Current Events > People really wanted FF7 remake to be one 300 hour RPG that took 15 years to do?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Instead of three 60 hour complete experiences that we get every 4-5 years?

"But the original was one game why can't they fit this in one game?"

Because that's how you get a shitty barebones 1:1 adaptation that doesn't add anything new. It's basically just the PC port with mods at that point. Even just adding voice acting makes the game take longer.

IT'S NOT 1:1. FUCK.

Anyone expecting one single game to do HD, elaborated and expanded versions of ALL of it, and wanting one single ultra package 300 hour epic for $60 after 15 years of development is out of their mind.

It's 3 parts because it's huge as fuck.

Why do so many responses to criticism resort to turning things into hypothetical binaries between what was received, and the most cartoonishly extreme example of something else? FF7 is about 30-40 hours. You could make a single 80-100 hour rpg that expands on the original in a satisfying way.

Just off the top of my head, you could cut the train graveyard from the Remake by two thirds and get rid of the entirely superfluous boss fight and story. Just treat it as it was originally, a short pace breaker between two major story parts. So much of the remake is unnecessary bloat to justify the length. >_>

I just wanted the same gameplay and slightly polished story with non poop graphics

MarthGoomba posted...

I just wanted the same gameplay and slightly polished story with non poop graphics

My guy you want PC mods. This is a new game.

Uh no people wanted a 70-100 hr game without all the bloat. FF7Remake took a 5-7 hr segment and stretched it to 40+ hrs. People wanted a game with updated graphics and cutscenes to properly tell the original story in a more digestible/emotion provoking way. The blueprints of the original was right there to adapt, no need to have spent 15 years on it. Its 3 parts because FF7 is popular and they know it'll sell.

Kim_Seong-a posted...

Why do so many responses to criticism resort to turning things into hypothetical binaries between what was received, and the most cartoonishly extreme example of something else? FF7 is about 30-40 hours. You could make a single 80-100 hour rpg that expands on the original in a satisfying way.

Just off the top of my head, you could cut the train graveyard from the Remake by two thirds and get rid of the entirely superfluous boss fight and story. Just treat it as it was originally, a short pace breaker between two major story parts. So much of the remake is unnecessary bloat to justify the length. >_>

Yes but it would also mean all three games would be designed completely differently. Remake and Rebirth are still designed as proper games even if the plot elements are more stretched out.

I think really it's more comparable to an adaptation than a proper remake.

SilvosForever posted...

My guy you want PC mods.

No. I want professional graphics, not unpaid amateur mods that look like crap

I haven't had any interest in the remake because it's broken up. I may get it eventually when it's finally finished. So basically what the title is saying.

I think people expected a more faithful remake. As it is now it doesn't seem to be a remake (only player like 1/2 of the first) and it's just an entirely new game with the same cast. Which idk they can do whatever they want with that as long as the games seem complete on their own.

I should get back to finishing the first one. It was pretty okay. The new one looks significantly better.

No. People wanted Rebirth where it starts at where Remake does and ends where it ends in the game coming out, which would be without parts.
Then remove the fluff because Remake had A LOT of fluff. Where they did 1:1 is actually where Remake shined. You could still add new thing here and there but certain things actually detracted from the game.

This would not be 300 hours long.

First you might notice how your levels and gear all reset in rebirth. Think about that one for awhile.

Really.... think about that one.

The original game was a bunch of prendered screens with 1-4 exits connected via an overworld that was just a blurry blob with low poly trees and cities. It had more in common with a SNES game than an open world game of today.

A Final Fantasy VII Remake spent so long as a dream game I don't think people really knew what they wanted by the time it came out. I do know that people got excited over the PS3 tech demo because it resembled a Midgard that actually looked like something you could explore. That was when tech limitations weren't seen as something we had to deal with anymore.

Which leads to the other big issue. It took 22 years for this thing to finally come out and Final Fantasy isn't as popular as it used to be. By the time this finished it'll probably be a 30 year old gap. A lot of older people don't play games as much as they used to and younger gamers don't give a fuck about Final Fantasy.

Kim_Seong-a posted...

Just off the top of my head, you could cut the train graveyard from the Remake by two thirds and get rid of the entirely superfluous boss fight and story. Just treat it as it was originally, a short pace breaker between two major story parts. So much of the remake is unnecessary bloat to justify the length. >_>

Exactly.

