Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 131: Deferred Action by Childish Administration

(+) Yeah! (+)

(as far as cops go)
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Corrik posted...

I feel if the cop feels his life is in danger he has the right to use force if he deems it necessary.

This is a very very low bar.

Why not just hold cops to the same standards as everyone else, especially when your very next line is "Now, cops are people"?
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Kenri posted...

Corrik posted...

I feel if the cop feels his life is in danger he has the right to use force if he deems it necessary.

This is a very very low bar.

Why not just hold cops to the same standards as everyone else, especially when your very next line is "Now, cops are people"?

Cops are empowered by the people to deal with situations we shouldn't be forced to. A cop doesn't need to get shot to be allowed to diffuse a situation.
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"I feared for my life" is essentially a "Get out of Jail Free" card.

I mean sure if there's actual danger, it's fine. But it seems like a lot of "cops" these days are afraid of their own shadows. Such as the ones who shoot a restrained man on the ground.

Or that instance when a cop shot an (off duty) black cop because "I was afraid". I think that instance really made the message crystal clear.
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"diffuse a situation" = kill somebody
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Dark Young Link posted...

"I feared for my life" is essentially a "Get out of Jail Free" card.

I mean sure if there's actual danger, it's fine. But it seems like a lot of "cops" these days are afraid of their own shadows. Such as the ones who shoot a restrained man on the ground.

Or that instance when a cop shot an (off duty) black cop because "I was afraid". I think that instance really made the message crystal clear.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3RJUMm-hd0
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Dark Young Link posted...

"I feared for my life" is essentially a "Get out of Jail Free" card.

I mean sure if there's actual danger, it's fine. But it seems like a lot of "cops" these days are afraid of their own shadows. Such as the ones who shoot a restrained man on the ground.

Or that instance when a cop shot an (off duty) black cop because "I was afraid". I think that instance really made the message crystal clear.

That's why we need cameras. There is difference between no video supported it and it is murder. And the video didn't support it but a human reaction caused a mistake. In which case would probably fall under so some of involuntary manslaughter or something.
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Kenri posted...

Corrik posted...

I feel if the cop feels his life is in danger he has the right to use force if he deems it necessary.

This is a very very low bar.

Why not just hold cops to the same standards as everyone else, especially when your very next line is "Now, cops are people"?

Not to side with Corrik, because I don't, but cops specifically are supposed to deal with violent situations so that we don't have to, so holding them to the standard of everybody else is tough because we very specifically don't hold them to the same standard when it comes to making them do their job. When we want something dealt with, we can just call the cops. The cops can't just call us in the reverse situation.

"There's a crazy guy beating on my door. I better call the cops." is a thing that can happen.
"There's a crazy guy beating on our door. We better call B8." is a thing that cannot.
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counterpoint

pun called us when he got robbed
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FFDragon posted...

counterpoint

pun called us when he got robbed

If called us means typed us a story on a website then by all means ur correct. Lol
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Cops should be held to higher standards imo.


We give them so much power, they shouldn't get off light if they abuse it because "Their job is hard". Yes, their job is hard. They routinely have to deal with assholes, many of which are fine with killing them. But that shouldn't meant they get to kill innocent people(Or at least people who didn't deserve to be killed) for free.
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Dark Young Link posted...

Cops should be held to higher standards imo.


We give them so much power, they shouldn't get off light if they abuse it because "Their job is hard". Yes, their job is hard. They routinely have to deal with assholes, many of which are fine with killing them. But that shouldn't meant they get to kill innocent people(Or at least people who didn't deserve to be killed) for free.

To be fair, "Not killing innocent people" isn't really a higher standard, it should just be A standard, period. That's a slightly different argument.

When I say it's tough to hold cops to the same standard as everyday people, I mean that... A cop reacting to somebody with a gun and one of us reacting to somebody with a gun shouldn't be held to the same standards. We aren't trained to deal with situations like that. We could just make it worse. Joe Schmoe pulling a gun on a violent individual is different than a cop pulling his gun on a violent individual, and should be treated differently. Normal people often don't need to be there escalating the situation. Cops do have to be there.
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Like, to clarify, I agree cops should be held to a higher standard when it comes to abusing power, killing innocents, etc. If they do wrong, then yeah, they should be held to a higher standard.

Where standards should differ is when they do the right thing in a situation, such as taking down a violent criminal.
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People bashing the police when they have no idea what putting one's life on the line at work is adorable.

95% of the people in this topic who bash cops all day wouldn't even get through police academy, let alone the PT required to become a state trooper. This is why actual police or people with police in their families laugh at this garbage when we see it. The ignorance is palpable.

You have 0.25 seconds (average human reaction time) to spot the real gun from a distance of, say, 20 feet away. Have fun.

