Lurker > Dark_Spiret

Thatuser posted...

Nice weapon but that's steep! I don't own a quality rifle. Just a repro Mosin-Nagant

im a cheap ass in almost everything..except guns. which is why i have a little extra to splurge on them. which really $850 for something like that is pretty good. i have around $3k in my main AR setup.

Thatuser posted...

How much that run you?

used (like new) for $850

i picked up a ruger alaskan in.300winmag recently.

in todays current market probably not the smartest thing to get the usual stuff given the inflated prices unless you dont have anything.

i like the salted stuff more, but i hate not having suger in things that its usually in vs the other way around. i can deal with no or less salt better than i can deal with no suger.

Lysandear posted...

i dont know why you guys have to lie. if it wasnt moddable to say "i'm just happy about the fact that this kid killed BLM protesters, and the fact it pisses off half the population is a bonus" would any of you have the balls to say it

do all BLM "protestors" pack glocks and go around starting fires?

Zeeak4444 posted...

At that point he had turned around right after the gun shot, saw the man in front of him was completely unarmed and still shot him.

The whole thing happened in a fraction of a second. Chances are extremely high that he didnt turn around and see an unarmed guy and decided to shoot him, but saw someone right up on him and fired. he didnt have time to analyze whether this person is armed or not especially after hearing someone try to potentially shoot him a second earlier and was several seconds ago being chased by a mob of individuals.

that ship has sailed. at most there might be more talks for a difinitive cut off point.

the whole intimidation angle is going to come down to the individual, but from what im seeing and reading they ARE letting people through, they arnt blocking anyone from going in or out.

honestly i feel both extremes are pretty fucking stupid. a baby at conception is no more a lump of cells than a blade of grass in a field prior to the brain and brain stem formation. and a baby is a baby by the third trimester.

that said the thought that a baby is a baby at conception imo carries more weight than a mother who feels the need to have an abortion just before birth which imo is murder outside of certain extreme circumstances. theres scientific evidence that babies can survive even just before the third trimester let alone up to the full 9 months. and no its not YOUR body at that point, you become a vessel for a living human being with a functioning brain until they come out.

tho to be quite frank i really dont give a shit. if you want to kill your kid then thats on you. my empathy meter has been sliding in recent years.

imo what id like to see happen is make it easier for younger individuals to know about sex and the possible ramifications of it. along with easier access to contraceptives and easier and substantially better funded adoption agencies that dont discriminate based on sex or race. the whole thought of abortion outside of extreme circumstances could be largely avoided and be a moot fighting point.

i was there every minute for about 2 months straight when my grandfather died and yeah its not a pleasant thing. the emotional and physical toll it takes on you is not easy nor what comes afterwards. just have to be strong and take it one day at a time. it will get better.

could probably go a full year without going to the store if i really had to.

trump is a piece of shit that needs to go, but get real. this was going to happen no matter who was in charge.

ClarkDuke posted...

isn't this why businesses have insurance? i would imagine a militia would potentially cause issues with insurance claims, ok?

under normal circumstances possibly, but we are also in a bad time for the economy. can those businesses afford to pay those costs and deductibles? can they risk losing dozens maybe even hundreds of jobs that can cause a mountain of issues for their familys?

Accrovideogames posted...

But vigilantism is criminal, so Kyle was in the wrong. The correct way to face the situation would have been to call the police and let them handle it, not go there armed with the hope of stopping the riot yourself.

not being able to call the police is why this whole thing started. the police arnt going to be there to save those businesses nor quell the riots or if they are its going to be too late. thats why the militias were there to deter and why businesses are turning to them.

if they can get through all of the other security measures i have then i doubt i have a chance anyway since id be up against superman.

bit overly dramatic.

ill make it short and sweet--

get a Glock 21. 14 rounds of .45 will put a hurt on anything and wont completely blow your ear drums out if you have to use it. not a huge fan of glocks, but they are simple and work. wouldnt recommend a long gun for a closed in situation. just make sure before you buy anything to go out to the range and test some options and see what you like for your self. this is especially important for a handgun. notable brands are all good like Glock, CZ, H&K, Sig, Smith and Wesson, Springfield Armory, Beretta.

a new handgun will genuinely come with a case with a lock option, a lock for the gun itself, 1-3 magazines, a small cleaning rod and maybe a loader for the magazines. as for what else you need--
ammo (hallow points for defense, full metal jacket for range)
additional magazines (imo)
cleaning solution, gun oil and swabs
maybe a light to put on it. streamlights are good.

ehhhhh i guess not.

im in the mountains living a life of solitude and laughing at the idiots.

gunplagirl posted...