Also you would shave another really long part that was actually an extremely unsatisfying and disappointing change:

remake spoilers
That you didn't get caught and put in the prison before trail of blood was a HUGE let down and facepalm.
Then Hojo putting you into his little maze was stupid as you can get.

Kim_Seong-a posted...

Why do so many responses to criticism resort to turning things into hypothetical binaries between what was received, and the most cartoonishly extreme example of something else? FF7 is about 30-40 hours. You could make a single 80-100 hour rpg that expands on the original in a satisfying way.

Just off the top of my head, you could cut the train graveyard from the Remake by two thirds and get rid of the entirely superfluous boss fight and story. Just treat it as it was originally, a short pace breaker between two major story parts. So much of the remake is unnecessary bloat to justify the length. >_>

wut

GTFO

The expanded train graveyard was one of the best parts of the original and helped build some stakes with monsters not only killing people, but kids to boot.

There is so much else than can be trimmed but I loved this part. I love that they took a regular enemy from the original and made it something so much more with the remake.

You guys get that cutting down a segment doesn't mean they could realistically replace it with an entire overworld or different towns right?

That's like saying they could cut missions from GTAV to add Vice City.

WingsOfGood posted...

Exactly.

Also you would shave another really long part that was actually an extremely unsatisfying and disappointing change:

remake spoilers
That you didn't get caught and put in the prison before trail of blood was a HUGE let down and facepalm.
Then Hojo putting you into his little maze was stupid as you can get.

I liked the Hojo stuff since it added more background on Aerith. Getting to see the room she grew up in was heartbreaking.

ReiRei89 posted...

I liked the Hojo stuff since it added more background on Aerith. Getting to see the room she grew up in was heartbreaking.

so you like a whole 2 hour segment because of a scene that takes less than a minute?

WingsOfGood posted...

Exactly.

Also you would shave another really long part that was actually an extremely unsatisfying and disappointing change:

remake spoilers
That you didn't get caught and put in the prison before trail of blood was a HUGE let down and facepalm.
Then Hojo putting you into his little maze was stupid as you can get.

I don't see what's stupid about that part though - it's literally a NEW dungeon. You seem to be taking the stance that anything not in the original automatically = bad. The dungeon took a while to get through, but it looked rad and overall I thought it was cool.

Close your eyes and imagine the original FF7. Now consider this question: "What if every city was bigger?" "What if there were more bosses and more dungeons?" And then fill in what those would be.

I think the Remake team did a great job in that.

The end product of all of this is going to be 3 separate games, but it's going to ultimately be a hell of a lot more content and a lot bigger scale than what people were even asking for originally. And I think that is a damn good thing.

The fact that the story is also familiar but unpredictable is also fine by me - I don't want to know how a story ends before I get to the end. That's how you get people just going through the paces.

Again, this whole project isn't a 1:1 remake. It is a retelling. An adaptation. A pseudo-sequel.

How many times has Spider-Man (in comic books) been told over again. It's like that. Or every time they make a new Batman origin movie.

Stop being laser focused on every single difference from the original game (which you perceive as imperfections) and try just enjoying the ride for what it is, seeing where they go with it, and judge it on its own merits at the end of the experience.

I for one am excited about the possibilities. More Turks backstory and characters. More Zangan. New villain characters, new SOLDIERs. New materia, new weapons, new summons. New everything. The characters have new abilities and limit breaks.

It's just the worst kinds of whiners man. I wonder how these people ever enjoyed any video game ever if they were always complaining about what could have been instead of what is.

I think people are going to look back on Remake and Rebirth as some of the best FF games ever made, but it's going to take a bit of distance and hindsight (and getting your heads out of your asses) to fully appreciate them.

SilvosForever posted...

I am just glad Rebirth is looking good so far. Frankly Remake was filled with way too much fluff. But if that let them make Rebirth then perhaps the payoff was worth it.
However I hope the whispers stupidity won't ruin Rebirth. Just barely into Rebirth so no spoilers please.

SilvosForever posted...

Stop being laser focused on every single difference from the original game (which you perceive as imperfections) and try just enjoying the ride for what it is, seeing where they go with it, and judge it on its own merits at the end of the experience.

No.
You don't seem to understand some changes are detracting. We didn't get to see the prison scene or the trail of blood in glorious remade 3D. They outright replaced the arrest and then they toned the trail of blood so it wasn't even eerie.