Oh, and if you shoot some moron because they pointed a fake gun at you, you get to have leftists who will never serve their communities in any profession bash their keyboards and calling local/national news to try getting you fired, and knowing this you're more likely to be in danger if the gun is real because of a potential extra half second hesitation. Have fun.

OH. And if you work in a high crime area but you're the kind of guy who does the right thing, it's directly adverse to your safety to rat on cops that actually are scumbags, because word will get out and you're guaranteed to not have your backup show up on time. So if you're a choir boy, you're actually more likely to get killed on duty than a jerk is. HAVE FUN. No one actually talks about this point, which is all the proof I need that the people bashing police live comfortable middle class lives and have absolute dick for street smarts. Because anyone with street smarts knows full well that no one at work trusts a rat.

But hey, it feels good to sit behind a keyboard and shit on police all day as a cause du joir, right? You people don't have the first clue. I've made it a point not to be mean on Board 8 anymore but cop bashing really sets me off. I have actual family out there and leftist policies directly put them at higher risk to get murdered on the job. Fuck that.

I would pay actual money to have Board 8 leftists serve as police in a standard overnight shift in Trenton for even one week. That's all it would take.

@JetJaguar
@trdl23

Props to trdl for helping me put the rat point into better words. That's as much his point as it is mine.

My Uncle is a Sheriff's Deputy and I agree completely with the "people in this topic who bash cops all day".

It's cute how you think having a relative who does the job you yourself can't puts you in a superior position.
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I remember that female officer who was shot and killed because she was afraid to fire because of the backlash of possibly losing her job if she was wrong.

That should never happen.
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UltiXX posted...

And if you work in a high crime area but you're the kind of guy who does the right thing, it's directly adverse to your safety to rat on cops that actually are scumbags, because word will get out and you're guaranteed to not have your backup show up on time. So if you're a choir boy, you're actually more likely to get killed on duty than a jerk is. HAVE FUN. No one actually talks about this point, which is all the proof I need that the people bashing police live comfortable middle class lives and have absolute dick for street smarts. Because anyone with street smarts knows full well that no one at work trusts a rat.

Lmao way to undermine your own point and straight up SAY that crooked cops ruin it for the good ones.

Incredible.
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Corrik posted...

I remember that female officer who was shot and killed because she was afraid to fire because of the backlash of possibly losing her job if she was wrong.

That should never happen.

Agreed.

But do you not agree that an innocent civilian who committed zero criminal offenses being killed is just as tragic?
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Liberals gonna liberal. It never fails.

Of course it is tragic. It's just as tragic when a bomb accidentally kills civilians or when a child dies in a hurricane because the parents chose not to evacuate.

It is tragic.

Mistakes do happen.

We shouldn't have our cops afraid to due their job at the risk of their lives. What if that officer (she wasn't shot and killed just beaten badly I guess) didn't do what she should have their due to fear of a mistake and an innocent child was killed by the person she failed to subdue?

They are empowered to try and make the best decision. And, when they abuse that power or go beyond that power they should be prosecuted. We should not, however, disrespect, belittle, or demonize the ones that are there to protect us.
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Corrik posted...

We should not, however, disrespect, belittle, or demonize the ones that are there to protect us.

Comversation over.

Welp, time to ignore the topic for a bit.
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If your relatives are the kind of cops who "guarantee backup doesn't show up on time" for "the guy who does the right thing", they deserve to "be at a higher risk to be murdered".

Because it's better them than the "choir boys" who actually protect and serve.

And if you actually have honorable LEO relatives (you probably don't because you can't help your pathological lies) they'd agree with me.

Before you get triggered: No, I'm not saying cops should die. I'm flipping your exact words around and saying if someone does, it should be the crooked ones.
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Corrik posted...

They are empowered to try and make the best decision. And, when they abuse that power or go beyond that power they should be prosecuted. We should not, however, disrespect, belittle, or demonize the ones that are there to protect us.

What's your opinion on Ulti's despicable post where he literally mocks good cops?

Because tbqh, as a person who actually has relatives in Law Enforcement and best friends in the military, that post has made me lose every single little tiny bit of remaining respect for his ass.
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ChaosTonyV4 posted...

Corrik posted...

They are empowered to try and make the best decision. And, when they abuse that power or go beyond that power they should be prosecuted. We should not, however, disrespect, belittle, or demonize the ones that are there to protect us.

What's your opinion on Ulti's despicable post where he literally mocks good cops?

Because tbqh, as a person who actually has relatives in Law Enforcement and best friends in the military, that post has made me lose every single little tiny bit of remaining respect for his ass.

I think Ulti has the worst way of saying shit and making people want to tune out everything he says because he can't talk to people with respect.
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UltiXX posted...

You have 0.25 seconds (average human reaction time) to spot the real gun from a distance of, say, 20 feet away. Have fun.