Violence against women is very much relevant to his becoming, by definition, a mass shooter. More than that, it helps show he had a history of disproportionate violence and instigating things.

if you wanted to go that route then this footag ehas no baring on what he did now. there is literally a laundry list of footage and proof that goes against him being for violence and instigating anything.

i wonder what we'd find if we dug into the 3 criminal victims' history because thye are currently being called martyrs and heroes too.

littlebro07 posted...

No question about it, he was afraid of a damn plastic bag

Id say he was afraid of a crowd of people chasing him, throwing things at him and GETTING SHOT AT while having someone rush him trying to take his only real means of personal defense.

yes, yes he did.

closetjpopfan posted...

if it wasn't for the fact that he was playing vigilante.

there is literally 0 evidence to support that.

https://www.pscp.tv/w/1jMJgXPwEbbxL

another lawyers perspective.

Smackems posted...

Pro abortion
Pro m4a
Pro gun
Anti political correctness
Anti racism in all forms
Pro large military
Anti war
Pro police reform
Anti censorship
Anti rioting
Pro cake

I have other stances but those are my big ones. When I take political compass tests I'm center left libertarian

roughly my stance as well tho i think there is room to talk as far as certain restrictions and caviats (like abortion and border security) and how M4A would work. im for the concept, but in actual practice i dont know how viable it would be. i also treat being pro gun and pro 2a as very different things. im pro 2a. i dont mind being pro cake, but im more of a pro chocolate brownie person.

which has a higher statistic likelihood of getting you killed?

Smarkil posted...

the blown out arm guy I can't remember but he had a rap sheet too.

think his was something like robbery with illegal weapons charges.

marc55 posted...

saw a pic of him holding the gun with gloves and the finger close to the trigger

not sure you are allowed to do this while open carrying remember reading a long time ago you arent supposed to hold that way while open carrying

why was he wearing gloves ?

the position of a long gun can vary by state (i dont know about WI) but that tends to be more of a grey area in general. as long as you arnt pointing the gun at someone theres very little recourse towards putting your hand on the handle. now if its a handgun thats out of the holster then thats more sketchy.

he was wearing gloves id assume from his earlier interview where he asaid he was also there to help administer aid if need be. he had a medical bag opposite his rifle.

anything serious is going to come down to what happened prior to the first shooting. he was in a group with a lot of people facing a lot of people. someone has to know what happened or someone has to have recorded it. the weapons charge and out of state isnt going to stick if he gets a good lawyer considering how close he was to everything.

the only things we know is that prior to the shooting you can apparently see the first victim antagonizing the shooter. if it comes out that he ended up pointing the rifle at people before getting chased down then hes going to get fucked. if it turns out the guy or someone else antagonizing him assaults him or threatens to causing him to run then theres a large chance he walks with minor issues.

everything after that is 100% justified on camera and can be used to play the sympathy card from his interview before (saying he was also there to help people with aid) to trying to check on the first person he shot (just before someone says to "get that motherfucker" causing him to flee the scene of the crime) to him trying to turn himself in afterwards to the police ect.

both events are not mutually exclusive.

MachineJaipur posted...

and firing into a crowd that is running away is stupid as shit.

where is this footage?

0.i aint spending top dollar on guns during a panic buy when i already have more than a few. same for ammo. should have been stockin gup years prior.