SilvosForever posted...

It's just the worst kinds of whiners man. I wonder how these people ever enjoyed any video game ever if they were always complaining about what could have been instead of what is.

You literally made this thread on CE when no one is talking about this because you wanted to whine.

Also the worst part is that some people will in ignorance start with Remake instead of OG FF7 not knowing that you shouldn't do that and you can't really explain why without spoiling.

Does anyone actually think itll only be 3 parts? It seems like theres too much to do in part 3 to cover everything thats left

They essentially pulled a Hobbit movie for the ff7 remake compilation. Completely unnecessary and full of filler because they knew it was gonna sell. The mainline franchise has been floundering and this allowed them to not worry about that for a decade or so

The craziest thing is, that since they have made it into a sequel, it still leaves room open for an actual remake down the line on top of everything else

Xerun posted...

Does anyone actually think itll only be 3 parts? It seems like theres too much to do in part 3 to cover everything thats left

They probably are hoping VII will be big enough to be its own franchise but I don't think that's going to work out.

With the way y'all bocker about final fantasy games, I'm not sure what y'all want.

Man thinking about it

There was even more fluff then I realized:

remake spoilers
Whole going to Jesse house
Entire Roche segment
train graveyard turned into 2 hours dungeon
Wall Market new characters with really long cutscenes (Sam and Asian lady)
Sewer turned into like 2 hour long Dungeon
Whole Hojo segment pretty much
The literal entire ending segment when you go into the portal

You could easily shave like 25-30 hours and not miss much at all

WingsOfGood posted...

Man thinking about it

There was even more fluff then I realized:

remake spoilers
Whole going to Jesse house
Entire Roche segment
train graveyard turned into 2 hours dungeon
Wall Market new characters with really long cutscenes (Sam and Asian lady)
Sewer turned into like 2 hour long Dungeon
Whole Hojo segment pretty much
The literal entire ending segment when you go into the portal

You could easily shave like 25-30 hours and not miss much at all

See some of this stuff I don't even mind in theory. But it's like a bunch of devs sat together throwing shit on a wall, but then never edited it back down.

"Hey let's have a sidequest with Jesse so we can flesh her out more."
"Yeah, that'd be cool!"
"And on the way to Jesse's house they can fight some jackass on a motorcycle."
"Who?"
"Idk just some idiot who happens to be there."
"Sure why not, put it on the board!"

Kim_Seong-a posted...

See some of this stuff I don't even mind in theory. But it's like a bunch of devs sat together throwing s*** on a wall, but then never edited it back down.

Well they had to pad it up or it wouldn't have been worth doing an entire game for which is literally the point.
It is funny how fans used to argue that making FF7 in glorious 3D was just too much. But when it came down to it what seems to actually have happened is they didn't have enough and had to find ways to pad.

I'm just going to point this out. Just because a game is 300 hours, does not make it good. I would rather have a 40 hour great game than a 150 hour game with a ridiculous amount of side quests. I don't mind them adding things to the new game, long as it doesn't take away from the feeling of the original. Don't change the key moments of the story to suit a new narrative all because you've had more time to "think" about what could have happened.

Take that creativity and use it towards Final Fantasy 17, or Final Fantasy 18, or hell, a new Crystal Chronicles.

WingsOfGood posted...

Well they had to pad it up or it wouldn't have been worth doing an entire game for which is literally the point.
It is funny how fans used to argue that making FF7 in glorious 3D was just too much. But when it came down to it what seems to actually have happened is they didn't have enough and had to find ways to pad.

It was too much. That's why they decided from the start to make a game set entirely within Midgar and start the sequel in the overworld.

Absolutely nobody wanted an alt history remake, and on top of that it's split into 3 parts for money reasons.

Punished_Blinx posted...

It was too much. That's why they decided from the start to make a game set entirely within Midgar and start the sequel in the overworld.

If that were true we wouldn't have 30 hours of padding. So you are incorrect.

xlr_big-coop posted...

Absolutely nobody wanted an alt history remake,

Apparently not even Nomura HIMSELF did but the other two exec guys pushed for it or so someone told me this. Which makes it funnier when a fan goes copium about that as if it was a glorious vision when the director themself didn't really want it that way.

