Lurker > KamikazePotato

Also no Lies of P, which would've gotten rocked but was really good so I wanted the chance to vote for it.

Spidey comparison poll:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/7462-best-of-2018-playstation-4

Although I think Spider 2 will be weaker than Spider 1.

SMRPG is a snub but it's a less egregious snub. The remake didn't really light the world on fire.

https://pastebin.com/Yzw3fYrF

Included the 125-101 games and the honorable mentions.

LightningStrikes posted...

If there was another game with XIII/XV reception I dont think it needs to turn up if its not a weak year otherwise.

FF13/FF15 absolutely would have deserved to turn up in a poll series with games like Star Trek: Resurgence.

Also, based on the midway point poll, Hogwarts Legacy is another snub. Although a much smaller one compared to FF16 and Jedi Survivor kinda.

Hmm. Pikmin fell off after the Power Hour, and Baldur's Gate climbed. Was rethinking my stance on TotK 55-45 but these few meaningless percent have RENEWED my confidence.

So with FF16 AWOL, what takes 3rd place in the Overall poll?

I'd take Pikmin 4 over Street Fighter 6. It was well-received, and if nothing else, solo Nintendo options have a habit of overperforming in these polls.

I think this field is much stronger than the one Tears faced. I'd still take Starfield over Diablo 4.

This result implies that BG3 gets relatively close to Tears of the Kingdom. I'm thinking 55-45 in favor of Zelda.

TeamRocketElite posted...

Shoot for the moon

Eyyyyy

Also this is an abysmal result for Starfield. Don't think anyone was expecting much from it, but wow.

Leonhart4 posted...

Okay so FFXVI just didn't make the poll at all.

I don't understand the logic behind these choices.

Pretty sure it just got glossed over. I doubt whoever's putting together these polls cares that much about them. Especially with Allen gone.

up

In comparison:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/9054-best-of-2022-new-franchises

Elden Ring went on to double GoW Ragnarok. It's the power hour and today's poll is very weak, but flirting with 60% at any point is still nuts.

I think there's a very good chance it does. Starfield's reception has worsened each week since its release. You can literally see it in the Steam review trends!

For the final round, the winnings will be DOUBLED. That's right, you heard it, folks - DOUBLED. A whopping $10 to whoever the final winner is.

Round 10 Hints

1. Dark Souls, Elden Ring, or Bloodborne.
2. The game that launched a thousand cosplays.
3. My favorite JRPG. Hint: It belongs to a series that hasn't been represented on this list yet.
4. Dark Souls, Elden Ring, or Bloodborne.
5. Dark Souls, Elden Ring, or Bloodborne.
6. Could be considered five different games if you squint. Maybe six if you count the one that got removed by the developers.
7. An RPG where 'LV' doesn't stand for 'Level'.
8. You fight the final boss three times throughout the game. When it's raining, his hair looks the same as yours.
9. Blink (or just look away) and you'll miss it. That's an actual game mechanic.
10. The Haunted Mansion: Depression Edition

Planescape is hard to sell to people used to modern gaming standards, but I would recommend Disco Elysium to anyone who likes reading.

12. Nier
It's absolutely baffling to me that Nier isn't that obscure anymore. The only reason I got this game was because I enjoyed TheDarkId's Something Awful LPs of Drakengard, and figured that it might be fun to experience the janky weirdness in-person for once. I wasn't expecting something *good*. Automata is what pushed the series to new heights, but I like to think that me shilling Nier 1 on B8 when it came out played some miniscule part in it having enough notoriety for Automata to exist in the first place.

Anyway Nier. The Gestalt version specifically, with ugly-ass Papa Nier. In a time before 'dad games' became trendy, before Joel and Booker Dewitt and reboot Kratos, we had Gary Busey's face stapled onto a buff anime protagonist. In all seriousness, Papa Nier is a big part of why the game felt special to me. He was a fresh change of pace from the typical JRPG standard, and his voice actor did a fantastic job. The other main characters are excellent too, with Kaine, Emil, Weiss, and the twins never disappointing whenever they're on-screen.

However, no JRPG in my Top 20 could get by just on the strength of its characters alone, so let's look at the rest. While Nier 1's combat and graphics are...serviceable, it knocks everything else out of the park. The story is simple but engrossing, consistently surprising you and backended with numerous memorable gut punches. The atmosphere feels like something straight out of a fairy tale, imbuing the bizarre setting with a sense of dreamlike wonder. And perhaps most importantly, the music is godlike; probably my favorite game OST of all time. Whenever Nier falters, its soundtrack lifts it up.

I think all that text still doesn't do experiencing Nier 1 justice, though. This game grabs you the moment you see the an unexplainable 1000-year long time skip. It gives off the same vibes as your favorite arthouse movie that not everyone 'gets', but that means something intrinsically special to you personally. I don't think I ever want to replay Nier, as I'm a different person now and probably wouldn't be affected in the same ways, but I'm very glad it left its mark on me.

11. Disco Elysium
Despite having nothing to do with D&D or western fantasy, Disco Elysium feels like the long-awaited successor to Planescape: Torment. Other CRPGs have tried to reach its depth of writing, but none succeeded until this game. It achieves that by alternating between several different styles, being either hilarious, insightful, or tragic, and executing each of those aspects flawlessly.