Unless the kid gets an incredibly incompetant lawyer hes going to walk. Even the stuff thats more sketchy like the underage with a rifle across state lines is spotty enough that it can be passed over (like the WI militia clause and his house being practically on the border and only 20minutes away). All of the footage shown shows him defending him self flat out while also tying to check on the first person he shot while using his phone, giving the calm interview that he was there to also help people and him actively trying to turn himself over to the police afterwards. On top of that hes very precise with his defense actions and immediately stopped when the threat was gone. it can all be used in his favor.

papercup posted... You're out of your fucking mind, nothing about this is justifiable

one person looks like might have thrown a molotov cocktail at him and continued to rush him (with many others right behind them) causing him to shoot them. this is the only part that could be deemed as sketchy depending on what was actually thrown at him and what he perceived it was.

you then have a mob of people rush him again and start to kick and beat him while hes down on the ground with running not being an option any more. shoots two more, but only those two who are still on top of him.

you then have him shoot a 4th person in the arm who just faked "surrendered" then pulled a pistol on him.

in terms of the actual shootings a good lawyer can easily get him off on self defense. the really big hurdle is everything else surrounding it like the age of owning the rifle, out of state living ect.

BlackScythe0 posted... The video does not show the beginning of the event. You are acting like it contains the entirety.

and the footage doesnt show what you want to believe. im basing it all on what we've seen so far.
Zeus posted...

Well, he did get assaulted, but Wisconsin isn't a SYG state

No its not, but it doesnt matter in this context. he was actively trying to run away both times with the second being flat on his back being assaulted before opening fire while still on the ground. there is no fleeing at that point.

BlackScythe0 posted... You don't get to kill someone then call subsequent shots justified because the later shots are being fired at people trying to take you down for murder.

and people dont get to chase down someone with a gun then claim victim-hood when they get shot. it wasnt even a stand your ground case, he was actively trying to flee at both instances. the first person he shot was obviously throwing something at him while he was already being chased by a group of people. the others he was about to get pummeled over while on the ground including a third guy who pulls a pistol on him while first acting like he was about to back off.

as i said whats going to get him is everything surrounding what happened.

thats about as clear cut of a justifiable shooting as you can get caught on camera including the third person shot in that moment who pulls a gun on him before getting it in the arm. everything surrounding that event might be what fucks him, but not the shooting itself.

probably not the best idea to run down someone holding an AR. especially when theyre on the floor and the perceived threat increases in their vision by 100.

UnholyMudcrab posted...

10 rounds is not a high capacity magazine. It's barely even average capacity.

for most 9mm's it can be considered low capacity.

good ruling but dont go nuts just yet. never underestimate the 9th's ability to violate rights.

restructure. better training with better pay with more liability and less militarization.

yikes.

and yet hilarious with all the riots over police going on.

the p-01 is a great handgun especially as a middle ground for a carry gun or HD weapon, but youll definitely need to practice a little more with it over something like a glock. youll need to get used to the DA/SA, how the decocker works and in the case of CZ's, the limited grip on the slide which isnt everyones cup of tea. take downs also arnt quite as friendly however iv never shot a CZ that wasnt extremely accurate, 100% reliable and that didnt handle recoil extremely well while feeling amazing in the hands. if youre someone who actually likes to shoot it doesnt get much better and theres a reason most competition shooters use them and outside of the 1911 is the most copied handgun design in the world.

as for the light option on a weapon iv also gone back and forth on. on one hand yeah its uncomfortable to be pointing your firearm in a direction just to see, but on the other hand it also frees up your other hand which might be vital for reloading, opening doors, manipulating your weapon ect. and just in general it means having a 2 handed grip which is going to make you more accurate. the weapon light in terms of weight might feel off, but once you start shooting it will help further mitigate recoil.

no debt and a hell of a lot more net worth. iv learned and been taught all my life not to be stupid with money.

words incoming..

right now is kind of a terrible time to get into it. prices have jumped up drastically for certain items (if you can find them) and ammo of all kinds are going to be price gouged significantly which is especially going to hurt if you do want to get your ccw which they do require you to use up your own ammo or buy theirs. or let alone just ammo to train with your self. this also brings into question the caliber you might want. a 9mm or .45 for instance makes the most sense, but with all the panic buying going on right now thay are much more rare and expensive than something like .40 or 10mm which youll probably have more luck in finding on the shelves. this panic buying probably isnt going to go back to normal for atleast another year.

