part of that change is pushing forward. I am sure a lot of kids had severe problems due to interracial marriage in decades past but it didn't mean that should be less.

I get it though.

I do not know the whole process. I just feel it is imposing something onto a child that could cause irreparable consequences and thus it should be avoided if able to.

Thus, I do not feel same sex marriage couples should have the "same" adoption rights.
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Corrik posted...

We had this conversation in the politics topic before.

I do not believe a child of a less than fully developed mind and body has the necessary tools to understand sex and sexuality at young ages. Thus, I feel children should not be put into households they cannot properly understand yet and may cause confusion within the child, ostracision from peers, and feelings of fear, depression, and/or dissatisfaction due to such situations.

I believe if a same sex couple wishes to adopt a child that the child should be 13 years or older and also willingly sign off on being adopted by the couple.

I believe that because I believe that the protection and well being of the child is utmost and paramount in the situation.

I get it, because I feel the same way about straight adoption.
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Do you believe that having to deal with having two moms or dads would be more damaging to a kid on average than going through the foster system?
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LordoftheMorons posted...

Do you believe that having to deal with having two moms or dads would be more damaging to a kid on average than going through the foster system?

Possibly.
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https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=79.9&d=77.1&g=82.7&s=87.0

https://www.isidewith.com/profile/3499549304/parties
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Corrik posted...

LordoftheMorons posted...

Do you believe that having to deal with having two moms or dads would be more damaging to a kid on average than going through the foster system?

Possibly.

So do you think homosexuality is morally wrong?
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Corrik posted...

I do not believe a child of a less than fully developed mind and body has the necessary tools to understand sex and sexuality at young ages. Thus, I feel children should not be put into households they cannot properly understand yet and may cause confusion within the child, ostracision from peers, and feelings of fear, depression, and/or dissatisfaction due to such situations.

Also like, heterosexuality is a sexuality, and kids dont understand that either. Sex is confusing for everyone.

As for the last part, I dont see the case for ostracation, fear, depression, etc would be worse with two gay parents than as a straight-up orphan.
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Corrik posted...

LordoftheMorons posted...

Do you believe that having to deal with having two moms or dads would be more damaging to a kid on average than going through the foster system?

Possibly.

So do you think homosexuality is morally wrong?

I am not having the literal same conversations over and over. We have already discussed this.
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Corrik posted...

Someone like Vlado would be upper right.

Even I'm in the bottom left quarter on Political compass, albeit more to the centre than years ago.

I really like the 8values one, it asks essential questions, and the most essential one is question 53: We must think long-term, beyond our lifespan.

Whoever answers "No" to that should not have any say in politics, ever.

My 8 values result: https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=45.1&d=17.0&g=34.6&s=24.2

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Vlado posted...

Corrik posted...

Someone like Vlado would be upper right.

Even I'm in the bottom left quarter on Political compass, albeit more to the centre than years ago.

I really like the 8values one, it asks essential questions, and the most essential one is question 53: We must think long-term, beyond our lifespan.

Whoever answers "No" to that should not have any say in politics, ever.

My 8 values result: https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=45.1&d=17.0&g=34.6&s=24.2

I do not believe you were bottom left compass with that 8values result.
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What reason have I got to lie? The questions there are simply not very well thought out. Or maybe their goal is to make everyone believe they're some kind of leftist... I don't know. Maybe it's those nation vs. international corporation questions, where siding with the nation as any sane man would gives you "left" points.
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Vlado posted...

What reason have I got to lie? The questions there are simply not very well thought out. Or maybe their goal is to make everyone believe they're some kind of leftist... I don't know.

You could link it.
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I took it again and I'm barely in the top left quarter now. The test is generally useless. So many questions are stupidly phrased, so many double negatives.
https://politicalcompass.org/analysis2?ec=-4.5&soc=0.82
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=61.6&d=60.6&g=66.9&s=80.9

No surprises here.

Something I find really interesting is how different people interpret the Tradition axis.

To many Americans, tradition encompasses like Norman Rockwell, women in the kitchen, even Jim Crow/Slavery. But I know a bunch of Canadians who took it and to them respecting traditions might have connotations like respecting native culture and such.

Just a weird divide!
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Corrik posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Corrik posted...

LordoftheMorons posted...

Do you believe that having to deal with having two moms or dads would be more damaging to a kid on average than going through the foster system?

Possibly.

So do you think homosexuality is morally wrong?

I am not having the literal same conversations over and over. We have already discussed this.

I definitely didnt! But whatever
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Inviso posted...

Yeah, I feel like that chart is yet another in a long string of "oh, both sides are bad, therefore the Republicans aren't THAT much worse than the Democrats" arguments that you really only ever see Republicans making to try and make left-wing liberals feel less enthusiastic about the Democratic party as a whole.

BSABSVR
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https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=56.7&d=60.3&g=53.8&s=66.3

My 8vals.

A little bit further left than I thought but the questions I feel were a little loaded that direction on the topic of markets vs socialism
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I got Libertarian Socialism which feels like an oxymoron.
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Inviso posted...

Eddv and Regaro are both conservatives

Man, am I just super surprised Eddv was to the left in the quiz and not the conservative proclaimed here.
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It's like you guys forgot the whole thing where Corrik said if his kids turned out to be gay and got married he wouldn't consider their spouse part of his fanily.