Disco Elysium doesn't have much of a main 'plot', per se. The game's surface-level conflict is a murder mystery in a waning, ramshackle, town, but that pales in comparison to its examination of characters and politics. Everyone in Disco Elysium is a flawed person influenced heavily by their surroundings and hangups. Some try to be good people regardless of their tough circumstances. Some end up as raving racists. Even the worst people don't feel fake, though. Disco Elysium's characters are exaggerated, but never unrealistic. Its little world is so colorful and well-realized that the game would have been good even with a bland silent protagonist.

Thankfully, the protagonist is anything but bland or silent. Known initially as The Detective, your player character quickly establishes himself as an amnesiac mess of a human being, and I love him for it. The Detective struggles to talk to anyone without sounding insane, picks up neuroses and addictions like trading cards, and constantly argues with his own instinctual emotions. Far moreso than the actual murder mystery, the real mystery of Disco Elysium is about uncovering why the Detective is the way he is.

It really doubles-down on being a character study, too. The Detective can equip some pieces of clothing for minor stat boosts, but they're much less impactful than the thoughts and worldviews he can choose to internalize. For example: do you want to believe you're an Apocalypse Cop, harbinger of the end times? Sure. What benefits does it offer? A sense of belonging and purpose that absolves you of responsibility, mostly. You could internalize a healthy worldview instead, but...then you'd have to take a deep, long look at yourself, and that's just not possible.

Looking in the mirror is difficult enough.

15. Dragon Age: Origins
In many respects, Dragon Age: Origins is a midway point between old-school CRPGs and modernized WRPGs. Its writing is strong, with plenty of detailed choices that will affect the plot and characters. DA:O has more dialogue variation that the majority of games being released today, and the Origins system is a fantastic way of making you feel personally immersed in the world. Those are all traits I more associate with CRPGs. Most modern WRPGs have the advantage of presentation and voice acting at the expense of nuance...except for Origins, which does it all. I'm sure there are examples I'm missing (even Inquisition does a decent job at this), but it's something I compare every WRPG I play versus Origins, and they almost always come out lacking, New Vegas notwithstanding.

Baldur's Gate 3 probably fits that bill as well. Really looking forward to playing it when it finishes patching.

Anyway, dialogue nuance wouldn't matter if the writing wasn't good. Thankfully it's fantastic albeit not especially unique. Dragon Age's world is a mix-and-stir of dark fantasy tropes. The final big bad is basically a zombie dragon, which is kind of hilarious. It does an excellent job of mixing those tropes though, resulting in a setting and characters that feel believably grounded despite their fantastical circumstances. The core party remains one of my favorites in any game I've played. Also, I'm an absolutely sucker for dark fantasy tropes, so sign me the fuck up.

Where Dragon Age could have borrowed a bit more from modern gaming standards is the combat. Like most old-school CRPGs, it goes for strategic, slow-paced Real Time With Pause, which is...fine. I usually dislike that system, but at least DA:O has my favorite variation of it. Mostly because it generally ignores D&D rules and does its own thing. Setting up rogue backstabs and mage killing fields is fun here, for once.

Overall, Dragon Age 1 is similar to the Path of Radiance/Radiant Dawn in that it's not a game that reaches crazy heights at any point. There's no one moment that made my jaw drop. However, I really enjoyed playing it from start to finish and have, multiple times. My appreciation for DA:O and its world only grows every time I re-visit it.

14. Skies of Arcadia: Legends
To this day, Skies of Arcadia feels like what JRPGs should have become.

That's not to say I think it's the best one ever. It's not even the highest on my list. But to me, this genre is at its best when its games inspire a feeling of adventure. A JRPG can still have a serious story, dark elements, and nuanced characters, but if it's missing out on that ability to inspire a modicum of childlike awe within my grizzled soul...then what's the point? As a counterexample, I played Octopath 2 recently, and it felt entirely empty. Flashy visuals/music/combat mean nothing when I don't care about what's happening on-screen. That's just going through the motions.

Then there's Skies of Arcadia, which oozes ~ADVENTURE~ from top to bottom. Sky pirates! Flying ships! Floating islands! Evil empires! Hidden treasure! Bounty hunters! Ancient secrets! While small by modern-day standards, the world of Arcadia never feels that way. Its atmosphere really is something special. In fact, I'd say that Skies of Arcadia does the open-world experience better than the vast majority of actual open-world games. For my money, exactly one JRPG and one non-JRPG have surpassed its feeling of ~ADVENTURE~, and both are higher on up the list.

Aside from all that...the characters are extremely charming, and the narrative is perfectly paced to provide a constant feeling of escalation. I also like how Skies has an anime aesthetic without being bogged down by typical anime weirdness. Unfortunately, the march of time makes this game a bit tougher to play each year. Random battles with a high encounter rate weren't fun back on release, and they're even less tolerable now. Also, while Skies of Arcadia's world is still special, it's a bit less special now that there's way more options for explorative game worlds.

Where's the goddamn remaster, SEGA?

13. Demons Souls
The one that started it all.

By 2023 standards, Demon's Souls is really starting to show some age wrinkles. It's been outdone both in and outside of its home series. Literally everything it established has been iterated upon and improved. You'll still enjoy it, especially if you're new to the genre, but people familiar with soulslikes will probably come away a bit unimpressed.

In 2009? Demon's Souls was a phenomenon. There's a reason the formula it established went on to become a cornerstone of modern gaming. The backbone of all future From Software titles started here. Dark fantasy architecture, dodge/stamina combat, winding interconnected environments, giant grotesque monsters, invasions, bloodstains, messages, etc. A lot of that was technically started by King's Quest, but Demon's Souls was the one to put it on 3rd-person on new consoles with a BUNCH of design improvements.

