Current Events > Loan Forgiveness Idea I Could Get Behind

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Have_A_Cigar 06/21/23 5:39:00 PM #52:	EmilyTheCEman posted... I agree, Donald Trump shouldnt have been able to file for bankruptcy like 20 times. Agreed^^^^ Skankhair posted... How about this idea: loan agents arent allowed to lie to people, especially minors and adults under 21, about how much those payments will actually be, and how much their degree will allow them to actually make. Because right now they do lie about those things, which is the actual problem. I think maybe you're putting too much an emphasis on the degree itself and one's earning capability. And many folks don't even work in the field they studied. And even further, if a student is taking out loans for a major without even having considered the earnings potential of that major (assuming they stick with it), then they are a fool. --- And did we tell you the name of the game, boy We call it 'riding the gravy train' <cite>Have_A_Cigar posted [p:974317692] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>EmilyTheCEman posted... </cite><quote>I agree, Donald Trump shouldnt have been able to file for bankruptcy like 20 times.</quote>Agreed^^^^Skankhair posted... </cite><quote>How about this idea: loan agents arent allowed to lie to people, especially minors and adults under 21, about how much those payments will actually be, and how much their degree will allow them to actually make. Because right now they do lie about those things, which is the actual problem.</quote>I think maybe you're putting too much an emphasis on the degree itself and one's earning capability. And many folks don't even work in the field they studied. And even further, if a student is taking out loans for a major without even having considered the earnings potential of that major (assuming they stick with it), then they are a fool.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lonestar2000 06/21/23 5:54:01 PM #53:	Whose shitty alt is the TC? --- Rumble Roses. Someone enters the room. Them: O_O Me: What?! I always play games without my pants on!- Inmate 922335 #ImpeachToadDickTrump <cite>Lonestar2000 posted [p:974318053] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Whose shitty alt is the TC?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
SaikyoStyle 06/21/23 8:42:08 PM #54:	Lonestar2000 posted... Whose shitty alt is the TC? I dont know but if he was my son I wouldnt admit it in public. --- Taxes, death, and trouble. Brunt/Gaila 2024. Make Ferenginar Great Again! <cite>SaikyoStyle posted [p:974322264] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Lonestar2000 posted... </cite><quote>Whose shitty alt is the TC?</quote>I dont know but if he was my son I wouldnt admit it in public.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
loafy013 06/21/23 8:47:22 PM #55:	Have_A_Cigar posted... Or the student could take 12 credit hours per semester while working full time to put themselves through college like I did. Sure, it took 5 years, but I got it done while bartending and paid off my ~$30k student loans within 5 years. Again, comes down to grit. And maybe some delayed gratification. Look, I'm just trying to present a solution here both sides could work with. The left wants the forgiveness - done. The right wants accountability - done. Win-Win Must have been nice to get a degree for only 30K. How many decades ago was this? Because a quick search shows that is the approximate cost for a single year for a student living on campus in their home state at a state school. --- The ball is round, the game lasts 90 minutes. That's fact. Everything else, is theory. <cite>loafy013 posted [p:974322365] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Have_A_Cigar posted... </cite><quote>Or the student could take 12 credit hours per semester while working full time to put themselves through college like I did. Sure, it took 5 years, but I got it done while bartending and paid off my ~$30k student loans within 5 years.Again, comes down to grit. And maybe some delayed gratification.Look, I'm just trying to present a solution here both sides could work with. The left wants the forgiveness - done. The right wants accountability - done.Win-Win</quote>Must have been nice to get a degree for only 30K. How many decades ago was this? Because a quick search shows that is the approximate cost for a single year for a student living on campus in their home state at a state school.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zero_Destroyer 06/21/23 8:48:24 PM #56:	Have_A_Cigar posted... I'm so glad I believe in personal accountability. Lots of hatred and hostility here due to an idea to give the handout but with an ounce of accountability. Nobody can give a legit answer to why someone who took out an obligation should get to default on that obligation with no strings attached. Lots of attacks, no real debate. Locking education behind large quantities of money and seeing it solely as a mechanism of job creation are both immensely flawed ideas that institutionalize money equaling to power (an idea innately combative with democracy) and simply continues the status quo of debt culture. It devalues education as a concept and associates it with wealth and elitism, which is a benefit to bad faith actors that seek to normalize anti-intellectualism. It's a bad idea as is, your idea engages with the system at benefit to employers under the assumption systemic flaws don't exist that that "personal accountability" can somehow overcome anything when it objectively cannot in many circumstances. There you go. --- Enjoy movies and television? Check out my blog! I do reviews and analyses. http://fictionrantreview.wordpress.com/ (The Force Awakens spoiler review up!) <cite>Zero_Destroyer posted [p:974322392] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Have_A_Cigar posted... </cite><quote>I'm so glad I believe in personal accountability. Lots of hatred and hostility here due to an idea to give the handout but with an ounce of accountability. Nobody can give a legit answer to why someone who took out an obligation should get to default on that obligation with no strings attached. Lots of attacks, no real debate.