Oh, and if you shoot some moron because they pointed a fake gun at you, you get to have leftists who will never serve their communities in any profession bash their keyboards and calling local/national news to try getting you fired, and knowing this you're more likely to be in danger if the gun is real because of a potential extra half second hesitation. Have fun.

OH. And if you work in a high crime area but you're the kind of guy who does the right thing, it's directly adverse to your safety to rat on cops that actually are scumbags, because word will get out and you're guaranteed to not have your backup show up on time. So if you're a choir boy, you're actually more likely to get killed on duty than a jerk is. HAVE FUN. No one actually talks about this point, which is all the proof I need that the people bashing police live comfortable middle class lives and have absolute dick for street smarts. Because anyone with street smarts knows full well that no one at work trusts a rat.

But hey, it feels good to sit behind a keyboard and shit on police all day as a cause du joir, right? You people don't have the first clue. I've made it a point not to be mean on Board 8 anymore but cop bashing really sets me off. I have actual family out there and leftist policies directly put them at higher risk to get murdered on the job. Fuck that.

I would pay actual money to have Board 8 leftists serve as police in a standard overnight shift in Trenton for even one week. That's all it would take.

As far as this post, Tony, I feel he is almost trying to incentivizing being a bad cop. I disagree completely. As an empowered individual who we trust for our protection, we assume as a cop you will do your best to be an upstanding person and should have no sympathy for a cop who abuses the power afforded to them.
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Btw I know you guys hate when people respond to his bait, but that was one of the grossest posts I've ever read in my 15 years on the board. I couldn't help it.

Thanks for the responses though, Corrik.

I'm gonna watch a movie now.
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TheRock1525 posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

I really wish people would stop saying Bernie would have lost against Trump.

It just makes no logical sense.

Basic transitive property.

It makes perfect sense.

LOL X-STATS
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Not to change the subject much, but I saw a post on Facebook that eventually led to this interesting Twitter thread about What Happened?:

https://twitter.com/GothamGirlBlue/status/906010498260275204

Curious what your thoughts are.
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I dunno, maybe it's because I'm a white male but none of that thread seems accurate to me.
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7/ They were really saying it about our coalition. *We* were unlikeable. *We* didn't really matter. It's *our* fault that Trump won.

I mean... Literally, unironically yes.
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(Not that not mattering part, but the others)
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redrocket_pub posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

I really wish people would stop saying Bernie would have lost against Trump.

It just makes no logical sense.

Basic transitive property.

It makes perfect sense.

LOL X-STATS

I get this is light-hearted, but it's fun to point out GameFAQs had like sixty-three worldwide one-on-one polls every year for when x-stats were at their most important. Hillary/Bernie had one primary poll per state and the Republican party never had fewer than three candidates in each primary poll. They eventually had one nationwide poll one day months away after the majority of their previous polls.

Am I saying GameFAQs was better at getting reliable x-stats? Maybe.
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HaRRicH posted...

Not to change the subject much, but I saw a post on Facebook that eventually led to this interesting Twitter thread about What Happened?:

https://twitter.com/GothamGirlBlue/status/906010498260275204

Curious what your thoughts are.

She's right-ish. There was always a false equivalency between Trump's miss-steps and her own. That she would be criticized for things that would be completely irrelevent for a male candidate while Trump did things that would have killed her run immediately.
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TheRock1525 posted...

There was always a false equivalency between Trump's miss-steps and her own. That she would be criticized for things that would be completely irrelevent for a male candidate while Trump did things that would have killed her run immediately.

Was Hillary criticized for irrelevant things because she's a woman or because she's Hillary? It seemed to me like most of it was the latter, though I guess you could argue the irrational hatred most of America has for her is because of her gender.
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it's directly adverse to your safety to rat on cops that actually are scumbags, because word will get out and you're guaranteed to not have your backup show up on time. So if you're a choir boy, you're actually more likely to get killed on duty than a jerk is. HAVE FUN.

wow this makes it sound like cops are pretty bad
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Xeybozn posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

There was always a false equivalency between Trump's miss-steps and her own. That she would be criticized for things that would be completely irrelevent for a male candidate while Trump did things that would have killed her run immediately.

Was Hillary criticized for irrelevant things because she's a woman or because she's Hillary? It seemed to me like most of it was the latter, though I guess you could argue the irrational hatred most of America has for her is because of her gender.

A ton of the hate for Hillary is because of her gender. Until the Benghazi and email bullshit Bill would have theoretically been getting heat from all of the same fake scandals but people still love him. Part of that is because he's very charismatic, but another part of it is because Hillary is a woman and some of the things society expects of a leader are considered negative qualities in women for a lot of people.
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https://twitter.com/danwlin/status/906324366434201601
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people still love Bill because Bill is loveable

Hillary made that "just chilling in Cedar Rapids" vine. She is bad at appearing like a real person.
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In regards to that Twitter thread:

Gee, I'm sorry that Hillary shifting the blame onto other people pissed everyone off but guess what it pissed everyone off.