My strongest memory from Demon's Souls comes from exploring the Tower of Latria's starting area. It's the closest DS gets to a true horror experience. I snuck around, exploring dark corridors and cramped cells, avoiding mind flayers and traps and god knows what else, when suddenly...

You have been invaded.

It wasn't one of the scripted AI encounters. For some serendipitous reason, this was the first time any player chose to invade my game world.

The game really did become survival horror then. I went from exploring to creeping. Each corner turned was a potential threat laying in wait. Eventually, slowly, I made my way into a fairly spacious room and investigated the back part of it. There was nothing inside. Relieved, I panned my camera around, preparing to leave.

And the invader was just standing in the entrance like a freaking movie monster. Silent, unmoving, staring. He probably could have backstabbed me, yet he didn't. This monster in the shape of a man wanted to see the fear in my eyes before he snuffed the life from me.

Then we fought and I kicked his pansy ass, but god damn was that a thrill ride of a level until then. Souls games kick ass.

Swamped with work, but will post the last 5 writeups + hints when I wake up later.

Kenri posted...

I love Metal Gear Rising because it has these absurd villainous caricatures who scream about how much they fucking love war and then you read some 20th century American history and you're just like "oh never mind this is just what people from the CIA and the state department are like"

Armstrong would be considered a moderate if he ran for office right now.

Leonhart4 posted...

WE'VE MANAGED TO AVOID DROWNING

My favorite cheesy line delivery from MGS2

Some of the stuff they made Quinton Flynn say in that game...

Thorn posted...

Probably because Bethesda was the publisher and Obsidian/Black Isle was the dev for New Vegas - as opposed to Betheseda themselves being the devs for 3, 4, and 76.

Yeah, I should've mentioned that in the writeup. I think Obsidian also wanted to continue working with them after NV but were denied by Bethesda. Legitimate shame, as Bethesda's writing has gotten slightly worse with every release, and they didn't exactly start out great in that department to begin with.

18. Metal Gear Solid 2
Few games have proven more timeless than MGS2. That Colonel AI monologue lives rent-free in my head to this day.

MGS2's mindfuck of a final stretch is largely why it's so high up on this list. Don't get me wrong; the rest of the game is great as well. It revolutionized stealth in a way that can't be understated. The jump from MGS1 gameplay MGS2 gameplay was insane, and it definitely stands the test of time. There are major games coming out in 2023 with a fraction of MGS2's complexity and depth. However, the story for most of the game is just...decent? Outside of some standout moments, it feels like a less memorable retread of MGS1's conspiracy spy thriller.

Then you get to the ending parts, and you learn why it was a retread. Why the game has been putting in more and more references to information control as it went on. Why Raiden exists at all. MGS2 invests a lot of story capital in its key message. A lesser narrative would have fumbled the bag. Instead, we got what feels like a predictive manifesto of the modern era, something that people decried as overly-complicated when it came out but have increasingly looked back on with renewed appreciation. Not me, though, cause that shit already hit hard as a teenager! Out of every game on this list, few have shaped my personal philosophies more than MGS2.

With that said, MGS2 suffers from being a 2001 game in the way that most 2001 games do. Despite its exceptional level of presentation for its time period, some of the voice acting delivery feels...iffy by modern standards. The pacing is also suspect as well. Having an insane last 10% is great and all, but some of the codec conversations to get to that point could've used an editor. Looking at you, Rose.

17. Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance / Radiant Dawn
Do you have any idea how frustrating it is to be a Fire Emblem fan when these ones are your favorites?

"Yes, I do agree that most games in the series have major flaws. You should play the Tellius duology. Those two are a cut above the rest."
"Oh, sure. How?"
"Easy! Just shell out hundreds of dollars for used copies, because Nintendo refuses to re-release the best games their entire company has ever made."

Anyway, Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn more or less ruined the rest of Fire Emblem for me. I can't take Three Houses or Awakening seriously when I know the heights the series can reach, and don't even get me started on Fates or Engage. Are PoR and RD perfect? No, but they hit every note they should. You've got smartly-designed strategy gameplay, medieval fantasy politics, banger music, an appealing art style, and a shocking lack of embarrassing anime weirdness. While neither game reaches the crazy heights of most other games in my Top 20, they're so consistently great that I hold them in just as high regard.

Radiant Dawn being a direct sequel to Path of Radiance also works to both games' benefit. PoR focuses on one group, introducing you to the world through the Greil Mercenaries, giving that narrative a stronger singular focus. Because of this, Radiant Dawn gets to spread its wings, cycling between multiple different factions and sometimes pitting you against characters you've come to know and care about. Its narrative is more disjointed by design, but more unique and memorable as well although some plot elements (like the blood pacts) are kinda dumb.

Lastly, I can't end this writeup without mentioning Ike, who functions as a fantastic protagonist for the duology. While he's not the deepest character ever, something about him is just inherently likable.

16. Planescape: Torment
"What can change the nature of a man?"

That one sentence drives the entire core of Planescape: Torment. In my writeup on Tides of Numenara, I mentioned how it was a game with strong writing that otherwise failed to have a compelling main narrative. In contrast, from the moment that The Nameless One wakes up in a mortuary without his memories and a message carved onto his back, almost every part of Planescape's writing feeds back into its central themes. What can change the nature of a man? How bound to our choices are we? Are you responsible for the choices that others make because of your influence? Can good deeds of the present make up for sins of the past? What does it mean to be good, anyway? At what point does supposed altruism become self-serving?