Also don't call it alt history remake call it what it is which is a Sequel

WingsOfGood posted...

If that were true we wouldn't have 30 hours of padding. So you are incorrect.

The scope creep is from the stuff after Midgar. Which is why the scope for Rebirth is so much bigger.

The alternative would be to scale down Midgar to just be a few hours long and cut out a lot of it. Which would be a bit awkward considering Midgar is arguably the most memorable and iconic setting in the game.

Punished_Blinx posted...

The scope creep is from the stuff after Midgar. Which is why the scope for Rebirth is so much bigger.

The alternative would be to scale down Midgar to just be a few hours long and cut out a lot of it.

I am talking about Remake only.

The scope creep is IN Midgar. You might have enjoyed Remake and that is completely fine, but you must also understand it wasn't necessary to make the sewer for instance into a long dungeon. This was a deliberate choice because of the decision to split into parts not something that forced them to split it into parts.
That is, after they decided it was to be split, they didn't have enough to justify selling part 1 and had to come up with a bunch of padded bs.

Some people are hoping for a FFVI remake too, done with today's graphics. There's no way to pull of a game of that scope without it taking at least a decade to create and a few hundreds of millions investment put in. Perhaps stylized (example: FF7 Ever crisis) but I'd think FFIX is the better game to remake in a stylized manner. You'd think tech advances would make it easier to create epic AAA tales, but the more and more detailed we've gotten, the more and more difficult pulling off games of an epic scope can be.

WingsOfGood posted...

I am talking about Remake only.

The scope creep is IN Midgar. You might have enjoyed Remake and that is completely fine, but you must also understand it wasn't necessary to make the sewer for instance into a long dungeon. This was a deliberate choice because of the decision to split into parts not something that forced them to split it into parts.
That is, after they decided it was to be split, they didn't have enough to justify selling part 1 and had to come up with a bunch of padded bs.

The reality is people would be angry if Remake was only a 5-20 hour game and the game wouldn't sell.

On top of that the game itself had development issues and they shifted teams midway.

I enjoyed the game fine and thought I had my money's worth. Yeah there was some padding but that's not unusual for a JRPG.

Also if Nomura wanted it to be a faithful 1:1 remake as people have rumored that this is true, he must have thought that would be doable.
That would definitely not be made into 3 parts.
He is the director so that basically kills the idea that it was necessary beyond a finance monetary level.

Btw I don't hate Remake. Some part of it I enjoyed and was happy about.

I will have to say though I did infact cringe through the whole ending.

ending spoilers

The whole we just beat Sephiroth and then Cloud goes "He is still out there. I will find him!"
and Barret is like "WTF didn't we JUST beat him!"
that was like the pinnacle of stupidity for Remake. Had to facepalm so hard. Barret was infact right.
And to make matters worse
--Rebirth introduction not really spoiler but warning--
the whole ending is kinda like it never happened.
Rebirth begins at the Kalm segment from OG FF7. It is as if that didn't really happen or more realistic to say it was shoved in which is 100% was.

But they did do a good job on the battle system. It not being pure action was a good touch. I liked the Yuffie dlc even though it was essentially pointless fluff but at least it was a side story that didn't detract or mess with anything.

Hoping whenever they release pc version, it will be released as one game and I get to keep same levels, gear etc.

kage_53 posted...

and I get to keep same levels, gear etc.

this won't happen

I wanted them to make it two games, max. Not three separate games. I'll still play it, but I'm gonna wait until it's all out on whatever system.

SilvosForever posted...

I don't see what's stupid about that part though - it's literally a NEW dungeon. You seem to be taking the stance that anything not in the original automatically = bad. The dungeon took a while to get through, but it looked rad and overall I thought it was cool.

Close your eyes and imagine the original FF7. Now consider this question: "What if every city was bigger?" "What if there were more bosses and more dungeons?" And then fill in what those would be.

I think the Remake team did a great job in that.

The end product of all of this is going to be 3 separate games, but it's going to ultimately be a hell of a lot more content and a lot bigger scale than what people were even asking for originally. And I think that is a damn good thing.

The fact that the story is also familiar but unpredictable is also fine by me - I don't want to know how a story ends before I get to the end. That's how you get people just going through the paces.

Again, this whole project isn't a 1:1 remake. It is a retelling. An adaptation. A pseudo-sequel.