He has indeed made himself clear.
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https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=75.0&d=71.8&g=66.9&s=70.9

Apparently I'm a Libertarian Socialist

I...guess this is a good time to link to Libertarian Socialist Rants?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIfKrI6Q_W8" data-time="
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Corrik posted...

Inviso posted...

Eddv and Regaro are both conservatives

Man, am I just super surprised Eddv was to the left in the quiz and not the conservative proclaimed here.

With Eddv, I think it's a lot like what happened with me. He was a lot more centrist and moderate, but the past two years have kinda informed us that modern conservatism (at least what is mistakenly referred to as conservatism and no reactionary extremism) is actually kinda dangerous to the modern world, and maybe we can afford to move more towards the left.
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https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=76.2&d=80.9&g=71.9&s=89.1

Seems right.
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https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=82.9&d=85.6&g=81.5&s=94.7

Surprised by how much I leaned towards liberty.

Wish I had 100% on Progress over Tradition. Tradition is such a bad concept
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Jakyl25 posted...

https://8values.github.io/results.html?e=82.9&d=85.6&g=81.5&s=94.7

Surprised by how much I leaned towards liberty.

Wish I had 100% on Progress over Tradition. Tradition is such a bad concept

I'm not even sure what I said that got points towards tradition.
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There was one question that was like We should pursue progress at any cost or possibly the inverse of that, and I chose the weaker option that still agreed with that idea. Thats about it
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Inviso posted...

Corrik posted...

Inviso posted...

Eddv and Regaro are both conservatives

Man, am I just super surprised Eddv was to the left in the quiz and not the conservative proclaimed here.

With Eddv, I think it's a lot like what happened with me. He was a lot more centrist and moderate, but the past two years have kinda informed us that modern conservatism (at least what is mistakenly referred to as conservatism and no reactionary extremism) is actually kinda dangerous to the modern world, and maybe we can afford to move more towards the left.

Sure theres some of that.

Theres also some like "all social programs should be abolished in favor of charity" questions that are SO LOADED.

Or like on healthcare they merely present like Single Payer or Nothing.

There were a lot of abstentions for me on those questions where the ability to answer more moderately would have likely dragged me slightly rightward on axis 1.

Axis 2 looks spot on to me

Axis 3 is a weird one because I felt the need to more strongly assert a right to the free press now vs what I answered the last time I took the test in 2015 but its honestly pretty close.

Other than a strongly pro science bent I come out looking fairly moderate here, which is pretty much how I see myself and have always presented myself - as a conservative democrat who would vote for a Romney or McCain if they ran against a Sanders type.

Moderate vs Moderate I tend to go Democrat due to Republican hostility towards science is all.
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Corrik posted...

Inviso posted...

Eddv and Regaro are both conservatives

Man, am I just super surprised Eddv was to the left in the quiz and not the conservative proclaimed here.

lmfao, are you serious? The guy's been arguing in favour of globalism for ages.
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Vlado posted...

Corrik posted...

Inviso posted...

Eddv and Regaro are both conservatives

Man, am I just super surprised Eddv was to the left in the quiz and not the conservative proclaimed here.

lmfao, are you serious? The guy's been arguing in favour of globalism for ages.

Corrik was being sarcastic
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Globalism btw isnt a left/right issue.
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Jakyl25 posted...

Wish I had 100% on Progress over Tradition. Tradition is such a bad concept

In the defence of tradition, sometimes changing things has unforseen consequences. Ex: pulling out of Iraq, even though I supported it and wanted it to happen earlier, led to the rise of ISIS. The saying "if it ain't broke don't fix it" didn't come from nowhere.

The problem in the US is when traditionalists try to argue for tradition long after something has been shown as safe. For example: gay marriage. By the time gay marriage became legal in the US, it had already been legal in other countries for over a decade with no adverse consequences. Multiple studies (going back decades) of gay parents in the US had already shown their kids were no more likely to be gay than the kids of straight parents, and tended to be raised about equally as well. There really was no risk involved with legalizing gay marriage.

If you want an actual hard choice, what's your opinion on whether polygamous/polyandrous marriage should be legalized. I knew a polyandrous (married to two men) woman. She certainly wanted it legalized. But there's actual risk involved in this one--we don't have decades of other countries with legalized polyamorous marriage, and polygamy has in the past been associated with a form of child abuse (where young girls in polygamy colonies were forced into marriage)--granted there are laws against child marriage and laws against child abuse, but would legalizing polygamy/polyandry put kids at risk?

If your answer is "don't know unitl we try, let's legailze it!" then yeah, maybe you should be 100% progress over tradition. If you're hesitating (I'm hesitating) then you probably shouldn't be at 100%.
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No hesitation at all. Legalize it for consenting adults!

Heck I dont even hesitate at legalizing incestuous marriage
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consent is consent!
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So Jakyl, person whom I actually respect, how have you liked my attempt at a more CASUAL political experience?
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It allows me to talk to people I get in trouble for talking to in my Topic series
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Good! I have liked the discussion that goes on for the most part. I shall make a second one.
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Eddv posted...

Globalism btw isnt a left/right issue.

Not in the classical left/right sense, sure. But that's all but irrelevant today.
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Boom.
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