There were like a dozen moments in Planescape that made me genuinely stop and self-reflect on what kind of person I was. Other games are lucky if they can get one of those. I don't think I'll ever forget when Torment sat me down and asked me to answer THE question it's been asking over and over, offering up literally 15 dialogue choice options to make sure all bases were covered.

It's worth noting that Planescape: Torment came out in 1999, and I played it in the early 2000s. This damn game proceeded to have a stranglehold on my personal standards for nearly two decades. While Planescape doesn't have the bombastic charm of say, a good JRPG, nothing else I played in any genre managed to match up to its sheer quality of writing. It was getting to the point where I was worried nostalgia had blinded me! Thankfully the rest of gaming finally caught up in recent years, and this archaic pre-2000 CRPG now has some stiff competition in the writing department.

Specifically in the writing department. Its actual gameplay was a relic even on release. Planescape isn't something I can recommend to modern-day gamers, and I don't think I'd even be able to replay it myself without heavy mod alterations. The combat just...isn't fun. You can avoid most of it, but it's still there, like an albatross weighing down the otherwise excellent narrative. Also, the narrative itself loses momentum about 3/4 of the way through after a fantastic segment where lots of buildup is paid off. Doesn't turn bad or anything, but it's just less interesting than what came before.

20. Fallout: New Vegas
There's a lot that could be said about Fallout New Vegas. It's the only Bethesda game to combine their unique style of exploration gameplay with actual strong writing, and shocker of shocker, the end result is really damn good. The Mojave desert feels like a fully-realized society without sacrificing the wacky novelty that categorizes Fallout. You get your faction intrigue in some quests and 'what the heck did I just see' in others best of both worlds.

I've talked about multiple Bethesda games on this list, so I won't rehash what makes those kinds of games fun. Instead, I'd like to focus on the one part of New Vegas that has stood out to me even years later: the Yes Man ending. Modern WRPGs that offer branching choices have a habit of tying your choices to pre-existing factions. You can be a Specter or an Inquisitor or a Witcher, but in the end you're still just furthering the interests of whoever you happen to agree with the most. Is it realistic? Sure, but these are video games, damnit. Why am I letting myself be led around by the nose when I'm the most important person in the universe?

Then there's New Vegas. In a game that has probably the best-written factions out of any WRPG I've played, in a game where I'd actually be fine with being forced to pick one...you're given an out. Yes Man comes rolling in and offers you the option that I always hope a game has, but almost never does: betray everyone and take over.

It's the best. So what if you don't know the first thing about governance? So what if Mr. House or the NCR would do a better job at leading the Mojave than you? Screw them. You're the one with quicksave and reload, so you get to make the rules. This desert belonged to you the moment you survived a gunshot to the head and woke up with a (platinum) chip on your shoulder.

19. Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
In the tutorial stage of Metal Gear Rising, you will:

-Jump on top of missiles flying through the air
-Parry a Metal Gear and toss it up while RULES OF NATURE's vocals kick in
-Get monologued at by a Brazilian samurai who cuts off your arm
-Fail to avert a presidential assassination, leading to major geopolitical ramifications

And that's honestly a good summary of the tonal experience you'll get from then on. MGR is an insane fusion of character action gameplay and Metal Gear batshit political writing, and it somehow works. One minute you're pulling someone's spine out to heal; the next you're learning about how the world is struggling to recover from the events of MGS4. Actually, I like Rising's codec conversations more than some numbered Metal Gear games. Turns out you can have some of the best combat in the business AND still tell a decent story! All the other action games were just fucking it up.

Outside of combat and the general story, Rising has three things worth pointing out as noteworthy. The first is the music, which is fantastic, especially in-game where the vocals are timed to kick in at the hypest possible moments. The second is Senator Armstrong, who would probably top a Best Bosses list if I felt like making one. Genuinely uses his limited screentime better than any other character I've ever seen.

The third is a bit more of a 'me' thing, but despite Raiden being one of my favorite characters after MGS2, I didn't like him much in MGS4. He came across like Kojima trying too hard to make him cool after the MGS2 backlash. Rising manages to reconcile Raiden's MGS2 and MGS4 portrayals while simultaneously advancing his character arc and giving it a fitting conclusion. Legitimately impressed at how they handled that.

MacArrowny posted...

Damn, Skies of Arcadia got me! There's a game I've gotta get around to playing sometime. It's a shame Sega's never remastered it.

Tell me about it :(

Kenri posted...

Unless that hint was unintentional, in which case it's even funnier.

Completely unintentional. You were playing chess while I was playing checkers.

Leonhart4 posted...

I bought Disco Elysium about a year ago, and I played a few hours of it, but man that game is slow. I guess the thorough nature is part of the appeal but it felt like I'd barely done anything.

Disco Elysium is 95% a study of various characters and their philosophies in life. The main plot definitely takes a backseat. For me the slowness is a feature, but I get why it wouldn't appeal to everyone.

Round 9 Results

--

9 people submitted guesses.
The most common score was 10 / 10.
The average score was 7.6 / 10.

Scores were all over the place here, trending high. While the most common score was 10, only three people actually got that.

--

Hint:
11. An isometric, dialogue-centric game where a good chunk of it is spent arguing with yourself.

Answers:
Disco Elysium 8

Expected one or two false positives, but everyone I guess Disco Elysium has gotten popular in recent years.

--

Hint:
12. This game inspired my least-favorite critic review of all time, where the reviewer gave up because they kept fishing at the wrong spot.