How many times has Spider-Man (in comic books) been told over again. It's like that. Or every time they make a new Batman origin movie.

Stop being laser focused on every single difference from the original game (which you perceive as imperfections) and try just enjoying the ride for what it is, seeing where they go with it, and judge it on its own merits at the end of the experience.

I for one am excited about the possibilities. More Turks backstory and characters. More Zangan. New villain characters, new SOLDIERs. New materia, new weapons, new summons. New everything. The characters have new abilities and limit breaks.

It's just the worst kinds of whiners man. I wonder how these people ever enjoyed any video game ever if they were always complaining about what could have been instead of what is.

I think people are going to look back on Remake and Rebirth as some of the best FF games ever made, but it's going to take a bit of distance and hindsight (and getting your heads out of your asses) to fully appreciate them.

this is one of those times I wish gamefaqs had a like button or something so I dont have to write a message that just says youre right and you said it well.

OzNarcissus posted...

I wanted them to make it two games, max. Not three separate games. I'll still play it, but I'm gonna wait until it's all out on whatever system.

another tragedy of this I suppose

wonder how different the sales would have been if it was all in one game instead?
we often think the splitting was greed-based or let's say finance needed incentive to approve the project but it might actually have had the opposite effect

WingsOfGood posted...

Btw I don't hate Remake. Some part of it I enjoyed and was happy about.

I will have to say though I did infact cringe through the whole ending.

ending spoilers

The whole we just beat Sephiroth and then Cloud goes "He is still out there. I will find him!"
and Barret is like "WTF didn't we JUST beat him!"
that was like the pinnacle of stupidity for Remake. Had to facepalm so hard. Barret was infact right.
And to make matters worse
--Rebirth introduction not really spoiler but warning--
the whole ending is kinda like it never happened.
Rebirth begins at the Kalm segment from OG FF7. It is as if that didn't really happen or more realistic to say it was shoved in which is 100% was.

But they did do a good job on the battle system. It not being pure action was a good touch. I liked the Yuffie dlc even though it was essentially pointless fluff but at least it was a side story that didn't detract or mess with anything.

I think youre confused about what happened at the end of FF7 remake. They didnt beat sephiroth. He is definitely still out there. The one they fought probably isnt even the same one that is out there. Either way, it all happened, and they go from the end of remake to Kalm, in a pretty obvious fashion. You didnt have to see the literal car trip in the back of a truck to connect the dots.

WingsOfGood posted...

this won't happen

Then it will be pointless.

Only reason console version has that feature is because they are on different platforms.

Zonbei posted...

I think youre confused about what happened at the end of FF7 remake. They didnt beat sephiroth. He is definitely still out there. The one they fought probably isnt even the same one that is out there. Either way, it all happened, and they go from the end of remake to Kalm, in a pretty obvious fashion. You didnt have to see the literal car trip in the back of a truck to connect the dots.

I am not confused at all. You are discussing information that comes from the OG FF7 as such mark your spoilers as you are spoiling part 3 with your infos.
The error here is nothing in Remake conveyed this info to the party. From their perspective they did just defeat him and Barret even says this. The only way they would think otherwise would be time travel shenanigans like Aerith memories except they had been erased already at this point.

Cloud says what he says because they needed him to say it, not because it made sense. And that is poor writing.

WingsOfGood posted...

another tragedy of this I suppose

wonder how different the sales would have been if it was all in one game instead?
we often think the splitting was greed-based or let's say finance needed incentive to approve the project but it might actually have had the opposite effect

Im fairly certain they had a vision and wanted to do the game justice and the splitting is due to that. They put massive amounts of dev time and money into these, its not like they pushed out three cheap games or split one game into three for profit. At worst the idea was people like FF7, they want FF7, lets give them a huge version of FF7 and a lot of people will buy the three games. But they could have literally just made any three games with that time and cost.

they made FF7 because thats what people wanted, and they gave it the resources and dev time of three fucking games, only for people to endlessly whine about getting more FF7.

i'm enjoying rebirth but i'm starting to get fatigued from all the bloat. i'm wondering if some things like the queens blood tournament on the cruise ship or having to do acitivities to get a swimsuit for costa del sol are necessary things to make you do. just makes it take longer to get through stuff that other games wouldn't make you do. especially the second one.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]



no. You misread, assuming youre talking to me. Theyre complaining that they got more FF7.