Current Events > How would a US-Canada war (w/o nuclear weapons) go into play?

(+) Yeah! (+)

So a long time ago there was a fear within Canada (pre-WW2) that US thought of declaring war on Britain and would therefore invade Canada as part of it. The Canadians then came up with a plan called Defence Scheme No. 1, which would target key American cities when they feel like invasion became imminent, in order to delay the US in gathering its forces, and therefore giving Britain the time to defend Canada.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_Scheme_No._1

Like, 1936.

It's literally the US military so
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Well we would take Canada without any real issue on paper but modern alliances would be thrown into complete disarray.

i mean we could still annihilate them but we couldn't occupy them worth shit
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if it happened the world should just sanction the usa forever
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We could take Quebec first, give them a better deal with more autonomy than previously and leverage that.

Beyond the obvious military and population comps, it doesnt help Canada that all their major cities are very close to the border.
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masticatingman posted...

Beyond the obvious military and population comps, it doesnt help Canada that all their major cities are very close to the border.

Well, so is Seattle and Detroit, and arguably New York City

US win the war, but the aftermath will not be good for them.
unless they are prepared to take on the whole world, i guess.
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RoboLaserGandhi posted...

We could take Quebec first, give them a better deal with more autonomy than previously and leverage that.

Quebec doesn't care about separatism anymore yo.

Anyway to answer the question the US conquers Canada and the Canadian military disappears into the wilderness to wage a guerrilla war. The average Canadian soldier is trained to act independently and IIRC receives the same level of training as US special forces

The average population also probably wouldn't go along with it. The US military would have the spend most of its time putting down insurgency, and dealing with sabotage pr general unrest.

Picture it as something like Iraq or Afghanistan x1000
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Kurumiee posted...

there was a fear within Canada (pre-WW2) that US thought of declaring war on Britain and would therefore invade Canada as part of it

Wow I had no idea.

Why did they have that fear?

Doom_Art posted...

The average population also probably wouldn't go along with it.

Well that's why you don't just invade outright. You need a cassus belli first. Canada unfairly treating the US on trade is a start, but it would need to be developed a bit more. Perhaps a year or so of hammering the negative effects of Canada's unfair trade practice on the US until you can logically make the leap that there is no choice but to invade Canada in order to allow the US to survive.

The message has to be delivered properly for the population to go along with it. Perhaps stage some "grassroots" manifestations against Canada in states where you have senators who are hesitating about supporting the war to pressure them.
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Isn't this what happens in the Fallout universe?
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BJ-blazkowics posted...

Why did they have that fear?

British and Americans didn't like each other very much and had a fair amount of ideological differences. Even after WW1
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The Great Muta 22 posted...

Isn't this what happens in the Fallout universe?

The intro of the first Fallout shows the power armor clad American soldiers executing some Canadian dude in newly annexed Canada.
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frozenshock posted...

Doom_Art posted...

The average population also probably wouldn't go along with it.

Well that's why you don't just invade outright. You need a cassus belli first. Canada unfairly treating the US on trade is a start, but it would need to be developed a bit more. Perhaps a year or so of hammering the negative effects of Canada's unfair trade practice on the US until you can logically make the leap that there is no choice but to invade Canada in order to allow the US to survive.

The message has to be delivered properly for the population to go along with it. Perhaps stage some "grassroots" manifestations against Canada in states where you have senators who are hesitating about supporting the war to pressure them.

Oh I meant the average population in Canada
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BJ-blazkowics posted...

Kurumiee posted...

there was a fear within Canada (pre-WW2) that US thought of declaring war on Britain and would therefore invade Canada as part of it

Wow I had no idea.

Why did they have that fear?

Because pre-WW2, the U.S. didn't really have any special feelings towards Britain, and something about clashing imperial ambitions and interests.

meanwhile, in another dimension

"Do you think President Clinton will go to war with Canada? I can't believe this is happening. I should have voted for Trump he wouldn't go to war with Canada"
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Doom_Art posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

Why did they have that fear?

British and Americans didn't like each other very much and had a fair amount of ideological differences. Even after WW1

I honestly had no idea. Crazy.

So how did they suddenly get so close that US even went to war in WW2 for Britan? (technically because of Pearl Harbor, but the US was clearly providing the UK with weapons and provisions before that)

We would win. After we demolished Canada, as a form of reparations we would build some Trump hotels there.
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DifferentialEquation posted...

We would win. After we demolished Canada, as a form of reparations we would build some Trump hotels there.

But there are already Trump hotels in Canada.
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frozenshock posted...

DifferentialEquation posted...

We would win. After we demolished Canada, as a form of reparations we would build some Trump hotels there.

But there are already Trump hotels in Canada.

Then we'll build more. And the existing ones will be made 10 feet higher.
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BJ-blazkowics posted...

So how did they suddenly get so close that US even went to war in WW2 for Britan? (technically because of Pearl Harbor, but the US was clearly providing the UK with weapons and provisions before that)

FDR and Churchill were friends. FDR was scared of fascism and believed if something wasn't done to stop Hitler a confrontation between the US and Germany was inevitable in the future anyway.
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Doom_Art posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

So how did they suddenly get so close that US even went to war in WW2 for Britan? (technically because of Pearl Harbor, but the US was clearly providing the UK with weapons and provisions before that)

FDR and Churchill were friends. FDR was scared of fascism and believed if something wasn't done to stop Hitler a confrontation between the US and Germany was inevitable in the future anyway.

Thanks for all of this information.... it'd be had to find it on my own since t's very specific. :)

"Oh hey you like our country eh? Ok, come on in. Soorry!"

BJ-blazkowics posted...