Answers:
Nier 8
Stardew Valley 1

https://www.engadget.com/2010-05-03-nier-review-fail.html?guccounter=1

I remain salty to this day.

--

Hint:
13. A PS3-era game that started a new genre. Multiple games in my Top 10 are in that genre, actually.

Answers:
Demon's Souls 8
Dark Souls 1

The person who guessed Dark Souls said they would kick themselves if it was Demon's Souls. Sorry!

--

Hint:
14. A JRPG where you build up a reputation through battles and dialogue choices, resulting in the game giving you changing titles that look like: [Main Character Name] the [Adjective]

Answers:
Skies of Arcadia 5
Suikoden III 1
Valkyrie Profile: Lenneth 1
Undertale 1

Skies of Arcadia Legends, specifically.

--

Hint:
15. My favorite Bioware game. So far, Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age: Inquisition have appeared on this list.

Answers:
Dragon Age: Origins 5
Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic 4

The two obvious frontrunners. Based on Inquisition's appearance earlier on the list, I figured the majority would assume that DA:O would be here as well, and I was just barely right.

--

Hint:
16. A PC game released in the late 90s where the main character constantly updates their journal. Seriously, you'll hear that voice line a million times.

Answers:
Planescape: Torment 7
Grim Fandango 1

Updated my journal. Grim Fandango is a fun game, but it soft-locked me halfway through.

--

Hint:
17. A strategy game duology. Can't think of anything else that wouldn't immediately give away the answer, so that's all you get. No, that last sentence wasn't a secret hint, and neither is this one.

Answers:
Fire Emblem Path of Radiance / Radiant Dawn 5
Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 1
XCOM: Enemy Unknown 1
Starcraft 1

Devil Survivor, XCOM, and Starcraft were all mentioned elsewhere on this list (or at least in the topic).

--

Hint:
18. A PS2 game that received controversy on release for its misleading trailers, which hid a major character entirely.

Answers:
Metal Gear Solid 2 9

Yeah, I guess this one was pretty obvious.

--

Hint:
19. Was released to moderate success about a decade ago, but got a recent resurgence of popularity due to memes. In fact, memes are referenced fairly often in the game itself.

Answers:
Metal Gear Rising 8

Guess you're all up-to-date on your MEMES...THE DNA OF THE SOUL....

--

Hint:
20. A game with choices and multiple endings, where your yes-man advisor encourages you to screw all the other factions and take over.

Answers:
Fallout: New Vegas 6
Triangle Strategy 1
Fallout 1
Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together 1

Side-eyeing my unopened copy of Triangle Strategy pretty hard now! The key part of this hint was the phrase 'yes-man', which is a character name from New Vegas.

--

That makes the winners of Round 9: AxemRedRanger, Thorn, and Kenri! Thorn is a topic lurker who specifically said they were just entering for fun, so we won't need a lightning round to thin the herd.

Next five writeups will be posted tomorrow.

Hope you all had a fun holiday! Just to be clear, the round will officially end in 6 hours.

Anti-purge

I'll end the round and post updates on the 27th. Long round, but want to give people extra time due to Christmas.

Up

MacArrowny posted...

damn, I had the same guess for 11 and 16

Hmm yeah, gonna make one change to Hint #11: it was a game released sometime after 2010. The one person who already submitted guesses can amend them if they want.

LeonhartFour posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/1618-division-32-64-round-1-pokemon-gold-silver-crystal-vs

imagine how this would go today

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/946-north-division-round-1-pikachu-vs-parappa-the-rapper
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/1306-north-division-round-1-pikachu-vs-fox-mccloud

Times have changed!

Round 9 Hints

Since we're in the Top 20, I tried to keep the hints on the harder side.

11. An isometric, dialogue-centric game where a good chunk of it is spent arguing with yourself.

12. This game inspired my least-favorite critic review of all time, where the reviewer gave up because they kept fishing at the wrong spot.

13. A PS3-era game that started a new genre. Multiple games in my Top 10 are in that genre, actually.

14. A JRPG where you build up a reputation through battles and dialogue choices, resulting in the game giving you changing titles that look like: [Main Character Name] the [Adjective]

15. My favorite Bioware game. So far, Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age: Inquisition have appeared on this list.

16. A PC game released in the late 90s where the main character constantly updates their journal. Seriously, you'll hear that voice line a million times.

17. A strategy game duology. Can't think of anything else that wouldn't immediately give away the answer, so that's all you get. No, that last sentence wasn't a secret hint, and neither is this one.

18. A PS2 game that received controversy on release for its misleading trailers, which hid a major character entirely.

19. Was released to moderate success about a decade ago, but got a recent resurgence of popularity due to memes. In fact, memes are referenced fairly often in the game itself.

20. A game with choices and multiple endings, where your yes-man advisor encourages you to screw all the other factions and take over.

Some kids definitely went through the 'lame baby game' phase but only after a period of being obsessed with it. Pokemon playgrounds were the wild west. Battles, trading, rivalries, political alliances, schools making new rules, rumors running rampant...those were the days.

Kenri posted...

Your Berseria write-up is pretty much exactly how I felt about Vesperia. I should probably get around to Berseria someday but man, it's hard to invest time in long RPGs (or any genre really) these days.

I was a fan of Vesperia's plot back in the day but it just hits way less hard these days. Feels watered down compared to something like Berseria. Yuri Lowell is still cool though.