</quote>Locking education behind large quantities of money and seeing it solely as a mechanism of job creation are both immensely flawed ideas that institutionalize money equaling to power (an idea innately combative with democracy) and simply continues the status quo of debt culture. It devalues education as a concept and associates it with wealth and elitism, which is a benefit to bad faith actors that seek to normalize anti-intellectualism. It's a bad idea as is, your idea engages with the system at benefit to employers under the assumption systemic flaws don't exist that that "personal accountability" can somehow overcome anything when it objectively cannot in many circumstances.There you go. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zero_Destroyer 06/21/23 8:51:58 PM #57:	Also, this shouldn't even need to be said, but giving more power to employers over individuals by making that kind of information public and tying it to financial institutions only increases the binds between wealth & education and reduces the power of the individual by revoking their privacy. Completely insane on that alone, but yeah, no, horrible idea. No debt relief at all would be preferable to whatever this nonsense is --- Enjoy movies and television? Check out my blog! I do reviews and analyses. http://fictionrantreview.wordpress.com/ (The Force Awakens spoiler review up!) <cite>Zero_Destroyer posted [p:974322486] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Also, this shouldn't even need to be said, but giving more power to employers over individuals by making that kind of information public and tying it to financial institutions only increases the binds between wealth & education and reduces the power of the individual by revoking their privacy. Completely insane on that alone, but yeah, no, horrible idea. No debt relief at all would be preferable to whatever this nonsense is </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Enclave 06/21/23 8:54:52 PM #58:	So TC wants to accelerate us into a corporate dystopian society where only the rich really have any rights. --- The commercial says that Church isn't for perfect people, I guess that's why I'm an atheist. <cite>Enclave posted [p:974322566] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>So TC wants to accelerate us into a corporate dystopian society where only the rich really have any rights. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
rexcrk 06/21/23 8:55:08 PM #59:	EmilyTheCEman posted... it would give a great glimpse into their grit, self awareness and willingness to take ownership for decisions He says unemployed in his sweatpants from his mothers basement. --- I've got better things to do tonight than die <cite>rexcrk posted [p:974322572] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>EmilyTheCEman posted... </cite><quote>it would give a great glimpse into their grit, self awareness and willingness to take ownership for decisionsHe says unemployed in his sweatpants from his mothers basement.</quote></quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zero_Destroyer 06/21/23 8:57:42 PM #60:	Lastly, we have seen & continue to see the premise of "accountability" completely ducked by authorities & institutions. If they cannot hold themselves accountable to debts or obligations they swore by, why should individuals when they engage with a system that does not value accountability? It's just technocrat shit where X company can do whatever they want, lobby to congress and not be held accountable if they break laws (or even better - change the laws so doing immoral things becomes legal,) yet individuals are expected to load bear everything. This is already a problem when it comes to, say, pollution, where the individual impact is negligible compared to larger entities that escape responsibility yet the individual is expected to do all the work with power conservation or recycling. Maybe if you understood this you'd get why "personal accountability" in the context of social policies is a buzzword and means absolutely nothing. --- Enjoy movies and television? Check out my blog! I do reviews and analyses. http://fictionrantreview.wordpress.com/ (The Force Awakens spoiler review up!) <cite>Zero_Destroyer posted [p:974322642] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Lastly, we have seen & continue to see the premise of "accountability" completely ducked by authorities & institutions. If they cannot hold themselves accountable to debts or obligations they swore by, why should individuals when they engage with a system that does not value accountability? It's just technocrat shit where X company can do whatever they want, lobby to congress and not be held accountable if they break laws (or even better - change the laws so doing immoral things becomes legal,) yet individuals are expected to load bear everything. This is already a problem when it comes to, say, pollution, where the individual impact is negligible compared to larger entities that escape responsibility yet the individual is expected to do all the work with power conservation or recycling. Maybe if you understood this you'd get why "personal accountability" in the context of social policies is a buzzword and means absolutely nothing. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