I will defend Hillary from things that were not her fault, but I won't defend her blaming everyone but herself. Especially blaming Bernie (who freaking told people to vote for her after he lost).

It's different from the Bernie or Bust crowd, who directly spat in the face of Bernie's values after he lost because they were pissed at Hillary. She was a freaking candidate and she's trying to pull this shit - that makes her as bad, if not worse.

Despite all of this, I still believe she would've been a better president than Trump, but that doesn't mean I have to like her.
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BowserCuffs posted...

I will defend Hillary from things that were not her fault, but I won't defend her blaming everyone but herself.

Apparently she's actually very hard on herself in the book. People are just picking out all the excerpts where she blames other people and none of the ones where she blames herself and, whether intentional or not, it's creating this false narrative.
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Guys... look, as much as I didn't think I'd do this, you're missing Ulti's point. He isn't incentivizing being a bad cop or condoning it. He's saying that it's really hard for a good cop to call out a bad one without risking his life even more than usual. That's a big reason for the "silent blue line" when an officer fucks up -- if any of the good guys steps off the line, they might have their backup conveniently stuck in traffic the next day. That's the awful reality of the job even for a true believer.

Of course my view of the good cop/bad cop ratio deviates a lot from his, and I also come from a police family, but fair is fair. There are other factors that make it an incredibly toxic culture, but I really don't feel like getting into it.

Tr;dl Being a cop is even harder than you think because bullshit internal politics can also get you killed, so the culture as a whole needs a course correction. That's a big reason it's so hard to change awful police culture from within.
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Hillary is very uncharasmatic and is bad at presenting herself as a desirable canditate. Decades of media demonization doesn't help.

With that said, her loss in the election also included:
1. Massive amounts of interference from a foreign country
2. The FBI re-opening a past issue days before the election
3. Hillary winning the popular vote by 3 million but losing anyway

I don't think people really comprehend the incredible amount of BS that led to the election results. Blaming Hillary is the easy out because she's uncharasmatic and hard to like but there's way, way bigger factors going on here than her being a bad canditate.

Also the demonization of her in a topic that is mostly liberal shows how bad she gets it anyway, so I tend to cut her some slack even if I don't care for her. People tend to go out of their way to make her look bad.
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And yeah trdl is right - cop culture is fucked up. I think it's bad (obviously) that cops can be so trigger happy, but the core of the problem is that they will never be punished for anything they do. There can be video/audio evidence and it's still not enough.

It's also not even close to the worst system in law! The judicial system hates minorities way more, and both systems combined are about half as bad as the good ole' for-profit prison system.
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trdl23 posted...

. He's saying that it's really hard for a good cop to call out a bad one without risking his life even more than usual. That's a big reason for the "silent blue line" when an officer fucks up -- if any of the good guys steps off the line, they might have their backup conveniently stuck in traffic the next day. That's the awful reality of the job even for a true believer.

Then why the fuck are people just allowing that to happen? If literally doing the right goddamned thing can get you punished by having your team not back you up, guess what? Those people shouldn't be on the team! It effectively prevents any cop from being good because you either have the bad cops, or the neutral cops who do the right thing unless one of their own does something wrong in which case you're SOL.


Like seriously? This is essentially "Snitches get stitches, and that kind of mentality only helps criminals.

If "good" cops are afraid to call out the crooked cops out of fear of being ostracized, why should they have to look the other way? Shouldn't the people doing that sort of shit be put on the chopping block instead?
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StealThisSheen posted...

Kenri posted...

Corrik posted...

I feel if the cop feels his life is in danger he has the right to use force if he deems it necessary.

This is a very very low bar.

Why not just hold cops to the same standards as everyone else, especially when your very next line is "Now, cops are people"?

Not to side with Corrik, because I don't, but cops specifically are supposed to deal with violent situations so that we don't have to, so holding them to the standard of everybody else is tough because we very specifically don't hold them to the same standard when it comes to making them do their job. When we want something dealt with, we can just call the cops. The cops can't just call us in the reverse situation.

"There's a crazy guy beating on my door. I better call the cops." is a thing that can happen.
"There's a crazy guy beating on our door. We better call B8." is a thing that cannot.

They have a higher degree of training, or should. It's also their job, that they're being paid for. So, you know, same standard justified. I'd actually say higher but it was Corrik so I was starting low.
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https://twitter.com/williamsjon/status/906368107437891585

This is a truly amazing image. "Awesome" in the classical sense of the word.
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KamikazePotato posted...

And yeah trdl is right - cop culture is fucked up. I think it's bad (obviously) that cops can be so trigger happy, but the core of the problem is that they will never be punished for anything they do.

Whoever tagged me in this topic, please don't. I find it difficult to deal with posts this objectively stupid.
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