25. Tales of Berseria
I was waiting for a JRPG like this for years.

To be fair, Berseria still falls into some of the genre trappings. Its main character has a bad-in-an-anime-way design. The pacing is inconsistent. Environments are low-budget and straight out of RPG Maker. The obligatory mascot character has voice acting that I can best describe as painful. And unfortunately, it doesn't entirely stick the landing, with some of the later plot beats diluting what made the experience unique.

But even with all that, Berseria rules. Its writing aside from a couple lines that crossed over into edgy territory is generally excellent. There are real moment of pathos here, where characters consider who they are, how they should lead their lives, and how much they're willing to sacrifice to achieve their goals. Velvet in particular is one of my favorite protagonists of all time, although the main party members all fantastic cast chemistry and strong character arcs. I was invested in the narrative more than any other recent JRPGs outside of [REDACTED, WILL BE ON THIS LIST]. It takes a lot for a game's plot to engross me now that I'm older and have seen literally hundreds of game stories, but Berseria succeeded in a big way.

As for the battle system; it's a Tales game. Even the worst Tales battle systems are pretty fun, and this is one of the better ones. It passed the KP test of 'turn the difficulty up and see if it gets more fun', although mostly because is Velvet super broken in a fun way.

24. Pokemon Red/Blue/Yellow
People shouldn't bother playing RBY for the first time in this day and age (maybe the GBA remakes, though). All you'll be left with is confusion over why this blew up into an insanely popular media franchise especially if you've played later Pokemon games first. The formula has been iterated on so much that the original RBY feels like an arthritic dinosaur.

But, man...you had to be there. Pokemon Red/Blue/Yellow was, without exaggeration, a lifechanging event. I have never seen a video game take over an entire generation to this degree. Call of Duty found a massive audience, but not everyone plays Call of Duty. Nintendo games are classic, but not everyone plays Nintendo. In the years of 1998-99, everyone in the younger age brackets played Pokemon. There was nothing else like it in existence. I have so much nostalgia attached to RBY that I could never in a million years judge it objectively.

With that said...it actually does a couple things better than its successors. RBY keeps its story light and allows for some degree of nonlinear exploration. Newer Pokemon games, at least up until Arceus and Scarlet/Violet, were increasingly linear, on rails, and needlessly verbose. A paper-thin plot is better than a bad plot. I'm interested in where the series goes from here, though. If they iterate on the Scarlet formula and release it with FPS that runs faster than a powerpoint presentation, maybe I'll actually play the next one.

23. Silent Hill 2
Silent Hill 2 is tough to discuss. It's one of those experiences that has mutated beyond its original reputation and scope. With every year that goes by without a game that can match exactly what Silent Hill 2 accomplished and with the increasingly rose-tinted memories people have of it this game gets elevated to an even higher pedestal.

I get why, though. Silent Hill 2 just feels special. It's the definition of a game where each interlocking piece comes together to form a cohesive whole, greater than then sum of its already-impressive parts. You change any tiny part of SH2 and its fans would riot. There are so many details in the game that feed into each other, including the monster designs, cutscene direction, janky controls, specific lines of dialogue, location of minor items, and even the awkward voice acting.

It all culminates in an experience that is scary, unnerving, and thought-provoking. Silent Hill 2's plot hits hard, although it's been aped by so many other horror games that it won't feel as fresh to newcomers these days. Doesn't help that SH2's re-releases are...extremely questionable. That Bloober Team remake is gonna be a disaster.

22. Final Fantasy IX
FF9 is a vibes game. While it does have strong elements that you can dissect and pick out in an objective manner, that wouldn't really cut to the core of what makes it such a special experience for some people. There's just this combination of whimsy and melancholic nostalgia that no other JRPG captures. 'The Place I'll Return to Someday' is a perfect title for FF9's main theme, and it puts you in the right mood as soon as you enter the title screen.

But this is a writeup, so I'll try to focus on some of those specific elements regardless. Vivi's characterization is universally praised and for good reason. The first four party members are all strong in their own ways. The soundtrack is up there with Nobuo's best, the pre-rendered backgrounds are gorgeous, and Disc 1 & 2 have tight pacing with lots of big scenes that move the plot forward. I also love the system where you enter a new town and get to see what all your other party members are doing as you explore. Why in the world hasn't that been copied by more games?

Final Fantasy IX isn't without flaw, of course. The last four party members don't get nearly as much development as the first four. Disc 3 doesn't feel quite as tightly-paced and impactful as the early game. Necron is kind of silly for a final boss. And unfortunately, the battle system is way too slow, even by old-school JRPG standards. If you can get past those issues, though, you're in for a very good time.

21. Metal Gear Solid
Despite the many sequels, MGS1 still feels like the most 'complete' Metal Gear game. Its writing is consistently entertaining, its pacing is near-flawless, Shadow Moses is the best setting in the series, and even Snake's voice acting comes across as grounded (by Snake standards). This is the game where Kojima was either restraining himself or being held in more restraint by editors. While unhinged Kojima can be fun, there's nothing wrong with having just a moderate number of plot twists, and the game includes plenty of unique moments regardless. Psycho Mantis alone blew people's minds back then.

I can't say much about MGS1 that others haven't. It single-handedly raised the bar for cinematic storytelling in gaming. Solid Snake is an enduring, beloved icon largely because of this game. The gameplay is definitely showing its age by now, but how could it not? MGS1 laid the groundwork for the entire stealth genre. And despite its limited mechanics compared to its successors, what's there is still very fun to play 25 years later.

