LogFAQs > #970322249

wolfy42 posted...

That being said, it didn't really matter cause being as weak as everyone else to magic attacks pretty much means you lose vs most people with magic lol.

Kinds of depends on what sort of magic the magic person does, and how magic works in a given universe/story.

For example, if Doctor Strange ties people up with the Crimson Bands of Cyttorak, it's theoretically possible to break them with pure strength (Hulk has done it, for instance). So Superman's inherent strength should still give him an advantage against them that normal mortals lack (the average person can't lift hundreds of tons). In a fight against Strange, Superman is still breaking free and punching right through the Shield of the Seraphim (which is also weak to physical force) and murdering Strange.

In the same vein, the Winds of Watoomb would generally blow a normal person away, but Superman could theoretically fly into them and resist them, or even do his whole "blow really hard and make a gust of wind" thing to counter them. Again, he'd have an advantage over normal humans here.

Where his "weakness" would mostly be a factor is against spells that require actual magical resistance to oppose, that can't be affected by mere physical strength and stamina. For instance, the Bolts of Bedevilment would still theoretically banish him to another dimension, the Mists of Morpheus should still put him to sleep, and the Illusions of Ikonn should still show him believable illusions. Though even then there's potential problems. Superman has superhuman willpower - does that mean he should be able to resist falling asleep or being mentally controlled? Would his X-Ray vision allow him to see through illusions somehow?

Other spells are even more complicated. The Flames of the Faltine create magical flame - but does that mean they burn like regular flame (which Superman should be resistant against), or do they somehow magically bypass all of his inherent biology and affect him the same way normal flame would affect a normal person (this would also be a question for stuff like Ghost Rider's Hellfire, which is said to burn both body and soul)? The Vapors of Valtorr create a magical mist that blocks all vision... but would that include X-Ray vision? Are the particles of the mist mundane in nature (which means Superman should be able to see through it), or are they literally magic particles that are immune to his vision in the same way lead is?

Different writers would probably interpret each of those cases differently. And that's assuming they aren't in the camp of saying he isn't just vulnerable to magic, but actively weak against it, so it hurts/affects him more than it would a normal human. Because in that case most spells would be super-effective against him.

But the point of all this is, if Superman is fighting a specialist mage (someone who only knows certain kinds of spells), he might be completely fine if he can use his strength, toughness, and ability to fly around and shoot lasers out of his eyes to break through the magic anyway. But a more competent universalist (like Strange) who can adapt on the fly and use a ridiculous amount of different types of spells probably stomps him into the mud (especially if we're talking MCU Strange with power over time itself).



wolfy42 posted...

Flash is just a literal dumpster fire right now.

The sad point there is that, for once, the problem isn't poor writing or a bad version of the character as a whole, but is almost entirely because of who they cast. So for once, it's kind of not their fault.



wolfy42 posted...

A fresh new take could be nice, but if you REDO the superman origin story another time I don't think anyone is going to line up for that.

Yeah, but they seem to have figured that much out already. Like, Marvel/Sony deliberately avoided retelling Spider-Man's origin story in spite of rebooting the continuity, they just started with "Okay, here's Spider-Man just doing his thing." And they seem to be going that route with Batman as well, where they seem more inclined to just go "Ehh, you know the deal, we're just starting in media res now."

A Superman reboot can just start with Superman already on Earth, doing his thing, and with the assumption that viewers will already have a good idea of who he is and why, and who characters like Lois, the Kents, or Lex Luthor are.

The real problem with any Superman reboot is figuring out which villains to use. It seems hard to tell a really great Superman story and keep audiences interested, because his Rogues' Gallery has never been as strong as others (especially Batman's). Which is why there's such a strong impulse to just default to Lex Luthor doing stuff (with Zod, Brainiac, or Darkseid being the main alternative choices).