that said if you just want something to have it just in case then as you said a glock 19 is a good all arounder (or a glock 23 in the case of .40 or 29 for 10mm), but when it comes to handguns its especially important to actually get out there and try them and see what works for you as well as the ammo for them since some guns can be more finicky than others depending on the rounds. glocks tend to work and are very simple for new shooters, but personally iv never liked the way they felt in MY hands or their triggers. its something you have to actually try and get a feel for. for other recommendations its hard ot go wrong with the big names like Colt, Beretta, Sig, CZ, Smith&Wesson, Springfield Armory ect. most of their stuff is very good. Im personally a fan of CZ's. Taurus is alright for the money, but i woudlnt put thousands and thousands of rounds through them. also dont neglect cheaper import stuff like rock islands or tri-star pistols, they tend to be surprisingly good quality for the money. also maybe think about looking into military surplus guns which tend to be fairly old and maybe rough looking, but they also tend to be battle tested and work.

when it comes to ammunition Hallow Points are on the menu for defensive rounds (but make sure you also take a look at your local laws, some states dont take kindly to HP's). and also make sure they are hot enough to go beyond 1000fps in order for proper expansion. some smaller guns with a smaller barrel wont allow the velocity to get high enough in certain rounds to expand them. something else you need to consider when buying ammo.

full metal jackets are fine for range use. when it comes to training with your carry ammo or using normal training rounds that will just come down to the individual, the practicality of cost is going to be a big factor most likely. iv always liked carrying a middle ground of normal HP's like generic remington HP's. not as consistent as the higher end ones, but they wont break the bank and generally they will still do 99% of what those higher ones are capable of. regardless id still put several boxes of carry ammo through your gun a year and remember to change out the ammo you carry in them atleast twice a year. ammo DOES degrade over time when exposed to the elements if not properly stored.

as for a long gun, AR's and AK's are the hot ticket. AR's tend to be more practical in the US so id focus on those first. an M&P Sport II as you mentioned is a nice budget starting AR and a nice rifle to learn on the platform. its also nice just to have something like it if, like you said shit gets really bad. tho im not really a fan of long guns in a home defense type situation. other notable brands of AR's are Ruger, Windham Weaponry, Spikes Tactical when it comes to the more budget brands or you can just say fuck it and get an FN, BCM or Daniel Defense if you ever feel like you just want an end all be all AR (once again if you can actually find any of these for a decent price now). You can go higher, but past those brands you start to get into some serious diminishing returns (tho knights armament offers some unique choices). stick to iron sights at first and get used ot them. optics are better, but they DO run out of batteries and they can be more easily damaged on top of being expensive for good ones. other stuff like rails for lights, lasers, grips ect al come down to the individual, just pick what works for you and dont feel like you have to go nuts with it, but its smart to at the very least get a setup for a light if nothing else.

shotguns you really dont need to get into too many specifics. its a shotgun. id probably focus more on Mossberg over Remington as far as newer options go (Remington is currently having some serious financial issues and since the early 2010's their quality control has been spotty). something like a mossberg 500 is very adequate for what ever youd need it for and can come with easily switched out barrels depending on what use youd want them for (like a 28" for hunting or 18" for home defense). if you want an end all be all shotgun then look to the mossberg 590a1, its what the military uses and its built like a tank. in terms of defensive rounds- buckshot if you have no immediate neighbors, #4 buck or higher end turkey game loads if you do and are worried about over penetration. semi-auto ones tend to be more finicky on ammo and it will cost quite a bit more to get a good one in my experience, but if you also want a recommendation on those types then anything by Beretta, FN and Benelli make quality ones. just make sure what ever you plan to carry in it that it will run reliably.

as for a bolt action, ruger and savage make some nice budget entry ones. Tikka (beretta) makes a very nice overall one in the $700-900 range with very nice accuracy out of the box. pick what ever caliber you feel like you might want. .308 or .30-06 are the most popular. if you really want to try some extreme range shooting then bump those up to a 6.5creed or .300winmag(if you want some serious power as well). also dont neglect a good optic here. its not uncommon for people to use an optic that costs just as much as their rifle. you get what you pay for.

2 is a substantial leap over 1, but outside of gunplay they also kind peak at 2.