30. Torment: Tides of Numenara
The spiritual successor to Planescape: Torment. It's a shame that the overall reception for this game was mixed, because while it doesn't quite live up to the first game, I think Numenara holds up very well on its own merits.

The Torment games are pretty close to Visual Novels. They do have combat, but it's not the focus whatsoever, and both games would probably benefit from removing battles entirely even if storyline changes would need to be made. 99% of my enjoyment came from the writing, where Tides of Numenara excels, albeit not without some caveats.

Numenara's story can broadly be described as a series of vignettes, where you travel around learning about the stories of individual people. Most RPGs are like that, but Numenara takes it a step further and really goes in-depth with them. Those mini-stories are the definitely best part of the game. They consistently come across as emotionally impactful in a relatively short number of words. Your party members are memorable, each with a strong personality and with an ending path that changes based on how you help them solve their problems. The game's third area is also worth mentioning as one of my favorite environments I've played in an RPG, being fantasy-style creepy and packed full of interesting setpieces.

However, whereas Numenara's writing does a fantastic on the micro level, it stumbles on the macro level. There's a strong hook about you being the castoff body of an immortal god, but the main plot honestly ends up bit undercooked. The various vignettes and setpieces don't tie together into one cohesive whole, leaving the experience feeling slightly lesser than the sum of its part, although I do like the game's final conclusion.

29. Bleed / Bleed 2
You can air dash, slow time, shoot things, and parry.

That's Bleed. Both games have inherently cool mechanics and fantastic game design. My strongest metrics for how much I enjoy an action game are "will this get more fun if I turn up the difficulty?" and "do I want to turn up the difficulty?" Some games feel like going through the motions once you figure out their loop. Bleed made me want to turn up the difficulty, then do a no-hit run of some bosses, then record myself doing that for no good reason. Super fun games. Oh and there's a plot too I guess, but it's very much an excuse for the action.

28. Dragon Quest V: Hand of the Heavenly Bride
Dragon Quest is a fun little series. The writing is charming, the artwork is Akira Toriyama, and the music is...there. It's easy to see how these games basically created a new genre and became pop culture phenomenons in Japan. Decades later, and Square-Enix still churning out similar DQ games, like JRPG comfort food.

Then there's Dragon Quest V. I'm not going to say it's the most complex story ever written, or that it would even hit me as hard nowadays that I'm older. But more than the rest of the series combined, DQV makes you feel things. To avoid spoilers, the broadest stroke I can paint is that you follow the main character over the course of their life. It's a very personal tale that prioritizes storytelling over the RPG standard of slowly building up a party of characters. The status quo is not treated as god here, and it makes for an extremely memorable experience with some legitimately shocking scenes.

This is where I would usually start listing flaws, but I'm not sure I have any worth noting. Maybe you can say that this type of story would have worked even better outside of the Dragon Quest framework, but I like how the JRPG lightheartedness balances out the big events that happen. Definitely recommend to fans of the genre.

27. Resident Evil 4
RE4 has the best level design and pacing of anything I've ever played. Every new place you go to is a fun encounter with something new to offer. Areas are open-ended enough to create unique environments for combat, but still linear so that you never lose momentum. The slow-ish pace of combat makes every fight feel tactical and meaningful, rather than yet another wave of enemies to blitz through. Ammo is restricted so that you need to put some thought into your shots, but not to the point where you're starving for resources.

It's honestly ridiculous how well Resident Evil 5 holds up almost 20 years later. Despite how it revolutionized the industry and inspired a lot of other games, few of them have managed to match its sheer level of moment-to-moment quality. I played the Remake recently, and while it was very good, the best parts were probably the sections airlifted straight from OG RE4.

Lastly, Leon Kennedy is a great protagonist no matter which incarnation you're referring to. The cheesy RE4 one is iconic, and the more serious Remake version is an alternative take that feels fresh and makes sense. Hmm. Maybe it's the hair...

26. The Last Of Us
I'm not a huge fan of Sony's AAA cinematic games. By that I mean Uncharted, Spiderman, God of War, Horizon, etc. I recognize they're good games but they don't fully appeal to me.

Last of Us 1 is the exception. While not perfect, this game is a masterclass of the zombie apocalypse genre. The story is resonant and deeply emotional, the actors all put on career-high performances, and there's multiple story beats that left me speechless. It all culminates in that ending, which has its detractors (hi Leon) but is extremely memorable if it's something you vibe with.

TLOU doesn't skimp on the gameplay, either. It has a nice mixture of stealth, survival, and 3rd-person shooter. I like how most encounters start with me silently taking down enemies, then devolve into a tense shootout when I get caught halfway through. Some sections aren't paced super well there's a few too many obligatory ladder sections but overall I enjoyed playing TLOU almost as much as I enjoyed experiencing its story.

lmao that would have been a hilarious false positive considering that's not my channel

azuarc posted...

I said MGS2. I also said Portal for 23, Gravity Rush for 29 and Psychonauts 2 for 30, so I'm fairly sure I wasn't counted. (I had the other 6 correct.)

You're right, sorry about that. Was in a rush to get the post up after being out all day. Double-checked everything and edited the post, it should be correct now.

MacArrowny posted...

That glitchfest one had me pretty uncertain. Didn't peg you as a Pokemon fan, heh.

I've got really strong memories tied to GSC and RBY. Despite playing a lot of Gen 3 through 5 though, I don't have the same enduring fondness for them, and I dropped off entirely afterwards. Pokemon is best when you're a kid discovering the world.