superbot400 06/21/23 9:00:15 PM #61:	Or we could just cut tuitions in college , refinance the loans, and make college more affordable. No I rather allow the government to abuse debt-trap loans overvalued degreees. --- http://spinsulin.freeforums.org/the-fantastic-four-respect-thread-t4436.html, my huge ass respect thread. You won't see it. <cite>superbot400 posted [p:974322710] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Or we could just cut tuitions in college , refinance the loans, and make college more affordable.No I rather allow the government to abuse debt-trap loans overvalued degreees.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Prismsblade 06/21/23 9:27:39 PM #62:	EmilyTheCEman posted... Society: If you want any hope of even a semi-passable decent life, you need a good degree. Oh and those can cost $50,000-$100,000. Which you dont have, so we can give you a loan! I hope youre prepared for that, 18 year old who is just entering the world with no work experience and no basis or perspective to understand what this loan really means relative to the monthly life bills you dont even have yet. Why do people enter into these obligations they cant fulfill? Nobody actually promotes that crap anymore. All you ever hear about about college nowadays are its cost and countless adults stuck in debt from its loans. If they can't bother to do a few hours of research and ask questions on the matter during their junior and senior year before signing those papers then that's on them. And if no adults in their cycles bothered to guide them on the matter or provide other career paths in life then they've failed them. So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society. --- 3DS FC:3368-5403-9633 Name: Kaizer PSN: Blackkaizer <cite>Prismsblade posted [p:974323448] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>EmilyTheCEman posted... </cite><quote>Society: If you want any hope of even a semi-passable decent life, you need a good degree. Oh and those can cost $50,000-$100,000. Which you dont have, so we can give you a loan! I hope youre prepared for that, 18 year old who is just entering the world with no work experience and no basis or perspective to understand what this loan really means relative to the monthly life bills you dont even have yet.Why do people enter into these obligations they cant fulfill?</quote>Nobody actually promotes that crap anymore. All you ever hear about about college nowadays are its cost and countless adults stuck in debt from its loans.If they can't bother to do a few hours of research and ask questions on the matter during their junior and senior year before signing those papers then that's on them. And if no adults in their cycles bothered to guide them on the matter or provide other career paths in life then they've failed them. So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
DnDer 06/21/23 9:51:11 PM #63:	Prismsblade posted... So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society. If society has failed them by, as you point out, not guiding them on the matter, why shouldn't we blame society? You cannot expect a child, even with the internet, to be able to "do research" and make a meaningful choice that will affect the next 40-60 years of their life (especially if there are loans involved) in an appropriately-formed manner. That guidance from adults in their lives, or higher institutions who can explain and espouse the values of their education, are hugely important to have on hand. If they don't, then we need to have mechanisms in place to do so. It takes a village, remember? --- What has books ever teached us? -- Captain Afrohead Subject-verb agreement. -- t3h 0n3 <cite>DnDer posted [p:974324033] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Prismsblade posted... </cite><quote>So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society.</quote>If society has failed them by, as you point out, not guiding them on the matter, why shouldn't we blame society? You cannot expect a child, even with the internet, to be able to "do research" and make a meaningful choice that will affect the next 40-60 years of their life (especially if there are loans involved) in an appropriately-formed manner. That guidance from adults in their lives, or higher institutions who can explain and espouse the values of their education, are hugely important to have on hand.If they don't, then we need to have mechanisms in place to do so.It takes a village, remember?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Heineken14 06/21/23 10:22:07 PM #64:	Prismsblade posted... Nobody actually promotes that crap anymore. All you ever hear about about college nowadays are its cost and countless adults stuck in debt from its loans. If they can't bother to do a few hours of research and ask questions on the matter during their junior and senior year before signing those papers then that's on them. And if no adults in their cycles bothered to guide them on the matter or provide other career paths in life then they've failed them. So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society. What other career paths? What are people going to do to have a functioning society if everyone stops going to college? --- Rage is a hell of an anesthetic. <cite>Heineken14 posted [p:974324707] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Prismsblade posted...</cite><quote>Nobody actually promotes that crap anymore. All you ever hear about about college nowadays are its cost and countless adults stuck in debt from its loans.If they can't bother to do a few hours of research and ask questions on the matter during their junior and senior year before signing those papers then that's on them. And if no adults in their cycles bothered to guide them on the matter or provide other career paths in life then they've failed them. So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society.</quote>What other career paths? What are people going to do to have a functioning society if everyone stops going to college?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