Thanks for all of this information.... it'd be had to find it on my own since t's very specific. :)

NP there's much more to all of it but that's kinda just my brief recollection of it

The late 19th century - early 20th century is one of my favorite eras to read about
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Doom_Art posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

Thanks for all of this information.... it'd be had to find it on my own since t's very specific. :)

NP there's much more to all of it but that's kinda just my brief recollection of it

The late 19th century - early 20th century is one of my favorite eras to read about

Have you read much on the post ww2 period?

I am very, very intrigued by the UK losing its colonies (why?) and why they lost power so fast and so bad, to the point that now France seems to be more influential and powerful than them

DifferentialEquation posted...

frozenshock posted...

DifferentialEquation posted...

We would win. After we demolished Canada, as a form of reparations we would build some Trump hotels there.

But there are already Trump hotels in Canada.

Then we'll build more. And the existing ones will be made 10 feet higher.

10 feet isnt much... barely enough for another floor.
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Kurumiee posted...

masticatingman posted...

Beyond the obvious military and population comps, it doesnt help Canada that all their major cities are very close to the border.

Well, so is Seattle and Detroit, and arguably New York City

There is more than just Seattle and Detroit in the US...
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Given America's poor record of fighting vastly inferior forces I assume a decades long war would end with a US retreat.

Hexenherz posted...

Kurumiee posted...

masticatingman posted...

Beyond the obvious military and population comps, it doesnt help Canada that all their major cities are very close to the border.

Well, so is Seattle and Detroit, and arguably New York City

There is more than just Seattle and Detroit in the US...

Anchorage is also a thing.

Canadians would use their supernatural hospitality to convert most of the US forces to their side. Within a month we would all be speaking Canadian.
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Kurumiee posted...

Hexenherz posted...

Kurumiee posted...

masticatingman posted...

Beyond the obvious military and population comps, it doesnt help Canada that all their major cities are very close to the border.

Well, so is Seattle and Detroit, and arguably New York City

There is more than just Seattle and Detroit in the US...

Anchorage is also a thing.

what

The point is that Canada's major cities are directly near the border, but the US major cities are not all concentrated there. Additionally, the major US military bases are very far from the border.
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EliteLevel posted...

Given America's poor record of fighting vastly inferior forces I assume a decades long war would end with a US retreat.

lolz
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we had the same exact fear against them

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red

Canada would mobilize their goose army. We wouldn't stand a chance.
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EliteLevel posted...

Given America's poor record of fighting vastly inferior forces I assume a decades long war would end with a US retreat.

Its more a matter of how difficult it is to occupy a hostile country where the people who live there dont want you there. Wed wipe out the organized military and government in no time. Its the guerilla warfare tactics by citizens turned fighters that would pose the real threat.

People tend to forget that Iraq had one of the larger armies in the world when we invaded in 03 and yet it took us only a month to reach Baghdad and more or less defeat their military and overthrow their government. They had the 4th largest army in the world during desert storm. Its the years and years of occupation that poses the real challenge.

Lol @ these inane responses. The US would swiftly beat the Canadian "army". Any holdouts wouldn't last long at all.

Lmao @ people suggesting there would be a guerilla war with the Canadian populace. No, there wouldn't. The Canadians wouldn't have the will to wage such a war if a western power peacefully occupies them. People literally comparing it to occupying Iraq and Afghanistan.

Idiots.
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ChainedRedone posted...

western power peacefully occupies them.

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BJ-blazkowics posted...

Doom_Art posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

Thanks for all of this information.... it'd be had to find it on my own since t's very specific. :)

NP there's much more to all of it but that's kinda just my brief recollection of it

The late 19th century - early 20th century is one of my favorite eras to read about

Have you read much on the post ww2 period?

I am very, very intrigued by the UK losing its colonies (why?) and why they lost power so fast and so bad, to the point that now France seems to be more influential and powerful than them

Then you will want to read about the Suez Crisis. The event that singlehandedly showed the world that the UK and France were no longer world powers. It was a huge embarrassment for both countries.
MorbidFaithless posted...

ChainedRedone posted...

western power peacefully occupies them.

You think there would be a Canadian genocide?
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ChainedRedone posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

Doom_Art posted...

BJ-blazkowics posted...

Thanks for all of this information.... it'd be had to find it on my own since t's very specific. :)

NP there's much more to all of it but that's kinda just my brief recollection of it

The late 19th century - early 20th century is one of my favorite eras to read about

Have you read much on the post ww2 period?

I am very, very intrigued by the UK losing its colonies (why?) and why they lost power so fast and so bad, to the point that now France seems to be more influential and powerful than them

Then you will want to read about the Suez Crisis. The event that singlehandedly showed the world that the UK and France were no longer world powers. It was a huge embarrassment for both countries.
MorbidFaithless posted...

ChainedRedone posted...

western power peacefully occupies them.

You think there would be a Canadian genocide?

Let's find a middle ground. A peaceful occupation implies that the Canadians would embrace their American overlords.

There would definitely be a resistance in the form of Ireland and Northern Ireland in the past. Wouldn't be surprised if some Canadian terrorist organisations pop up in the midst of it, with the aim of destroying the American infrastructure

dodgefan91 posted...

EliteLevel posted...

Given America's poor record of fighting vastly inferior forces I assume a decades long war would end with a US retreat.

Its more a matter of how difficult it is to occupy a hostile country where the people who live there dont want you there. Wed wipe out the organized military and government in no time. Its the guerilla warfare tactics by citizens turned fighters that would pose the real threat.

People tend to forget that Iraq had one of the larger armies in the world when we invaded in 03 and yet it took us only a month to reach Baghdad and more or less defeat their military and overthrow their government. They had the 4th largest army in the world during desert storm. Its the years and years of occupation that poses the real challenge.

Largest army means nothing if theyre fighting using rocks and swear words.