UltimaterializerX posted...

Final Fantasy 16 would have worked for 28 as well.

Don't have a PS5 :(

Round 8 Results

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9 people submitted guesses.
The most common score was 5 / 10.
The average score was 5.89 / 10.

Well, I sure succeeded in making it harder! Everyone got a 6/10 or worse this time around, except for two outliers that scored high.

--

Hint:
21. !

Answers:
Metal Gear Solid 9

Thought there might be some guesses for other MGS games, but no, you guys swept it.

--

Hint:
22. An RPG where the main character is not its strongest representative in GameFAQs contests.

Answers:
Final Fantasy IX 5
Final Fantasy VI 4

A battle of two Final Fantasies, with the consensus narrowly guessing correctly.

--

Hint:
23. At one point, you jump down through several HOLES, then emerge at a higher elevation than when you started.

Answers:
Silent Hill 2 2
Dark Souls 3 1
Spelunky 1
Final Fantasy VII 1
Outer Wilds 1
Portal 2 1

I figured this would be a tough one. The hint was pretty obscure, although I included an extra clue in it with the capitalization of HOLES, referencing one of the weirdly memorable lines from Silent Hill 2. Even that clue is pretty obscure though, so I'm not surprised that only two people got it.

--

Hint:
24. It's a glitchfest with a bunch of sequels that improve the core concept...but the original will always be nostalgia incarnate.

Answers:
Pokemon Red/Blue/Yellow 6
Nier 1
Devil May Cry 1

'Glitchfest' was a pretty big indicator. RBY is infamous for glitches.

--

Hint:
25. The best Tales game.

Answers:
Tales of Berseria 5
Tales of the Abyss 3
Tales of Arise 1

This one was a KP knowledge check. I've gotten into multiple discussions on this board about not liking Abyss very much while praising Berseria.

--

Hint:
26. Probably spawned thousands of google searches along the lines of 'Can Cordyceps actually do that?'

Answers:
The Last of Us 9

Freebie. Even if you haven't played the game, you probably heard someone mentioning it when the TV show was at its peak.

--

Hint:
27. The only Resident Evil game on this list.

Answers:
Resident Evil 4 7
Resident Evil 2 Remake 2

I respect the RE2 Remake guesses, but unfortunately for them, there was no swerve.

--

Hint:
28. A JRPG that goes through not one, but two years-long time skips that heavily affect the plot.

Answers:
Dragon Quest V 6
Nier 2
Chrono Trigger 1

Didn't even consider Nier when making this hint. It fits, although not as much as DQV, which is a game utterly defined by its time skips.

--

Hint:
29. A 2D indie action game duology. I loved them enough to upload several gameplay videos to youtube.

Answers:
Bleed 2
Hotline Miami 2
Ori and the Blind Forest / Will O' the Wisps 2
Spelunky 1
Shovel Knight 1

I'm honestly curious about the people who got this one right. Did they remember me talking about Bleed years ago? Did they track down my dormant youtube channel? Did they hunt through Steam's catalog and go for an obscure pick? All valid options!

--

Hint:
30. One of the few games on kickstarter that I backed, was a big kickstarter success...and that I actually ended up liking.

Answers:
Torment: Tides of Numenara 2
Undertale 1
Shadowrun: Hong Kong 1
Divinity: Original Sin 1
Divinity: Original Sin 2 1
Shovel Knight 1
Hollow Knight 1

A bunch of good guesses. I've played and like most of the games here. Torment is the only one I actually backed, though.

--

Which makes the winners of Round 8 Mac Arrowny and AxemRedRanger, each with a score of 9/10! Don't feel like doing a lightning round this time, so they'll both get payouts.

Game writeups will be posted tomorrow and the day after.

I won't be posting until tomorrow either way (work busy) so if you people send guesses before then, I'll count them regardless.

I'll give this 24 more hours.

Top 30 Honorable Mention: Lies of P

Playing this now, and Lies of P absolutely would have gotten high up on the list if I'd started it before this topic. Definitely Top 30, maybe Top 20 if I was feeling extra spicy. Excellent Soulslike game, and is the only one (at least that I've played) that is on par or better than some of From Software's offerings, although it doesn't quite hang with their best.

I'm not even sure I understood how Lies of P's parry mechanic worked after two hours. It has a good number of systems that open up as the game goes on too, more than any other Souls games except maybe Elden Ring.

Symphonia I can agree lays its cards on the table pretty early.

Upsy-daisy

I will go to bat for Lies of P as being better than DS2, DS3, and Sekiro

Sure. I'll keep it to a pastebin so this page doesn't get clogged though.

https://pastebin.com/CHT33Cy6

After how we came close to ending up with multiple perfects last round, I tried to make this batch of hints more challenging overall.

Round 7 Hints

21. !

22. An RPG where the main character is not its strongest representative in GameFAQs contests.

23. At one point, you jump down through several HOLES, then emerge at a higher elevation than when you started.

24. It's a glitchfest with a bunch of sequels that improve the core concept...but the original will always be nostalgia incarnate.

25. The best Tales game.

26. Probably spawned thousands of google searches along the lines of 'Can Cordyceps actually do that?'

27. The only Resident Evil game on this list.

28. A JRPG that goes through not one, but two years-long time skips that heavily affect the plot.

29. A 2D indie action game duology. I loved them enough to upload several gameplay videos to youtube.

30. One of the few games on kickstarter that I backed, was a big kickstarter success...and that I actually ended up liking.