itachi15243 06/21/23 10:22:50 PM #65:	This would literally devastate if not destroy the economy by paying for this service in the first place, while also running afoul of so many many security and banking laws that the whole country would have to be rewritten. This is like saying, why don't we all share everything! But fundamentally worse because this idea is actually worse and fails in almost just as many ways. --- I do drawings and stuff https://www.fiverr.com/blueblitz <cite>itachi15243 posted [p:974324718] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>This would literally devastate if not destroy the economy by paying for this service in the first place, while also running afoul of so many many security and banking laws that the whole country would have to be rewritten. This is like saying, why don't we all share everything! But fundamentally worse because this idea is actually worse and fails in almost just as many ways. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Heineken14 06/21/23 10:23:34 PM #66:	itachi15243 posted... This would literally devastate if not destroy the economy by paying for this service in the first place, while also running afoul of so many many security and banking laws that the whole country would have to be rewritten. This is like saying, why don't we all share everything! But fundamentally worse because this idea is actually worse and fails in almost just as many ways. And then the republicans that implemented it would blame it on democrats. --- Rage is a hell of an anesthetic. <cite>Heineken14 posted [p:974324734] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>itachi15243 posted...</cite><quote>This would literally devastate if not destroy the economy by paying for this service in the first place, while also running afoul of so many many security and banking laws that the whole country would have to be rewritten. This is like saying, why don't we all share everything! But fundamentally worse because this idea is actually worse and fails in almost just as many ways. </quote>And then the republicans that implemented it would blame it on democrats.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ZMythos 06/21/23 10:26:16 PM #67:	Prismsblade posted... Nobody actually promotes that crap anymore. All you ever hear about about college nowadays are its cost and countless adults stuck in debt from its loans. If they can't bother to do a few hours of research and ask questions on the matter during their junior and senior year before signing those papers then that's on them. And if no adults in their cycles bothered to guide them on the matter or provide other career paths in life then they've failed them. So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society. Damn, bro really pointed out how it's literally society's fault and then said "stop shifting the blame to society" --- Rainbow Dashing: "it's just star wars" AutumnEspirit: kissu <cite>ZMythos posted [p:974324790] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Prismsblade posted... </cite><quote>Nobody actually promotes that crap anymore. All you ever hear about about college nowadays are its cost and countless adults stuck in debt from its loans.If they can't bother to do a few hours of research and ask questions on the matter during their junior and senior year before signing those papers then that's on them. And if no adults in their cycles bothered to guide them on the matter or provide other career paths in life then they've failed them. So stop shifting the blame to the rest of society.</quote>Damn, bro really pointed out how it's literally society's fault and then said "stop shifting the blame to society" </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Have_A_Cigar 06/22/23 6:25:55 AM #68:	loafy013 posted... Must have been nice to get a degree for only 30K. How many decades ago was this? Because a quick search shows that is the approximate cost for a single year for a student living on campus in their home state at a state school. It was more than 30k. I paid the rest as I went from working full time. 30k were the student loans when I was done. And not everyone has to live on campus. 83% of Americans live within metropolitan areas (https://www.prb.org + /resources/census-bureau-to-track-both-metro-and-micropolitan-areas/ - the link was too long) = Community college access to the vast majority of people. And if you have an internet connection, plenty of online only options available also. The problem many are talking about is going to college based on traditional standards - plenty of alternatives apply. And people need to get it out of their head college isn't even necessary - so many very well paid trade jobs out there if someone would be willing to enter into an apprenticeship. But it all boils down to one needing to take personal accountability to drive one's success. Quit enabling the whiners out there. Success and sulking are both choices. Which are you choosing? --- And did we tell you the name of the game, boy We call it 'riding the gravy train' <cite>Have_A_Cigar posted [p:974330745] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>loafy013 posted... </cite><quote>Must have been nice to get a degree for only 30K. How many decades ago was this? Because a quick search shows that is the approximate cost for a single year for a student living on campus in their home state at a state school.</quote>It was more than 30k. I paid the rest as I went from working full time. 30k were the student loans when I was done. And not everyone has to live on campus. 83% of Americans live within metropolitan areas (https://www.prb.org + /resources/census-bureau-to-track-both-metro-and-micropolitan-areas/ - the link was too long) = Community college access to the vast majority of people. And if you have an internet connection, plenty of online only options available also. The problem many are talking about is going to college based on traditional standards - plenty of alternatives apply. And people need to get it out of their head college isn't even necessary - so many very well paid trade jobs out there if someone would be willing to enter into an apprenticeship. But it all boils down to one needing to take personal accountability to drive one's success. Quit enabling the whiners out there. Success and sulking are both choices. Which are you choosing?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
#69	Post #69 was unavailable or deleted.
Have_A_Cigar 06/22/23 6:29:21 AM #70:	Snakethief posted... 69 Well done! --- And did we tell you the name of the game, boy We call it 'riding the gravy train' <cite>Have_A_Cigar posted [p:974330781] in Loan Forgi... [t:80484300]...</cite> <quote>Snakethief posted... </cite><quote>69</quote>Well done!</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > Loan Forgiveness Idea I Could Get Behind (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > Loan Forgiveness Idea I Could Get Behind